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jayfish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 11:47 AM
Original message
Bill would end overtime pay requirement for many more IT workers
Edited on Fri Dec-02-11 11:57 AM by jayfish
Source: Ars Technica

A bill recently introduced in Congress would greatly expand the exemption to the Fair Labor Standards Act for IT employees, ending overtime benefits for many more types of workers, including network, database and security specialists.

Among other things, the FLSA mandates that employees get time-and-a-half overtime pay for working more than 40 hours in a week, unless they are executives or specifically exempted from the law's protection. There are already many exemptions, and the current text related to IT workers exempts "any employee who is a computer systems analyst, computer programmer, software engineer, or other similarly skilled worker," whose primary duties fall under categories including "systems analysis techniques and procedures," and "design, documentation, testing, creation, or modification of computer programs."

But a bill sponsored by Sen. Kay Hagan (D-NC), titled the "Computer Professionals Update Act," takes the exemption's 131-word text and bumps it up to 205, adding job classes such as database and network specialists and security professionals along the way. The proposed text exempts "any employee working in a computer or information technology occupation (including, but not limited to, work related to computers, information systems, components, networks, software, hardware, databases, security, internet, intranet, or websites) as an analyst, programmer, engineer, designer, developer, administrator, or other similarly skilled worker," with primary duties including "the application of systems, network or database analysis techniques and procedures, including consulting with users, to determine or modify hardware, software, network, database, or system functional specifications."

The bill would also label all employees listed in the exemption as part of the "bona fide executive, administrative, or professional" class exempt from overtime and minimum wage laws. However, the proposed modification keeps the exemption's current text limiting affected employees to those who are on salary or make at least $27.63 an hour.

Read more: http://arstechnica.com/business/news/2011/12/bill-would...



Total BS! :mad: :mad: :mad:

ON EDIT:...and it was put forth by a Democrat.
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midnight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 11:50 AM
Response to Original message
1. Kay needs to be replaced...
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davidwparker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #1
13. A lot of them do. Then, when they are out looking for jobs
Edited on Fri Dec-02-11 12:25 PM by davidwparker
they can see the mess they have created.

I hope Congress sees that 2012 is the anti-incumbent backlash. As I read Cenk say, 99% of the Republicans are corrupt; 80% of the Democrats are corrupt.

on edit: spelling
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midnight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #13
32. A bipartisan effort to keep all the winnings for themselves..
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Blaq Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 01:27 PM
Response to Reply #32
129. IT workers can shutdown the world if they wanted to.
Practically everything nowadays relies on computers. Without IT workers, the world's economy will collapse. I don't think these are the right people to mess with. If there's any salaries that ought to be capped, they should cap the millions CEO's get instead.
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Big_Mike Donating Member (274 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 01:32 PM
Response to Reply #13
130. You sir are an optomist
I personally rate ALL politicians as corrupt. There might be the occasional exception, but none currently come to mind.

Some are simply more to my taste than others.
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slay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #1
36. I agree - Kay Hagan should not be called a Democrat
Edited on Fri Dec-02-11 02:57 PM by slay
she's one of my senators and only got elected because her opponent at the time was Elizabeth Dole. Hagan is a republican for all intents and purposes - I have e-mailed her office many times expressing my concern over her embrace of republican ideals - and only once did I ever hear back from her/her office - and it was a form letter! I will gladly vote her out in 2014 - hell I'd even take a moderate republican over her! :grr:
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Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:05 PM
Response to Reply #36
52. A good Democrat does not attack the right to overtime
or any other worker rights protected by federal law.
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awoke_in_2003 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:29 PM
Response to Reply #52
72. How many good democrats...
do we actually have in Congress? Five, maybe?
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frylock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 06:43 PM
Response to Reply #72
90. maybe
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ProfessionalLeftist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 06:53 PM
Response to Reply #36
92. Haven't seen one stance yet from this woman that resembled a Democrat. n/t
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Bluenorthwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 07:16 AM
Response to Reply #92
113. Hagen is the 1%
Husband a transactions attorney, oil well owner and member of a 'restricted' country club. Their net worth they state as in the 11-40 million dollar range. 1%.
She is from a political dynasty family, her offices handed to her.
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bcool Donating Member (62 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 11:51 AM
Response to Original message
2. Most IT jobs don't pay overtime...
...at least in my experience...since they're considered to be "professional" positions.
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Eric J in MN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. IT workers who are paid with an annual salary don't get overtime, but...
...IT workers paid by the hour do.

This bill would take away overtime from the hourly workers, who already lack health insurance and need to look for their next project while on their current project.

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jayfish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #6
17. Being eligible for overtime pay has little to do with how your employer pays you.
You can be a salaried employee and receive overtime pay. It has more to do with your annual pay and the duties of your position. You employer cannot just say "well your salaried so you don't get overtime.

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jeff47 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #17
67. In this case, it actually does
There's an explicit exemption in the overtime law for salaried IT workers.
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DWilliamsamh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 08:40 PM
Response to Reply #17
103. I have been paid overtime in ZERO salaried positions...
As a matter of fact you're lucky if they let you take comp time for hour worked over forty in a given week, no matter how many hours you work. For instance the weeks I worked 70 hours, with a couple 20 hour days thrown in, when our AS400 totally crashed. What did I get in consideration? Bupkis.
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geardaddy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #6
42. +10000
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limpyhobbler Donating Member (184 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:00 PM
Response to Reply #2
47. I think this law would affect me, I would lose overtime pay...
I am called a "network specialist" and get time and a half for anything over forty hours. We usually all average around 45 hours a week. This law could affect us, so this is going to suck if it passes.

