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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 12:24 AM
Original message
No more saggy pants for Arkansas school children
Source: Reuters

No more saggy pants for Arkansas school children
Apr 04, 2011 | Reuters

Arkansas students who love their sagging pants should soon leave them at home.

Arkansas Governor Mike Beebe signed a bill on Wednesday that bans students from wearing clothing that exposes "underwear, buttocks or the breast of a female."

Arkansas educators have long complained about the drooping attire, such as young men wearing saggy jeans that expose the top of colorful boxer shorts.

"We feel the bill can improve the learning environment in schools," said Donna Morey, president of the Arkansas Education Association.

One concern of the General Assembly was that "student competition over the manner in which clothing is worn could lead to violence and injuries during school hours," according to the legislation. Lawmakers also said that students should learn to dress in a way that is acceptable in the workplace as they prepare to enter it.



Read more: http://www.asianage.com/international/no-more-saggy-pan...
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sudopod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 12:36 AM
Response to Original message
1. CRISIS AVERTED nt
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christx30 Donating Member (774 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 12:45 AM
Response to Reply #1
5. I know!
I am so thankful that all of the problems in Arkansas have been solved, and the government in the state is able to focus on the stupid and petty now. Arkansas must be the greatest state in the union at this point.
I am so grateful for the courage of our elected leaders.
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gtar100 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 01:10 AM
Response to Reply #1
11. Oh Thank God. America is finally getting back on track, thanks to the Republicans.
They sure know how to address the important issues we are facing. I can imagine this move alone will create thousands of jobs, just like they promised.

Back to reality... what a bunch of fools.
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Tripod Donating Member (534 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 04:13 AM
Response to Reply #11
23. I agree with the "Fools" part.
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backtomn Donating Member (424 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 02:47 PM
Response to Reply #1
82. You are right !!!
We are all safe now.
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wordpix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #1
116. governors should tackle the real reasons kids look up to the saggy-pant "idols" they emulate
I work in an inner city school and even though we have a dress code, there are always those who try to get through the doors with their pants hanging down past their asses and other inappropriate wear. As much as I dislike this style, I know the kids are only dressing like their rap video idols and young adults they look up to.

How about tackling poverty, dysfunctional families, drug addiction and other issues in these neighborhoods instead, governor? When kids feel good about themselves, their neighborhoods and schools, they'll dress nicely, wash their hair and brush their teeth, too.

I literally have one student whose brother was shot dead a few yrs. ago and recently, her best friend-neighbor was also shot dead. I have another student who sleeps on the floor (without a mat) and is ridiculed by his family for going to school every day. His 12 yo sister doesn't attend school and has a line of boys lined up out her door, and his 18 yo sister is unmarried, no job and pregnant. The father of this family smokes crack in front of the children. :grr:

BUT---it's teachers and saggy pants to blame for failing test scores and F-rated schools. :sarcasm:
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alp227 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #116
117. but then it'd take TAXING THE RICH wouldn't it? you can't do that! lol
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Puzzler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 12:39 AM
Response to Original message
2. Why is school dress an issue for the governor?
I thought issues like this were for the individual schools and/or the various eduction boards.
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rpannier Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 12:42 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. It was a bill passed by the legislature
He had to sign or veto it
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Puzzler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 12:50 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. I guess I should have asked...
... why was this an issue for the legislature? Surely this is micro management. What's the point of school principals and school boards then?
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mr clean Donating Member (106 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 02:09 PM
Response to Reply #6
78. What's the point of school principals and school boards then?
To get rid of Teacher Unions of course.

It just hasn't made it this far south.... yet(I hope it stays up north).
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backtomn Donating Member (424 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #2
83. Remember....Bill Clinton was a supporter
I think that this is all terribly misguided. With all that is going on in schools, this might be issue #205.
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 12:42 AM
Response to Original message
4. This is how Republicans plan to rule.
Not address important stuff like jobs, healthcare, energy, or infrastructure. No, kids clothing is a priority. They are now legislating fashion. What's next? Certain hairstyles? Tatoo's? Music? There are limitless possibilities on what they'll legislate by decree.

