Has the substantive level of discussion here at the DU decreased recently?

[MrSoundAndVision]

Poll question: Has the substantive level of discussion here at the DU decreased recently?

Poll result (77 votes)
Yes	(42 votes, 55%)	Vote
No	(32 votes, 42%)	Vote
How dare you!	(3 votes, 4%)	Vote

[unblock]

1. robb is a dingbat!

[specter]

2. Same ol thing

Havent been here since the war "ended" but this seems to be a common question.

[stopbush]

3. If it has, it's only because the RW shit has been flying so fast and

so furiously on so many levels that it's hard to find the time to pen anything substantive before the NEXT RW turd erupts.

It will only get worse as the election nears...

[MrSoundAndVision]

6. That's bullshit

The discussion can be as substantive as you, or anyone else, wants it to be. I just ignore the propoganda from the RW generally, well I avoid arguing it's pros and cons, as they are meant to divert discussion.

This poll is meant to be instructive really. I mean, here we are, March, goose farts Kerry as our nominee, and the shouts are silent here in the halls of debate, replaced with whimpers of democratic unity in the form of Nader bashing, and anybody but bush -isms.

I just want democrats to realize that such strategies only embolden die hard democrats, like yourselves, and actually don't attract new members to our party, which seriously brings in to question our winning strategy. I always thought that what makes the Democratic party a winning party is it's connection with the working class.

[IndianaGreen]

15. The working class has been hurt by NAFTA and globalization

The presumptive Democratic nominee supports NAFTA and globalization.

[RandomKoolzip]

4. Jesus Christ.....

Y'know: sometimes reading DU is like listening to old grizzled punk rockers complaining about all the "new bands" who just can't rock like they did in he old days. "Young kids are ruining the scene," "It's not cool anymore," "They've sold out," etc. woof woof blah blah. It's all bullshit.

When hipster pundits claim things like "rock is dead" or some such, they are usually just burnt out on going to see bands. It has nothing to do with the state of "rock," it's the person listening who's going through the changes. DU is "decreasing the standards of discussion recently" about as often as Bob Dylan makes a comeback.

If this really upsets you, go find some interesting shit, post it, and take it upon yourself to elevate that ol' discourse right up into the stratosphere. It's up to YOU, dude.

"If you don't like the news, go out and make some of your own."- Scoop Nisker, KSAN DJ

[MrSoundAndVision]

7. Ahh go to another thread...

I'm actually trying to elevate the discussion, dude.

[RandomKoolzip]

9. This is like the eightieth thread utilizing the same topic.

And it's always the same shit. All the old-timers commisserate and cry in their beer over the old times, the newbies who might have something interesting to say get alienated, and the discussion sits on the launching pad, sniffing its own farts.

Boo hoo.

[MrSoundAndVision]

11. Do you have something interesting to say?

Hm?

[Cronus Protagonist]

19. So, what do your farts smell like?

I always like mine, is that normal?

http://brainbuttons.com

[MrSoundAndVision]

8. and by the way...

Bob Dylan never made a comeback, it's a lie! HE SUCKS!

[nightperson]

24. Hee hee.

Something I've been postponing for a while http://www.geocities.com/bostonwolfpack / . Should this obvious soundtrack automatically open on certain threads?

[shimmergal]

5. Don't know about that, but

the Lounge is a lot less fun than it used to be.

Maybe banning sex threads has had a chilling effect on the discussion there in general? It seems like a lot more topics than just the newly forbidden one have dropped off the radar screen there.

[specter]

10. When

did they ban sex threads??

[MrSoundAndVision]

12. Looks like....

honesty has tied phantoms of democratic unity....I hope this isn't an indication of what's to come.

[Wonco_the_Sane]

13. I'm newish but...

...don't think so. Some issue stuff iisn't being debated as much with Kerry locking up the nomination. However I think there is a lot of good stuff here. (the world is what you make of it)

[rucky]

16. Funny, you don't look newish.

[Stephanie]

23. LOL and

you do deserve a

[kodi]

14. yes, the responses on this thread pretty well prove it.

its not so much the volume, but the actual depth of substance.

gone are the days (except for bev harris) where the site was a genuine conduit for the dessemination of investigative reports from evil Duers.

indiana green, salin, will pitt, symbolman, et al, all great work, but now little of that is on-site anymore.

used to be this site was a clearinghouse for all sorts of detailed reports from active researchers who posted their own findings and research on liberal and progressive topics.

sure, there is some smattering of good info still but compared to what it used to be, this has devolved to the level of a junior high school cafeteria for the kool kids.

as Euripides said:

"All is change; all yields its place and goes".

[Cronus Protagonist]

18. I wrote a whole post in response to your comment and trashed it

No point in going there. When you've been around for a while on the net, you'll begin to see the pattern. It happens to every board, by the way.

http://brainbuttons.com

[Cronus Protagonist]

17. I voted yes - too many irrelevant polls for me (eom)

http://brainbuttons.com

[Chovexani]

20. Yes, but this too shall pass.

Not to play the old fart card or anything, but I've been lurking on DU almost since its inception (something not immediately apparent by my low post count). My observation is that these things ebb and flow. For a stretch of time there will be great, substantive debate on the boards. It deteriorates for a while as people come and go and then the signal to noise ratio gets bad. More people come and go, and things improve.

GD is really a microcosm of the site itself. Since it's the most active board, this principle is expressed more starkly here. Want proof? Every few months, without fail, somebody posts a thread like this. It's not a new phenomenon. As DU continues to grow in its membership, people will come and go. Blowhards will show up and fling their feces at the screen for a while, then leave. Thoughtful people will offer analysis and inspire some good discussions, then they'll leave. It's a cycle. We just happen to be in the low part of it right now.

There's also the flood phenomenon. Sometimes the "noise" gets worse a lot of the times for a week or two after some wingnut mentions DU in an article or on a radio show, sending over an influx of disruptors. Sometimes, when a major news event happens (like, say, 9/11) we get a lot of newbies flocking to the site to get info, and that's always a mixed bag--on one hand you get people who may have only gotten their news from CNN/M$RNC/Faux and are reaching out because they smell a rat and want the truth, but OTOH you also get Freeper types who, again, are looking to disrupt.

I really wouldn't be so worried about it. Every message board has its good and bad folk. As far as political boards go, DU is still one of the best IMO because even at its nadirs there are some damn thoughtful and almost frighteningly intelligent people here. There are so many issues I knew almost nothing about until I came here and very smart people helped to educate me. And issues I thought I knew something about, I was able to gain a fresh perspective on.

The 2002 election season was one of the nadirs, and it's not really a surprise that this one has been--uh, spirited, as well. Just remember that it's just part of a bigger cycle and don't get too worried about it. Post intelligent threads and get the conversations started. If you get too frustrated, take a step back, take a deep breath, and take a break from the board for a week or two. You'll be amazed what it will do for your mental health.

--C

[JohnOneillsMemory]

21. Maybe things were once 'richer.' But have you seen FreeRepublic? ECH!

I've only been around here the last year or less and I have had to learn how to wade around the 'me too-* sucks' blandishments.

But I've found amazing things and learn all the time. That's enough.

I recently took a walk through freeperville and was appalled by the lack of information and any discourse of substance.

Freeperville makes this site look like a bunch of geniuses!

[MSchreader]

22. Yes

Between the DU-PATRIOT Act, the new Secret Police and tripwire banning, this place is no longer conducive to honest political discussion. Oh, and the influx of DLC/NDOL/Kerry-okee types didn't help, either.

Martin

[Yupster]

25. I've kind of liked it better

since there's no more "Dean sucks," "Gephardt sucks," "Kerry sucks even worsier" crap. That stuff didn't register too high on my sustantial measurement index.

[ulysses]

26. yeah, but it ebbs and flows.

Always has.

[Renew Deal]

27. Including the PFC thread, yes.

Without it, no. I have been involved in some great stuff in the last week.