White House says alleged abuse of Iraqi prisoners is 'despicable'.

[Mattforclark]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/

Bush is apparently doing something right. On the principle of giving credit where credit is due, I applaud him.

[RobertSeattle]

1. I heard Bush is also against Cancer

:evilgrin:

[mouse7]

25. You're... You're... You're..

Nice to see Dumbya quoting his heros and role models again. Dumbya is just as credible saying it, too.

[Jacobin]

2. What is "alleged" about it?

They took fricking pictures of the torture.

[Mattforclark]

3. Innocent until proven guilty applies even to the worst criminals

to Osama Bin Laden, to Saddam Hussein, to these soldiers, and to George Bush, if you are so inclined.

[Technowitch]

18. The photos alone, if real, are damning enough...

Assuming we're not talking some bizarre hoax involving a fiendishly skilled expert at Photoshop manipulations, those photos first aired on 60 Minutes II sure do look like 'proof of guilt' to me.

There's been little denial that it happened -- the only things lacking are the names of those involved.

Maybe it's just me, but standing next to a bunch of POWs being forced to engage in degrading acts and/or being visibly tortured -- while mugging and grinning for cameras -- is all by itself a crime against humanity.

Or, to put this all in other terms, respect for the rule of law in a chain-of-command comes from the top down. The attitudes and respect shown by the Commander-in-Chief works its way down... and I think we are seeing here precisely the kind of government Bush Jr and his friends would impose upon all of us.

[saigon68]

19. MEET LYNNDIE ENGLAND WAR CRIMINAL AND HER PALS

Families of the 372nd tormented by stories of POW abuses in Iraq


http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/nationworld/iraq/bal-te.md.soldier30apr30,0,160127.story?coll=bal-home-headlines






At most, the 372nd's alleged abuses of prisoners were "stupid, kid things - pranks," Terrie
England said, her voice growing bitter. "And what the do to our men and women are just?
The rules of the Geneva Convention, does that apply to everybody or just us?"

Everyone had been proud of Lynndie England. A Wal-Mart in nearby LaVale displays her photo
on its Wall of Honor. The Mineral County courthouse in Keyser, W.Va., posts her photograph
and those of other local soldiers under a banner that says: "We're hometown proud."

Lynndie England had found purpose, and love, in the Army. She got engaged last year to a fellow
member of the 372nd, Charles Graner, who appears with his arm around her in the newspaper photo.

THE FIANCÉE WAR CRIMINALS




Now, Lynndie England is detained on a U.S. base - her family declined to say where - and is
barred from leaving for anything besides her job. She has been demoted from the rank of specialist
to private first class. And when she calls home, she says frustratingly little.

On Edit: The Mother of this creature is exhibiting an anti-social pattern of minimizing and
criminal thinking. I'd love to see a DSM diagnosis of both mother and daughter

does anyone not see WHY AUSCHWITZ was tolerated

[saigon68]

23. SAME SONG DIFFERENT MELODY

The women jailers of Bergen Belsen



(L-R) IRMA GRESE center HERTA BOTHE w/smirk on right

After the war survivors provided extensive details of murders, tortures, cruelties and sexual excesses
engaged in by Irma Grese during her years at Auschwitz and Bergen-Belsen. They testified to her
acts of pure sadism, beatings and arbitrary shooting of prisoners, savaging of prisoners by her
trained and half starved dogs, to her selecting prisoners for the gas chambers.
She habitually wore heavy boots and carried a whip and a pistol. She used both physical and emotional
methods to torture the camp's inmates and enjoyed shooting prisoners in cold blood. She beat some of
the women to death and whipped others mercilessly using a plaited whip.
After the Kommandant of Bergen-Belsen, Josef Kramer, Irma Grese was the most notorious
defendant in the Belsen Trial, held between September 17 and November 17, 1945. Grese was
convicted and sentenced to be hanged. She was executed on December 13, 1945.

The notorious Herta Bothe became a camp guard and soon acquired a reputation as
a sadist who beat prisoners without mercy. She had a good time shooting at weak
female prisoners carrying food containers from the kitchen to the block with her pistol.
And she often beat sick girls with a wooden stick. After the war Herta Bothe was
charged with having committed war crimes. At the Bergen-Belsen Trial she got
imprisonment for 10 years.

[DoYouEverWonder]

20. Not since the Patriot Act was enacted

Now you can be held with ever seeing a lawyer, in an undisclosed location, and may never even be charged.

[madrchsod]

4. but bush has no comment on the

dead children of iraq or the elderly of iraq.

[Mattforclark]

6. Is that relevant?

[leftchick]

5. It only took them 2 days to respond.....

Nothing here about the US paid contractors who were running the prison either. Hmmm do they get away with no punishment?

