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Decision on Possible Attack on Iraqi Town Seems Near (Fallujah - NYT)

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VolcanoJen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-04 07:34 PM
Original message
Decision on Possible Attack on Iraqi Town Seems Near (Fallujah - NYT)
Edited on Sat Apr-24-04 07:35 PM by VolcanoJen
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/04/25/politics/25IRAQ.html?...



Who the hell are they kidding? Who wants to bet the carnage is underway even as I type this? My stomach is uneasy and my head hurts... and I can barely contain this anger and frustration.

Excerpt:

As Mr. Bush discusses strategy for Falluja, administration and senior military officials portray his choices as dismal.

"It's clear you can't leave a few thousand insurgents there to terrorize the city and shoot at us," one senior official involved in the discussions said in an interview on Saturday. "The question now is whether there is a way to go in with the most minimal casualties possible."

No decision to begin military action has been made yet.

The chief of the American occupation authority, L. Paul Bremer III, visited Falluja on Saturday with Lt. Gen. Ricardo S. Sanchez, the senior commander in Iraq, to consult with frontline commanders. They appeared to be making a last-ditch effort for a negotiated settlement.

But in Washington, Secretary of Defense Donald H. Rumsfeld has expressed strong doubts that the Falluja political and business figures the Americans are talking to hold any sway over the insurgents.

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boobooday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-04 07:37 PM
Response to Original message
1. Who is the enemy now?
Hard to tell. Bush is only making things worse. If only this were a nightmare and we could all just wake up . . .



http://www.wgoeshome.com
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skooooo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-04 08:28 PM
Response to Reply #1
8. We have always been at war with Eurasia!
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DemNoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-04 07:47 PM
Response to Original message
2. God always tells our President to kill
It is not hard to guess what will happen.
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gottaB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-04 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. spot on
Funny how it always works out that way
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saigon68 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-04 07:57 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. I don't think God communicates W/ him
I'll give you 1 to 3 odds ---its the Big Guy Satan.
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-04 08:05 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. exactly saigon....
I sometimes feel very stongly that the aWol* chimp occupying the WH is indeed the anti-Christ. Too many similarites to be ignored.
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VolcanoJen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-04 08:10 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. leftchick, saigon...
I just wanna do this, ok?

:grouphug:

I love you guys.
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saigon68 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-04 08:17 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Thanks
:-) :-) :-)
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 05:32 AM
Response to Reply #6
13. thank you Jen.....
I had to go to bed right after posting that last night. Learning our Greensboro soldier was found dead too! This is all so fucking depressing. I thank you for the compassion. The feeling is mutual Jen, you are the best!
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54anickel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-04 08:36 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. You have no idea -
how many times I thought the exact same thing.

And the wacked out fundie types that beat people upside the head with their absolute truth, literal translation of the Bible are the ones that get "Left Behind".

Isn't there a warning in the Bible about false prophets?
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 05:36 AM
Response to Reply #9
14. Indeed... Matthew 7:15-23
Looking at Matthew 7:15-23, we find Jesus gives us the guideline for determining false prophets:

"Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."

....seem perfect doesn't it?

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saigon68 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 07:44 AM
Response to Reply #14
21. As I go to Mass this morning to pray for the souls of the dead
from all sides, because they are human.

I shall ask forgiveness for my angry temper and reflect on the above passsage from Matthew.

I further fear civil disobedience will commence when the draft is announced. And pray that those who oppose this violence are not gunned down like the students at Kent State in 1970.
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54anickel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 08:01 AM
Response to Reply #14
22. Thank you Leftchick. Yes, perfect and ironic. A very important message
for these troubling days. I will need to reflect on this and what type of fruits I have been baring in my life.
(Another one to send off to Shrub.)
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demoman123 Donating Member (565 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-04 08:54 PM
Response to Reply #5
12. Bush is not the anti-Christ
Not enough charisma.
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Raenelle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-04 08:44 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. No need for bogeymen here--that's how undisciplined ego behaves
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saigon68 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-24-04 08:53 PM
Response to Original message
11. THE FIRST VICEROY OF IRAQ-NAM
Edited on Sat Apr-24-04 08:56 PM by saigon68


THE FIRST VICEROY OF IRAQ-NAM

Viceroy Pontius Paul Bremer I

announced that more former members of Saddam's military would be allowed to join the ranks of
the new US-trained army because of the poor performance of the Iraqi forces during rebel
attacks.(AFP/Pool/File/Damir Sagolj)




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maddezmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 06:49 AM
Response to Original message
15. agree Jen, the decision has been made
now only thing to do is wait and see how far bush* and his gang go. :(
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hang a left Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 06:56 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. I am crossing my fingers that they are trying to save face here.
I have read a few opinions in the last few days here that this may, in fact, be the current strategy. That perhaps we won't storm Fallujah and Najaf. I am hoping that these bastards will find a way out. I am praying.
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maddezmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. "Marines will share patrols with Iraqis" from today
FALLUJAH, Iraq -- As US officials grappled with whether to attack this insurgent stronghold, US and Iraqi negotiations announced yesterday that US Marines will start joint patrols with Iraqi police and civil defense forces in Fallujah on Tuesday morning.

Marines at Camp Fallujah, headquarters of the First Marine Expeditionary Force, were preparing for an as-yet-unannounced operation that they half-jokingly called ''the battle to end all battles in Fallujah," The previous night and early morning, Marines seemed to carry out a show of force, as mortars thundered from the US base here and the grinding sound of the guns of US AC-130 warplanes could be heard.

~snip~
more:http://www.boston.com/news/world/articles/2004/04/25/ma... /

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

don't know what to think anymore
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hang a left Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 07:08 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. From your post
"US officials hope to avoid a bloody urban battle without letting leaders of the insurgency there -- whom they characterize as a mix of remnants of Saddam Hussein's regime and Islamic militants from Iraq and neighboring countries -- claim victory."


I hate the way that they get away with identifying the Shiites.

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hang a left Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 07:12 AM
Response to Reply #17
19. This is encouraging also
"Last night, the occupation authority announced $10 million to be spent on public works in Fallujah, with $25 million more on the way."


Perhaps we can bribe our way out?

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0007 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 07:32 AM
Response to Original message
20. Everything Junior sez is a historic moment in stupidity
Is the admin waiting for public opinion? Or are they trying to convince themselves they have no other choice, but to try and save face.

If they go in this will be the called the dumbest of dumb.
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dbt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 08:03 AM
Response to Original message
23. Judging from new reports Sunday morning 4/25,
Edited on Sun Apr-25-04 08:06 AM by dbt
It looks like we are going into Najaf. And once again huge, newsworthy developments (the kind that might make The Sheep nervous) occur on a weekend.

Whatever troops we send into Najaf (and can Falluja be far behind?) might as well be called Kamikaze.

:freak:
dbt
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maddezmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #23
26. just saw video on CNN of "select searches"
looks like the US was in Fallujah, but reporting not "really" going in. Whatever that means? Tuesday seems to be the date they are targeting for a decision whether or not to go in full force.
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maddezmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 06:38 AM
Response to Reply #26
27. select searches=probes
:(
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symbolman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 08:07 AM
Response to Original message
24. "MURDER BY NUMBERS" Flash Movie (Re: Troop Coffins) by Symbolman
I just created this over the past few days.. I think it's one of my best, but I always say that

I call it, "MURDER BY NUMBERS" -it's based on the song by The Police..

This time they've gone TOO F*CKING FAR.. these troops BELONG to the AMERICAN PEOPLE and their families, they are NOT Bush's personal little ARMY GUYS..

Here's the url if you want to have a look, and pass it on to your neighbors..

Turn up those speakers!

this takes BUSH to TASK. AND his Old Man, the other Butcher of Bagdad.

http://www.takebackthemedia.com/murderby.html

Bring them HOME NOW, before they have to come home in a box.


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Kukesa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-25-04 09:34 AM
Response to Reply #24
25. Wow!
I'm speechless, symbolman. "Murder by Numbers" should be seen by everyone and I'll do my part to send it to my email list.

Thanks for all the hard work.

Kukesa
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NewYorkerfromMass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 10:11 AM
Response to Original message
28. It's been called off
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/20019...

U.S. postpones plans for attack in Fallujah


By Rajiv Chandrasekaran and Karl Vick
The Washington Post

BAGHDAD, Iraq U.S. Marines have postponed plans to mount an attack against insurgents holed up in Fallujah and instead will attempt to regain control of the violence-racked city without a full-scale offensive, military commanders said yesterday....
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