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Frank Booth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 01:53 AM
Original message
House Democrats may tweak tax deal
Source: Washington Post

As the Senate prepared Tuesday to push through a sweeping tax package negotiated by the White House and congressional Republicans, House leaders were looking to amend the measure to satisfy the concerns of angry liberals without unraveling the deal altogether.

----

Outraged by the agreement to exempt individual estates worth as much as $5 million from taxation, senior Democrats said they would press to lower the threshold to $3.5 million. They also want to impose a stiffer tax on larger estates, by setting the rate at 45 percent rather than the 35 percent demanded by Republicans and agreed to by Obama.

Those are the same terms that were in effect in 2009. The estate tax expired for the 2010 tax year but is set to spring back to life next month with much tougher provisions. House Democrats said their alternative would hit only about 6,600 of the nation's wealthiest households while raising an additional $26 billion over the next two years compared with the Obama-GOP compromise - money that could be used to reduce the soaring national debt.

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House leaders were also considering a proposal by Rep. Brad Sherman (D-Calif.) to convert the payroll tax holiday into a one-time refund check that would be issued to every American worker early next year. Sherman said the alternative was designed not only to get cash more quickly into the hands of consumers, but also to protect Social Security. Some Democrats fear that Republicans would try to extend the one-year payroll tax holiday, permanently reducing the flow of funds to Social Security at a time when the GOP and deficit hawks in both parties are urging lawmakers to cut benefits for future retirees.

Read more: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/20...
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tomm2thumbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 02:10 AM
Response to Original message
1. 'Don't touch my souffl! You'll make it fall & we'll all starve. Out of my kitchen!'

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rasputin1952 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 05:25 AM
Response to Reply #1
9. LOL...
:D
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avaistheone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 02:18 AM
Response to Original message
2. Better makes sure the funds that make up for the payroll tax holiday
come from raising the cap on Social Security, rather than taking money from the General Fund. Otherwise Social Security is going to get seriously screwed.
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progressoid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 02:49 AM
Response to Original message
3. Phew! 3.5 million.
I'm still safe.


:eyes:
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Sherman A1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 03:32 AM
Response to Original message
4. The idea by Brad Sherman has merit
as a half way decent compromise on a bad concept. The payroll tax holiday is a very bad idea in that it will affect SS. This plan takes a bad idea and makes it a bit less so. I could go with the single payment idea, in that I could then roll that check into an IRA account doing potentially less damage to myself.

I will have to write my Congressman asking him to help kill the whole thing or to support Mr. Sherman's compromise deal.
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Skink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #4
13. wouldn't a rebate be nice. I took the money when Bush did it.
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DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 03:32 AM
Response to Original message
5. Geeze.
- What a bunch of pansies.....

What America needs is some balls

GOP honcho Mitch O'Connell says what America needs is for Republicans to finish beating the snot out of Obama, and strengthen the already rich by eliminating taxes for them and shifting the burden onto us. Obama says America needs to find bipartisan cooperation with the party of ruthlessness. Elton John says that America needs more compassion (Thanks, we never noticed).

What America really needs is a wall-to-wall people's insurrection, preferably based on force and fear of force, the only thing oligarchs understand. And even then the odds are not good. The oligarchs have all the legal power, police, jails and prisons, surveillance and firepower. Not to mention a docile populace.

Shy of open insurrection, a nationwide refusal to pay income taxes would certainly shake things up. But broader America is happy in the sense they know happiness as an undisturbed regimen of toil, stress and commodity consumption. Despite the way it looks in the news, most Americans remain untouched by foreclosure, bankruptcy and unemployment. So risking loss of their work-buy-sleep cycle in an insurrection looks to be sheer lunacy to them.

Like cows, they are kept comfortable in the pure animal sense to be milked for profit. Animal comfort kills all thoughts of revolution. Hell, half of mankind would be thrilled with the average American's present material situation.