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LiberalEsto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:11 PM
Response to Reply #2
56. My husband has worked in IT for over 30 years
and he has never been paid overtime, even though he has always worked late nights and many weekends. Sometimes he got a little comp time, but those days are over. The Corporate Masters can do whatever they want.
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Major Nikon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #56
66. Any employee that is FLSA exempt can request an audit from the DOL
If the audit finds the employee shouldn't have been FLSA exempt, the employee can get back pay.
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LiberalEsto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #66
69. interesting
but I suspect that people who did this would lose their jobs
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #56
86. my husband is a programmer and has always been paid overtime
is it possible that your husband is a poor negotiator? my husband has not worked there 30 years but he has worked over 25 years and he was by the hour/overtime/non-exempt employee from the very beginning

it is obvious that you are going to be forced to work a lot more late nights/weekends IF THEY DON"T HAVE TO PAY YOU

only managers are exempt where my husband works, everyone else is a regular hourly worker and all get overtime, so i don't think even if this law passes, they could single him out and stop paying him

if they did, i guess he would have a lot more free time because he turns down overtime as it is and he would just turn down more of it, however, he has a pretty strong specialty
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LiberalEsto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 09:16 AM
Response to Reply #86
118. My husband is a database administrator
At that level they are considered exempt. He rose past programming many, many years ago.

His negotiation skills have nothing to do with it. He gets calls from headhunters every day.
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Samba Donating Member (13 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 08:01 PM
Response to Reply #2
97. started in 1991
Programmers and IT staff were considered professionals and administrators because they carry a big burden of responsibility. Despite the lack of specific education, professional certifications etc. that are required for other 'professions'.

If I remember right it affected people making more than 6.5x the minimum wage. That would be >$45/hr now so at some point that multiplier was lowered?

Then there are the H1B visas - where 10's of thousands of foreign 'specialist' workers came to fill IT and science jobs. Initially at a small fraction of what they would pay a local hire but always under the threat that if they fire you you'd be deported almost immediately. This grew up to about 100k IT workers around 1999-2002. They added provisions like 'must pay the same as others in the same position' and 'must seek and fail to find a local worker first' but regardless they still pay considerably less, replace local hires and prevent the natural wage inflation for these jobs. Many of the offshoring companies are run by former H1B hires.

These jobs always show up on the 'most needed' lists for people choosing college majors. They pay like $40-80K on average - for 45-60 hour weeks. (Plus constant continuing education - if you want to still have a job when the stuff you are working on now goes obsolete in a few years.) I'd guess half the people who go into this thinking 'career' are looking to get out after 8 years and 80% by 20 years.

With a real 'free market' the wages would be at least 25% higher. Without the overtime exemptions there would be a lot less of the constant crisis/deadline!/emergency!! stress and then more people would be willing to get into and stay in these careers.

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boppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 10:49 PM
Response to Reply #97
108. "Despite the lack of specific education, professional certifications etc."?
A+ CCNE, MSCE, RHCE, ZCE, degrees in CS...

It aint' the 90's anymore, there's a whole industry of certification.
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LiberalEsto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 09:10 AM
Response to Reply #97
117. The way the system seems to work now...
is that managers get huge bonuses for coming up with insanely short production schedules for projects. They browbeat the computer people (my husband is a DBA) into working long hours and weekends to meet these ridiculous targets.

If the targets are met, the managers collect their big bonuses, while the IT workers get zip. Not even a thank you these days. My husband's company is known for being an unusually nasty place to work, and he's been looking.

At his job level, he's considered exempt and always has been. He works for a company that contracts with a federal government agency. Previously he worked many years at Fannie Mae and took early retirement instead of staying on and eventually getting laid off. Fannie had a pretty similar system of creating unrealistic targets and browbeating IT people into working long hours, but at least managers gave the workers $100 and an emailed thank you while collecting their $50,000 bonuses. It's probably changed there too.

The work culture in corporations seems to have become one where managers can do pretty much whatever they want to their staffs and get away with it. And nobody dares to complain for fear of losing their job and not being able to find another one. In addition, a lot of working IT people these days are here from overseas on H1-B visas and don't dare complain. Because these folks don't dare make waves, and because everyone knows how hard it is to get a decent paying job now, there is very little dissent against rotten management people.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #117
120. That is downright sickening.
We must regain control of this nation. OWS.
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DWilliamsamh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #2
102. If they are SALARIED workers you are right
But people like myself who work contract work (a growing class) get paid on an hourly wage basis. Overtime is the only way 9when it is approved) to make up for the fact that if you're not at work you are taking a pay hit. So any doctor's appointments sickness etc that keeps you out of work affects your pay.
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #2
110. I just posted about this...many IT jobs...
...are contracted out. This is a huge trend in the tech field right now.

My husband was laid off a few months ago, and he has no problem finding contract work.

The reason that this legislation is being written and forced through Congress now--is that
corporate America likes this trend. The like that they can exploit unemployed workers and
hire contractors--and that they don't have to pay benefits, pensions, 401ks and other perks.

Contractors are better for their profit margins. Since workers are desperate and scared about
the economy now--why not exploit these people even further by nixing the overtime pay that they
currently get?

It's total greed and it's really revolting.
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uberblonde Donating Member (993 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 11:52 AM
Response to Original message
3. Broken link.
Got another one?
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jayfish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. Fixed. -NT-
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tridim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 11:55 AM
Response to Original message
4. Overtime pay, in IT? Since when?
Maybe this new BS will help get IT professionals to finally unionize.
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 12:17 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. I used to get it, a long time ago. I believe the rules changed in about 1996.
I haven't seen a penny of OT pay since three jobs ago.
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MilesColtrane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #4
37. "Maybe this new BS will help get IT professionals to finally unionize."
Amen
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jeff47 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:14 PM
Response to Reply #4
70. Unionizing geeks isn't going to happen
Geeks really like Objectivism. It appeals to their desire to see order in the universe, and belief that they are better than other people. Plus, it's black-and-white lines between good and bad are easier for them to handle than the fuzziness of reality.

Used to be one as a kid, but grew out of it long ago when I pulled my head out of my ass socially. Lots of geeks haven't done that, so aren't going to be willing to unionize. There's some long-term hope, in that there's more and more "non-geek" personalities in IT. But it's going to be a long while.
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boppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 10:53 PM
Response to Reply #70
109. I don't think it's Objectivism, so much as libertarian-ism.
A union would add more rules, and remove individual freedoms, and geeks don't like to make those kinds of bargains.
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 06:08 PM
Response to Reply #4
87. my husband gets overtime as a programmer
maybe it's because he works in industry instead of in an "office-y" type environment?
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AldebTX Donating Member (739 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 12:02 PM
Response to Original message
7. I am in IT
I am exempt now. I get paid for 40 hours a week, but I don't think I have had a week this year except for holidays and vacation where I have worked less then 50. Since our IT staff is not 24 by 7 but our organization is 24 by 7, myself and other staff members are called back in, on all days and times for any issues with the networks. I was called in last night at 2am for instance.

No compensation or time off for the call back and expected to be on time to work early this morning.

I have never had anyone explain to me why "we" are special when it comes to over time.

Why don't I quit....medical benefits and the current job market.

If the economy ever picks up....bye bye.
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jayfish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 01:21 PM
Response to Reply #7
23. Your employer choosing not to pay you for overtime does not make you an exempt employee.
http://www.flsa.com/coverage.html

I have to wonder how many IT people are being shafted by their employers (who may be violating federal law)and don't even realize it.


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Major Nikon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:09 PM
Response to Reply #23
68. Many are
Few challenge their status. That's why employers get away with it.
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 06:12 PM
Response to Reply #23
88. well a lot of computer guys have poor negotiating/social skills
Edited on Fri Dec-02-11 06:13 PM by pitohui
i wouldn't even call my husband any great negotiator but at least he had the good sense to realize that he needed to be in an hourly position, because he saw other programmers going into jobs where they were not paid overtime and they were worked like dogs to the point where their hourly pay was min wage or less...i think some programmers have so little social skills or ability to interview for jobs that they will eat any kind of shit rather than speak up for themselves...he started working in the 1980s and pay for programmers has only gotten shittier for most people, of course, there are the rare people who are microsoft millionaires or whatnot but for most it's just a job and not a particularly well paid one

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Xithras Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #7
45. Are you salaried?
Edited on Fri Dec-02-11 04:04 PM by Xithras
If you're salaried, your employer can work you all they want at your base pay level. That's how salary works, and it's one of the reasons that I always research a companies working environment before taking salaried jobs.

If you're an hourly employee, then your employer is breaking the law. While employers don't have to pay overtime rates for exempt employees who exceed 40 hours a week, they DO have to pay you at your base rate. They can't make you work for free. If you're working hourly, and your boss is only paying you for 40 hours while requiring 50 hours of work, I would start keeping careful records of when and where you are working, and what you're doing. When you eventually leave the company, go take those records to an attorney with experience in labor law, and ask them whether you have a decent back-pay case. There have been MANY cases where people have done this, and their employers were later forced to compensate them for their unpaid worktime.

But if you're salaried, you're SOL. Sorry.
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ThomThom Donating Member (752 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:33 PM
Response to Reply #45
74. wall-mart got busted for that
punch out and go back to work is illegal
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socialindependocrat Donating Member (379 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 08:06 AM
Response to Reply #45
115. They have exempt and non-exempt salaried employees
In Delaware, the company I worked for had all their employees salaried

but

There were non-exempt employees who worked 40 hrs/wk and got overtime pay

and

exempt employees who were exempt from overtime pay.
(supposedly, they got paid an amount that compensated them for overtime every now and then.)

This always seemed stupid to me - to make a law that says a company can't work employees
16 hours a day - so you make it 8 hrs a day with overtime - and then you make a law that allows employers to classify people as "exempt" and you can work their butts 16 hours a day.
This doesn't make a bit of sense to me.
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Davis_X_Machina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
8. Hagan's a Democrat...
...in the same way, and to the same extent, that Velveeta is cheese.

The myriads of libertarians in the IT community don't need that kind of protection, anyways. Only the state can coerce you -- an employer, a mere business cannot.
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toddwv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 12:14 PM
Response to Original message
9. Excellent way to make workers into wage slaves and increase unemployment.
Who are these idiots running our country?

