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_Jumper_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:00 AM
Original message
Article about bigot Daniel Pipes, who Bush supports
Edited on Wed Mar-10-04 01:02 AM by _Jumper_
http://www.aljazeerah.info/Opinion%20editorials/2004%20...

<In an effort to divide Americans one that if you inserted blacks for Muslims and whites for Jews would be vigorously damned as a Ku Klux Klan speech he told the American Jewish Congress in 2001 that he worries that the presence and increased stature and affluence and enfranchisement of American Muslims will present true dangers to American Jews. When Pipes was contacted by a leading journalist seeking a clarification he said, It is accurate in itself, but you must note that this was spoken to a Jewish audience>

<I make the same point respectively to audiences of women, gays, civil libertarians, Hindus, Evangelical Christians and atheists among others, all of whom face true dangers as the number of Muslims increases.>

>As early as 1983, a Washington Post book review noted that Pipes displays a disturbing hostility to contemporary Muslims. He professes respect for Muslims but is frequently contemptuous of them. Pipes also said in describing Islam, This religion would seem to have nothing functional to offer.>

<Pipes smears the Muslim community with several accusations eerily similar to those leveled against the Jewish community in Europe prior to the World War II. These include: (1) being parasites on society, (2) being disproportionately engaged in criminal behavior, (3) having unacceptable customs, (4) seeking to take over the country, and (5) sexual aggression against women. With all these vulgar opinions, how can such a man be foisted by President Bush on the US Institute of Peace (a congressionally sponsored think tank)? Pipes is not only an insult to peace but to America itself.>

Bush placed Pipes on the US Institue of Peace's 15-member board of directors as a temporary recess appointment, circumventing Democratic opposition led by Ted Kennedy and Tom Harkin , who blocked his confirmation in the Senate.






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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:02 AM
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:08 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. you two
how dare you?! :)

No,not him.

I can't really even remember who it was,but I'll never forget laughing my ass off to that statement :D
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thebigidea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:20 AM
Response to Reply #6
10. Be glad. Be glad.
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Aidoneus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:22 AM
Response to Reply #6
12. Rini, probably
Edited on Wed Mar-10-04 01:22 AM by Aidoneus
who is no longer among us.

Or Blitz, who is also no longer among us.
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_Jumper_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:24 AM
Response to Reply #12
16. Blitz?
What was he banned for?
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Aidoneus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:32 AM
Response to Reply #16
20. ironically, not for I/P postings
Edited on Wed Mar-10-04 01:35 AM by Aidoneus
It's interesting that his consistantly racist tendency was not what did him in. Like it is now with others, that was deemed acceptable. Apparently the brass became aware of the fact that he's a regular at certain right-wing forums (the appallingly fascist LittleGreenFootballs being the main), and that it was painfully obvious that his sympathies lie with Team W and what passes for the "enemy" around here. I'm told he's made some quite harsh remarks about this site and the people here before and after, though I have not read such remarks myself.
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Tinoire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 04:36 PM
Response to Reply #20
34. He's also at FR.
Sent his regards to Skinner from there recently.
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_Jumper_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 04:38 PM
Response to Reply #20
35. Wow
I didn't know him well but he was one of the few posters that came to my aid when I posted a controversial thread about radical Islamism.
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thebigidea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-11-04 09:22 AM
Response to Reply #35
47. which should tell you something, eh?
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Ms. Clio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 05:03 PM
Response to Reply #20
38. I knew it I knew it I knew it!!!
Edited on Wed Mar-10-04 05:09 PM by meluseth
I was onto him from his first post.

Oh happy day!

(edited just because)
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salin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #20
40. Not being an I/P denizen
only periodically (to myself) speculated based on the spin of some of his threads going a ways back. Some were downright... amusing.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:25 AM
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:33 AM
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:34 AM
Response to Reply #12
23. I was Rini!!!!!!
thanks,I couldn't remember who it was.But that was the one!
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:17 AM
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:20 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. Nope,not him
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thebigidea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:23 AM
Response to Reply #11
14. though I'm almost tempted to do a song about his ilk...
entitled "Mr. Pragmatic"
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DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:08 AM
Response to Original message
5. Pipes' views are pretty mainstream.

His fans are by no means limited to Republicans.
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_Jumper_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:23 AM
Response to Reply #5
15. Why do you live in the US?
I don't understand why you do since you realize Middle America hates you. Why not go to a more tolerant country?
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DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:25 AM
Response to Reply #15
17. My sleeper cell transfer hasn't come through yet

:party:
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lefty_mcduff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 07:32 AM
Response to Reply #17
28. Heh, heh, heh.
That's funny! Though you owe me a keyboard - spewed the morning coffee
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eissa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #17
37. LOL!
Well, you know, according to Rep. King, you're all just a bunch of extremists just WAITING for the right moment to strike.