~Joe Bageant, "America Y UR Peeps B So Dum?"
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 04:08 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. Pansies? Balls?
You and Joe Bageant seem like a couple of real gems.
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DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 10:22 AM
Response to Reply #7
12. Thank you! :-) n/t
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sirthomas66 Donating Member (336 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #5
15. Outstanding post. I'm going to use it, if you don't mind.
Edited on Wed Dec-15-10 11:59 AM by sirthomas66
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DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. Thank you, and you're welcome! ;-) n/t
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breadandwine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #5
16. Like Obama, Darth Vader meant well, but he was seduced by the dark side of the force.
Edited on Wed Dec-15-10 12:40 PM by breadandwine
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 04:05 AM
Response to Original message
6. ALMA (angry liberals my ass). Moderates (both Republicon and Democratic) were furious. Only true
believers of both Parties were willing to swallow this deal and the excuses for it.

IOW,

TWEAK THIS!
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Creative Donating Member (831 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 04:12 AM
Response to Original message
8. There is talk that some Republicans will join Democrats in opposing this.
What appeared to be a done deal less than a week ago, could now be in jeopardy.
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rasputin1952 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 05:43 AM
Response to Original message
10. It all comes down to those that "have", believe everyone else...
Edited on Wed Dec-15-10 05:45 AM by rasputin1952
should pay for their good fortune...they are cheap jugheads.

Here's the deal from a baseline point of view:

1. If you have millions, and didn't hire a good tax attorney and Accountant, you are an idiot.
2. If the inheritance tax is such a big deal for the wealthy, give the money to your heirs before you die.
3. Inheriting huge amounts of money is income, it should be taxed, (hell, the heir didn't even work for it!).

If we are going to tax those at the lower end of the spectrum, why should the wealthy get a gift? Taxes are expressed not only at the federal level, but at state and municipal levels as well. Then there are sales and use taxes that people pay at a higher level when poor simply because they take what they've earned and spend it. At the higher level of income, they invest and make more, something the "average" worker cannot do. BTW...the notion that the wealthy invest in "jobs" is complete BS, if that were true, the tables would be turned and businesses would be begging people to work for them...that hasn't happened under the bush tax cuts for 10 years, in fact, for ten years we've seen jobs being outsourced and getting wiped off the economic map; all the while the wealthy got much wealthier. It's actually hard to spend a million dollars, unless there is a gain involved.

Oh, and "Class Warfare"...damn right this is class warfare, and when people finally wake up and figure out they've been carrying the wealthy on their backs for a long time, supporting them by paying for their wealth by working extended hours for less pay, it could get very nasty. I do not advocate violence in any form, but there is no way I can hold back an very angry citizenry, nor can anyone else.

It all comes down to a bunch of cheap bastards that think cash is the only thing that matters...they step not over, but on those that are in dire straits, and then spit on them for good measure. They work people into early graves and then blame the dead for being lazy...it's despicable.
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The Wizard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 07:09 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. Rasputin is correct
At what point will the camel's back break? Violence or the the threat thereof is effective. The Teabaggers use it well.
As it stands, there is class warfare, and the wealthy have all the weapons and set the rules.
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gratuitous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 10:39 AM
Response to Original message
14. Break up the package, and vote on the individual parts
There's no compelling reason the estate tax giveaway has to be tied to lower tax rates for the wealthy. The "temporary" social security "holiday" doesn't need to be contingent on extending unemployment benefits. Break it apart, and let's have a whole slew of those "up-or-down votes" that the Republicans thought were so important and sacrosanct a few years ago when they were in the majority. Let's see who stands up and who stands behind the curtain when roll gets called.
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Ruperto31 Donating Member (250 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 03:11 PM
Response to Original message
18. The estate tax is a false flag.
The ceiling goes from $3.5M to $5M? So what? The real problem with this legislation is that (1) the rich still get their tax cut, and (2) this is paid for by cutting the Social Security tax by two percentage points. It's like Robin Hood in reverse: stealing from the poor old future geezers to subsidize the rich.
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sirthomas66 Donating Member (336 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 03:25 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. SS is not yet being defunding YET, just the employee portion of payroll
taxes are being reduced. That is still an ominous effort, but so far the rich are not getting any of it.
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Kingofalldems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-15-10 03:25 PM
Response to Original message
20. K and R
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