Oh yeah...

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lovuian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 12:17 PM
Response to Original message
11. this Government is ANTI WORKER
they have NO RESPECT for the worker and as a result their depression will get worst

Lech Walesea said it
You pretend to pay us and we pretend to work
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Davis_X_Machina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. We're a majoritarian system...
Edited on Fri Dec-02-11 12:23 PM by Davis_X_Machina
...and have free elections. So what you mean is 'We are anti-worker.'

Things are the way they are because people in sufficient numbers either want them that way, or don't want them to be different, or don't want them to be different enough.

This government was not forced upon us by an occupying power. It would be more convenient if that were the case, but it wouldn't actually be true.
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Muskypundit Donating Member (417 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. That is an enormous simplification of the current state of affairs.
If people actually had a unbaised media that gave them the facts and merits of each side, and didn't produce enough spin to cause hurricanes, the government would not look like this. People in the u.s are generally socialist, and liberal. But corporate media control mucks it up. We are being fooled into this, not fairly convinced.
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Davis_X_Machina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #14
21. This is a cop-out.
Public institutions are either the ones the public actually wants, or the ones they can't be arsed to change.

Progressive learned helplessness is the largest obstacle to progressive governance in this country.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:39 PM
Response to Reply #21
77. Right -- public wants to get rid of the Post Office -- ???? ROFL
And, most especially, by deceptive means!

Not only that, the publci doesn't want a public education system -- !!

Or even free colleges????


Check with OWS -- !!



"Learned helplessness" ....? Sounds rather like a Limbaugh-ism?

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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 03:56 PM
Response to Reply #14
46. Exactly. For decades, since Reagan, the right has been fucking up the economy
and then blaming the fucked up economy on the left, on labor unions, on undocumented workers and the unemployed (neither of whom would be so prevalent in the absence of Republican policies), and they shout it through their media, so the people who are thoroghly propagandized think the left, the unions, the undocumented and the people who can't find jobs are the reasons of recedession and unemployment.

We are a left/liberal nation, in the grip of a right/fascist oligarchy which owns the media.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:41 PM
Response to Reply #46
78. +1000% --- "left/liberal nation, in grips of a right/fascist oligarchy which owns the media" --
True -- and remember the days when using the word "fascist" used to bring on

shock and questioning?

Not so much anymore -- sadly!!


This is a nation which loves the New Deal -- and is looking for even more radical liberal

solutions!!



:hi:
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 09:41 AM
Response to Reply #46
122. + a brazillion!
:applause: :woohoo: :fistbump:
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Eric J in MN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. How much a person gets to talk to a politician depends on the size of the donation.
I've been to US Congressional fundraisers in Minneapolis and Saint Paul.

All the attendees get to eat dinner & listen to speeches.

The people who make bigger donations get to talk to the Congress members before dinner while the rest of the attendees stand in the lobby.
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Davis_X_Machina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #15
20. If you put 40,000 persons in their district office, they'd listen.
If you sent 400,000 persons to the polls who don't usually go, they'd notice.

But they'd have to get off their couches.

All that's missing is the will.
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zogofzorkon Donating Member (256 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #20
24. If you put 40k in their district office they'd pepper spray them then arrest.
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Davis_X_Machina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #24
128. No city in America could do that, not even New York.
They were able to do it barely, once, in DC during the Vietnam era. And they had the Feds and the Army in town.

300,000,000 million Americans, 200,000,000 old enough to act -- and OWS, nationwide, has produced 4000 arrests.

A college town where the home team wins NCAA basketball championship does that.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:44 PM
Response to Reply #20
79. Have you noticed at all that since Nixon's regime the object is to deceive and destroy elections . .
and democratic/liberal voters -- ???

You do recall the registration scam from 2000, I presume?

That's never stopped -- they're still at it in every way possible.

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sulphurdunn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:47 PM
Response to Reply #20
81.  Al Gore
won the popular vote by 400,000 ballots nationally in the 2000 presidential election and would have won in Florida if all the ballots had been counted even after the voter roles had been scrubbed. The politicians and the judges didn't notice. More than 4000 Occupy protesters have been arrested nationally. Hundreds have been injured, several seriously. The police didn't listen. I don't know where you get the idea that the will of the American people to act is missing. It's just slow to be aroused. Once it is you better get off the couch.
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Davis_X_Machina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 01:12 PM
Response to Reply #81
126. 300,000,000 million American...
...200,000,000 million old enough to act.

4000 Occupy arrests so far. That's one minor-league basketball game's attendance.

That's where I get the idea that the will of the American people to act is missing
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sulphurdunn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #126
131. I don't think so.
All revolutions are carried out by a minority of the people. There were tens of thousands of people who shut down the port at Oakland. The police wisely backed off that day. The protest easily cost the economy $1 billion. The longshoreman did not resist it. Costs in police overtime alone were several millions of dollars. Millions of people world wide are protesting the global political and economic status quo. Lots of blood is being shed there. A million people may descent on Washington during demonstrations scheduled of January 17th. This is just the beginning. You can either take a seat or take to the field but don't try to dismiss it. That's what the fawning corporate media is trying so desperately to do. Big mistake.
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limpyhobbler Donating Member (184 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #12
55. I doubt that Senator Hagan ran on a platform of cutting overtime pay for IT workers
or she wouldn't have got elected. Not sure, correct me if she did, but I somehow doubt it.

She probably is sponsoring this change as payback to one of her campaign donors. Just guessing, I can't prove it.

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Maineman Donating Member (411 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:39 PM
Response to Reply #55
58. I would make a very similar guess.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:36 PM
Response to Reply #12
75. You think we have "free elections" --- ???? ROFL
...and have free elections. So what you mean is 'We are anti-worker.'

Things are the way they are because people in sufficient numbers either want them that way, or don't want them to be different, or don't want them to be different enough.

This government was not forced upon us by an occupying power. It would be more convenient if that were the case, but it wouldn't actually be true.




Americans are not "anti-worker" -- this is a liberal nation -- which still supports the

New Deal -- and even more radical solutions.


Americans have been abused by corporate control of our government and our press --

which denies many the information and vision which they need to understand our problems and

what is causing them and how to fix them. One example of that is the Postal Service and

the depeptive political attack on our PO Department and its workers to destroy it for the

benefit of elites/privatization.


Same is also true of our military and its privatization -- Patriot Act/Homeland Security!


In fact, our Congress has been privatized if you look at it realistically -- privatized

with corporate money buying government and candidates/incumbents.

"Congress is controlled by the oil and coal industry" -- Al Gore/Rolling Stone-June 2011


Further, we've had 50 years of RW political violence -- assassinations -- which not only

took President John F. Kennedy but our people's government!

Add to that a corporate press -- and corporate/private voting computers which are hackable

even from remote locations -- and it adds up to stolen elections not "free elections."


And the Supreme Court's Gang of 5 decision which put Bush in the White Hous eis even more

evidence of fascism in America.




PS: --

Keep in mind, also, that the voting computers aren't something new in 2000 --

they began to come in during the late 1960's. In fact, two journalists in 1969 noting the

odd and unverifiable results being reported by computers began an investigation which resulted

in their book -- "Votescam -- The Stealing of America."

Additionally, during the mid 1960's, the LARGE computers used by MSM came in giving them new

powers to PERDICT and CALL elections -- winners/losers -- Electoral College Votes, etal.

Previously they had only been permitted to report ACTUAL VOTE TALLIES.



*http://www.constitution.org/vote/votescam__.htm


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Go2Peace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 08:03 PM
Response to Reply #75
99. Absolutely right.
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Davis_X_Machina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 01:15 PM
Response to Reply #75
127. Theft, on any scale....
...doesn't deliver 60 Republican and Republican-fellow-traveler Senators.

People vote that way, and in numbers that swamp even the most fevered theories of vote theft.

The left in this country isn't big enough to matter. Its ideas aren't popular enough to turn out a government.

It's painful, but there it is.
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Go2Peace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 08:02 PM
Response to Reply #12
98. I don't believe that anymore. There is little "Representation" left
They ignore the will of the people often. I would bet that, especially in this climate, most of the country would disagree with this change.

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midnight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 02:38 PM
Response to Reply #11
31. Wonderful response. " You pretend to pay us and we pretend to work"
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:46 PM
Response to Reply #31
80. We need a huge slow down by workers -- all together -- !!
Production has gone up by 35% over the last decades with no similar increase

in pay checks!!

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apnu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 12:44 PM
Response to Original message
16. There are four co-sponsors to the bill, three of them are Republicans
Here is the list from: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=s112-1747

Michael Bennet
Scott Brown
Michael Enzi
John Isakson
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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 02:43 PM
Response to Reply #16
34. Michael Bennet CO - D?
He's the corporate bagman that Obama endorsed and campaigned for in our CO primary against a more progressive opponent...


hmmmmm.........................
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Autumn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:48 PM
Response to Reply #34
82. That was a big WTF for me too.
And by that, I do not mean Win The Future. That broke my heart.
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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 07:57 PM
Response to Reply #82
96. there is nothing, absolutely nothing
that says more about Obama and his priorities than what happened during that primary. It is the key to everything the man and his administration are about.

IMHO.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 09:04 PM
Response to Reply #34
105. hmmm..... sad -- !!
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Angry Dragon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 12:50 PM
Response to Original message
18. It seems congress has no problems cutting wages for hourly workers
but just can not seem to find the time to cut the obscene salaries of bloated ceos
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DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
19. ''.....and it was put forth by a Democrat.''
- Right. Imagine that......

K&R




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dballance Donating Member (460 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 01:19 PM
Response to Original message
22. She's from NC which has Charlotte - one of the biggest banking cities
She's doing what her corporate masters demand.
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pkdu Donating Member (621 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #22
71. ...and Research Triangle Park! n/t
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stevenleser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 02:03 PM
Original message
IT workers have been everybody's favorite whipping boys/girls for the past 10 years. nt
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katty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 02:03 PM
Response to Original message
25. yeah we put you in the exec class so u can work MORE for LESS
sickening
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nahant Donating Member (57 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 02:06 PM
Response to Original message
26. Screwing IT AGAIN
This is total BS, just another way to screw over workers who have to put in way more than 40 hours a week... I know I was among them when I was working... Companies are trying any way they can to screw workers... The Race to the Bottom continues unabated!!!
And when we get to the bottom just the Fuck will be able to buy the goods that companies are making?? The 1%?? Shit they will never make up for the lost sales as more and more workers wallets keep getting thinner and thinner....
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aggiesal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 02:06 PM
Response to Original message
27. No doubt, she probably represents ...
the Triangle Park area.

Ever hear of IBM?
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Eric J in MN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #27
29. Kay Hagan is a Senator, and so she represents all of NC. (NT)
NT
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aggiesal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #29
125. Oooops, my bad, ...
I thought she was a congress person, not a senator.
Thanks!

How many other technical companies are in NC.
BofA Hdq's are in Charlotte.
How could this benefit them?
Except maybe the obvious banking IT dept.
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SoapBox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 02:13 PM
Response to Original message
28. India and China...here we come!
You can work in the U.S. and get paid slave wages too!
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 02:31 PM
Response to Original message
30. Isn't it great to finally see bipartisan efforts from the Senate?
What a shame we don't have the skill needed to spot the stealth politicians until well after they're elected.



Senator Kay Hagan.
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AllyCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 02:41 PM
Response to Original message
33. What the heck? Why should anyone who is not salaried be exempt from OT pay?
What is wrong with these people?
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quakerboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 02:48 PM
Response to Original message
35. They need to strengthen, not weaken worker protections
It should really read "who make at least 27.63/hr or are on equivalent salary". Cause right now, they can give you a darn low salary and then declare you executive, and you are f'd.

As long as we are bound and determined to tie Health care to jobs, the exemption should also require that and other minimum benefits (retirement anyone?) to also be included to qualify.

Because as things sit, they can offer you salary equivalent to approx $12/hr on a 40 hour week, with no benefits, then work you 70 when they feel like, in the end paying you just $7 an hour. With no benefits. Aren't you glad you are an executive/professional?
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Citizen Worker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 03:10 PM
Original message
A bi-partisan effort to cut the income of IT workers but no bi-partisan effort to make it easier for
IT workers to join a Union! Or to pass card check. Tell me again why I should vote for democrats?
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Citizen Worker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 03:10 PM
Response to Original message
38. A bi-partisan effort to cut the income of IT workers but no bi-partisan effort to make it easier for
IT workers to join a Union! Or to pass card check. Tell me again why I should vote for democrats?
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socialindependocrat Donating Member (379 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 03:15 PM
Response to Original message
39. They are underpaid as it is
I am not an IT person and I am even retired BUT

Where else do you get an employee who works all day
and then goes home and continues to work on the
computer until it's time to go to bed?

These people practice their profession and become better
at their job while they're at home at night.

When you are stuck and don't know what to do - Who do you call?

When the system goes down - Who do you call?

When problems need to be resolved "RIGHT NOW" or overnight
Who works thru the night till 6:00a.m.?

These people are worth their weight in gold and they are being
screwed every day.

They need protection from slave-driving managers who abuse them at every turn.

Let's be realistic!!!!!
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Hotler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 03:22 PM
Response to Original message
40. WTF! n/t
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jimmydwight Donating Member (17 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 03:25 PM
Response to Original message
41. I can't believe this. What is the ultimate goal,
work for free? that 1% and 99% are getting farther and farther apart.
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wxgeek7 Donating Member (189 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 03:36 PM
Response to Original message
43. Oh crap, look at what someone entered on her Wikipedia bio!
"Kay Ruthven Hagan ( /ˈheɪɡən/; born May 26, 1953) is the junior United States Senator from North Carolina and a member of the Democratic Party. She hates computers and those who make their living supporting them. Previously, she was in the North Carolina Senate."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kay_Hagan

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MrsBrady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 03:46 PM
Response to Reply #43
44. that's hilarious n/t
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BumRushDaShow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #43
51. It's after 5 pm ET and it is still there!
:rofl:
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lunasun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 08:47 PM
Response to Reply #51
104. the truth should stay there!! what a crap dem
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RoccoR5955 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #43
63. Ain't that the truth!
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RoccoR5955 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #43
64. Ain't that the truth!
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OhioChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:02 PM
Response to Original message
48. With "friends" like this, who needs enemies? n/t
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inademv Donating Member (738 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:03 PM
Response to Original message
49. Don't fuck with the people who handle your food and database security
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Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:03 PM
Response to Original message
50. I would expect Walmart would reclassify all their employees
that touch a computer including a cash register to be included in this change. Employees will file suit. The SCOTUS will ultimately refuse to hear the employees' appeal from the GOP lower court that ruled against the employees.
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Recursion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:09 PM
Response to Original message
53. I haven't seen an hourly IT job in years.
Help desk, I guess. I've never heard of a sysadmin (what I do) getting overtime; we're all salaried that I know of.
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gtar100 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:09 PM
Response to Original message
54. Our government just keeps walking backwards.
What a bunch of shit heads. Corruption sure is in full force these days.
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catrose Donating Member (591 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:37 PM
Response to Original message
57. There are contracting shops (like Collabera)
that have decided that anyone who touches a computer is an IT worker, even though lawsuits have decided to the contrary. Your contract reads that you will be paid straight time for any hours over 40.

Talk to them about it? All the recruiters are from India and do not understand you when you speak of such things.

On the upside, even if you sign the contract, you cannot sign away your rights. You can sue later.

As I understand it, anyway.
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Hugabear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:43 PM
Response to Original message
59. How long before they make almost every occupation exempt?
:grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
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Swede Atlanta Donating Member (906 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:45 PM
Response to Original message
60. Another giveaway to the rich...........
You know in most European countries even white collar workers have collective bargaining. Why do we continue to erode the foundations of the middle class? If you remove this classification some, but not all, IT shops will exploit these workers subjecting them to unreasonable working hours, split shifts, etc. This is ludicrous. I hope Obama vetoes this if it gets that far.
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47of74 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #60
89. I wouldn't count on it
He's shown a remarkable lack of a spine to date, so he'll probably kowtow to corporate demands even though he knows there's no chance in hell of getting their support in return.
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Fokker Trip Donating Member (222 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 06:13 AM
Response to Reply #89
112. Did he ever really have a spine? nt.
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RoccoR5955 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:46 PM
Response to Original message
61. Figures it comes from someone in a Right to Work for LESS State!
Edited on Fri Dec-02-11 04:54 PM by RoccoR5955
OK, then when her hard drive crashes, and she needs an new one, if this thing gets passed, I hope that the person who fixes it doesn't have OT, and doesn't work the extra hours needed to get it fixed.

These people know nothing of how much it takes to do this kind of work. They don't know what a chore it is to clean up other people's computer messes... ESPECIALLY with Windoze! I guess the Mac is no better. Not to mention the questions users ask, that they could find out from a simple inquiring from within the help files, or for cryin' out loud, the whole damn Internet!!!! Sheesh, where do they think we learn this stuff, and get our patience to deal with their crap from?

Today, an IT worker is more like your plumber or electrician, because the devices have become as ubiquitous as a toilet, or a lightbulb. Why should we be paid as executives, when we are actually doing the grunt work of the 21st century?


Just to add, I am a civil servant, described as a "Microcomputer/Network Support Specialist." Don't let the title confuse you, if ANYTHING goes wrong with the network, servers, muckley mucks' computers, they call ME, because I know all the systems. Sometimes on weekends, or at night. I am also union, so I do have protections, and I doubt that NY will become a Right to Work For Less State any time soon.
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Missy Vixen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:49 PM
Response to Original message
62. Let's find out if she has accepted campaign contributions from Microsoft, for starters
Maybe her three co-sponsors might have as well.

My husband is a network engineer. He works at least a 12-hour day, five days a week. He worked last Friday, which he was supposed to have off. Let's just say he works harder and longer hours than Senator Hagan. He is salaried, but his last job was at a certain worldwide company that rhymes with "Bicrosoft". He was hourly there. When they want you to work 70+ hours a week, you should get PAID for it.

This is the opportunity for the IT community to make a LOT of noise...

:eyes:

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mokawanis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
65. The assault on workers continues
At a time when the working class is getting hammered, elected officals just keep taking more and more away. Who the fuck votes for these assholes?
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awoke_in_2003 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:32 PM
Response to Original message
73. Everyone needs to wake up...
this will not end with IT workers. It will slowly creep to every job out there. The gains that labor made after WWII are slowly but surely being chipped away at- at least since the Reagan error, I mean era. The sad thing is- there are not very many democrats who will say "boo" about this. Like George Carlin said "It's a big club, and you ain't in it"
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goforit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:37 PM
Response to Original message
76. WTF?????
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Turbineguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 05:57 PM
Response to Original message
83. That the great thing about Congress these days.
Everything is for sale. :mad:
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Donnachaidh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 06:03 PM
Response to Original message
84. oh hell -- tell me again why there shouldn't be a move to clean OUT Congress?
About now, the only one who seems to be working for the 99% is Bernie Sanders. the rest of them need early freaking FORCED retirement. :grr:
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mwooldri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 06:05 PM
Response to Original message
85. Just called one of her staffers in DC.
Very nice, just didn't have much of an idea. Told her upfront as worded, it would cut IT workers overtime pay. And the wording of that is awfully close to regular customer service call center staff.

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Duval Donating Member (377 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 06:44 PM
Response to Original message
91. I'll help get her out! Damn! Republican Light!!
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DaveJ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 06:54 PM
Response to Original message
93. Unacceptable. This is sorta like "pepper spraying" workers.
Just because corporate drones have no lives and want to work 24/7 doesn't mean everyone else should. Kay Hagen (D-NC) is setting herself up for a corporate job after she gets voted out. Increasing work at lower pay is the opposite of what should be happening.
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MgtPA Donating Member (390 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 07:16 PM
Response to Original message
94. I worked IT from 1974 to 2010, both salaried and hourly, and I never got overtime.
We got paid for the hours we worked, which was sometimes 60 hours a week, but no time-and-a-half.

We were professionals, and that's how we were paid. That includes working federal contracts.
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Go2Peace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 08:14 PM
Response to Reply #94
100. You got taken.
Unless you were a manager Most IT was classified non-exempt until the last two changes, which occurred in the last 10 years.

There is no such thing as single hour overtime. Your employer gave it to you to make you think that they were not screwing you.