BTW, Pipes is a racist SOB. Plain and simple.
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thedecline Donating Member (50 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:10 AM
Response to Original message
8. .
If you replaced the words "muslim" and "islam" with "jew" and "judaism" in Pipes's speeches and writings, he would be called an anti-semite. But since he's talking about muslims, everything's OK.
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_Jumper_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:22 AM
Response to Reply #8
13. Exactly
Muslims and people perceived as Muslim need to see the tragic writing on the wall: Americans don't want you here. I have. I will be emigrating to Canada ASAP.
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Djinn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:31 AM
Response to Reply #13
19. I'd like to be able to say move down here
but unfortunately I think too many Australians are just as bad
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_Jumper_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:34 AM
Response to Reply #19
22. I think Australia is better on this front than the US
Australia is my #2 choice after Canada.
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Aidoneus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:37 AM
Response to Reply #22
24. Not really..
Edited on Wed Mar-10-04 01:45 AM by Aidoneus
the native blacks and non-white immigrants (South Asians from India & Pakistan, Mashriq Arabs--don't know about North African Arabs there, but it would be the same--, etc..) are treated just as badly. They have their racist conservative base like we do--just look who they elected and what he's done..

Europe is in some ways worse than America on such matters. It seems the whole European-descended world (that includes the settler-states it implanted outside of Europe) is on a par, Canada is probably your best bet on those grounds. I would suggest not letting these fascist assholes drive you away and instead stay around, but I'm not familiar enough with your particular experiences.
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_Jumper_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:44 AM
Response to Reply #24
25. Perhaps
But I wouldn't have to fear internment there and I would be able to look forward to tolerance steadily increasing. It is marginally better.

Europe is very intolerant, especially Southern and Central Europe. Eastern Europe is poor so it isn't an option. Scandanvia is a bit better than the rest of Europe but I would say Australia is probably more racially tolerant than it due to Australia's history as a nation of immigrants.

What do you think about New Zealand?
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DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:49 AM
Response to Reply #25
26. google woomera before you cease fearing internment in AU

Woomera is just one. They put Muslims in concentration camps where children sew their lips shut.
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Djinn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 01:57 AM
Response to Reply #25
27. thinking of moving there myself actually!
Edited on Wed Mar-10-04 02:09 AM by Djinn
At our last federal election John "is it still 1954?" Howard was looking very iffy...then along came a boatload of refugees and little john played the race card for all it was worth refusing to allow a Norwegian ship who had rescued the refugees from their leaking boat to transport the people to Australia and insisted they be taken to Indonesia (a non signatory to the Refugee Convention) they intimated that the boat was possibly full of terrorists in disguise which was a ploy helped hugely by the Sept 11 atacks, no-one really questioned why any terrorist would take the leaky fishing boat risk when "illegals" who come by plane (or UK backpackers overstaying their visa's) are not subject to mandatory detention and people on the fishing boats often sink and drown...basically our own right wing shock jocks (think poor man's Limbaugh) whipped up the frenzy "the navy should just shoot them" was one comment I recall from the time (I worked in media monitoring then and each day was a little bit more sickening) and low and behold the midget won the election.

New Zealand has been quietly accepting half the refugees bound for Australia and has issued visa's enabling men who's wives and children came on subsequent boats to be reunited with their families - something they could not do in Australia.

Most Australians (like most Americans I imagine) are OK but a lot of them are pretty ignorant and don't seem to have much desire to change that. As for how Aboriginal Australians are treated ... well I don't want to damn my country too much in one post, suffice to say the Prime Miniature refuses to even offer a public apology for policies (in place up until the mid 70's) that forcibly removed children from their families because "we can't apologise for something "we" didn't do - strangely enough little JOhn was an MP back in the mid 70's! (see Human Right & Equal Op website for info http://www.hreoc.gov.au/social_justice/stolen_children /)

See RAC-VIC (on my sig line) if you need any extra info on how we treat refugees in Aust.

And on Ductape Fatwa's comment - Woomera has been shut down they've replaced it with shiny new razor wire encircled camps also in the middle of the fucking dessert and the ingenious "Pacific Solution" (has a nice Nazi ring to it dontcha think?) whereby we bribe piss poor pacific nations into doing our dirty work...also one other point we don't just lock up muslims, we're quite happy to refuse the right to claim asylum of other folks from the middle east and south asia as well, although being muslim certianly helps to whip up the paranoia
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_Jumper_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 03:34 PM
Response to Reply #27
29. Which country do you think is more tolerant?
Australia or New Zealand?
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legin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 04:23 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. Reading the above section
The problem I can see with some of the countries mentioned above is probably best summed up by the jewish people who before WWII moved out of Germany to escape persecution and went to France, and then lo and behold guess who turns up.