I guess they've given up on the youth vote...oh well, just another way for Republicans to prove they're the Anti-Party. All they tell us is what they are against...never tell us what they are for.
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bluestateguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 12:52 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. You may well be right
Bu the Arkansas legislature is Democratic and so is Governor Beebe.
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Hestia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 10:49 AM
Response to Reply #7
105. Not it's not - TBaggers were elected in here this past election, just like the rest of the country
The only thing keeping us from having abortion bills passed is through intervention by our Secretary of State. Beebe, I'm not sure about him sometimes, though he has always been a moderate. I do think he said that he would pass all the TB bills, just to show them what would happen if they did pass. They fiddle and the poverty level rises, especially with the rise of gasoline. There is no room in budgets here, we've been gnawing at the bone since Ronnie. Our Economic Policy - Thank God for Mississippi, though I am not sure we can say that anymore.
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Ramulux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 12:57 AM
Response to Original message
8. Insanity
"We feel the bill can improve the learning environment in schools,"

How? Seriously, do they even have any sort of argument as to why this is true? What studies have been done researching the correlation between grades and the height of ones pants? These people just make shit up and dont even bother trying to come up with reasons for why they are doing it.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 04:37 AM
Response to Reply #8
25. Why is it wrong to prohibit boys and girls from showing their underwear?
this does not ban BAGGY clothes, this law is saying that boys have to pull their pants up, or wear a long enough shirt, that no one sees their boxers. It is akin to similar rules for girls about skirt lengths (some skirts and dresses are fine for night clubs or parties but not really appropriate for school as their panties, or lack there of, can be seen every time they sit down or get up or bend to get something in their locker or bag. "impove the learning enviornment" means the law about pants that sag so we see boys boxers is too distracting for the gay boys and straight girls just as girls showing too much of their breasts or their panties is too distracting for the lesbiens and straight guys. I teach and I see this, boys showing off their boxers in class. Underwear are not to be shown off in the classroom. Like i said that is fine at a night club or at a party or out on the street but school is none of those places. does your boss let you show your underwear at work?
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yellowcanine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #25
63. To me it is more of a question as to whether this is the proper role for state government.
Why not let the local schools deal with dress codes?

This is using a sledgehammer to put in a thumbtack.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #63
74. does the state have the right to have a dress code for state workers?
if so they would also have a right to call for dress codes in state schools as well. I agree that there are many far more important things to have the state legislature vote on than school dress code and i would think that most if not all school districts already have such a dress code in place so this is problably nothing more than a populist move by the democratic party in arkansas.
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yellowcanine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 01:36 PM
Response to Reply #74
76. Not a question of right. Question of governing philosophy and common sense.
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nalnn Donating Member (528 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #74
110. I may be misreading you but...
The state does have and enforce either directly or indirectly dress codes on its employees.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #110
112. which is why i think that it is resonable for the state to have
a dress code saying "no underwear showing" for its school children.
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harmonicon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #25
98. ah, a voice of sanity!
The first one in this thread so far. Good job.
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cstanleytech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 12:58 AM
Response to Original message
9. I wonder if the scotus will agree with this infringment on constitutional
Edited on Mon Apr-04-11 12:59 AM by cstanleytech
rights.
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lobodons Donating Member (448 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 01:31 AM
Response to Reply #9
13.  in loco parentis
in loco parentis comes to mind.
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pnwmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 01:49 AM
Response to Reply #9
16. Do middle or high school students really have a constitutional right
to display front or rear cleavage?