I almost *always* received overtime in my 20 year IT career and I had some pretty "professional" job titles and responsibility.
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MarkCharles Donating Member (932 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 07:46 PM
Response to Original message
95. workers of the 22'nd century, of all colors, replace the black slaves of the
19th century. THIs is the Republican Party's wet dream!
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INdemo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 08:15 PM
Response to Original message
101. A so called Democrat did this or is trying to end workers rights
Unless we organize a real progressive party and elect real progressives to represent the working class interests our Democracy is over..
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ingac70 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #101
119. She's from NC.....
Actual Dems in the South are few and far between.
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klook Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 10:18 PM
Response to Original message
106. There are many variables
Hourly IT workers (most of whom are either contractors, or full-time employees working in less-skilled positions) typically get no pay for sick days or vacation days, and no paid holidays. They typically also pay for their own health insurance (or work through an agency that takes a substantial slice off the top to pay for the worker's benefits).

So that overtime pay often comes with its own hefty price tag.

Still, I strongly oppose any bill that would make it impossible for people in these specific positions to get paid overtime! That's outrageous.

There are huge numbers of IT workers who will fly the coop as soon as the economy improves, and this will only increase turnover when that day comes. Meanwhile, employers want the current state of affairs to continue. A return to the 1990s environment, where IT jobs were growing on trees and many skilled and semi-skilled workers were commanding huge bucks, strikes many employers as a nightmare scenario. (But they forget they were getting rich then, too!)
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 10:46 PM
Response to Original message
107. This may be why this is happening...
Edited on Fri Dec-02-11 10:52 PM by CoffeeCat
I'm not the expert, but my husband is a tech geek. He was laid off a few months ago, and I've learned
a lot about the field--just from listening to him talk about his job and his experiences
as he looks for full-time employment.

This legislation may be happening because of the trend in the tech field. As we all know, corporate
America is greedy as hell. There is a huge trend in the tech field to contract out work. Then, companies
don't have to pay benefits, pensions, or health insurance. My husband is having NO PROBLEM finding
contract work. Since he is not salaried, the companies are required to pay him overtime.

This seems like a growing trend in the IT/tech field--and it is also a trend in my field PR/Marketing/Writing.

I think this trend will continue because it lowers costs for corporations. Paying those benefits is
quite the cost, I'm sure!

Corrupt corporate America has collectively realized that they can hire contractors and save money--but oh no--they
have to pay these people time-and-a-half for hours worked over 40! Gee, it sure would be nice to exploit
these people and make them work 40,60 or even 80 hours a week--but paying them overtime would cut into
profits. Plus, if they can make a contractor work 80 hours a week--without benefits or overtime--they
could probably start laying off more people. What a win!!

One thing we know for sure, if a bill like this is being introduced--it was because corporate America asked
for it. Seriously. The corporations bribe our politicians via campaign contributions (and probably with
insider stock tips as well), and our elected representatives craft the legislation that helps the corporations
make millions and rip off the peasants.

That's exactly what is happening here.

And what's even more disgusting about this--is that contract IT guys are usually in a more desperate situation--like
my husband. They need the work. It's not a stable gig, like a salaried job. So, they take the work--even long
hours--because of the uncertainty of not knowing when the next contract job will materialize. So, if they ask you to
work 80 hours with no overtime...you're practically forced into doing so. Most IT guys are professionals and many
with families. These guys are used to making high salaries, so they're trapped. Plus--like us--we're now forced to pay
$600 monthly for health insurance (with high deductibles and co-pays), so there's another reason why the work is
so important. They've got us over a barrel so why not exploit us some more by cutting overtime?

I'm so frickin tired of these bastard, criminal corporations using the United States House and Senate as their
own personal playground. It's unjust and it ALWAYS, ALWAYS harms the people!!!!
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Synicus Maximus Donating Member (828 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-02-11 11:01 PM
Response to Original message
111. I've been in IT since 1970, as a tech, instructor and analyst and
not only never have received overtime I have never even thought about getting any overtime.
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 07:40 AM
Response to Original message
114. Note also more Indian and Chinese are being brought in---they will work long hours and get no
overtime and if they complain they will be sent home.
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TNLib Donating Member (683 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 08:51 AM
Response to Original message
116. I'm in IT and Exempt so nothing changes for me.
I worked as a federal employee with a union in the past and to be honest there wasn't much difference. The first 2 hours of OT in an 8 hour period wasn't considered overtime and managers had the discretion of making the overtime comp time then denying PTO leave.

I think I went into the wrong field and every year it seems to be getting worse for IT professionals.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 09:37 AM
Response to Original message
121. K & R !!!
:mad:

:kick:
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RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 09:55 AM
Response to Original message
123. I, for one, am outraged for the Indian people!
:grr:
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Hamlette Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 11:09 AM
Response to Original message
124. Funny story
it is against the law to work more than 45 hours per week (for the same employer) in Switzerland. My sister worked there in IT. They would often work more than 45 per week. She did not complain, she was pretty jazzed about her job and ended working late nights. She managed programmers, don't know what her title was, something like program lead or something designing systems to run big applications like the stock market.

anyway, the Swiss police staked out the parking lot at the office where she worked and recorded the license plate numbers, noting when the cars arrived and when they left, and busted the company!

Compare that to our cops, in riot gear, breaking up OWS. If they had been like the Swiss police, there would be no need for OWS. We'd have lives.
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RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-03-11 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #124
132. Where's the "funny?"
:cry:
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The Gunslinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-11 11:18 AM
Response to Original message
133. Thank you Kay Hagan
For sticking up for the 1%. It's good to see that IT giants who already outsource tons of labor out of the country will get an opportunity to increase their bottom line on the backs of already over worked IT professionals.


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