[Iceburg]

7. 2 days -- bush was able to memorize the script in two days? wow

[Judi Lynn]

8. His administration made sure we all knew early on in his war

against Afghanistan that they were sending some prisoners to other countries for reasons they never really made clear, but apparently meant for people to infer torture was ahead for them in Egypt, Syria, etc.

Not a hint of regret there for sending those prisoners off to god-knows-what.

Not to mention the creation of a totally new kind of American monstrosity: keeping prisoners of war as "terrorists," just off the coast at Guantanamo, in limbo, in perpetuity.

[Spazito]

9. What they really think is despicable...

is that the pictures got out to the public, they are not at all horrified at what the pictures show. This is the headline that should be out there: "The World says that the bush administration is Despicable".

[KansDem]

10. My thoughts exactly...

A day after CBS television broadcast images of the alleged abuse, White House spokesman Scott McClellan said such behaviour would not be tolerated.

In other words, the WH will not tolerate the broadcasting of these images...

[KansDem]

11. To paraphrase freeper/fundies when Clinton offered his apology...

Bush is only "sorry" he got caught...

[Just Me]

12. If I believed they were sincere, I'd give them credit.

But, they have given me every reason to doubt/question/scrutinize their sincerity. They have behaved arrogantly, heartlessly and without any conscience in deceiving the American people and practically stealing from our national treasure in addition to spilling our blood and the blood of those who did nothing, NOTHING to the American people.

Moreover, Cheney just "blessed" FAUX news which was practically advocating torture tactics not so very long ago.

[TahitiNut]

13. "That's one terrible photographer!" said the Dim Son.

:puke:

[maddezmom]

14. 17 soldiers suspended last month

how many overall? :(

[0007]

15. This blows me away more than just the mere word 'despicable'

[Bandit]

16. Just despicable I say . snort ~ guffaw ~ Did I pronounce my big word right

Don't blame me though. It is those nasty soldier guys. I've been on vacation so I couldn't have anything to do with it. Despicable it is.

[54anickel]

17. This statement is a sad commentary on the decency and moral standards

of some. I mean they need rules to determine this type of behavior is wrong? In a way this soldier's comment depicts the mentality of Shrubco so well - no accountability/responsibility for their own actions. Much like Shrub it needs to come from a "higher authority". This soldier holds the army responsible individual decisions, Shrub give the responsibility to "God".


One of the suspended soldiers, Staff Sergeant Chip Frederick, said the way the army ran the prison had led to the abuse.

"We had no support, no training whatsoever. And I kept asking my chain of command for certain things... like rules and regulations," he told CBS. "It just wasn't happening."

[Moderator]

21. direct link

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3674355.stm

In future, please make sure to include a direct link to the article, and the subject of the thread needs to match the title of the article, in this case, "Bush 'disgusted' by Iraq abuse".

I'll let this one remain, since it's already got a lot of responses.

[NewHampshireDem]

22. Just googled "iraqi torture" on google news ..

http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&edition=us&ie=ascii&q=iraqi+torture

Check out the international reaction ... "despicable" doesn't even begin to describe the situation, and the rest of the world knows it. If they hated us before, now we've given them more than enough good reason to do so. I can only wonder what they must think is going on at Gitmo.

[saigon68]

24. FINALLY FINALLY---THEY WAITED FOR THE CHIMPANZEE

to make up his mind as to what he was going to do.

THE US IS TAKING IT RIGHT IN THE ASS

[maddezmom]

34. Guantanamo Warden to Oversee U.S. Iraq Prison Rules

http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=worldNews&storyID=5004269§ion=news

Is this insanity or what?

[Canuckistanian]

26. Alleged "President" Bush promises to get to the bottom of this

Just like the Valerie Plame affair.

[saigon68]

27. THIS DIRT BALL IS A NAZI

http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=domesticNews&storyID=5004215§ion=news

In contrast to media outlets in Europe and parts of the Middle East, where photographs of reported torture of Iraqi prisoners by U.S. forces were prominently displayed and decried, newspapers in the United States featured the images of the fallen -- which carried their own controversy.

This shows U.S. newspaper editors understand what kind of war coverage interests American readers, according to David D. Perlmutter, a historian of war and media at Louisiana State University in Baton Rouge.

"The torture pictures are absolutely irrelevant," Perlmutter said in a telephone interview. "Americans care about American soldiers, and only journalistic and political and academic elites fret about pictures of collateral damage ...

"If you start talking to the public, you'll find people sympathizing with the soldiers," he said.

[Judi Lynn]

30. Funny you should mention it!

I found this odd article he wrote:

Should Israel go Nazi?