I kind of doubt it.
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cstanleytech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 03:54 AM
Response to Reply #16
20. Except the constitution last time I checked
doesnt have a section specifically saying the government can tell people what current clothing fashions to follow or what music to listen to or even what books to read or not to read.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 04:40 AM
Response to Reply #20
27. this is well within the role of schools to do this
"Lawmakers also said that students should learn to dress in a way that is acceptable in the workplace as they prepare to enter it." preparing kids for the workplace is a clearly defined role of public schools. dress codes to eliminate gang colors are constitutional in order to improve the learning environment, telling kids that they must hide their underwear is indeed preparing them for most workplace dress codes.
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mr clean Donating Member (106 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #27
79. +1
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cstanleytech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 09:06 PM
Response to Reply #27
124. However just because lawmakers say its ok doesnt mean it is.......
for example there are people like myself who believe the courts as well as our elected officials (the law makers) are in error by allowing people to imprisoned there for years without a trial.
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pnwmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 06:35 AM
Response to Reply #20
38. There have been many other SCOTUS rulings that students
in public schools do not have all the same rights as adults. For example, corporal punishment is still allowed in some states, with the approval of SCOTUS. That bothers me a hell of a lot more than a dress code that banned partial nudity.
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NashVegas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 08:06 AM
Response to Reply #20
50. self-delete
Edited on Mon Apr-04-11 08:07 AM by NashVegas
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RZM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 09:57 AM
Response to Reply #20
65. Plenty of kids are forced to wear uniforms, even in public schools
That's apparently constitutional.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 04:37 AM
Response to Reply #9
26. school dress codes
are usually legal.
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SheilaT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 01:08 AM
Response to Original message
10. Every time I see some kid whose
pants are drooping down to his knees, I'm very, very tempted to pull them all the way down.
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emilyg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 01:36 AM
Response to Reply #10
14. Me2
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Golden Raisin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 03:02 AM
Response to Reply #10
18. I wonder what do they do if
Edited on Mon Apr-04-11 03:09 AM by Golden Raisin
they have to run for their lives? Seems like they wouldn't get very far (fire, bully, etc.) without tripping over their sagging pants and falling.
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cstanleytech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 03:59 AM
Response to Reply #10
21. I feel the same but on the other hand
the fact is what we approve of as far as what kids are wearing is the same issue our parents faced with us and their parents with them and so on, the same thing happens with music in how what is popular changes and evolves as the years go on.
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wickerwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 10:07 PM
Response to Reply #21
101. My main objection to this trend is that it never seems to go away.
The class year ahead of mine in high school were called "The Saggy Britches"... in 1993. And it was already considered borderline passe. Rappers started the trend in the late 1980s.

So why, oh why, is this nearly 25 year old "fashion statement" still in vogue? If anyone I knew had worn bell bottoms and an afro to school in 1993 they would have been mercilessly ridiculed.

Why Generation Z? Why?

Is it so hard to come up with your own stuff? How about only putting on one pants leg? There's still a lot of room for creativity in shaving or body painting- that could really piss your parents off.

Or at least steal the rockin' stuff from the 80s and 90s. Grunge was awesome and you barely even had to do laundry.
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lobodons Donating Member (448 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 01:28 AM
Response to Original message
12. or the breast of a female
I was wondering what constitutes as "the breast of a female"? Why not just mandate burka's?
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pnwmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 01:47 AM
Response to Reply #12
15. I'm guessing they're talking about cleavage.
And I'm not going to get worked up about this. Overly sexy clothes are an unnecessary distraction in school. Have you seen what some middle-schoolers want to wear?
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 04:43 AM
Response to Reply #15
28. +1
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 07:17 AM
Response to Reply #15
45. Abercrombie & Fitch offering bikini with push up bra top--for SEVEN year olds.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #45
75. that just aint right
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freshwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 09:51 PM
Response to Reply #45
100. Making the pedos happy, huh?
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RZM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 09:59 AM
Response to Reply #12
66. There is quite a distance between clothes that show cleavage
And a burqa. I'm sure there is plenty of room within the 'happy medium.'
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Loudmxr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 01:53 AM
Response to Original message
17. There is nothing like a 4th grader in a Brooks Bros. suit that commands respect in Arkansas.
Take that to the bank!! :crazy:
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AllTooEasy Donating Member (540 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 03:39 AM
Response to Original message
19. High school girls in Ft. Lauderdale are showing butt crack now. School boys...

...are taking pics with their cell phones. Something has got to be done about that!!! This has nothing to do with Liberal vs. Conservative. Do you want your daughter (or son) showing off their butt crack at school?

BTW, I'm no prude. I've hit many a nude beach in my adult life.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 04:56 AM
Response to Reply #19
29. I am a teacher, i take my job seriously
and would never EVER do anything sexual with a student, but i am human and can be distracted by 16 to 18 year old girls in lam skin tight dresses who happen to sit in front of the class and "forget" that they are not wearing panties (only happened once and in a 1st year university class i was teaching). The boys in the class are even more distracted because they are daydreaming about getting her to have sex with them and I will be trying to stay concerntrated on the lesson i am giving and while i would like to kick the girl out of class for not having panties how can i say anthing without being accused of being a pervert? The boys show off their shiny sily boxers to distract the girls and the kids are not concentrating on learning, they are concentrating on dreams of getting laid. School is not a god damned night club. Reasonable dress codes are nothing bad. Not showing ones private parts or undergarments is reasonable.
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RebelOne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 07:34 AM
Response to Reply #29
46. What do you teach?
I certainly hope it is not spelling, grammar or English. There is a spell check.
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joeglow3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 10:57 AM
Response to Reply #46
69. You realize this is a message board
I certainly don't give a shit about that here and don't spend time double checking it.

That said, I have had teachers send out notes to parents with awful grammar and that makes me sad...
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #46
73. i teach English and history in English
Edited on Mon Apr-04-11 01:16 PM by reggie the dog
and i dont proofread when i write on this board
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iemitsu Donating Member (524 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 05:00 PM
Response to Reply #73
90. why don't you proof read?
it is a habit that you should try to develop.
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LanternWaste Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #90
93. Odd... where I work, we have jobs for proofreaders
Odd... where I work, we have jobs for proofreaders so that the writers may concentrate on the job at hand.

I imagine civility is also a habit we should attempt to develop...
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iemitsu Donating Member (524 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #93
96. i guess that hiring someone to check your work is
good for the economy. but should those who spell better than you get paid less than you? because you're too busy thinking to check your work?
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wickerwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #96
102. Sentences begin with capital letters and your last one is a fragment.
Edited on Mon Apr-04-11 10:17 PM by wickerwoman
Am I hired?

On edit: And "proofread" is one word.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #96
114. ????
just chill allright, use "proper" punctuation if you want, i am too lazy to click spell check because i know nearly everyone else on here doesnt give a damn so long as the message is passed. if i were to make a sign and carry it around at a demonstration where people will see me in public then i will use my dictionary but on here i dont think it really matters.
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LanternWaste Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 06:05 PM
Response to Reply #96
121. Ummm... your grammar is incorrect.
Ummm... your grammar is incorrect (lower case B in '"because"). Are you too busy thinking to check your work?
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #90
113. when i type shit for my students
or work in general i proofread, when i type on here i dont, as you can see i dont use caps often either because i dont feel like it. to me this forum is like a bar or coffeehouse, you go to talk and listen, i use slang here, swear, all sorts of things i wouldnt do at work.
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LanternWaste Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #46
94. I imagine you yourself are quite without error
I imagine you yourself are quite without error in your chosen profession-- unless of course you instruct manners and civility. :shrug:
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 12:49 PM
Response to Reply #94
115. +1
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Kokonoe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 08:24 AM
Response to Reply #29
55. But..But.. it IS France.
I'm so jealous. Those problems are not here.
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Tripod Donating Member (534 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 04:11 AM
Response to Original message
22. Societies teachers aren't good enough.
I agree, I hate that look! but each generation has their thing. One day that baggy pants woman will run this country. It is just about personal identity. I hope they can figure it out.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 05:01 AM
Response to Reply #22
30. baggy is one thing,
showing off ones underwear is another. I wore and still wear baggy pants (not all the time but sometimes) and baggy shorts too, i just wear pants that are long and baggy but that are kept around my WAIST by a belt. I do not lift my shirt up when i sit down to show off a tiny bit of boxer that may show. The schoolkids are showing off half of their boxers down to the point that if they foget to button their boxers......

