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Hissyspit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-11 10:54 AM
Original message
Occupy Wall Street Hunger Strikes Begin as Occupy Portland Camp Shut Down by Police
Source: Daily Mail / ABC News

Occupy Wall Street Hunger Strikes Begin as Occupy Portland Camp Shut Down by Police

By MEGHAN KENEALLY
Last updated at 4:38 PM on 4th December 2011

Some Occupy Wall street protests throughout the country are taking desperate measures to keep the movement alive as only a few camps across the country remain open.

In New York, which was the original birthplace of the movement, protesters have started a hunger strike and hope to move to a different plot of land since they have been barred from Zuccotti Park.

- snip -


'I am definitely worried about being hungry and being sick, thats definitely crossing my mind but I am more worried about people being apathetic,' Mr Ibanez told ABC News.

'If we do get arrested, which seems most likely like we will be, we will continue the strike in jail,' he continued.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2069835/Occupy-...



http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2011/12/occupy-wa...
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Drale Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-11 11:14 AM
Response to Original message
1. The problem with hunger strikes is that
they only work, if the people you are protesting against care what happens to you and that is clearly not the case here.
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dmallind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-11 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Or at the very least if they are responsible for you - as in prisons etc
The idea that a group of people living on the street are hungry, even starving is obviously not going to bring the banks or authorities to their knees. It hasn't for the last 5000 years or so. The idea that they are hungry and starving of their own free will is likely only to engender jokes and scorn, not capitulation. Very silly idea indeed.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-11 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #2
15. The OP says they are expecting to be arrested.
Ghandi's hunger strike was fairly effective and that was not 5000 years ago.

There is an alternative: the rest of us could stand with them--not in hunger strike, but in some high profile way-- until authorities do care.

But, that sounds too inconvenient, doesn't it? I mean, maybe we'd all have to send the WH 3 emails a day or something. I'd rather watch Real Housewives or something than help OWS out with their silly ideas. Wouldn't you?
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russspeakeasy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-11 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. If I may add... if they care and if you are visible.
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Hissyspit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-11 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #1
7. The point is to shame those who would react that way.
I have no idea how effective this will be, but that's how hunger strikes are supposed to work. Many Americans who haven't paid much attention have been shocked by the police tactics, including conservatives and "libertarians."
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-11 06:20 PM
Response to Reply #1
16. Please see Reply 15. DU is a hoot sometimes, isn't it?
Edited on Mon Dec-05-11 06:21 PM by No Elephants


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newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-07-11 10:18 AM
Response to Reply #1
41. bingo!!!
a hunger strike, let's say in Ireland, would work. It goes back to celtic society. For a gross injustice, a hunger strike was seen by many as shame on the person who perpetrated the injustice. But, here in the good ole US, we have enough people who cannot be shamed no matter what they have done. You cannot shame a sociopath, and they really don't care. It's more like scrooge "then they should die and decrease the surplus population."
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Arctic Dave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-11 11:47 AM
Response to Original message
4. I say do it. The more the veil comes off the government, the more
people will have to face the truth of what this country is and is not.

Solidarity.
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Zorra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-11 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. Yes.
"Keep hope alive. The truth will prevail."
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-11 06:24 PM
Response to Reply #4
17. You know, we could start helping somehow. I wonder if DUers, or even half of them, would commit to
doing something like sending five emails a day a piece to the White House? And trying to spread the word to our respective friends and family to do the same, or as much as they are willing to do?

It's a very big country and these brave people are trying to do it for all of us. Why aren't we thinking of ways we might be able to band together to support them?

Just a thought.
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Arctic Dave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-11 10:14 PM
Response to Reply #17
24. I think that is a great idea.
Make it to were even the most ostrich type of person can't get away from the message.
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-11 11:48 AM
Response to Original message
5. I can see conservatives celebrating!
That's what they want for the dirty hippies they see.

Comments in the Portland paper show that many people will cheer this.
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Hissyspit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-11 12:15 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. I believe the point is to ultimately shame those who have no sympathy.
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randome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-11 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. So they will magically acquire sympathy?
If they don't have it to start with, how will this change anything?
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Hissyspit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-11 02:48 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. No. Sympathy from OTHERS who see the petty responses.
Edited on Sun Dec-04-11 02:49 PM by Hissyspit
The Powers That Be have come out looking pretty bad to a lot of people in their response to OWS.
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randome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-11 06:41 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. Making TPTB look bad is a fairly innucuous goal.
May as well mock them for having money. Think that would work?

Anything -hanging out in parks, building barns, hunger strikes -anything but directly attacking the people who put us in this stupid economic situation.

Idealism is fine but soldiers win the war.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-11 06:31 PM
Response to Reply #8
19. LOL, more honest disagreement.? Seriously, what is your point?
That OWS they've failed? Cool. Now what?
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U4ikLefty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-07-11 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #8
46. Ask the mirror. nt
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lbrtbell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-11 06:12 AM
Response to Reply #6
12. You can't shame people with no sympathy
Sympathy is required to feel shame.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-11 06:33 PM
Response to Reply #12
20. true, or more DUers would be ashamed of what they are saying about OWS and what they
themselves are NOT accomplishing.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-11 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #5
18. Gee, Thanks for the support.
Edited on Mon Dec-05-11 06:30 PM by No Elephants
Meanwhile, why would anyone sit around IMAGINING what conservatives MIGHT celebrate?

Who gives a flying shit?

I don't value their opinions enough to blow my nose in them.
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ZombieHorde Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-11 01:15 PM
Response to Original message
9. Bad idea. The PTB want the protestors dead. nt
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-11 06:35 PM
Response to Reply #9
21. Some of the lowest, er, I mean, lowliest folk seem to want the same.
Edited on Mon Dec-05-11 06:35 PM by No Elephants
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Islandlife Donating Member (135 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-11 10:13 AM
Response to Original message
14. As effective as holding their breath; won't work.
Gotta try something else. Something is wrong with the channeling of information/argument/demands or something Is wrong with the information/arguments/demands. The news media carries fewer reports of these activities and no agency is responding.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-11 06:37 PM
Response to Reply #14
22. Well, you could be emailing media and their sponsors demanding they
Edited on Mon Dec-05-11 06:40 PM by No Elephants
give coverage. Or emailing authorities. Or trying to help in some other way.

Do you care enough to try to think of ways to be of some help?
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-11 06:45 PM
Response to Original message
23. These are some brave, determined people. Respect.
We need to be thinking of ways we can all help them.
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Dreamer Tatum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-06-11 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #23
37. Send pizza! Oh, wait...nt
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Freddie Stubbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-06-11 09:17 AM
Response to Original message
25. When was the last time that a hunger strike by a non-prisoner was successful?
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Kingofalldems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-06-11 09:50 AM
Response to Reply #25
26. Looks like a big FAIL for the mock and undermine set.
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Freddie Stubbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-06-11 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #26
29. How is pointing out a likely ineffective strategy mocking or undermining?
Wouldn't encouraging an ineffective strategy be more undermining?
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Kingofalldems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-06-11 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #29
30. Being against everything and anything OWS is undermining
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-06-11 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #30
32. +1
Glad you clarified. I was not sure what your response to Freddie meant.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-06-11 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #25
31. When was the last time a movement in the U.S. went on a hunger strike, successful or not?
I can't think of anything since women's suffrage.

BTW, the OP says they expect to be arrested, so I am not sure why anyone is focusing on non-prisoners and only non-prisoners.
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Freddie Stubbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-06-11 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #31
35. 2006:
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newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-07-11 10:26 AM
Response to Reply #31
42. yes, the hunger strike during the suffrage movement
while they were in prison. I just don't know if it would work now. I've talked to a few people who witnessed the police brutality and those I talked to thought the brutality was extreme and this is america where it shouldn't be happening.
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rethymnon Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-06-11 10:33 AM
Response to Original message
27. OWS = Fail
They've managed to reinforce every negative stereotype about progressives, and have won over none of the moderates / independents / undecideds that will decide the election. It's purely anecdotal, but none of apoliticals at my office give a rat's ass about them. It was a counterproductive circle-jerk.

Their time would have been 100x better spent volunteering for 2012 democratic campaigns.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-06-11 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #27
33. LOL! Tell the apoliticals at your office something for me. Tell those shits to fuck themselves.
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newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-07-11 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #27
43. the corruption is so rampant in this country today
and people, families are hurting, some are on the streets. I could give a damn what your "office" buddies think. We have done election, we have heard promises, we have heard two democratic presidents tell us to move along no corruption to see here about the previous repug presidents and their slimy administration. And, by not taking care of the corruption and immorality on WS, in government-WE, THE AMERICAN PEOPLE, HAVE BEEN HURT-besides paying for the outright corruption and greed.