By David D. Perlmutter

Last line:
Still I have to warn all those who insist on gleefully calling Israel a Nazi state: one day the Jews may cry to the heavens (or the opposite direction) in exasperation and declare, "If only!" Be careful what you wish for, you just might get it.
(snip/)

http://www.jewishworldreview.com/0702/perlmutter1.asp

His epic piece, "Palestine for Dummies"

Last paragraphs:

Finally, the Palestinians are an accessible cause celebre of the Left. No big deal to have your crumpets with your artsy pals in a London teahouse in the morning and then fly down for the afternoon to "express solidarity" with Arafat's brownshirts. Dynamite-throwing Palestinians are chic; Tibetan orphans are not. When was the last time you saw any "human rights" activists rush to the southern Sudan to be human shields between black Christian babies and a Muslim Sudanese army aerial bombardment?

So this journalism professor and historian sits and waits for a brave journalist to ask an obvious, fact-driven question. And I fantasize that perhaps some foolhardy but honest --apparently none exist -- U.N. administrator will announce that "Frankly, there are hundreds of peoples more deserving of a homeland and we should be helping them and ignoring the Palestinians…"

I think I have a long wait ahead of me.
(snip/)

http://www.sullivan-county.com/id4/perlmutter1.htm


Perlmutter

[The_Casual_Observer]

28. As spoken in calm tones by Scott McClelland?

Bush always mourns, is saddened, and so on, just take it from old Scott and his press releases.

[proust]

29. To make sure this never happens again

I'm sure they'll just take away soldier's cameras.

[MaineDem]

36. Welcome to DU

:hi:

And you're probably right about the cameras. We won't stop the (alleged) abuse but we'll stop photographing it. Yeah, that sounds about right.

[phrenzy]

31. How many times?

If this is the shit that happens while they are snapping pictures, what kind of shit are they doing when there are NO cameras?!?!

Or do you honestly believe that this is just a 'one time' incident and that cameras just happened to be there for that one time?

We all know for a fact that if there was no physical evidence of this shit (i.e. pictures) - that they would have just been told to "stop fooling around" and that would be the end of it.

I hope any more of these fuckers who doubtlessly engaged in this kind of shit get taken prisoner by Sadrs guys and see what kind of shit they get back.

[Iceburg]

32. But will there be a public inquiry?

[Rochambeau]

33. You can be proud of your country americans !

Yes, "bad guys", bastards doing very ugly things and even crimes comes with every war in every army because war is a bitch but it doesn't come public in every country ! And when it comes public many times the government or the army (the army first) do their best to hide it and protect the criminals (I am French, I know what I am talking about!! Algeria, Rwanda maybe....). But not in the USA ! Because of the medias, because of the service men who did their duty and made the information public because, because , I don't know exactly but it's not important ! But it happened and you can be proud of that!
I'm proud to call myself a friend of the american people when I hear such kind of story! Really! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :dem:

[nodehopper]

35. Bush is also against AIDS in Africa but cut all funding going there

And notice he said "taken care of"--not punished, but something a lot more ambiguous

[yardwork]

37. I see this differently.

I see it as Shrub sending a warning to others who might have similar photographs or stories to tell. The clear message from the commander in chief to whistleblowers is this: "If you come forward, you will be allowed to twist in the wind. I will call you 'despicable,' make sure you are blamed, and not investigate any further."

Think about it. How many people with evidence about atrocities are even slightly involved? Most people in a position to witness and take photos can be accused of complicity.

This is a warning from the WH to anyone else who might consider coming forward. Let the cover up continue.

[Tinoire]

38. Good. Then he will undoubtedly look into the abuse of the WOMEN

((with thanks to Chookie))

<snip>

The real facts are that there is report after report of US abuses; on the internet, in the back pages of our newspapers, in personal accounts that with a little luck will now make their way to mainstream press. This is not an isolated few – this is business as usual for the US military and their collaborating band of thugs in Iraq. Is it any wonder that bodies of US soldiers who fall into Iraqi hands are mutilated and displayed?

The pictures of US soldiers dishonoring Iraqi detainees came as no surprise to JUS (Jihad Unspun). We have been reporting alleged abuses since shortly after the fall of Baghdad. We received several reports over the past months of US soldiers raping Iraqi woman, only to find these photos posted to US porn sites. While these photos and reports were put down to “loose” Iraqi women (which shows a fundamental understanding of Iraq’s religion and culture) we discovered later that those who were detained, some at Abu Ghraib prison, who refused to provide US officials with intelligence where given a prod to garner “cooperation” by rounding up the female relatives, forcing then into sexual acts that were filmed and then shown to their husbands, fathers and brothers and to the general public through porn sites. Now the CBS 60 Minutes II report legitimizes the incidents we have been reporting all along.

The Arab world is outrage. The Muslim Ummah is outraged. Iraqis are outraged and so are people of conscience everywhere. I pity the next soldiers that fall into Resistance hands. And contrary to its belief – America can be defeated and most likely will be defeated and dangled at the end of its own pathetic rope for all the world to see.

http://www.jihadunspun.com/intheatre_internal.php?article=2811&list=/home.php&