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Antonin Scalia: Cross is Symbol of All Religions

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Stingo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 06:42 AM
Original message
Antonin Scalia: Cross is Symbol of All Religions
Christians do not get a special claim on the cross as the symbol of Christ having been crucified for our sins, not if Antonin Scalias interpretation has any bearing. Scalia claimed in the Supreme Court that the cross is not a special symbol to honor Christian dead, but to honor all dead. Muslims and Jews likely agree that Scalia is a whackjob.

http://allspinzone.com/wp/2009/10/08/antonin-scalia-cro...
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ixion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 06:45 AM
Response to Original message
1. The depth of human ignorance (hubris?) never ceases to amaze me
that is a ridiculous statement that reflects (or maliciously implies) a total ignorance for the various religions of the world.
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cognoscere Donating Member (381 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 10:21 AM
Response to Reply #1
16. Fat Tony's belief
that an innocent person who is found guilty has somehow had a full and fair trial, clearly demonstrates that the man is seriously fucked up in the head. That such a grossly mental incompetent is on the "Supreme Court" demonstrates how fucked up our government is.
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Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #1
23. Tony's a Catholic, Ignorance Is His Creed
all good Catholics MUST be ignorant. Otherwise, they are no good to the Church or the Unholiness.
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saltpoint Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 06:46 AM
Response to Original message
2. Chronologically, Antinuous was one of the last gods to be worshipped in the
cascade of gods and goddesses out there.

Let's put a statue of Antinuous in Scalia's church and see how he likes it.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 06:47 AM
Response to Original message
3. Is he being checked for Alzheimer's?
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Stingo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 08:44 AM
Response to Reply #3
13. That was my first thought this morning
My wife talked me down.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #13
32. Or teeny tiny TIAs?
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ejpoeta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 06:52 AM
Response to Original message
4. he's assuming that 'all' religions are christian ones. I can't stand when people think like this.
They think THEIR religion is the religion and all the rest are not. Makes me sick. The cross is the symbol of JESUS being put on a CROSS... so of course it is a christian symbol. Idiots!!
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ChairmanAgnostic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 07:41 AM
Response to Reply #4
8. "Think" is probably the wrong choice of word here.
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badgerpup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 01:45 PM
Response to Reply #4
29. Well...he does have a point...sorta...
...and I don't mean just the one on top of his head.

Christianity, when it first started out, had a distressing habit of swallowing any other religions with which it came into contact, bending and shaping their myths and deities into the Christian pantheon.

Not going to go into detail, but quite a few of the saints have had a Christian paintjob in order to conceal their 'pagan' background.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 05:59 AM
Response to Reply #4
43. This proves he is
unfit to be a supreme court justice.
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bigbrother05 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 06:58 AM
Response to Original message
5. So why does Arlington use different symbols on headstones?
If it's all the same, why was there such a stink over the Wiccan symbol a few months back. Surely there is no need for all those six-pointed stars cluttering up a national monument.

:sarcasm: (for those that just have to have a "proper" symbol)
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ChairmanAgnostic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 07:41 AM
Response to Reply #5
9. it was all a mistake. Give Scalia a chance to fix it, and he will
by banning all those other faux symbols.
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drm604 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 07:01 AM
Response to Original message
6. This illustrates the mindset of people like Scalia.
Their symbols, their culture, are the norm - sort of the base assumption. Anything else is simply a variation from that norm.

This kind of thinking should not be present in any of our courts, let alone the highest court in the land.
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Recursion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 07:37 AM
Response to Original message
7. strictly, it's an international cartographical symbol for any religious site
But yeah, he's a moron.
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Warren Stupidity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 07:49 AM
Response to Original message
10. Not stupidity: arrogant contempt. nt.
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DrZeeLit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 07:52 AM
Response to Original message
11. Ah... he's been reading Dan Brown's new book, hasn't he. How charming......
Court decisions based on popular culture.

What will they think of next?
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Kahuna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 08:06 AM
Response to Original message
12. scalia is a menace. That is all. nt
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freethought Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 09:15 AM
Response to Original message
14. Of all Religons?
What if you're an atheist? Or and agnostic?

What's the symbol for those Antonin?
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Stingo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 09:25 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. That one is a circle, I think
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Sam1 Donating Member (136 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 10:23 AM
Response to Original message
17. Scalia is a great illustration of what Harry G. Frankfurt calls
a bullshitter. He has the "Truth" and will make statements in support with out concern for "truth." The only consideration is to advance the "Truth".

What I think many have missed is the implication, which he is advancing, that the cross is how a Christian county honors its dead. Scalia is not a wackjob, and you under-estimate him with such a label.
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 10:35 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. Are there Catholic Dominionists?
I thought Dominionism was a purely protestant malady.
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Sam1 Donating Member (136 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 04:31 PM
Response to Reply #18
35. I don't think it is dominionism as much as it is the belief that the
Catholic Church is the one true Church presided over by the Vicar of Christ.
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smoogatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 12:15 PM
Response to Reply #17
22. He's a fascist.
A fascist is not a reasonable thing to be, obviously. Therefore he's a whack-job.
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Sam1 Donating Member (136 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #22
33. Given his defense of the 5th and 6th amendments he is a strange
kind of fascist. He is not one to be demonized and underestimated. Sotomayor(likely as not misspelled) may turnout to be a good a counter balance as we can get.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 06:04 AM
Response to Reply #22
44. Yup. nt
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kleec Donating Member (117 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 11:00 AM
Response to Original message
19. .
Scalia is the height of arrogance and ignorance.
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benld74 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 11:05 AM
Response to Original message
20. BS! I CALL BS Scalia you douche bag!
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Stingo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 01:48 PM
Response to Reply #20
30. DoucheBecKKKK
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smoogatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 12:14 PM
Response to Original message
21. Antonin Scalia is a symbol for all fascist douchebags.
Fascist douchebags of every race and denomination recognize Scalia as an emblem for broad-based idiocy of all kinds.
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Dollface Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #21
25. I'm not sure who should be more insulted, fascists or douchebags.
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smoogatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. Douchebags.
Fascists in this country don't know what the word "fascist" means, so they can't be insulted by it.
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Dollface Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. Excellent point
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 06:05 AM
Response to Reply #25
45. LMAO! nt
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pokerfan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 12:21 PM
Response to Original message
24. PZ Myers
Supreme Court Justice Scalia is a supremely clueless jerk