So, now you think that voting is going to solve a problem that's been going on since reagan brought the age of glorifying greed (doesn't care how you obtain it) and selfishness? You think that just allowing the same status quo that got us into this mess, will just magically work itself out--especially, the wealthy and corporations that have way too much influence in our government, on both sides of the aisle? The only way to rectify the problem is to shine a light on the cockroaches or hold a mirror up to their dorian faces.
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Zorra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-07-11 05:42 PM
Response to Reply #27
49. LOL! Aw, are we scarin' ya? Might as well get used to it!
Coming soon to a theater near you...Occupy Productions Presents:

CORPORATE SUBJUGATION BY THE 99%!


Pelosi: Occupy Movement Enhances Dems National Message

In an interview with TPM on Friday, she said theres no recent precedent for the sort of election House Democrats are going into. In 1994 and 2010, Congressional Republicans ran against Washington controlled by Democrats. In 2006, Congressional Democrats ran against Republican corruption and President George W. Bush. This time around, President Obama will carry the national message for the party while individual candidates use it as they see fit to win in their districts. That national message, Pelosi said, has much greater salience thanks to the Occupiers.

Our statement is we are reigniting, Democrats are reigniting the American dream, building ladders of success, removing obstacles to opportunity to all who work hard and play by the rules, Pelosi said. We have work to do. We think that important to that is enhanced by whats happening in the Occupy , which is the 99 and one. They really emblazoned that in the minds of the American people. Thats what we dedicated our lives to, but they gave it that clarity. People say they didnt have a message. They may not have a message, but they have a statement. And the statement is the status quo is unacceptable 99 and one.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/12/pelosi-occup...

Corporations Are Not People, Money Is Not Speech, City Council Says

In a discussion about money in politics, the Los Angeles City Council unanimously agreed Tuesday that corporations are not people and not entitled to the same constitutional protections.

The council's 11-0 vote in front of a packed chamber of Occupy L.A. members and other activists drew a standing ovation.

If supported by the mayor, the city would be on record in support of federal legislation that would ensure corporations are not entitled to the same rights as people, especially when it comes to spending money to influence elections. It also proposed language for a constitutional amendment declaring that money is not a form of speech and affirming the right of the federal government to regulate corporations.

The resolution is, in part, a reaction to the U.S. Supreme Court's 5-4 decision in the 2010 case, Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission. The court majority agreed that corporations and unions can spend unlimited amounts of money in elections.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Status: Adopted as amended
Date adopted by Full Council: November 14, 2011
Vote: 9-0

BE IT RESOLVED BY THE CITY COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF SEATTLE, THE MAYOR CONCURRING, THAT:

Section 1. By adoption of this Resolution, the City of Seattle recognizes the peaceful and lawful exercise of First Amendment Rights by "Occupy Seattle" and others.

Section 2. The structural causes of the economic crisis facing our society require decisive and sustained action at the national and state levels. Cities are harmed by the crisis and must play an important role in the development of public policy to address it. By adoption of this Resolution, the City Council commits to the following steps to minimize economic insecurity and destructive disparities:

1. The City will review its banking and investment practices to ensure that public funds are invested in responsible financial institutions that support our community. The Council may also consider future legislation to promote responsible banking and provide an incentive for banking institutions to invest more in our City, particularly with regard to stabilizing the housing market and supporting the creation of new businesses. This review should include evaluating City policies on responsible depositing and management of City funds. Moreover, the City will examine the number of home foreclosures in Seattle and the circumstances and causes of the foreclosures, the financial institutions involved in the foreclosures and the methods, tactics and apparent inequities that many people face in Seattle when lender foreclosure proceedings occur and will explore solutions intended to be more humane, civil and consistent with a spirit of assistance to the borrower.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
:hi:
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hack89 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-06-11 10:34 AM
Response to Original message
28. This is stupid. nt
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-06-11 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #28
34. Thanks for your concern. I am sure OWS pales in comparison to all your accomplishments, but
Edited on Tue Dec-06-11 11:38 AM by No Elephants
you still don't have to dump on it every chance you get.
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hack89 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-06-11 11:51 AM
Response to Reply #34
36. I want them to succeed - that's the point. nt
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On the Road Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-06-11 06:11 PM
Response to Original message
38. One of the Issues with a Hunger Strike Is:
What's the trigger for the hunger strike to stop? If there is none, it's almost guaranteed to end with a whimper.
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Freddie Stubbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-07-11 08:54 AM
Response to Reply #38
39. Or with dead protesters
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On the Road Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-07-11 09:45 AM
Response to Reply #39
40. I Know -- I Mean My Issue with It
is not so much with the mechanism of a hunger strike. It just seems like a tool for very specific goals like political prisoner release.

Let's say the hunger strike has the intended effect, and Bloomberg or Cuomo feels pressured enough to give in. Given the sweeping nature of the protesters' concerns, what is it that they do that would satify the demands of the hunger strikers?
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newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-07-11 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #40
44. the OWS has already accomplished something
it has shone a light on corruption, and the impact on americans because of that corruption. Because of little boot's tax decrease to the wealthiest in this country, especially, during a time when war was being propagated with no asking of sacrifice, except the blood of our soldiers. I remember when he proposed his tax cuts and there were people, even wealthy people, against them. The obscene, with little accounting, corporate war profiteering on our tax dollars, cutting taxes to those who made money on the wars, and the anti-labor-pro-corporate attitude has contributed to this financial and infrastructure crisis. Also, the corruption-deregulation-of wall street and banking industry. The OWS has certainly shone a light on the banking industry, wall street and monied influence in our government.

To say OWS has done nothing is absolutely fekkin wrong. These are not "hippies", these are citizens-the elderly, labor, environmentalists, educators. They know that the corporations are making a big power grab--privatizing the public commons. Yes, all of those airline personnel in NY, the veterans , the clergy, the seniors are just all damn "hippies." The media can keep making the claim for so long until their whole game is exposed-as to whom the media works for, and here's a clue, it's not the public.
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On the Road Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-07-11 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #44
45. Who Said OWS Accomplished Nothing?
However, they have defined the issues and goals in such a way that meeting them will be impossible without lowering the bar after the fact. Recently some members have adopted a tactic is suited for short-term specific goals when there are no announced objectives that could possibly be met.
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lynne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-07-11 04:30 PM
Response to Original message
47. I've never understood the concept of a hunger strike -
- I don't see where it serve any purpose and don't think it's an effective tool. Can only speak for myself, but knowing that someone is on a hunger strike has never made me reconsider their situation or take notice of what they are protesting or advocating. My first thought is "How stupid?" when someone chooses not to eat when they can, especially when so many would love to eat but can't.



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Zorra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-07-11 05:15 PM
Response to Reply #47
48. Here: MISS ALICE PAUL ON HUNGER STRIKE;
Suffragist Leader Adopts This Means of Protesting Against Washington Prison Fare. NOW IN JAIL HOSPITAL Threatens to Starve to Death Unless Better Food Is Provided for Six Companions.

WASHINGTON, Nov. 6.-- Alice Paul, National Chairman of the Woman's Party, now doing a seven months' sentence in jail here for picketing the White House, has gone on a hunger strike, and tonight she had been in the jail hospital without food for the preceding twenty-four hours, stolidly ...

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F50E16F8...

In the US presidential election of 1916, Paul and the NWP campaigned against the continuing refusal of President Woodrow Wilson and other incumbent Democrats to support the Suffrage Amendment actively. In January 1917, the NWP staged the first political protest to picket the White House. The picketers, known as "Silent Sentinels," held banners demanding the right to vote. This was an example of a non-violent civil disobedience campaign. In July 1917, picketers were arrested on charges of "obstructing traffic." Many, including Paul, were convicted and incarcerated at the Occoquan Workhouse in Virginia (later the Lorton Correctional Complex) and the District of Columbia Jail.<3>

In a protest of the conditions in Occoquan, Paul commenced a hunger strike, which led to her being moved to the prisons psychiatric ward and force-fed raw eggs through a feeding tube. This, combined with the continuing demonstrations and attendant press coverage, kept pressure on the Wilson administration.<3> In January, 1918, Wilson announced that women's suffrage was urgently needed as a "war measure", and strongly urged Congress to pass the legislation. In 1920, after coming down to one vote in the state of Tennessee, the Nineteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution secured the vote for women.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

That's the idea behind it.

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