it is fine that kids have their fashion but not showing ones UNDERGARMENTS is perfectly reasonable as a rule.
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Tripod Donating Member (534 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 05:16 AM
Response to Reply #30
31. I agree. ..:)
Let's leave some things to our adult lives...
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 05:27 AM
Response to Reply #31
32. or to their bedrooms with their partners
while the hurry before mom or dad get home.... ;)
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Tripod Donating Member (534 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 05:39 AM
Response to Reply #32
34. I am grateful, My girlfriend wears amazing underwear.
But not every one gets to see them!
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Norrin Radd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 04:21 AM
Response to Original message
24. On a side note, I thought this look went out in the
mid 90's? Hipster/emo skinny jeans or ironic 70's/80's faux thrift store wear and moustaches hasn't reached Arkansas, yet? They are so far behind next you'll tell me they are getting into 3rd gen Rave wear?
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Ultraviolet Cat Donating Member (17 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 05:33 AM
Response to Reply #24
33. No . . . . it never really went out of style!
I'm a high school teacher in Michigan, and I remember when this style first started showing up in the early 90's. My students are *still* wearing their pants like this -- making this style of dress older than most of the kids currently wearing it.

I was talking with my wife about the difference between girl's clothing styles that seem to last for 6 months and this style that is almost old enough to vote, and she pointed out that most of the girls' styles seem to go out of the fashion when their mothers start wearing them. So, this seems to be the problem -- we have here a clothing style that is so ridiculous that no grown man would ever go out in public dressed this way, so teenage boys are still able to wear it to separate themselves from their parents.

So, here is my modest proposal -- instead of banning the style, I suggest that for the next 6 months we have a nationwide movement of dads wearing saggy pants and showing off our boxers. By the end of the six months, teenage boys will be wearing their pants up just under their chests -- Urkel style! Problem solved!
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david_vincent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 08:24 AM
Response to Reply #33
54. You're the only one here who gets it
When dealing with rebellion, the way to handle it is not to outlaw the offensive behavior (leaving aside the debate of whether it is or isn't actually offensive). Kids started wearing their pants hanging down out of a sense of prison chic -- they were copying the ill-fitting clothing worn by the incarcerated. To do away with it, you don't ban it, you mandate it. That's the only way to rob it of its purported coolness.
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Hestia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 10:55 AM
Response to Reply #33
106. Love it!
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Le Taz Hot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 08:14 AM
Response to Reply #24
52. I thought the same thing.
I haven't seen the baggy pants thing en masse here in California in probably 3 years. Now it's the retro 60's skin-tight stuff all over again. Been there, done that, and at 56 won't be doing that again. You're welcome. ;-)
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Democat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 05:52 AM
Response to Original message
35. Nanny State?
Is this a Democrat or Republican?
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Hubert Flottz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 06:22 AM
Response to Original message
36. Where will the military go to recruit all those crack troopers now?
Edited on Mon Apr-04-11 06:22 AM by Hubert Flottz
If they busted everybody around the country because of crack exposure, Wall-Mart would have a total shutdown...you'd think the folks in the home state of Wally World would get that?
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Celebration Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 06:31 AM
Response to Original message
37. our public schools have had uniforms for awhile
At first the kids and some of the parents didn't like them, but they have worked out well. Now kids don't concentrate on how they dress, and that is one less distraction for learning. Gang symbols were a big problem here in school, and the uniforms get rid of that. Also the kids with money, and the kids without, are on a more even keel. So not only can they not show their underwear, but no baggy pants either. Since I don't have a school age kid, I don't know the exact "uniform" but I think it requires belts.

I probably would have griped for awhile as a teenager, but this is a good idea for here and now. It is not a state law, however.
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pnwmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 06:39 AM
Response to Reply #37
39. I went to a school with uniforms and everybody griped.
But I doubt that I was the only one who secretly liked not having to figure out what to wear every day.
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mwooldri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 07:58 AM
Response to Reply #39
49. My school at the secondary level had a very strict uniform code.
Girls had an easier time of getting around some of it... unbuttoning the tops of shirts and hoiking up their skirts that were supposed to be knee high. Boys didn't have any real leeway whatsoever. The teachers caught on to the girls not having enough buttons done up... all students - boys and girls - were made to wear a tie.

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pnwmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #49
71. Ties do seem a little over-the-top. I don't see any
educational advantage to making kids physically uncomfortable. (Or adults, for that matter.)
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mwooldri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 07:48 AM
Response to Reply #71
103. Fortunately when my sister left that school...
... they made the dress code even tighter - if you could believe it.

At that point you're right it wasn't about educational advantage, it was about image projection - that it was a more elite school than your average run-of-the-mill secondary education school.
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Fearless Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 06:43 AM
Response to Original message
40. What we need is state mandated uniforms!
Just like the Hitler youth had! :eyes:
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Teaser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #40
42. man that is one stupid comment
Edited on Mon Apr-04-11 07:02 AM by Teaser
uniforms = Hitler Youth.

OK.
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Fearless Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 08:41 AM
Response to Reply #42
58. No. Uniforms = forced conformity.
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iemitsu Donating Member (524 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #58
92. uniforms do equal conformity.
Edited on Mon Apr-04-11 05:18 PM by iemitsu
you are right. and those who defend the forced wearing of uniforms are control freaks.
that is not what education is about.
if there are real problems associated with a clothing style then it should be no problem for educators to help their charges discover those problems and determine for themselves or as a group how to address them.
state legislators do not need to waste tax-payer's money dealing with this fashion.
the style is not sexy.
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Kokonoe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 08:51 AM
Response to Reply #42
59. Hitler Youth = uniforms
It must be true both ways.

Or not.
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Fearless Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 08:56 AM
Response to Reply #59
60. It isn't. Because that is not what I said.
I was alluding to the FACT that uniforms are forced conformity and that studies show that they is no relationship between uniforms and school achievement. The point of schools is to promote student learning. Uniforms are needless.
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joeglow3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 11:14 AM
Response to Reply #60
109. Fankly, I don't think most are arguing that
Rather, the stigma that comes with not "fitting in" with the new trends may cause students to miss school more and eventually drop out.

http://www.woio.com/Global/story.asp?S=4356460&nav=menu...
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 06:44 AM
Response to Original message
41. Thought headline said "No more soggy pants for Arkansas school children"
Assumed either Arkansas schools or Arkansas school children were leaking.

Anyone know a good optometrist in Boston?
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ehrnst Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 07:04 AM
Response to Original message
43. Small Government in action!!! (nt)
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ehrnst Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 07:08 AM
Response to Original message
44. This must be one of his "improving education" priorities....
"Since taking office in 2007, Governor Mike Beebe has made improving education,
expanding Arkansass economy and cutting taxes top priorities. " - from his website.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 07:38 AM
Response to Original message
47. Well, one thing is clear, anyway.
The topic of dress codes for minors could occupy DU for another decade, at least. :)

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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 07:55 AM
Response to Original message
48. Meh, the kids will come up with something new. nt
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Kokonoe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 08:11 AM
Response to Original message
51. Sometimes my grandson has saggy pants.
But I change them as soon as I see.


Do kids still like the pacifiers in the mouth fad?

We just can't have young people making decisions for themselves. What would it lead to!!!

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greiner3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 08:22 AM
Response to Original message
53. Assholes can burn the Koran for free speech;
But let someone show what color of Joe's they have and they are criminals.
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TygrBright Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 08:25 AM
Response to Original message
56. Prediction: Arkansas school kids will start....
...wearing trousers so tight you can watch their pubic hairs grow.

amusedly,
Bright
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Sabriel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #56
119. I say they should wear full-body lycra or spandex
Let the old farts complain they're TOO covered up!
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olegramps Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 08:35 AM
Response to Original message
57. Isn't it just normal teen rebellion? Same old game parents and kid have played since time began.
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Fearless Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 09:14 AM
Response to Reply #57
61. Yes. And we're spending taxpayer dollars to ban it. During a budget shortfall might I add.
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WatsonT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 02:02 PM
Response to Reply #57
77. Just mandate the teachers dress the same
that will kill this trend pretty quick.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #57
84. like when i was a teen in Illinois
we could get detention for showing off our boxers. Wearing baggy pants sagging with a baggy shirt to cover it was no problem so long as no one saw our boxers.
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yellowcanine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 09:15 AM
Response to Original message
62. Seems like an unwarrented intrusion of state government. I thought Repubs were against the "nanny
government". You can't get much more nanny like than this.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #62
86. these are democrats, this is arkansas
the legislature and executive at the state level are controlled by democrats. arkansas is actually a fairly reliable left wing state.
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Art_from_Ark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 07:45 PM
Response to Reply #86
97. I wouldn't exactly call Arkansas a "left-wing" state
It's actually quite conservative. Since 1972, the state has voted for a Democratic presidential candidate only 3 times (Carter, Clinton, and Clinton). Mike Huckabee was governor for 10+ long years. And now the state has a Republican US Senator (only the 2nd time in 130 years) and 3 of its 4 US representatives are now republicans (for maybe the first time ever, and the 4th representative often votes with the Republicans).
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Hestia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 10:59 AM
Response to Reply #97
108. Don't remind me...sigh...and we're right to work - yee haw!
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Hestia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 10:58 AM
Response to Reply #86
107. Not It's Not! TBaggers were voted in here in November! Only Gov & SoS are Democratic
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #107
111. from what i looked up
Edited on Tue Apr-05-11 12:34 PM by reggie the dog
your state legislature is democrat both the house and senate

The state senate is 20 Democrats and 15 Republicans


the state house is 54 to 45

and the governor is Democrat, that is fairly left wing and great for a former confederate state.
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Art_from_Ark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 11:59 PM
Response to Reply #111
126. Arkansas is NOT "left-wing"
Edited on Wed Apr-06-11 12:00 AM by Art_from_Ark
Most of those "Democratic" state legislators are "good ole boy" closet Dixiecrats who attach a D to their name because it's still the only way to get elected at the local level in many parts of the state. HOWEVER, at the *national* level, the state has increasingly come to vote for REPUBLICANS, voting for a REPUBLICAN US Senator and 3 REPUBLICAN representatives (out of 4) in the 2010 election.

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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-06-11 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #126
127. yet your governor is not a republican like in wisconsin
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Art_from_Ark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-06-11 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #127
128. His predecessor WAS a Republican like in Wisconsin
and is currently considered a contender for the 2010 Republican presidential nomination, despite his nuttiness.
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Art_from_Ark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 01:03 AM
Response to Reply #128
129. Whoops--
meant to write *2012* presidential nomination
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blackspade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 09:40 AM
Response to Original message
64. It always boils down to shit like this:
"One concern of the General Assembly was that "student competition over the manner in which clothing is worn could lead to violence and injuries during school hours," according to the legislation. Lawmakers also said that students should learn to dress in a way that is acceptable in the workplace as they prepare to enter it."

Clothing fashions somehow lead to violence and injuries, Total bullshit. These assholes have been saying the same crap for decades with no evidence to back it up.
And of course kids need to learn to be 'acceptable' little worker drones for our corporate masters....
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iemitsu Donating Member (524 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 05:23 PM
Response to Reply #64
95. you have this right.
the same old unproved arguments.
dress codes do not make the man.
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Dappleganger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 10:12 AM
Response to Original message
67. School is for learning.
I don't have a problem with any school having dress requirements which are universally given and enforced for the purpose of a better learning environment. Wear your baggy styles on your own time.
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Fearless Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 10:57 AM
Response to Reply #67
68. Dress requirements (ie uniforms) create student learning?
Do you have data to back that up?
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Dappleganger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #68
70. Uniforms or school dress codes?
First, we are parents to four teens so my opinion is based upon that experience. Second, there isn't a school that we have encountered which does NOT have a dress code. Whether or not they enforce the dress code is up to them.

Third, yes I do believe that dress codes for school-aged kids is conducive to learning. They are paying more attention to their studies than how far down their pants go. If they want to do that on their own time, I don't have any issue with it but in school it's not their time.

I don't need data to back up my opinions.
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Fearless Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 02:36 PM
Response to Reply #70
80. You never need data to back up your opinions
However if you want others to believe it, the opposite is true. I don't deny that they should have "proper dress codes" at all in fact. But I do not think that the state should dictate what that means. Ever. It should be up to schools.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 03:14 PM
Response to Reply #67
87. this is not anti baggy style
it is perfectly possible to wear baggy style pants without showing ones boxers, either cinch them up at the waist with a belt or wear a long enough baggy shirt to cover the boxers too, this law is about showing ones underwear at school.
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bitchkitty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
72. School uniforms
That's what I would do if I ruled the schools. We can give up a fighter jet or two and pay for uniforms across the country. Maybe a school breakfast and lunch program too. Problem solved. :)
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and-justice-for-all Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 06:55 PM
Response to Reply #72
123. I agree 100%...nt
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RedCloud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 02:38 PM
Response to Original message
81. Buttocks and breasts are out (so to speak). What about the front section?
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #81
88. the front section is concerned with pants so low
that you see over half of the boxer
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ileus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 03:05 PM
Response to Original message
85. Now what about their parents?
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MellowDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 04:46 PM
Response to Original message
89. Fine by me...
I remember some of the big distractions in high school from this kind of clothing. There were two girls that sat in front of me in physics, a class I was already struggling with, whose ass-cracks showed prominently every single day. They weren't even that attractive, just playboy-wannabes trying to use sex to get attention, but damn was it distracting, and not in a good way.
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LiberalEsto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 05:00 PM
Response to Original message
91. That'll larn 'em
young whippersnappers.
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Sen. Walter Sobchak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-04-11 08:52 PM
Response to Original message
99. sagging pants serve an essential public service
they warn the public at large they are in the presence of mental defectives. Watching my neighbors dumbfuck eminem wannabe son run for the bus tripping over his own pants used to be the highlight of me and my girlfriends day.
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okieinpain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 10:33 AM
Response to Original message
104. what about the plumbers working in schools. will this apply to
them also.
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we can do it Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
118. Just How Goddam Long Is The Saggy Pants Shit Going To Go On?
its been over 20 fucking years now. It is no longer a fad. WTF is wrong can't kids even think up a new fad anymore?
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mcollins Donating Member (506 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 04:48 PM
Response to Original message
120. I was thinking 1930s Zoot Suiters. nt
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and-justice-for-all Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 06:54 PM
Response to Original message
122. I actually agree with this....
yes I know there are more important issues at hand, but I digress....

I would like to see students in uniforms to be honest.
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QED Donating Member (253 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-05-11 09:24 PM
Response to Original message
125. "Pants on the ground"
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