Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Israeli Agents Believed Involved in Abu Ghraib

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Editorials & Other Articles Donate to DU
 
SandyUSA Donating Member (57 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 12:29 AM
Original message
Israeli Agents Believed Involved in Abu Ghraib
This article is ODD because it comes from an ultra-neocon news website. I get their daily news E-mail just to keep up with what the opposition is saying. Why they would want to be revealing this info is beyond me! Sandy

Monday, May 24, 2004
Israeli Agents Believed Involved in Abu Ghraib

Diplomatic sources in Washington tell NewsMax's U.N. correspondent Stew Stogel that Israeli nationals are believed to be involved in the Iraq prison controversy.

"Israelis have been to Abu Ghraib and other prisons ," says one source familiar with the U.S. operations.

It was explained that the Israelis involved have been assigned as "civilian contractors" to work with Coalition forces in interrogating Iraqi POWs.

The "contractors" are said to be veterans of Israel's domestic intelligence unit, Shin Bet, as well as the more famous international intelligence agency, the Mossad.

"Who has better experience in dealing with the Arabs than Israel?" one source asked.

It was explained that several of the "interrogation" techniques used by U.S. forces in Iraq have in fact been used by Israel "for years."

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2004/5/24/131401.sht...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 01:14 AM
Response to Original message
1. Becasue they are setting Israel for the fall
I know it is complex

By the way, it does not mean that in reality we did not consult wiht ALL strategic allies in the region, including Israel... just that this is a set up... and I wish more people realized this

By the way, Israeli Nationals (as contract workers for CACI and TITAN, which are AMERICAN COMPANIES, with a contract with a state actor called the US) may be present or not. The same goes for South African Nationals, and I could go on.

By the way the other countries that we consulted with are Jordan (who have gotten some of our less than savory prisoners, I guess for the sites), and Egypt and Saudi Arabia... again got some of our prisoners. (I guess Club Med)

It is popular to use Israel in the blame game but our own people knew of how to torture arabs. Again another shock here, but we have been in the area since AT LEAST 1940, don't you think we have picked up a thing or two over those decades of playing in the sand box?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Alerter_ Donating Member (898 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 05:27 AM
Response to Reply #1
20. explain this conspiracy theory?
so, if Israel was involved, then it's a set up to blame it on Israel? Is AIPAC, one of the leading voices for war, also being set up?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
maggrwaggr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 01:21 AM
Response to Original message
2. is this one of the guys?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 01:32 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. We went thorhg this this morning
gang marking, they woudl not be THAT STUPID

I know you want to believe that
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MidwestTransplant Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 01:39 AM
Response to Reply #4
9. Jews don't get tattoos either (remotely religious ones).
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jpgray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 07:26 AM
Response to Reply #9
27. That's the orthodox scene, certainly, but there are Jews who get tattoos
Edited on Tue May-25-04 07:27 AM by jpgray
They won't be buried in a Jewish cemetary, but not everyone is broken up about that. This is not to say a single tattoo is any proof of Israeli involvement--a religious tattoo does seem like an oxymoron.

(incidentally my avatar has a hilarious bit on this very subject. :D)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SandyUSA Donating Member (57 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 01:36 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. About the tatoo & Israeli contractors
The scorpion means something. I e-mailed this photo to an Arab-American physician tonight, and asked him what it means. I have read somewhere but cannot remember... although maybe it is just a sting killer symbol, which is bad enough.

As to anyone trying to say that Israeli "contractors" have less to do with the prison interrogations and abuses than South African or Tasmanian "contractors" is ridiculous and misleading. The neo-cons who led us into this war are all associated with the ultra-Zionists in Israel who plan only by hook or by crook the eventual expulsion of all Palestinians. Our military was doing training sessions with Israeli forces based on the scourge techniques used in the West Bank and Gaza. Ask any Arab who has been in an Israeli prison if this scenario is not one they are already very familiar with. Yes, we Americans and other humans are quite capable of cruelty of our own devices, but much of this was in effect MADE IN ISRAEL.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 01:39 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. Yep and the scorpion is also used
by the gangs in the southland together with the star of david

Look it is this simple, when it comes to International law

EVEN IF there were Israeli Contractors, they were working for a US Company hired by a State Actor CALLED THE UNITED STATES... so time we face the music and stop pulling a Bush... what was done in our name was done by OUR EMPLOYEES and OUR TAX MONEY

I must add, the Mossad would not be that stupid...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
saigon68 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 05:37 AM
Response to Reply #2
22. What the hell is this???
Where did you get that picture?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Dover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 01:29 AM
Response to Original message
3. It's no secret that the U.S. is modeling it's policies and techniques on
Israel's. Besides intelligence gathering techniques, the U.S. has followed Israel's lead in it's pre-emptive approach, and in it's acceptance of assassination of leaders (rather than bringing them to trial). This is also why the Geneva conventions are so unacceptable to the neocons.

I don't know if the Israelis are being set up as I'm not sure this article is at all apologetic about these new interrogation techniques.

If they are attempting to shift blame (nothing new for Bushco) I doubt they'll get away with it....even if it's true. All this could do is hurt Bushco and his adoption of these techniques.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 01:33 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. It is a shift
the tactics are not only those used by Israel, but Jordan, Egypt, Saudi Arabia, and other countries in the region.

Wonder why ONLY ISRAEL is mentioned?

Need I mention oh Dark September?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SandyUSA Donating Member (57 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 01:40 AM
Response to Reply #5
10. Because it is Israeli interrogators who are there!
Simple. NewsMax is Limbaugh mentality. For this article to originate with them as a smear on Israel is highly unlikely. This is not an issue that will be long in contention because there is too much evidence.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 01:45 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. There is also evidence of South Africans
There is evidence of ISI people on the ground

There is evidence of Ghurkhas

There is evidence of Salvadorans and Chileans

Did I mention the South Africans?

What you have evidence is of a whole sale MERCENARY operation runnning amock with Nationals FROM MANY nationalities

At the end of the day, WE are responsible... this is INTERNATIONAL LAW... I know you cannot or will not see this.

I know ISRAEL, ISRAEL... I have seen this movie before, sadly... in the 1930s

Not that the Neo Cons are not responsible and the Israelis were not consulted... they were, but so were the Jordanians, the Egyptians (both nations have tortured Prisoners for us), or for that matter the Saudis... WHY IS THAT?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Alerter_ Donating Member (898 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 05:34 AM
Response to Reply #12
21. Israel was around in the 1930s?
"I know ISRAEL, ISRAEL... I have seen this movie before, sadly... in the 1930s"

Israel was around in the 1930s? I hope you are not confusing "Jews" with "Israel", are you anti-semitic?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Pachamama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 01:37 AM
Response to Original message
7. Purposely throwing this info out to infuriate & inflame the muslim world?
What if, they are purposely "leaking" this info (and who knows maybe it is true as well) to the media in order to infuriate and anger and fuel the fire that is already burning in the hearts of the muslim world that hates US and Israel and thus leads to increases in "tensions" and attacks and then - the reason for more "offensive" actions in the name of "freedom" from terrorism...hmmmm...Iran? Syria? Who's next?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 01:41 AM
Response to Reply #7
11. That is a far more logical explanation
and also shifting responsibilty, this has been done over
the course of history before.

Anybody who has studied the history of persecution knows how
this is done.

Notice nobody mentions our other ALLIES in the area...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SandyUSA Donating Member (57 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 01:46 AM
Response to Reply #7
13. Wow, you thought of something I didn't
Edited on Tue May-25-04 01:47 AM by SandyUSA
In regrad to: Purposely throwing this info out to infuriate & inflame the muslim world?

You may be right. The goal of the neo-cons is not really democracy in the Middle East. It is division and domination of the region. Calming things down is not really on their agenda. More conflict, more rage from the Arab and Muslim world, and more justification for US attacks against these "terrorists" we have fomented -- that is what Perle, Wolfowitz, and all the others named on 60 Minutes II the other night have in mind. And it is not anti-Semitic to say so. There are many Jewish Americans and Israeli peace activists who oppose their plans.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 01:50 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Ah you are seeing the light
this is the game they are playing

Oh and by the way, Perle and Wolfie are no friends of any Jew I know off... never mind they claim to be Jewish... they remind me of another bunch again back in the 30s.

Oh and it really does not matter if the info is on the up and up or not. There are plenty of people WILLING to believe it...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SandyUSA Donating Member (57 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 01:54 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. What bunch in the 1930s?
Oh and by the way, Perle and Wolfie are no friends of any Jew I know off... never mind they claim to be Jewish... they remind me of another bunch again back in the 30s.

Are you referring to the Troskyists like Irving Krystol? My spelling may be off tonight..
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 02:00 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. In the US
but no, they remind me of the leadership of the Jewish Community in Germany, Austria and Poland....

They cooperated with the Nazis and set the way for the Holocaust.

These boys are doing the same, cooperating with those who are trying to bring Armagedon forth, and a Second Holocaust

They are aslo Strausians, hence they will do all they need to do for power.

So "leaking" this and shifting blame now that the war is going bad to Israel (and the Likud had some responsibility) will only help to inflame things, and alas keep them in power. They will not mention that the Arab Security Services gave them in some cases more sensitive help (as in torturing prisoners from Afghanistan). Why? If they did, we may face a street revolt in Amman, but if we leak out that Israel was involved, well the best seller in the M.E is the International Jew, they are playing to that exact mentality.

Oh and by the way, as a student of the holocaust, and a child of the holocaust I am doing all I can to prevent another one, whether it involves Jews or Muslims it does not matter... I see these boys for what they are... STRAUSSIANS
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SandyUSA Donating Member (57 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 03:04 AM
Response to Reply #16
18. STRAUSS
Hmm, I see you are well informed. And indeed the dreadful thing about the Jewish Zionists (and/or STRAUSSIANS) playing around with the support of Christian Zionists is that it may lead to a Holocaust of all Israelis, the surrounding areas, not to mention incineration for a lot of the rest of the world. It is a horror.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 03:21 AM
Response to Reply #18
19. I would not even call them Zionists
Edited on Tue May-25-04 03:23 AM by nadinbrzezinski
just like many other terms that have been dirited over the years, Zionism has been dirtied as well

I wonder if Ben Gurion is also kicking and screaming with our
founding fathers... Oh I am sure he is... after all the Likud has NEVER been Zionist, but something else...

Yes not well known, in the midst of the War for Independence, they were almost arrested by the Hagganah... as they were about to launch a civil war

They are the reason for not going behind the green line... and they are extremists

but again, they are truly not zionists either...

And I wish people also realized this.

As to these boys, the alliance is a very dangerous one... with the fundies... and could very well lead to WW III, doesn't Wooseley

desperately want one? Oh yes... he does.

Oh and the christian zionists, what a crock of... I know they beleive they are, but you cannot be for the survival of a people or a state, or waht have you, just to destroy it at the end of days...

Strange times we live in...

But that is why this story fits a pattern... and a very worrisome pattern

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Alerter_ Donating Member (898 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 05:38 AM
Response to Reply #16
23. nadinbrzezinski, like the "Transfer Agreement"?
"They cooperated with the Nazis and set the way for the Holocaust."

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DavidFL Donating Member (236 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 03:01 AM
Response to Reply #7
17. I heard this said about the AG photos listening to the radio one night...
...that the reason why those pictures were taken was that they were intended to be publicized and shown around. If that is the neocons' intent, they are not being given enough credit for their planning skills because they're sure as hell doing a bang up job of ticking off Arabs and Muslims. At the same time though, it really doesn't make complete sense to me because those photos essentially implicate a whole bunch of people in the commission of war crimes and majorly ticked off the uniforms in the Pentagon. Between that and the Chalabi/Iran thing, I really don't know what to believe anymore.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
0007 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 05:45 AM
Response to Reply #7
24. Makes sense to me. News Max is a propaganda poop sheet
to incite and cause problems. Just like that idiot Rush Limbaugh.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ze_dscherman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 05:53 AM
Response to Original message
25. Arab sources reported this weeks ago
I remember reading reports accusing Israeli interrogators/translators involved, from Saudi/Lebanese papers. Didn't pay much attention to it, since it was only speculations - too propaganda prone. No link, sorry.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GeronimoSkull Donating Member (335 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 06:15 AM
Response to Original message
26. Titan and CACI's Israeli connections
The Israeli Torture Template
Rape, Feces and Urine-Dipped Cloth Sacks
http://www.counterpunch.org/madsen05102004.html
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Thu Jul 31st 2014, 09:13 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Editorials & Other Articles Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC