Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Newsweek:1/4 of Iraq casualties could be due to lack of armor (MUST read)

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU
 
underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-28-04 12:13 PM
Original message
Newsweek:1/4 of Iraq casualties could be due to lack of armor (MUST read)
Only 70 fully operational M1A1 tanks left there too. Also read Rep.Jan Skakowski's Buzzflash editorial.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4825948 /

A breakdown of the casualty figures suggests that many U.S. deaths and wounds in Iraq simply did not need to occur. According to an unofficial study by a defense consultant that is now circulating through the Army, of a total of 789 Coalition deaths as of April 15 (686 of them Americans), 142 were killed by land mines or improvised explosive devices, while 48 others died in rocket-propelled-grenade attacks. Almost all those soldiers were killed while in unprotected vehicles, which means that perhaps one in four of those killed in combat in Iraq might be alive if they had had stronger armor around them, the study suggested. Thousands more who were unprotected have suffered grievous wounds, such as the loss of limbs.


On the battlefield, that has translated into a lack of armor. Perhaps the most telling example: a year ago the Pentagon had more than 400 main battle tanks in Iraq; as of recently, a senior Defense official told NEWSWEEK, there was barely a brigade's worth of operational tanks still there. (A brigade usually has about 70 tanks.)

http://www.buzzflash.com/contributors/04/04/con04177.ht...

A BUZZFLASH GUEST COMMENTARY
by Congresswoman Jan Schakowsky

CHICAGO, IL - U.S. Representative Jan Schakowsky (D-IL), Chief Deputy Whip, today issued the following statement after Newsweek reported "...that perhaps one in four of those killed in combat in Iraq might be alive if they had had stronger armor around them...

Thousands more who were unprotected have suffered grievous wounds, such as the loss of limbs." (Newsweek, 5/3/04)

She added, "Force protection, traditionally the number one concern of any President, has been neglected by the Bush Administration. As Commander-in-Chief, President Bush is failing our troops. American casualties are mounting in Iraq because soldiers were sent into battle, without lifesaving equipment, by a President bent on waging a war of choice."

"The families of soldiers in Iraq want to know: Where has the money gone? President Bush has spent almost $200 billion on the war, yet their sons and daughters were not given the protection they are entitled to before being sent into Iraq," Schakowsky concluded.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
lovedems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-28-04 12:15 PM
Response to Original message
1. I *heard* (can't remember where) that Cheney was trying to blame
Kerry for the lack of armor because of some of his past votes. Of course it is not true or distorted in some manner but I think he is trying to get that message out.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-28-04 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Yes ONE Senator has that much influence
That clearly glosses over the lack of planning and readiness checks they did before starting this mess. Also it illustrates how wildly wrong they were in their "throwing flowers and waving American flags" ASSumptions.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lovedems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-28-04 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. While this is really, really, really assinine, we have all seen
Dickhead try stunts that were more insane then this!

SNIP

Cheney also blasted Kerry for his vote last fall against $87 billion to support U.S. operations in Iraq, including body armor and other troop needs - a vote that's now the focus of a Bush-Cheney TV attack ad.

http://www.nypost.com/news/nationalnews/21157.htm
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-28-04 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #7
12. I thought W was the "leader"
Looks like Kerry has been running the show all along.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
liveoaktx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-28-04 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. That 87 Bill got passed, didn't it? Regardless of who voted for or against
it? So it's this government's responsiblity, trying to pass the buck on their lack of planning again.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lovedems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-28-04 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. see above response.
Just more finger pointing to take the blame away from them
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-28-04 12:47 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. Yes it did pass
Kerry voted for it when they had a way to actually "pay" for it and then when it came out of the conference committee and they had no way to "pay" for it he voted against it. He didn't say that very clearly that one time however.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lovedems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-28-04 12:24 PM
Response to Original message
2. Here is the one article I found...
(SNIP)

I got back from Iraq just after Thanksgiving so I can only comment on what I know of prior to that time. Guardsmen had a shortage of body armor then, they were also told when they deployed that they would get body armor upon arriving in Kuwait before being moved to Iraq. That didn't happen so Guardsmen were in Iraq with no protection other than their cammies. Thus began the buying of armor by families and donated armor from policemen etc. Lack of armor for their humvees was also a grave issue.

I wouldn't put any trust in any handoff myself. It isn't that I don't trust the military to do their best, it is the orders coming out of the DoD that make me nervous.

There has been no shortage of armor for the civilian contractors of KR&B aka Halliburton. When you have seen a convoy of Guard troops, with no body armor or armored humvees being sent to escort some contractors wearing the best body armor & driving a armored humvee, you really question what is going on here


http://www.murdoconline.net/archives/001157.html


This is the first one I found and it is not the original article that I read, but it still provides the info.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-28-04 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Time said on AVERAGE troops spend $2,000
I read it in December I think (they had a graphic with soldier's Christmas wishlist) and they not only were buying body armor they were buying GOOD body armor and GOOD walkietalkies and GOOD GPS systems.

Oh but KBR employees are all taken care of :grr:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lovedems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-28-04 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. I don't know anyone in Iraq but I just have to wonder how they feel about
this administration. I am sure it is a mixed bag, just like it is here at home but for God's sake, they are cutting benefits, cutting pay, inadequately arming them... This administrations treatment of veterans and those currently at war is absolutely unforgivable!

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
moondust Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-28-04 01:15 PM
Response to Original message
10. Who could have imagined
that soldiers riding around in a military vehicle in a war zone would need protection from enemy fire? C'mon Condi, just say it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-28-04 01:31 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. They never thought the Iraqis could throw rose petals so hard
That is what they are throwing right?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DeepModem Mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-28-04 03:43 PM
Response to Original message
13. kick
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Thu Aug 21st 2014, 05:51 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC