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The Northerner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 03:27 PM
Original message
Venezuela Chavez nationalizes French-owned retailer
Source: Reuters

CARACAS, Jan 17 (Reuters) - Venezuela's socialist President Hugo Chavez on Sunday nationalized a chain of supermarkets controlled by France's Casino (CASP.PA) on charges of price gauging after the government devalued the bolivar currency.

"Because of multiple violations of Venezuelan laws the Exito chain will now belong to the republic, there is no way back," Chavez said on his weekly television show.

In his 11 years in office, Chavez has nationalized large swathes of the economy, including major oil projects along with electricity and telecommunications companies.

The leader who calls Cuba's Fidel Castro a mentor has recently declared himself a Marxist and wants to build a socialist society in one of the world's top oil exporters.

Read more: http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN1714485520100117
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BunkerHill24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 03:33 PM
Response to Original message
1. nothing wrong giving the people back their Gawd given resources. nt
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hack89 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Isn't Venezuela a net food importer? nt
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MellowDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. Yeah, because supermarkets that import food...
are giving back Venezuelan's "their" resources. Actually, Chavez is just taking the resources of someone else for himself and calling it nationalism, when really, it's just stealing.
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BunkerHill24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 04:03 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. You are not stealing when you want to have control of your resources. nt
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MellowDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 08:25 PM
Response to Reply #7
30. Supermarkets that were built by a private corporation's investment...
are not "Hugo's". What you seem to be advocating is communism, which has been proven so emphatically to not work as an economic system. A country cannot control the market effectively or efficiently. It's part of the reason for rapid inflation and the devaluing of currency in Venezuela, which gave Hugo the convenient excuse to nationalize any industry.
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BunkerHill24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 10:10 PM
Response to Reply #30
35. Sadly you are forgetting here in America we own General Motors too
...I call it Government Motors. Capitalism? keep it to yourself!
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MellowDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-18-10 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #35
45. Not really...
unless you want to call a temporary takeover a permanent acquisition. A mixed economy is best.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 05:14 PM
Response to Reply #1
15. how is a grocery store a "resource" that can be seized by a government?
Edited on Sun Jan-17-10 05:16 PM by KittyWampus
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madville Donating Member (743 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 03:34 PM
Response to Original message
2. I'm sure they are beating the foreign investers off with a stick at this point
Come here and invest millions but we reserve the right to take everything and give you a kick in the pants if we feel like it. It makes sense that if the value of the currency gets cut in half then prices have to double, is that what this company did?
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BunkerHill24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. We all know why foreign companies invest in places like Iraq nowadays
because they are giving favorable means to loath the national resources. I think these international companies are there to take advantage of the inability for these government to have meaningful regulations. I'm glad, in Venezuela, that there is something being done to have them limit their exploitation.
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bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #4
12. You didn't really mean "loath" the national resources did you? Maybe "loot"? I'd think
they would rather "love" the natural resources than loath them.

Otherwise, I agree with your position. I think.
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DissedByBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #4
20. Aside from the abuse there are good reasons
Many of these countries do not have the technology, know-how and equipment to fully utilize their natural resources.

Thus they rely on foreign companies to do it for them.

There are various structures that can be created to protect the government, but it's usually not a good idea for the country to try to run everything.

After the oil bust left Chavez cash-starved, even he is now going back to the oil companies for help.

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Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 03:55 PM
Response to Original message
6. Good for Chavez!
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DonkeyHoTay Donating Member (81 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 04:58 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. Chavez has guts... Now. if only we could...
nationalize. i.e., "repatriate" the Fed!

JFK wanted to begin the process of returning control over the
country's money supply to the US Treasury.
LBJ reversed President Kennedy's NSAM authorising the
Treasury to issue silver certificates within hours of his
assassination.

Why?

Only Dillon knows... (knew)
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Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. Thanks for that information.
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LaPera Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 04:26 PM
Response to Original message
8. Thanks "Northerner" Viva Chavez - I'm sure you feel the same - We are all socialist here at DU
Edited on Sun Jan-17-10 04:33 PM by LaPera
Unless you're NOT and you don't use our public roads & highways, or police & fire departments, public education, , our court system * government offices or if you don't support our military, protect our national parks and lands and waterways, support our politicians pay and way of government, support protection agencies (EPA, FDA) making sure your food, medicine is safe, etc. etc.!!

