Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Pakistan Refuses to Help as U.S. Sorts Out a Fatal Attack

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
Home » Discuss » Latest Breaking News Donate to DU
 
alp227 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 12:04 AM
Original message
Pakistan Refuses to Help as U.S. Sorts Out a Fatal Attack
Source: NYT

The American airstrikes that killed two dozen Pakistani soldiers last week were called in during a skirmish in which both sides thought they were under attack by the Taliban, American officials said Friday. But efforts to sort out precisely what happened and in the process ease the latest crisis to strain the tenuous alliance between the United States and Pakistan are being hindered by Pakistans refusal to cooperate with the American-led military investigation into the attack, the officials said.

A week after the raid on two Pakistani outposts, American and Pakistani officials are offering competing narratives of what went wrong during a tightly planned operation by Afghan and American Special Forces against a Taliban training camp on the remote, cedar-studded mountain slopes along the border between Afghanistan and Pakistan.

Even the most basic facts are in dispute. The Americans say they were fired on first and cleared the strikes with the Pakistanis. The Pakistanis say that NATO gave the wrong coordinates for the proposed airstrikes and that their forces fired only after the attacks began.

Previous cross-border strikes were investigated jointly and the fallout quickly contained, like the dispute that followed the American helicopter attacks on Pakistani forces in September 2010. But a year of crises that began with an American contractor shooting two Pakistanis to death on a street in Lahore and included the Navy Seal raid northwest of Islamabad that killed Osama bin Laden, now risks ending with the breach of an alliance that has been the cornerstone of American national security policy for the past decade, American officials and analysts said.

Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/03/world/asia/pakistan-r...
Refresh | +10 Recommendations Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
FirstLight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 12:19 AM
Response to Original message
1. maybe if
they weren't using drones, there's be a fucking eyewitness account or two...instead of someone on a remote playing a fucking video game version...
Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
 
wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 01:25 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Thank you.
Drones make it possible for Americans to kill with no risk to themselves. As if that's a good thing.
Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
 
No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 02:11 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. Good point. I would rephrase ever so slightly, though.
"Drones make it possible for some Americans to kill other Americans and citizens of other nations with no risk to themselves. Ask if that's a good thing."

Tough question to answer, if you assume the only other alternative is thousands of troops risking their lives overseas (or in the U.S.). I don't assume that, but I have no easy answers to my own question, either.

Big help, I know, but it as food for thought, albeit perhaps indigestible.
Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
 
ArcticFox Donating Member (654 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 09:32 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. The absence of risk is a very bad thing
Risk invites care in planing and carrying out operations, and causes us to consider the consequences of our actions.

Launching an attack without putting our people at risk demonstrates to the world that we are cowards. It says we value the lives of others so little that we won't even risk our own injury to take them.

Imposing such overwhelming and indefensible force on a foreign people terrorizes them all. It gives them no military target to attack either to defend themselves or in retaliation.

And we "wonder" why they turn to"terrorism." It's not in response to "our freedoms," just our belief that we are free to kill any person without warning (and often without cause) anywhere in the world.
Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
 
hack89 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 10:45 AM
Response to Reply #2
9. This was not a drone attack - there were troops on the ground. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
 
Leontius Donating Member (380 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 10:02 AM
Response to Reply #1
7. Maybe if you read the article
you'd know that they weren't drones used in the attack, manned Ac-130's and manned Apache attack helicopters aren't drones.
Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
 
hack89 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 10:42 AM
Response to Reply #1
8. There are plenty of eyewitness
Edited on Sat Dec-03-11 10:45 AM by hack89
US forces were operating on the Afgan side of the border and took fire from the Pakistani side. The attacks were carried out by manned aircraft.
Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
 
sarcasmo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 09:31 AM
Response to Original message
4. Is the United States still sending Pakistan millions of dollars per month?
Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
 
Muskypundit Donating Member (417 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 09:58 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. Try hundreds of millions
And of course
Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
 
cosmicone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 11:57 AM
Response to Original message
10. Of course Pakistan won't help...
then it would come out that these Pakistani soldiers were shooting at NATO troops, shoulder-to-shoulder with the so called Taliban (which is composed of active duty Pakistani military and ISI anyway.)

Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
 
quakerboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 04:03 PM
Response to Original message
11. Wouldnt it just be crazy if
we stopped sending them millions of dollars to buy military equipment to use against us, and then stopped sending multimillion dollar drones and missiles to blow up that same equipment?
Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Wed Aug 20th 2014, 04:04 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Latest Breaking News Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC