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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-07-09 01:57 PM
Original message
The Crusade to Defeat Obama Intelligence Pick Hurts All Jews
The Crusade to Defeat Obama Intelligence Pick Hurts All Jews

MJ Rosenberg
Director of Policy for the Israel Policy Forum


The effort to force President Obama to withdraw the nomination of Chas Freeman as chairman of the National Intelligence Council is getting creepy.

Initially, it was just typically ugly. The forces that support the Likud line on Israel always try to block any appointment of anyone who opposes Israeli policies in the occupied territories. During the past eight years they got accustomed to having their people in virtually every foreign policy post. They were called neocons and one of that group's many successes was manipulating the intelligence that got us into Iraq (see Feith, Douglas).

So it was natural that when President Obama apointed someone who was on the record as strongly opposing the occupation they would go ballistic -- and they did.

Steve Rosen, the indicted former AIPAC official, organized a full-court attack on Freeman, enlisting all the usual suspects (the New Republic crowd, the Weekly Standard crowd, and their various and sundry camp followers). Journalists all over Washington were contacted not only by Rosen but by his former employers to take down Freeman.

It was all about Israel, of course. Everyone involved in the anti-Freeman effort are staunch allies of the lobby.

But focusing only on Israel did not look good. So the "get Freeman" bunch decided to feign interest in his alleged ties to Saudi Arabia (of course, that is all about Israel, too) and, get this, his supposed lack of sympathy to Chinese dissidents. The latest is that they are accusing him of taking Saudi money for his foundation and are demanding that this be investigated in the name of good government.

But it's all about Israel.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mj-rosenberg/the-crusade-...
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ZombieHorde Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-07-09 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
1. I don't see how this "hurts all Jews". nt
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peacetalksforall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-07-09 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. It doesn't. It is essential to make distinctions. There are plenty of Jews who
Edited on Sat Mar-07-09 03:12 PM by peacetalksforall
are up front operatives and supporters of the Likud Party (and others) and their plans for kicking out the Palestinians and continuing to disallow rights, homes, business, land, freedom of movement. And there is xx per cent of Jews who are not on board, who seek peace and co-rights for Palestinians or some who probably don't have an opinion. Best to distinguish between Jews and Israelis and Israel paid promoters in the U.S. and especially in the U.S. Government whose outright purpose to support 'Likud' in policy.
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-07-09 02:52 PM
Response to Original message
2. AIPAC RRRAWWWXXXX, Freeman SSSSSUXXXXXX!!!!!!!!!
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-07-09 02:56 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. The self-described pro-Israel crowd are her worst enemies
Pro-Israel is the equivalent of Pro-American.

Pro-American. We know who they are. They are the uber-nationalists, flag-waiving, 'Support the Troops' magnetic ribbon crowd. They are the ones that cheered as our troops invaded Iraq. They are the ones that furiously attacked anyone questioning the government's rationale for the war.

What has Iraq done to our country? It has bankrupted our nation. It has left us a legacy of wounded and emotionally damaged veterans. It has filled our cemeteries with the graves of men and women too young to be dead.

A reasonable argument can be made that those that fit the above description of 'Pro-American' were enablers of the destruction of America, for they supported policies and politicians that led to our debacle in Iraq. The sensible conclusion being that those that opposed the war in Iraq were the true pro-Americans for they foresaw the harm that such a war of aggression would cause to Iraqi society, its people, and to our own people.

Now replace the label 'Pro-American' with the "Pro-Israel' label, and you can draw a similar analogy that those that most fiercely defend Israel's policies and governments are indeed enabling the destruction of Israel, while those that call for a return of the pre-1967 borders and for justice for Palestinians are the true 'Pro-Israel' advocates.

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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-07-09 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. The Palestinians will get justice when their leaders decide to pursue justice,
instead of idiotic terrorism.

Conflating our war on the fantasy Iraq threat with Israel's real struggle to cope with an eliminationist quasi-government on its doorstep is a looooong stretch.
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-07-09 03:20 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. On the Freeman issue, I would trust Obama more than I would AIPAC
or the GOP scum.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-07-09 05:36 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. It's smug attitudes like that that keep wars going! There is only one war I know of
in the modern era, that qualifies for such a black and white attitude--and that is the war against Hitler, and possibly the war against Japan. Every other war that I know of, in our era, is a fuzzy situation with two sides that have justifications for fighting. Often it is one with the most fire power that has the least justification--I'm thinking mainly of the U.S. war on Vietnam, and the two U.S. wars on Iraq, especially the second, and of course the many "dirty wars" that the U.S. has unjustly fought--against Nicaragua, El Salvador, Chile, Argentina and others, and the horror we are involved in--with $6 BILLION in U.S. military aid, and U.S.military personnel, and Blackwater--in Colombia right now; as well as the dirty rotten attempted fascist junta this last September in Bolivia, run out of the U.S. (Bushwhack) embassy.

There are two sides in Colombia. According to Amnesty International, 92% of the murders of union leaders in Colombia are committed by the Colombian military (about half) and its closely tied rightwing death squads (the other half), with only 2% committed by the FARC, the armed leftist guerrillas (and the rest are common crimes). These stats hold up for the deaths of political leftists, human rights workers and others as well. And the death toll includes peasant farmers and youths whom the Colombian military or rightwing death squads kill and dress up as FARC, to up their 'body count,' to impress U.S. senators. There are "two sides" but one of them has $6 BILLION in U.S. military aid, and is held up as a paragon of democratic virtue--when nothing could be further from the truth--and the other is demonized as "terrorists." The FARC kidnap; they kill some people--though far fewer than the fascists. To end the 40+ year Colombian civil war, these two sides have to be brought together. Both sides have to be listened to. The injuries that both sides have inflicted, and suffered, need to be put aside, so that peace can occur. If one side keeps getting propped up with billions in military aid, it will never end.

The situation in Bolivia in September was rather different. The Bolivian government did not fire one shot. It was the injured party. U.S.-funded and organized rioters tore down government and NGO buildings, beat up indigenous, blew up a gas pipeline, and machine-gunned some 30 unarmed peasants. Still, for the sake of peace--after President Morales threw the U.S. ambassador and the DEA out of Bolivia, the new South American Common Market--UNASUR--unanimously ralled to his support, and was able to bring the parties together, to prevent a split up of Bolivia (the fascists are white separatists and wanted to secede, in their eastern provinces, and take Bolivia's main gas/oil reserves with them), and to enable a peaceful vote on Bolivia's new Constitution (which allows the provinces and indigenous tribes some autonomy).

Talking and putting aside phrases like "idiotic terrorism" is necessary for peace. The white separatists posed a mortal threat to Bolivia, yet the Bolivian government sought detente and an end to the violence, and the chance for the sides to work together for the greater good. The white separatists were trying to create exactly what you describe--"an eliminationist quasi-government" not just on Bolivia's doorstep, but within Bolivia. This insurrection was aimed at destroying the Morales government and Bolivia's democracy, by absconding with its main natural resources.

To make peace you have to end war. There is no other way. And I'm afraid that the situation of Israel/Palestine is similar to Colombia--a more than 40+ year, seemingly insoluable conflict, with both sides feeling greatly aggrieved, both sides having reasonable arguments about the security and welfare of their people, and reasons for fighting, for a very long time, and for wanting to eliminate the other. The Colombian rightwing feels that they are in a "real struggle" to cope with an armed leftist guerrilla army. The rightwing's drug trafficking, corruption and death squads aside, they--or rather the people they represent--have a point: their lack of safety and security. And the FARC guerrillas--and many non-armed leftists in Colombia--also have a point: the social injustice in Colombia, and the greater brutality of the Colombian military, with its U.S.-funded fire power.

How do you stop this war? How do you create peace for everyone? If you want peace, you have to end war. You have to stop demonizing the other side, as if they were not human. And if you have superior fire power and go the way of crushing an insurgency with legitimate grievances, you will end up like Colombia, with such disastrous carnage all over the landscape and such vast corruption, that you invite your own demise--which is what I fear Israel is doing.

You do Israel no favor by asserting that the Palestinians don't want justice, and are engaged in "idiotic terrorism." You contribute to the illusion of Israel's rightwing that Israel can exist as an armed medieval fortress, in the midst of hostile neighbors, and not crumble from within, or lose all U.S. support, due to its injustice (or our bankruptcy), or be ultimately defeated. How can Israel achieve peace--and healthy, honest relations with its neighbors? It has to be done--so, how can it be done?
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-07-09 06:14 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. K&R
Edited on Sat Mar-07-09 06:14 PM by IndianaGreen
Can't recommend individual posts, but if the software were to allow it, this post of yours definitely deserves a hearty recommendation.

:fistbump:
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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-07-09 06:29 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. "armed medieval fortress"
An excellent analogy, one the islamic fundie nuts like too, and we all know how it worked out the last time. The notion that Israel can exist in a permanent state of war with all around it in perpetuity is not correct.
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 01:49 AM
Response to Reply #9
17. Your attribution of smugness is an exercise in projection.
When the odds are 400,000 to 1, smugness is not an option.

And I think you understand that well.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 09:39 AM
Response to Reply #17
24. The odds are evened out a bit by $12 billion/yr in U.S. military aid and nuclear weapons,
don't you think? I presume that, by 400,000 to 1, you are referring to the entire Islamic world, versus Israel, and presuming also that the entire Islamic world intends to wipe Israel out? Correct me if I'm wrong. I'm finding your comment enigmatic. And I'm not sure who you are including in the 400,000. First of all, I think that's a wrong presumption. I think the Islamic world is a mixed bag, as various as our own culture, in political views. Secondly, I think the attitude that Palestinians do not seek justice, and are engaged in "idiotic terrorism" is, indeed, smug. I am not projecting. It is very similar to U.S. flag-waver bigotry that all "ragheads" are "terrorists." I am not saying that Israel is not in peril. But I think that half the reason that Israel is in peril is the rightwing Israeli attitude toward, and actions against, the Palestinians. And another part of it is the "armed medieval fortress" part. By being armed to the teeth, largely by the U.S., Israel maintains the illusion that that condition can go on indefinitely--and it insulates Israel from taking the many actions it should be taking to create friends in the region, or at least healthy productive alliances.

I'm trying to think of an example. Say that France had decided to reassert a presence in the U.S. during our civil war era, and had armed Louisiana during the civil war, and say that LA had therefore managed to fight off the Union army, and was able to maintain itself as a separate, independent state--and also to maintain slavery--by trading with France out of the port of New Orleans. To maintain its independence, LA would have to remain armed to the teeth, and it would obviously have hostile relations with the U.S., which had banned slavery, and which had lost a chunk of its territory. Now imagine a leader in LA, who has inherited this situation some time later, and sees that it can't continue indefinitely--it has to change. LA cannot continue as an armed camp, a vassel of France, surrounded by hostile neighbors. The first thing to do--to work toward a detente with the U.S.--would be to end slavery. Secondly, strong diplomacy with the surrounding states, and with the U.S. government. Also, gradual disarmament. Also, gradual cutting of direct ties with France--perhaps an anti-colonial movement would be in order. The best thing for LA would be peace, and perhaps eventually re-joining the Union. How do you achieve it, after a long history of hostility?

You can imagine the patriotic feelings, the anger, the history of injuries, and various kinds of bigotry, on both sides. Some in LA would think that all the slaves were anti-LA--an "enemy within." They would probably treat them more harshly, even cage them up, in the interim. Those in the U.S. would consider all LA-ers to be traitors and white supremicists. Etc. Etc. To achieve peace--the best condition for all--this history of mutual injury has to be jettisoned, and a new social and diplomatic pact achieved. By saying that Palestinians do not seek justice--something that is obviously untrue--you are still trapped in the history of past wrongs, inflicted by both sides. You can't envision a peaceful future.

Granted, there may be some smugness in my being able to say this. I am not an Israeli, nor a Palestinian--and have no direct stake in that conflict, other than my desire that Israel survive, and successfully integrate itself in the Middle East context, for a peaceful future. That is my main desire. I don't have a lot of sympathy with Arab culture. But, because I am removed--and have no direct stake (other than my tax dollars being spent on military aid)--I think I am able to see it more objectively, the way a diplomat and a peace negotiator must see the conflict, in order to help resolve it.

