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Tx4obama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-10-10 06:31 PM
Original message
Nancy Pelosi wants DREAM Act vote
Source: Politico

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi wants to push for a vote during the lame-duck session on a bill that would legalize young, undocumented immigrants if they attend college or serve in the military, according to Democratic sources familiar with a leadership conference call Wednesday.

A vote on the bill, known as the DREAM Act, could come as early as next week, the sources said. Pelosi asked Rep. George Miller (D-Calif.) and Rep. Xavier Becerra (D-Calif.) to assess the mood of the caucus, according to one source.

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) had previously announced that he plans to bring up the DREAM Act during the lame duck session. His spokesman said Wednesday that Reid still hopes to call a vote.

The move by Democratic leaders to put immigration back on the legislative calendar will win support from Latinos, whose strong turnout numbers in the West last week were credited with helping the party hold on to control of the Senate. Immigration advocates have pressed Democrats to move on the DREAM Act as a down-payment on their promise to push for a comprehensive immigration reform bill in the future.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1110/44959.html



Lookin' good !!!

:) :) :) :) :) :)

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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-10-10 06:31 PM
Response to Original message
1. Yes!!
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msongs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-10-10 06:46 PM
Response to Original message
2. drag it all out for a vote - dadt/dream act/tax expirations extensions all of it nt
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davidwparker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-10-10 06:58 PM
Response to Original message
3. Get it in while you can, Nancy.
(sure wished you found your way on the impeachment table)
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bluestateguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-10-10 07:20 PM
Response to Original message
4. Mike Malloy slammed this bill from the left
and I am inclined to agree with what he says.

I am a Lean No.
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w4rma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-10-10 07:31 PM
Response to Original message
5. No. (nt)
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Honeycombe8 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-10-10 08:56 PM
Response to Original message
6. No. nt
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RZM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-10-10 09:10 PM
Response to Original message
7. Serve in the military . . .
I can see that. That seems more than fair. But just for attending college? Do we extend that same benefit to those here legally on student visas? I don't think so. So why should undocumented immigrants get it then?
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La Lioness Priyanka Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #7
16. because its not their fault they are undocumented. nt
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RZM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. Well that all depends upon how you look at it
Edited on Thu Nov-11-10 03:16 PM by RZM
You can make that argument, but I think it's a tough one to defend and still show basic respect for the rule of law. What you seem to be saying is that completely free and open borders are the only way to do things and unfettered transit is a basic human right, so people who come across without permission are doing nothing wrong and it's the government's responsibility to grant anybody and everybody who can make it across the border legal status.

The other argument (and one probably shared by far more people) is that there is a working immigration system already in place and if you wish to come here, you must respect our nation's laws and go through the proper channels. If you do not do that, you are in violation of the law and should be held accountable for your actions. Remember too that the government has a responsibility to promote civic harmony and the safety of its citizens and that the whole process serves to screen out criminals/troublemakers and ensure that immigrants have a basic understanding of our language, laws, and culture.

Just about every nation on earth (including those whose citizens come to the US in large numbers illegally), adheres to the second argument, which often reflects a majority public opinion (it certainly does here). Shouldn't the will of people who are citizens of this country be respected? By claiming that 'it's not their fault,' you're essentially saying that it's not the job of immigrants to respect our laws, but the job of the government to respect the wishes of the hundreds of millions of people who wish to come here for whatever reason.
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La Lioness Priyanka Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. you realize that the dream act only covers people who were brought here
before they were adults. so by the general theory that we dont hold children accountable for the actions of their parents,its not their fault.

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RZM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 03:33 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. Yes I do know it concerns only young people
And I apologize if I read much more into your post than was appropriate. But in the end it still taps into the same issues and arguments about legal vs. illegal immigration and respect for the law. Like I said, I can see granting status to people who have elected to serve this country, especially now, knowing that it could result in their deployment to a combat zone. But why just for going to college? That certainly represents participation in American life, but it's not really a service. I don't understand why somebody whose parents chose to bring them here in violation of the law should have an advantage over someone else whose parents did not.
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La Lioness Priyanka Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 03:34 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. it taps into whether or not Americans believe children should be punished for
the crimes their parents committed.

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RZM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. But the DREAM Act isn't punishment, it's a reward
You're twisting the logic here, saying that not being granted citizenship for gong to college or serving in the military is 'punishment.' Why is that the case? That rests of the supposition that citizenship is naturally earned by doing those things. Like I said, I can agree with military service members being granted citizenship, but is not being granted citizenship for going to college really 'punishment?' Would you make the argument that all of the thousands of people here on student visas are being 'punished' when those expire and they have to go home?
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ieoeja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. Because this is their country.

It is the only country they have known. What would you do? Deport them to a foreign country?


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RZM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 03:44 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. That's not always the case
The DREAM Act stipulates only that you must have been a continuous US resident for five years or more before its passage. So plenty of people who would fall under it certainly have known life somewhere else. That being said, I don't have an answer to that question. It's a difficult one. On the one hand, I probably wouldn't want to deport somebody who arrived as a newborn. But somebody who came here when they were 16? That's not the same thing.
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La Lioness Priyanka Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #23
25. dream act caps at 15 for entry into the US
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RZM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 04:00 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. Ok, well 15 then
It's still not the same as coming here as a toddler. I'm not trying to give a full-throated endorsement of mass deportations here and I do feel for kids who have grown up here, but I also question the rewarding of something that you don't want to happen in the fist place, which is families coming across the border without going through the proper channels.
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lunasun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #21
28. and if the only language they know is English now
what country do you send them to when they get out of the military?
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JonLP24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 04:14 PM
Response to Reply #17
29. It is a broken system
Asylum is only granted for less than 2% of Mexican nationals. Columbia nationals are granted at a rate that is 20 times higher even though the claims are similar--drug cartels take over a town or village, buy off the police force, and the only safe thing to do is leave the country.

Another thing is the quotas are the same for every country--meaning it is the same amount from Mexico to all the way to other side of the world. You'd have an easier time getting accepted if you applied from Latvia than Mexico--which has over a million applicants pending. Speaking of the process, it usually takes about 20 years for an applicant's case will be heard. Too long for those unable to find a living wage. The process probably encourages more illegal immigration when the way things are set-up makes it nearly impossible for them to get in.

Anyways, I saw that you called it a "working system" and I just wanted to point out it may not be as working as you might think. I'm pretty sure the DREAM Act's goal is to help those that were brought here by their parents so I'm not so sure "respecting the law" is the right message when they never had to option.
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 03:52 PM
Response to Reply #7
24. Anyone who came legally on a student visa
Was college age when they got here and had the money to do it.

this is to give a break to kids brought here illegally by their parents. It doesn't even cover kids who can't go to college because they can't afford it or can't get in.

This is very twisted. The opportunity to come here legally as a legal adult is fine - we're talking about kids who have no way to be legal but who've grown up here.
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RZM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 04:06 PM
Response to Reply #24
27. Should it cover the non-college students?
Edited on Thu Nov-11-10 04:10 PM by RZM
It certainly is somewhat unfair to them as well. But I just don't feel the college criterion should be there. One of my problems with this bill is like all other immigration 'reforms' we've seen in the past few years, it represents only a tiny aspect of the larger issue. This isn't how it should be done. This should be part of a larger reform package, but of course don't expect to see that anytime soon.
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Unvanguard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-10 09:20 AM
Response to Reply #7
34. What does one have to do with the other?
People on student visas are not similarly-situated to undocumented students who have been here since they were very young. As a natural-born citizen, I didn't have to go to college or serve in the military to get US citizenship. Similarly, the requirements should be much weaker for people who are as materially "American" as everyone else. Deporting them is obviously unacceptable; hence, they shouldn't be forced into an inferior legal status.
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Owl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-10-10 09:13 PM
Response to Original message
8. No.
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SarahB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-10-10 09:25 PM
Response to Original message
9. YES! This is the best thing they could do with the lame duck session!
:sarcasm:

Are you fucking kidding me?
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Tx4obama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-10-10 09:42 PM
Response to Original message
10. Huh?
Getting The Dream Act enacted was a promise Obama made during the campaign and talked about 'many' times at his townhalls & rallies.
It needs to get passed this year, since it would be harder to do next year.

I don't understand the negative and the 'no' comments on this thread.
What's up with that?





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applegrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-10-10 09:58 PM
Response to Original message
11. I like it.
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Travis_0004 Donating Member (417 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-10-10 10:02 PM
Response to Original message
12. I'm against it
First off, is federal funding being used to allow these people to go to school. I hope not.

Also, if Americans are currently being turned down to join the military (because we are hitting enlistment goals), then we don't need illegal immigrants in the military. I might think differently if we could not meet enlistment goals.
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lunasun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-13-10 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #12
32. wow!
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Unvanguard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-10 09:24 AM
Response to Reply #12
35. The answer to your first question is "no" (though it should be "yes.")
So, why do you support forcing an inferior legal status on undocumented youth who have been here almost all of their lives, and who came here through no fault of their own?
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pampango Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 04:45 AM
Response to Original message
13. Progressive Caucus FOR it; ENDORSED by Sanders, Kennedy, Feingold; repubs all AGAINST it.
What's to discuss? It's a great idea. It only applies to people brought here as minor children and graduated from an American high school. It would give them conditional legal status. If they fulfilled the education or military requirement, they could then apply for permanent legal resident status.

The alternative is to leave them in limbo making them pay the price for the sins of their parents who brought them here illegally. They contribute little to society if they can't go to college, work, or join the military. The other alternative is to deport them back to a country and culture that many of them were taken from when they were so small that they don't know anything about it.

The repubs will undoubtedly successfully filibuster it in the Senate. Make them do it and drive another nail in their own coffin.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DREAM_Act#
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 04:55 AM
Response to Original message
14. Shouldn't Congress be prosecuting George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, et al for war crimes?
Or discussing the California Missile Crisis, or some other such terribly important business?
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La Lioness Priyanka Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 02:49 PM
Response to Original message
15. good, i am glad. nt
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Big_Mike Donating Member (274 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 04:28 PM
Response to Original message
30. Umm, how are they going to get into the military?
You cannot enlist unless you are a valid permanent resident and have a green card.

By definition, the undocumented do not have that. As a matter of fact, once you enter, you MUST become a citizen within 6 or 7 years or you are tossed out for not conforming with the regulations.

Another issue with the undocumented...(waiting for flames after making the following statement) Are we certain we want undocumented since here prior to age 15 to join, given how many undocumented are in the gangs? If the leaders are smart, they keep the members from getting the tats and other markings, and then send them of for advanced infantry training?

College, maybe. Job Corps, probably. Civilian service such as the California Conservation Corps or some such civic service entity, certainly. Military, no.

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LAGC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 07:14 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. I think it's mainly to benefit those who have already served their country honorably.
Yet still lack the benefits of citizenship like looking forward to Social Security (assuming its still solvent when they retire) because they were brought over as youngsters and didn't attain citizenship by birthright.
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Koshari Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-10 09:03 AM
Response to Original message
33. Pass the Bills During the Lame Duck Session
I have a lot of hope that Nancy will get as many bill through as she can, however a little help never hurt. A group of us put together a petition and we need all of the signatures that we can get.

We need to let Congress and the President know what we wish to have passed during the Lame Duck Session. I have put together a letter but you are free to edit the version you sign, please add other bills or take some away if you don't support them.

The time is NOW, we have a very short window of opportunity. We may have to wait more than two years if we don't get these pieces of legislation through now.

We must let them know what their liberal base expects of them.

Sign the Petition Please: http://www.change.org/petitions/view/pass_the_bills_dur...

Thanks!
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