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WriteDown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 04:49 PM
Response to Original message
9. Vive Mugabe! nt
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LaPera Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #9
19. Thanks for the idiotic imput Rush! nt
Edited on Sun Jan-17-10 05:43 PM by LaPera
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WriteDown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 06:43 PM
Response to Reply #19
25. Yeah, because there are no parallels.
:eyes:

I think we need to nationalize, Apple, Google, and Microsoft immediately. Look at the obscene profits they are making off the people's resources!
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duphase Donating Member (93 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 04:55 PM
Response to Original message
10. If it's okay to privatize, why can't they nationalize?

Making a resource available to all is just as just as taking a resource that belongs to all and in effect, giving it to a few.
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naaman fletcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #10
24. How is a grocery store a resource?
I understand how oil is a resource and should be kept for the people.

In this instance, a company comes in a builds stores, buys cash registers, sets up a complicated logistical and distribution system, and then "poof" Chavez comes along and steals it.

Who would ever invest money in this country again?

The answer: nobody.

He is driving this country into the ground.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 05:07 PM
Response to Original message
13. Rotters is WRONG again. Chavez did NOT nationalize Venezuela's oil.
That was done by a previous, rightwing government. What Chavez did was to re-negotiate the oil contracts, from the previous governments' giveaway split of 10/90, favoring the multinationals, to a fairer split of 60/40, favoring Venezuela and its social programs. So instead of all the profits going into third yachts and mansions for Exxon Mobil executives, more of the profits are going to education, health care and other benefits for the poor majority. And the rich and the corporate in Europe, England and the U.S. really, really hate that.

Rotters continues to be a rumor-mongering, inaccurate, biased, propagandizing, corpo-fascist 'news' monopoly serving Europe's and England's richest people, and it's getting to be worse than the Wall Street Urinal on Latin American issues. It has become exceedingly unreliable. You really and truly cannot trust a word they write. You can't even trust basic facts--for instance, on the nationalization of Venezuela's oil. On a Rotters assertion like this--"recently declared himself a Marxist"--notice that there is no quote. We really don't know what Chavez said. It is without context. It is not a quote. There is no venue mentioned. There is no way to verify it.

As for price gougers, especially multinational corporate food price gougers, they had been repeatedly warned about it; they defied the law; they got what they deserved.
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bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 05:10 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. He said "Wall Street Urinal"
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

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DissedByBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #13
33. More importantly
It's not just a 60/40 split of the profits. It is 60/40 control of the venture.
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 05:26 PM
Response to Original message
16. A small detail the right-wingers ALWAYS refuse to admit: nationalization is always compensated
at fair market value.

Only the profoundly backward, phenomenally uncurious, deliberately ignorant, or congenitally deceitful refuse to acknowledge this fact which would force them to cut back on their noise.

Example of easily accessed previous articles:
Venezuela's nationalization fast but with compensation
Submitted by cpowell on Wed, 2007-02-14 02:06. Section: Daily Dispatches
By Brian Ellsworth
Reuters
via Yahoo News
Tuesday, February 13, 2007

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070214/wl_nm/venezuela_nat...

CARACAS -- Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez is setting a faster than expected pace in his nationalization drive toward self-styled socialism, striking three takeover deals that push out U.S. firms in about a month.

Chavez, an ally of Cuba who is vehemently opposed to what he sees as U.S. imperialism, is boosting state involvement in Venezuela, the No. 4 supplier of oil to the United States, as he consolidates power after a landslide re-election last year.

Venezuelan authorities said on Tuesday they would buy the assets of U.S. power company CMS for $106 million, a day after cutting a similar deal with telecom giant Verizon for $572 million.

Last week the government signed an accord to buy the holdings of U.S.-based global power generation firm AES Corp. for $750 million despite analysts' predictions of protracted takeover battles.

"The government has showed it's clearly willing to move at a particularly fast pace to deliver on promises," said Patrick Esteruelas, an analyst with the Eurasia Group.

The deals came two weeks after Chavez received special powers to rule by decree and five weeks after he vowed to nationalize the telecommunications and power utilities.

The announcements on January 8, which Esteruelas dubbed "Red Monday," wiped out a fifth of the Caracas stock exchange's value.

Chavez quickly implemented the nationalizations by avoiding protracted legal battles and outright seizures, and, instead, striking buyout deals.

The companies did not have the choice to hold on to their investments, but they and economists said the buyout terms were tough but fair given the nation's deteriorating investment climate.

New Vice President Jorge Rodriguez, a central player in the nationalization effort, cited the state's purchase of Verizon's 29 percent stake in Venezuelan phone company CANTV as a sign the process was "fast and transparent."
More:
http://www.gata.org/node/4816
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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 06:01 PM
Response to Reply #16
22. Market value at the time, not future value.
you work hard setting up a business. You sacrifice to make it work. Then I come in and put a gun to your head (literally) and set fair price.

Hey your deity just stated we invaded haiti. Care to support that. He is done, cooked, and all you little chavista froggies are sharing a pot with this moron.

Time to show your true colors. A rescue mission headed by the US / UN and the Democratic president or Hugo's invasion charge? Which is it?
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YankmeCrankme Donating Member (576 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 08:37 PM
Response to Reply #22
31. Future value??? What the heck??
So, when you buy a car you pay future value not current value? Being able to buy a car for it future depreciation price is pretty savvy negotiating. How about a house? Do you pay future value or present value? Because, you figure a house goes up in value so I can see you wanting to pay more for it than what the owner is asking. Maybe you aren't such a savvy negotiator after all.

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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 09:12 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. No friend, when you build a business you build a revenue stream..
Edited on Sun Jan-17-10 09:23 PM by Pavulon
take you for example. Your dead body parts auction for a few thousand dollars. You ability to earn alive exceed that value.

If I build a business like say, a hardware store, and I am forced out by eminent domain I may be compensated for my property value. I will not be compensated for the revenue I would earn year over year.

However it is much more complex when you are a desperate red shirt wearing asshole taking shit because your revolution just shit its self. You think a multinational is going to lend him the materials and time for say a NG power generating facility. NOPE. He now gets to pay cash up front.

Because he presents the risk of theft. Letters of credit, deals to fund facilities with percentages, gone.

Cheers, ps I do business in brazil and Venezuela and did not fall of the truck yesterday.
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angstlessk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #32
37. you may not have fallen off the truck..but surey you want to kick the poor off the backside
unlike Chavez....you sound like the 'elite' who want Chavez ousted because he is for the poor and not the rich of the country..there are many like you.
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WriteDown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-18-10 09:03 AM
Response to Reply #37
43. Kind of like the people in post 36...
They just wanted to kick New London off the backside. Scum.
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TxRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-18-10 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #37
48. Unfortunately
Political rhetoric of being "for the poor" doesn't cut the mustard.

Especially in light of his recent doubling of inflation, which is going to hit the poor very hard as do his other insane decisions.

He is on the path to completely devastating his country and it's poor.

Only the fact he has oil to sell has saved him so far, and even that may prove to be too little to save the country.
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toopers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-18-10 08:56 AM
Response to Reply #32
40. One thing you forgot Pavulon . . .
someone works to completely "devalue" your business prior to forcing you to sell. That is the "free market" value in Venezuela!
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ChangoLoa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-19-10 06:11 PM
Response to Reply #32
52. Right but
remember one thing (besides the present issue of expropriation). Venezuelan private commercial stocks have been constituted thanks to state subsidies (over-valuation of the bolivar). Imported goods were acquired for 1/2-1/3 of their real price. Suddenly, the whole country lost half of its artificial purchasing power for imports, showing what we all knew... that Venezuela has been living above its means for a long time.

Now, the adjust is extremely bitter and, of course, it shouldn't have been made in one blow. People who complain about the "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation (Chavez being criticized before, for not devaluing, and now, for devaluing) are clueless. This should have been done years ago with a gradual, step by step devaluation.
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WriteDown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 06:45 PM
Response to Reply #16
26. Exactly Judi. It's just like the Kelo decision....
Those people were compensated for their houses. I always wondered why they were such a bunch of whiners.
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COLGATE4 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 10:14 PM
Response to Reply #16
36. What information do you have that permits you to make
a blanket assertion such as "nationalization is always compensated at fair market value"? In particular, you go on to state as an example of this that "Venezuelan authorities said on Tuesday they would buy the assets of U.S. power company CMS for $106 million". Question: On what basis can you state that this amount represented a fair market value???
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DissedByBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 05:33 PM
Response to Original message
18. Price gouging?
He halves the value of the bolivar, they're probably taking a loss if they keep selling at face value, so they "raise" the prices probably to effectively what they were before.

Chavez calls price gouging and nationalizes the chain.

Just quit with the trumped-up excuses! If you want to nationalize, just nationalize. No need to lie again.
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ro1942 Donating Member (701 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 06:01 PM
Response to Original message
21. Love you Hugo
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Regret My New Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 06:04 PM
Response to Original message
23. I guess we'll see how it works out for him...
I hope for the sake of people of Venezuela, it all works out good. :)
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WriteDown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 06:46 PM
Response to Original message
27. The U.S. needs to nationalize Apple, Google, Microsoft and Toyota immediately...
Stop letting them make obscene profits off the people's resources!
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Bucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 09:32 PM
Response to Reply #27
34. Is it Tim Geitner you want running those companies or should we wait for a Republican?
Honestly, I just don't know where you people get it from...
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WriteDown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-18-10 09:01 AM
Response to Reply #34
42. They need to be run by the people!
Think of how those profits can help our failing economy if we nationalized them.
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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 07:00 PM
Response to Original message
28. Economically illiterate moron.
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Flaneur Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-18-10 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #28
46. Maybe he needs some college sophomore to tell him what to do.
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TxRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-18-10 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #46
47. It might actually be an improvement
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-19-10 05:48 PM
Response to Reply #47
50. is it economics they teach, or an ideology regarding economics
I see a lot of fascism in this country, yet all we here about are the socialist boogeymen. Funny thing is, our economy is in the shitter for the very economic ideology most espouse today in America. Americans don't need to worry about socialism, what they need to worry about is fascism, while their rights are being trampled upon. Chavez however, makes for an entertaining distraction to those caught up in this Ponzi scheme we see in America today, ever since Reagan.... all has moved extremely far to the right.

I am skeptical many here would even bother to register just to trash him for being what many like to call him a dictator. It's about ideology... very revealing.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-19-10 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #28
53. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-17-10 07:40 PM
Response to Original message
29. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
classysassy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-18-10 12:47 AM
Response to Original message
38. Viva Chavez
Right on Hugo,kick those crooks out of your country.We here in America should worry about our problems,let Venezuela worry about theirs.
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toopers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-18-10 08:54 AM
Response to Reply #38
39. Yes, and let's not worry about Haiti's problems either!
eom
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AngryAmish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-18-10 08:57 AM
Response to Original message
41. It's a mistranslation
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-18-10 09:30 AM
Response to Original message
44. VISIONARY!
:nuke:
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Goldstein1984 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-19-10 05:09 PM
Response to Original message
49. Good for Chavez and his people
I worked for Williams Energy in 2002 when it backed the unsuccessful coup against Chavez. Why the coup? Because Williams was extracting resources and giving very little back to the Venezuelan people. Nationalization of the oil industry in Venezuela gave Venezuelans control of their resources. Chavez also recently nationalized several Hilton hotels, which were catering to foreigners and paying Venezuelan nationals less than a living wage to serve non-Venezuelans.

I understand the hostility toward Chavez. The empire status quo is really tough to see slipping away, which is one reason why 5% of the world's population is doing 50% of its military spending--a big surge to retain hegemony.

By the way, note the Chavez introduction in the article: "Venezuela's socialist President Hugo Chavez ..." The mainstream Western media has to work that "socialist" in there. Never mind that he's the democratically elected socialist President.
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-19-10 05:49 PM
Response to Original message
51. good!(nt)
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