What would your solution be? Continued hostility--forever? But it won't be forever. Either Israel or the U.S., or both, will be bankrupted by it, and collapse from within. That is what war does. Or what? Completely crush the Palestinians--cage them in, shoot all their rebels? That is the path that Israel is on, led by the rightwing and war profiteers, and it is also a suicidal path, because Israel will end up with no friends in the world at all, and its lonely, "surrounded" status will be worsened. Israel cannot survive by means of weaponry and war. It must start living up to its ideals, creating friends, and reaching out diplomatically to its own region. It cannot keep relying on "big brother" to back it up, because "big brother" is in big, big financial trouble, and also moral, ethical, constitutional and every other kind of trouble. We just slaughtered a million innocent Arabs to get their oil! This has gravely harmed our ability to help Israel, and to achieve any credibility at all in the Islamic world. So Israel needs to start seeing to its own credibility and diplomacy and future. And in my opinion that means changing, abandoning this militaristic stance, and becoming diplomats.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-07-09 04:45 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. Excellent point, IndianaGreen! I agree! nt
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peacetalksforall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-07-09 03:15 PM
Response to Original message
6. Subject to learning more - I will take a supportive position favoring Freeman.
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Purveyor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-07-09 06:30 PM
Response to Original message
12. Thank you for posting... K&R eom
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yurbud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-07-09 10:19 PM
Response to Original message
13. when will people separate anti-Israeli ethnic cleansing and anti-semitism?
If someone didn't like Bush, we didn't call them anti-WASPitic.
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Behind the Aegis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-07-09 10:28 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. Probably at the same time people actual learn about Israel and what is happening...
...and quit spewing idiotic propaganda about ethnic cleansing, genocide, and apartheid.
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yurbud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 12:00 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. what would you call it if it wasn't Israel & Palestine, and the group with superior arms
was killing the other side ten to one and encroaching on the land they live on with the excuse that the prior occupants never had direct title since they had dominated by various past empires?

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Behind the Aegis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 03:50 AM
Response to Reply #15
18. I would call it war.
War isn't always "fair." Much like life. It doesn't mean it is right, but it also doesn't make it the bullshit you are trying to peddle.
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yurbud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 04:27 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. is it a just war when one country decides they want real estate that other people already live on?
Israel should either make the occupied territories part of Israel or let it go instead of trying to make life insufferable for Palestinians so they will leave.

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Behind the Aegis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 04:35 AM
Response to Reply #20
21. Well, if that is all you know about the situation, it explains your earlier ignorant post.
Were it as simple as the anti-Israel crowd wished, of course, if they had their way, there would no longer be an Israel.

"Israel should either make the occupied territories part of Israel or let it go instead of trying to make life insufferable for Palestinians so they will leave." Incredible ignorance right here on DU, but it is OK because it "acceptable" bigotry.
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yurbud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 05:28 AM
Response to Reply #21
22. please post your enlightening information. Your insults aren't persuasive, they're just lazy
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Behind the Aegis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #22
25. Of course they are lazy, as lazy as your tired propaganda.
But, then again, I am sure you know it is propaganda.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 07:25 AM
Response to Reply #18
23. War? War isn't always fair?
Do you admit to being a Nazi?
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Behind the Aegis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 02:11 PM
Response to Reply #23
26. Do you admit to being a bigot?
Sounds like it with that post.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 08:18 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. My point is
anyone that disagree with radical right wing politics in Israel, in your mind is a bigot. You have it backwards. Israel is not always right, same with the U.S.
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Behind the Aegis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. Your point falls flat on its face because it is untrue.
You, like many others, make up shit and expect it to be taken as gospel. Well, here is a newsflash for you, correcting or even attacking anti-Israel propaganda is not equivalent to finding all Israeli policies correct or thinking Israel is always right. Only in the minds of the shallow anti-Israel bigots is anyone who dares not always speak ill of Israel considered RW or propagating the "Israel is always right" mantra.

So before telling me what my position is, learn to read and understand what has been written, then you won't be like so many here who throw out strawmen at anyone who isn't a rapid anti-Israel propagandist.
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yurbud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 12:00 AM
Response to Reply #14
16. Just because Israelis are our cultural cousins doesn't mean their shit doesn't stink
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Behind the Aegis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 03:51 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. Aristotle? Is that you?
:eyes:
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wuvuj Donating Member (874 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-08-09 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #16
27. Two peas in a pod?
Zionism and Manifest Destiny. Dumb and DUMBER?
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