Canada can't stand up to the u.s. militarily and it is right next door to the 'bully', so when it comes down to the crunch if bush* says everybody in Canada should hop around on one leg, that's what everybody in Canada will have to do.

Australia now functions as the South East Asia representative of the bush* World Tyranny TM. That's the deal they got from bush* for helping in Iraq, so that's them out of the equation.

New Zealand, a country I had my eye on for a while, suffers from the same problem as Canada, it's next door to the stronger Australia.

Eastern Europe is no good either as it has fallen under the influence of the u.s. (I had my eyes on Hungary for a while).

It really has to be a country that has a shot at standing up to bush*, so it has to be one of France, Germany or Russia.

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_Jumper_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 04:27 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. France, Germany, and Russia
They are even more intolerant than the US. Russia is poor anyway. Under your scenario NZ would probably be the best option since the US is very unlikely to attack it via Australia. Even if Australia were to attack NZ, it likely could get China to come to its aid since saving NZ would be a PR coup for China, would send a message to the US and the world.
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legin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #31
33. It's not only about being attacked, it's also having to do things
that you don't agree with because it is less agro than upsetting your stronger neighbour. I agree that N.Z. is a pretty good option, but you ain't going to be free, you are still going to have to make concessions to the 'beast' somewhere down the line.
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_Jumper_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 04:39 PM
Response to Reply #33
36. True
But on balance I would prefer it over France or Germany.
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legin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #31
39. There is also a psycological point
Being here on this board basically says that it is important to all of us as individuals to fight, in our own particular way, to stop this planet being flushed down the plughole.

Staying where you are means you are going to fight from the inside, moving to France, Germany or Russia says you are going to fight from the outside, moving to New Zealand sort of says "Well I'll think I'll sit this one out and hope the right side wins". And if the right side doesn't win you still get it in the neck, it just takes longer for them to get around to you.

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legin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #30
32. Basically
the Jewish people in WWII who survived the most easiest were the ones who moved out of Germany and went to the u.s. and britain.
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Djinn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 08:17 PM
Response to Reply #29
41. NZ for sure
although I don't live there so it's not really an informed opinion.
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_Jumper_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 11:31 PM
Response to Reply #41
42. Interesting
What makes you think that? NZ's more progressive politics?
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Aidoneus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-10-04 11:56 PM
Response to Reply #42
43. it doesn't try to be a bigshot
mostly because it can't. Australia strives to be the main imperialist power in the south Pacific, with a national mentality to match. NZ can't be that, so it mostly doesn't try. I wouldn't say it's perfect, as it's currently run by a neolib/neocon political machine that rotted away the centre-left party in the same way Blair is working on over in Airstrip #1, but a most pleasant place anyway from all accounts I have run across.
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_Jumper_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-11-04 12:28 AM
Response to Reply #43
44. How does it fare on the issue of tolerance?
Better than Australia?
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Djinn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-11-04 07:04 PM
Response to Reply #42
49. better relationship with indigenous community
it's not perfect but it's a far cry from Aust. There was NEVER anything like The Treaty of Waitangi in Aust and they also have a much much more human asylum seeker policy
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_Jumper_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-11-04 07:53 PM
Response to Reply #49
50. Immigration
NZ has the highest rate of immigration in the world, mostly due to the high rate of emigration. Do you believe that rapid demographic change will cause a rise in racism in 20-30 years in NZ or will the transition be smooth as people realize immigration is required for economic growth?
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AlienGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-11-04 01:47 AM
Response to Original message
45. Interesting tangent: the AJMA
The American Jewish-Muslim Alliance, which seems to be a relatively new organization, released a statement about one of this guy's speeches. It can be seen at http://www.danielpipes.org/article/1625 .

Has anyone here heard of the AJMA before? It sounds like a good idea to me, and like something that DUers might be interested in supporting. (They don't seem to have a website yet, but I've emailed their contact person for more information.)

Tucker
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regnaD kciN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-11-04 03:02 AM
Response to Reply #45
46. Here's a news story...
http://www.c-n.com/news/c-n/story/0,2111,912431,00.html

(I must admit to being puzzled at what appears to be a small group in New Jersey deciding to issue a press release about something that happened at Berkeley, but I guess everyone has the right to speak out on an issue. I must admit, however, to being sceptical about anyone defending Pipes, who I agree is an over-the-top racist and anti-Muslim bigot -- it would be a little like a newly-formed "Louisiana Interracial Alliance," with a goal of promoting understanding between whites and blacks, starting off by issuing a statement defending David Duke...)

:eyes:
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_Jumper_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-11-04 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #46
48. LOL
Thanks for exposing that fraud.
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