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democratic Donating Member (486 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 05:43 PM
Original message
14 year old Iranian boy dies after 85 lashes for breaking Ramadan
http://www.iranpressnews.com/english/source/001327.html

A 14 year old boy died on Thursday, November 11th, after having received 85 lashes; according to the ruling of the Mullah judge of the public circuit court in the town of Sanandadj he was guilty of breaking his fast during the month of Ramadan.

The Kurdish site Rojehheh Lt reports that the young mans identity has not been disclosed. He was scheduled for burial on Saturday, November 13th (after 3 days at the local morgue), in the cemetery of Beheshteh Mohammadi in Sanandadj. However due to the publics realization of the events surrounding the boys circumstances the cemetery was stormed and his burial did not take place.

According to informed sources, supervisors have instructed that the burial take place in the presence of his closest relatives, surveyed by security forces.
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Liberal Veteran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 05:44 PM
Response to Original message
1. Ain't organized religion great? nt
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The Zanti Regent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 11:01 AM
Response to Reply #1
26. Look at this snippet from THE BRICK TESTAMENT
This is what the Christians want to reinstate:

http://www.thebricktestament.com/the_law/when_to_stone_...
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gottaB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-05-04 02:11 PM
Response to Reply #26
33. lol
:D
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Anakin Skywalker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 05:45 PM
Response to Original message
2. And Somewhere in America....
someone was stoned to death for not celebrating xmas, if the rightwing fundies were to get their way.
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TwentyFive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 05:45 PM
Response to Original message
3. Ashcroft must be jealous.
Why can't we lash kids for not praying to Jesus in school?
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Book Lover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 05:46 PM
Response to Original message
4. From the same webpage: Boy sentenced to death for murder
http://www.iranpressnews.com/english/source/001328.html

Iranian boy,16, sentenced to death for murder

Under Iranian , any person who has reached the age of maturity -- considered nine-years-old for girls and 15 years for boys -- can be executed for capital offences.

<snip>

Last month the judiciary said it has drawn up a bill that would scrap the death penalty and lashings for under-18s -- meaning the sentencing of the 16-year-old could be annulled.

Several Iranian human rights organisations and Nobel Peace Prize winner Shirin Ebadi have been lobbying Ayatollah Mahmoud Hashemi Shahrudi, the head of the judiciary, not to sentence minors to death.

Murder, armed robbery, rape, apostasy and serious drug trafficking are all punishable by death in Iran.
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Ruby Romaine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 05:48 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. the rw fundies can get us for apostasy !
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Trajan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. WTF is up with the age variation for gender ? ..
Boys of 15, but GIRLS OF 9 can be executed ? ...

WTF ? ...

WTF is wrong with these people ? ...

SHEEESH !
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Lydia Leftcoast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 06:24 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. I do know that 9 is the age at which they are required to wear the hijab
There was an Iranian film about that. Before that, they can wear anything they want.
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lukasahero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-06-04 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #7
41. Quote is "Age of maturity"
It's just a way to make sure little girls can be f*cked by old men legally. Lovely.
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Trajan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 05:48 PM
Response to Original message
5. ....
Tempted to say bad things about Islam ....

Must ..... be ....... good ........

Poor Boy: .. My son is 14, and though I am PISSED he wont take out the trash as I asked him, he wont be getting lashes ....
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enki23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 12:19 AM
Response to Reply #5
13. i'll say bad things about islam
when it leads to this kind of fucking horror. no problem. that nation's brand of islam is fucking vile. period. makes me glad, once again, that i still live in a mostly-secular society. the more secular the better. the more secular, the fewer lashings to death of children. atheists almost ever do this sort of thing. they've got fewer rationalizations for fucking lunacy.

some fundy nut christian here in the states did the same thing to his son last year, with a belt. his siblings, and mother, watched and to some extent even helped. the main difference is, he and his kind aren't yet in charge here. they're trying to change that, of course. but we have a lot further to fall before jerry falwell, and worse, have their way here completely.
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barb162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-20-04 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #13
24. amen
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Djinn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-06-04 10:31 PM
Response to Reply #13
43. Morons lead to this, not Islam
Edited on Mon Dec-06-04 10:33 PM by Djinn
same as morons lead to ALL religious horror, not the religion itself.