This exchange with Scalia is simply stunning: the man is an incompetent ideologue who I wouldn't trust to rule on a parking ticket. Can we have him impeached? Here's how he reacted when told that non-Christians might object a teeny-tiny bit to having their dead memorialized with a gigantic Christian symbol.

"The cross doesn't honor non-Christians who fought in the war?" Scalia asks, stunned.

"A cross is the predominant symbol of Christianity, and it signifies that Jesus is the son of God and died to redeem mankind for our sins," replies Eliasberg, whose father and grandfather are both Jewish war veterans.

"It's erected as a war memorial!" replies Scalia. "I assume it is erected in honor of all of the war dead. The cross is the most common symbol of of of the resting place of the dead."

Eliasberg dares to correct him: "The cross is the most common symbol of the resting place of Christians. I have been in Jewish cemeteries. There is never a cross on a tombstone of a Jew."

"I don't think you can leap from that to the conclusion that the only war dead the cross honors are the Christian war dead," thunders Scalia. "I think that's an outrageous conclusion!"

Far less outrageous is the conclusion that religious symbols are not religious.

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unblock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 12:30 PM
Response to Original message
27. as usual, scalia forms his conclusion first and searches for suitable fig leaf rationale later
it's obvious how he'll vote, and it's almost as obvious that he doesn't have an intellectual leg to stand on.
hence his frustration, evident in calling a logical argument not merely faulty, but "outrageous".

i wonder if a predominantly jewish town, say, skokie, illinois, were to erect a star of david and call it a "war monument" and claim it was honoring all war dead, not just jewish ones, and some christians complained, i wonder if scalia would reach the same conclusion.

actually, no, i don't wonder. i don't wonder at all.
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Sam1 Donating Member (136 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 04:24 PM
Response to Reply #27
34. Pretty much the definition of a bullshitter
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winyanstaz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 02:45 PM
Response to Original message
31. As a Pagan I have to agree with a little bit of that...as.......
Edited on Thu Oct-08-09 02:47 PM by winyanstaz
The Pagans used a cross with a short "stem" called a 4-directions..to carry it in parades a longer handle was added on the bottom.
This was the norm long before Christians stole the pagan cross...just as they stole the holidays. (such as Easter/Ester/Ostara..where the pagans gave decorated eggs as symbols of fertility and Christmas/Yule/...where the pagans brought in an evergreen tree and placed lights/candles on the tree and gave gifts.)
You see..for one thing...the romans did NOT use the cross as depicted nowday..they used a T- shape to crucify people on.
This also explains why when the Christians showed up in Ireland..there were already crosses with the celtic knots (for the sacred circle) there.
The cross does not belong to only the Christians.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 06:07 AM
Response to Reply #31
46. But it is not universal.
And that is the point.
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winyanstaz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #46
51. agreed..it is not universal.
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FiveGoodMen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 05:17 PM
Response to Original message
36. Those who confirmed his appointment should be charged criminally
Or hung.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 07:31 PM
Response to Original message
37. Scalia is surely the epitome of Christianity and acting like a Christian...
:sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm:


:sarcasm:
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Island Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 07:46 PM
Response to Original message
38. Scalia is a symbol of all idiots.
Not just idiots who wear robes.
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sakabatou Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 09:16 PM
Response to Original message
39. Someone give me a clue-by-four
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Democrats_win Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-08-09 10:24 PM
Response to Original message
40. Would you worship the gun if your son was killed by a gun?
Some say that early "christianity" adopted the cross from other religions so that a transition from the other religion to "christianity" would be smoother.

Also, the actual method in which Jesus was crucified was likely not the t-shaped cross associated with "christianity."

Finally, the ten commandments forbid worshiping objects such as carved images of animals, objects in the sky etc. Essentially, cross worship is forbidden.
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PSzymeczek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 12:13 AM
Response to Original message
41. Um....
No.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 05:57 AM
Response to Original message
42. Convoluted logic.
The same logic that, after duck hunting with Dick Cheney, enabled him to not recuse himself when the SCOTUS ruled on Dick's secret energy meetings.
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OneBlueSky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 10:15 AM
Response to Original message
47. definining "intellectual" downward . . . n/t
.
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niyad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 12:30 PM
Response to Original message
48. umm, tony?? the cross is NOT a symbol of my belief system, so bugger off
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JohnWxy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 01:09 PM
Response to Original message
49. I'm sure Scalia didn't have this in mind but the 'Christian' cross symbol was appropriated from the
Egyptian symbol for life, the Ankh. The Christians just modified it by closing the loop at the top.

I always wondered why if this was supposed to be the Crucifix why it had a piece jutting up above the horizontal piece, since the Roman device for crucifying criminals and other ne'er-do-wells was a 'T' shaped affair. When I saw an Ankh it was immediately apparent where the symbol came from.

The symbol is much older than Christianity.
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yellowcanine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-09-09 02:24 PM
Response to Original message
50. I agree that Scalia is a symbol of ignorance to all peoples.
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