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Has Bush "served in the military"?

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SeveneightyWhoa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 02:38 PM
Original message
Has Bush "served in the military"?
I'm just wondering if it can be said that George W Bush has "served in the military".

According to AOL/Time's Presidential Match Guide (http://www.presidentmatch.com/Guide.jsp2 ), he has.

"Has Held Elected Office Yes
Served in the Military Yes"

So only Kerry, Clark, and Bush, have served. Previously, I would've thought that the latter name couldn't be included in such a list. Are AOL/Time being less than accurate, or has Bush technically "served"?
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 02:39 PM
Response to Original message
1. Well, he went through the motions
For a couple of weeks.
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bushwakker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 02:40 PM
Response to Original message
2. I know he was suspended from the Guard
why Dems don't point this out is beyond me.
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Thor_MN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 02:42 PM
Response to Original message
3. Sure he did, but it was a fake plastic turkey...
Didn't you see it on TV???
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mn9driver Donating Member (877 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 02:44 PM
Response to Original message
4. He didn't serve honorably or satisfactorily, but he technically
did "serve". National Guard service counts as Military service by most folks' standards (even if AWOL or a Deserter :evilgrin:).
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EndersGamer Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Let's make it a rule tha
you only get to make snide remarks about someone else's military service if you yourself are holding an honorable discharge from one of the branches.
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mn9driver Donating Member (877 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. OK, eight years USN, 1980-1988.
Managed to show up every day for work, too-unlike smirk. ;)
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #8
18. Ouch
Very nice
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cryofan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. Buch was a deserter who got special treatment because of
Edited on Sat Jan-31-04 02:59 PM by cryofan
...his father, who was a Senator.
I say Bush should be tried for desertion and punished appropriately.

BTW, 6 years US Navy aboard the USS Kitty Hawk. Oh, and my daddy did not have to buy MY honorable discharge, unlike Deserter Bush.
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hlthe2b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. Well, he did serve on active duty in the National Guard.. that's the point
Edited on Sat Jan-31-04 02:59 PM by hlthe2b
of the AOL questionnaire. Of course that doesn't answer the question of whether he truly served all the time required or was given "special" dispensation.

And, EndersGamer, I DO hold an honorable discharge from the active duty that I performed in the uniformed services. My DD214 is on file.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 03:02 PM
Response to Reply #6
12. Okay...I served and was granted an Honorable Discharge...
...do I now have your permission to slam Junior for being AWOL and then becoming a deserter because he was gone more than 30 days? And is it okay to mention that Junior was a deserter at a time when thousands of Americans were being killed in Vietnam?

To tell you the truth, it's open season on Junior's military service, regardless of whether or not anyone else served nonorably or dishonorably. Facts are facts.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. Forgot to add my military service...USN for five years, 1976-1981...
...served as a Naval Gunfire Liaison Officer at USMC Camp Pendleton, CA, from 1979-1981.
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hlthe2b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 03:08 PM
Response to Reply #6
17. Welcome to DU, EndersGamer...
But, I notice you didn't comment on your own service, when you suggested a rule restricting comment on Bush*' service....
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #6
19. I have no military service, but get this:
I don't go around pretending to either. To hell with Bush.
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hlthe2b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. Good point. I think any US citizen has EVERY right to expect
that a candidate for the Presidency would be honest and forthright in their depiction of their qualifications and past-- including any military service.

EVERY American has the right to question the honesty and legitimacy of Bush*'s claims to military service or any other "qualification that he may claim".

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reprobate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #6
24. USAF, 1961-1965. And I'll say it. Bush was AWOL for 18 months.

Now let's see your qualifications to tell us what not to say.
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Mari333 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 02:12 PM
Response to Reply #6
28. I can criticize any damn pResident I want!
any damn time!
add to that Im the stepmother of a kid being sent over to that goddamn lie of a war
add to that Im a US citizen and I can criticize any one of those morons who sit in office any time I want.
anytime..they work for ME...not vice versa
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thebaghwan Donating Member (998 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #6
30. USAF 1965-1969 Air Rescue & Recovery Service-"That others may live"
Bush was awol and I don't need your fucking approval to exercise my freedom of speech.
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newyawker99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 07:09 PM
Response to Reply #6
33. Hi EndersGamer!!
Welcome to DU!! :toast:
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Capn Sunshine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 07:25 PM
Response to Reply #6
36. What if you were part of a military task force and got blown up
even though you weren't military, but USG civvy advisors?

Or to put another way, why can't anyone comment on something if it's being cynically exploited?

I don't need to play football to know a cheerleader.


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mike1963 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 06:33 PM
Response to Reply #4
26. I managed to get into the ANG in 63 (and confess it was to avoid
not evade being drafted) but I was on a waiting list for over a year. Nor did I get a rare 'instant commission' as * did. Our guard unit actually did get 'activated' during the Pueblo business. As it happened, I was sent to Colorado Springs not Viet Nam but nobody pulled any strings, they just happened to need some people with my AFSC (called MOS in the army). I don't apologize for it, I would have gone where-ever they decided to send me (as if I would have had a choice)

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jsw_81 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 02:45 PM
Response to Original message
5. He was AWOL from the National Guard
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MikeG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
7. You know this AWOL stuff was during Watergate.
And he can't account for the time. Do you think he was one of the Cubans. He's fluent in Spanish, just not English.
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hlthe2b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 03:01 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. Bush* fluent in Spanish? Don't make me laugh....
Even my incredibly poor "Spanglish" is better than his, as my Hispanic friends would surely attest ( though they giggle at my poor attempts regularly).
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #11
20. I imagine his Spanish is pretty good
After all, you need to be able to at least get by speaking Spanish if you are going to spend lost weekends in Tiujuana, right? And I am sure he has had a ton of those.
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Bridget Burke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 02:45 PM
Response to Reply #20
31. Not Tijuana....
That's on the border with California. The Boys Towns along the Texas border were closer. The women working there know enough English to do their jobs.

Have you ever head Joe Ely sing Butch Hancock's "She Never Spoke Spanish To Me" ?

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nostamj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #7
13. if he's as fluent in Spanish as he is in English
he couldn't order a taco at TacoBell!
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never cry wolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. Since when is he fluent in english??
He speaks some sort of fascimile of english but fluent? I think NOT.

Welcome to DU, MikeG. :hi:
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MikeG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 03:08 PM
Response to Reply #7
16. This could absolve him from culpability for the Watergate
Affair. There has to be some reason why he can't account for his time.
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Nay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 05:50 PM
Response to Reply #7
23. Bush fluent in Spanish?? I don't think so.
He mangles that language just like he mangles English. And his accent SUCKS.
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Frank Rose Donating Member (108 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 03:17 PM
Response to Original message
21. Yes, he served*, but like everthing he* has done*......
There will be a little star attached*.
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hlthe2b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 06:12 PM
Response to Original message
25. Hmmm. seems the one poster who wanted only those with military
service to "have the right" to question Bush*'s military record has neither indicated his/her own service nor hung around for the discourse. An interesting case of post and run? Perhaps we were baited?
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EndersGamer Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 01:48 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. Nope, just got busy
Four years active - Regular Navy, two years reserve (which, through snafu, never required my actual presence - sound familiar?) Honorably discharged in 1976. My service included personal and unit citations.

I enlisted in 1970, not to escape the draft, not because I was bloodthirsty, just because I was raised to believe that all citizens are required to give something back.

As a result of my service during a time when the members of the military got little respect from civilians, sometimes I get a little testy when legitimate service is sneered at by those who have no such experience.

BTW, I had dedicated shipmates who were reservists, I had more than several experiences with paperwork foulups, and I think that there are more than sufficient reasons to criticize the President than on his absence or lack of absence from reserve meetings. After all, he did complete flight training (one of my classmates died during that), and if you will recall, it was fairly easy to get out of military service in those days.

It would never occur to me to criticize someone of my generation for dodging service - Our involvement in Vietnam was open to question. In return, I expect that those who did not serve to keep the acid out of their voices when talking about anyone's service.
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Bridget Burke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 03:00 PM
Response to Reply #27
32. As a woman, I was not draftable.
Although women did serve--and still do.

I do sneer at Bush for his actions during the war. Many of my friends were against the war & used various methods to avoid service; I didn't hold that against them. Others joined voluntarily or just went when drafted. Some of the trust-fund Marxists I knew at the time looked down on them but I did not. My father and two uncles served during WWII. Both uncles went on to careers in the service; my father was called up during the Cold War & died in a plane crash. I don't remember him but, believe me, I have never shown contempt to those who serve.

Bush prided himself on his indifference to the issues of the day. His daddy wangled him a slot in the Guard so he could get some good pictures in his flight gear, but he didn't bother to fulfill his obligation.

The main problem is that he still likes to pose as a "fighter jock"--remember the "Mission Accomplished" fiasco? And he's preened & posed while sending over 500 men and women off to die.

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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 07:20 PM
Response to Reply #27
34. Junior was a DESERTER whether you want to believe it or not...
...and he chose to be a deserter while thousands of Americans were still being killed in Vietnam.

Desertion was a crime punishable by execution during WWII, and field execution by officers during Vietnam. In fact, I knew an officer that had to shoot a man during a real heavy combat situation.

As long as that illegal SOB-head-of-the-NeoCon-coup is sending troops into other countries for absolutely no good reason, the subject of Junior's military service will continue to be a valid, and growing, concern among ALL American citizens regardless of whether or not they served in the military.

You need to give it a rest, bud.
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leesa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 02:12 PM
Response to Original message
29. So only someone who has been in the military should be Prez?
Maybe this is why the US has such a beligerent attitude towards the rest of the planet. How bout we elect someone based on intelligence and diplomatic skills?

Surely you know Bush signed up for the National Guard (after he received preferred placement over hundreds of other qualified candidates, thanks to Daddy), trained on an obsolete plane (to make certain he would not have to go to Viet Nam) and then disappeared for awhile during time of war only to reappear in time to get his "honorable discharge" (no doubt also courtesy of Daddy). I don't think this is news to anyone. Most of Amerikans think it's fine to go AWOL.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 07:24 PM
Response to Reply #29
35. No, most Americans don't think it's "fine" to go AWOL, certainly not...
...those that have actually served.

By the way...Junior was actually a deserter. After 30 days in AWOL status, an individual is declared a deserter if he fails to return to base. He or she can expect to receive a pretty harsh punishment once they turn themselves in or they are apprehended. Unless, of course, your last name is Bush.
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