And plenty of atheists beat and otherwise harm their kids.

I'm an atheist pretty much always have been I remember being in grade 2 (above 7 years old) and having an argument with an RI teacher about God - it all just seemed stupid to me, but that said, this shit has little to do with religion - the Muslims I know can not reconcile any of this shit with the Islam they know - the Koran specifically says there is NO COMPULSION in religion it also states that suicide is a sin (there goes the matyrs suicide option) unfortunately like ALL religious texts it's just vague enough to be twisted by misogynists, totalitarians and fascists to say whatever they want.

That Christianity CURRENTLY produces less overtly insane behaviour has more to do with the living standards/history and wealth of the countries in which Christianity is the norm than any inherent progressiveness of Christianity.

BTW

22 juveniles have been executed in the US since 1976, 16 states still allow the execution of 16 year olds - OK they have to have committed considerably more serious crimes to receive the death penalty than one would in Iran but it's not like your system never convicts the innocent.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 06:19 PM
Response to Original message
8. Fucked up
How tragic.
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indepat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 07:29 PM
Response to Original message
10. This is murder no different from putting a pistol to his head and
his brains out.
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kcwayne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 07:40 PM
Response to Original message
11. Suppose we'll ever read a headline like "Atheists kill child for
not believing in reason"? Doubt it.

Yet every fucking day you can read about some religious numbnut killing themselves, their children, their spouse, neighbors, or strangers because of some religious vision. Draw your own conclusions.
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megatherium Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 10:27 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Actually, atheism has been at least as murderous
as any of the organized religions: the Soviets and the Chinese Maoists killed tens of millions in the 20th century.

The real problem is the depravity of humans. They kill each other a lot, for all kinds of stupid reasons. For ideology (religion or atheism), for politics, for natural resources, for sheer hate.

The modern Western idea of the intrinsic value of human life, of our responsibility to protect the defenseless and to help those in need, can arguably be traced to Judaism and Christianity. These same ideas find expression in Buddhism and other major religions as well. It is human depravity that corrupts religion, as well as other institutions, to vile ends. (For example, the Medicis were the primary patrons of the Italian renaissance, supporting artists such as Michelangelo, but when they gained control of the Catholic Church, their greed triggered the Protestant revolution and led to centuries of war.)
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kcwayne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 08:51 AM
Response to Reply #12
16. The Soviet and Maoist killings were done in the name of the state
and not for the ideology of atheism. Although you could be executed for practicing religion under these regimes, the point was they viewed organized religion as counter-revolutionary and therefore a threat to the regime. Atheism was not central or primary to the premise of either government, in the sense that theism is central to the premise of organized religion.

Your larger point is well taken, but I just don't accept the Soviets or Maoists as representative of those that declare themselves to be atheists. They both governed over people that continued to be theists, and in fact continued to practice their religion, just less visibly.

I guess my larger point is that people that are bound to belief systems first using reason as a secondary consideration are more likely to do insanely stupid and evil things. And that is true whether the belief in God or the Great Leader.
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ElectroPrincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #12
17. No the real problem is organized religion gone wild ... remember
The Inquisition ... what a show!?!
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blitzen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 02:32 AM
Response to Original message
14. DUers...Beware!!! watch out for Neo-con agitprop!!!!
Edited on Fri Nov-19-04 02:39 AM by blitzen
Now, I'm NOT saying that this didn't happen. And I'm NOT saying, assuming it did happen, that it's not a crime against universal human rights. I AM saying that probably none of us knows if it did happen, and none of us knows (except perhaps the original poster) whether "iranpressnews" is a real journalistic outfit or a CIA/Iranian exile-sponsored propaganda crew. 'Tis the season for demonizing Iran!

Update: I checked out the "iranpressnews" homepage....Fairly crude and obvious propaganda, calling for a US-sponsored overthrow of the Iranian gov't.
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__Inanna__ Donating Member (246 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 04:16 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. Good point
But isn't it pathetic that we have to even think that way? Oops, now someone will call your point a *conspiracy theory*
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jjanpundt Donating Member (284 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 11:02 AM
Response to Reply #14
18. Personally, unless I see a news story about Iran from
an incredibly reliable source - Guardian, BBC, other reputable foreign press - I won't believe anything regarding Iran. The admin is gearing up its "hate Iran" machine and this makes all sensationalistic stories immediately suspect IMO. Deep cynicism to the fore and tinfoil hat firmly in place!
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Starlight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 11:15 PM
Response to Reply #14
20. I think you're right. This doesn't seem to be a real news site.
The only "news" is anti-Iranian & pro-American propaganda pieces. I checked mainstream Iranian news sources & I don't see anything of this story. If anyone can find it in a legitimate news source, please let us know.

http://www.world-newspapers.com/iran.html
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-05-04 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #14
30. Thanks, blitzen! I had planned to try to see what the heck was behind
this publication, as well.

Manufactured crap definitely all has the same ring, doesn't it? They are actually not too imaginative: portray the "enemy" you want to harm as the most depraved group of godless people on the face of the earth.

Ridicule them, show them as wild beast. Try to make them seem comical, and other times as desperately violent. Make them appear to be worthy of swift retribution. It's the RIGHT thing to do!

In the meantime, cross fingers and hope that among the READING public, usually Democrats, there will be a lot of memory lapses, and people won't remember true atrocities born right here, even under similar conditions, which, strangely, float by, usually, with hardly a lingering reflection.
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proudbluestater Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-06-04 01:36 AM
Response to Reply #14
36. Blitzen you are right on the money
Edited on Mon Dec-06-04 01:37 AM by proudbluestater
I called "Democratic" out on this last week when he posted about women being stoned and had folks in an uproar from a story at this same "site." Does anybody notice any good things about Iran being said in the so-called Iran Press? Does anybody wonder why it's only in English? Last week the choices were English and French -- only.

Beware postings by Democratic, folks.
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-06-04 10:37 PM
Response to Reply #36
44. Thanks. Your warning will save us time here.
Who doesn't know the rancor one can feel reading posts in all seriousness, then having to learn, after some consternation, and disgust, you're been jerked around!

Forewarned is forearmed! No time to get sucked in, for sure!
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fortyfeetunder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 06:35 PM
Response to Original message
19. this is truly pathetic
I thought children and individuals with certain medical conditions who could not fast were exempt from the fast. Guess 14 is not a child anymore. Someone was making an example of the kid.
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okasha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-05-04 02:34 PM
Response to Reply #19
35. If fifteen is the age of maturity for boys,
then a fourteen year old would be exempt. Guess whoever wrote the "news story" didn't do the research.

Okasha
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BeHereNow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-20-04 01:32 AM
Response to Original message
21. This sounds suspiciously like the incubator story to me...
Edited on Sat Nov-20-04 01:33 AM by BeHereNow
Sorry to be so cynical, but this story
sounds very much like a ploy to demonize Iran.
Anyone remember the Rendon Group?
the story of the BAD men throwing the newborns
on the cold hospital floor?
Sorry, I am skeptical of this story knowing that the
Cabal is itching to gain public support to strike
militarily in Iran.
"Oh, they are building nukes!"
"Oh, they lashed a boy to death!"
Cynically yours,
BHN
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BeHereNow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-20-04 01:43 AM
Response to Reply #21
22. IRAN PRESS NEWS is TOTAL BULL SHIT
Sorry guys, but this web site is a crock of proganistic shit.
I assure you, it is funded and run by NEOCON money.
EVERY fucking article on it is about human rights abuses
and the development of NUKES by the wicked brown people
in Iran.
BULL SHIT- complete propoganda, and I would lay money on
who is behind it.
bhn
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barb162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-20-04 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #22
25. if this story is true I wonder if the judge gets thrown in jail and I
wonder why the boy died...untreated infection from the wounds?
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-05-04 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #22
31. Thanks, BeHereNow. We shouldn't have to simply swallow this crap. n/t
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Raskolnik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-05-04 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #22
32. Unfortunately
Remember, just because the story is being used as propaganda doesn't mean its not true. There ARE horrible human rights abuses in many theocratic Muslim countries. Acknowledging that doesn't equate to supporting Bush.

The religious leaders of Iran are by and large some evil motherfuckers that do this kind of thing on a regular basis. That doesn't mean that invading their country is a solution, of course, but it does mean that its OK to condemn them for this behavior.

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proudbluestater Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-06-04 08:42 AM
Response to Reply #32
38. The public will never get onboard with this after Iraq
Edited on Mon Dec-06-04 08:45 AM by proudbluestater
Have you somehow forgotten Abu Ghraib? Guantanamo Bay? Bombing hospitals and the dire conditions that WE have caused in a Muslim country for NO GOOD REASON?

This propaganda will not fly; we have no moral authority in this country with our human rights abuses.

The Supreme Court has already ruled, for instance, that the people held in Guantanamo Bay cannot be held indefinitely without representation. And yet, the current regime will even defy its own Supreme Court. It will continue to torture and PROMOTE those who sanction it, rather than fire them outright. We have violated the Geneva Conventions over and over and this fascist regime is guilty of war crimes. Now tell me we will make life BETTER for Iranians. Ha.

We have a lawless administration with zero credibility. We are led by outlaws.
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Raskolnik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-06-04 09:13 AM
Response to Reply #38
39. "on board" with what?
I'm not sure I understand your point.

Just because our leaders are shitty doesn't mean these other leaders are anything other than horrible. I'm certainly not advocating war with Iran, but I have *no* problem condemning their leadership for actions like this.

This isn't a zero-sum game, people! There's enough bad to go around for multiple parties.
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DoctorMike Donating Member (2 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-05-04 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #22
34. Iran Press News
I was trying to figure out who these people were, because the web page is totally anonymous--who is paying for this thing and why?
It is obviously not advertiser supported.

http://www.whois.sc/iranpressnews.com

Says it is a private party who bought the domain through godaddy recently. But it won't say who.

This goes in my "heard it on the internet" file.


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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-20-04 09:51 PM
Response to Original message
23. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
talk hard Donating Member (549 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-05-04 08:04 AM
Response to Original message
27. It's bullshit but it's not our country.
We can abhor and protest stuff like this that happens in other countries, but I'm certain there are many things that happen here in America that incite the ire of nonAmericans. This story is devastatingly tragic, but it is their culture and not likely to change. Poor kid.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-05-04 08:57 AM
Response to Reply #27
28. The Islamic Penal Code of Iran --goggle it. Punishment is severe for
those who tresspass!
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Starlight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-06-04 09:09 PM
Response to Reply #27
42. And *AGAIN*...this is a FAKE NEWS website!!!!
Edited on Mon Dec-06-04 09:09 PM by Starlight
Why do people keep posting this? It's an American propoganda site, people!! Just preparing gullible sheeples to hate the Iranians in preparation for the upcoming war. :nuke:

-------------------------------------------------
www.iranpressnews.com (67.18.160.230)

67.18.0.0 - 67.19.255.255
ThePlanet.com Internet Services, Inc.
1333 North Stemmons Freeway
Suite 110
Dallas, TX
US


Pathos, Peter
abuse@theplanet.com
+1-214-782-7800

-------------------------------------------------
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max sg Donating Member (31 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-05-04 09:13 AM
Response to Original message
29. Too painful


This is a classic example where the most evil persecutions are done in the name of "God". It doesn't seem to matter whether it is Christian or Muslim.
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clem_c_rock Donating Member (989 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-06-04 04:02 AM
Response to Original message
37. LOOK AT THE RADICAL ARABS - TIME TO SEND IN THE B1'S!!!
And if we napalm their kids - it's only for their own damn good.

PATHETIC PROPAGANDA FOLKS!!!!!!!!!
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Bridget Burke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-06-04 03:18 PM
Response to Original message
40. Find one more source for this story....
Preferably, one that isn't 100% propaganda.

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