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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 10:52 AM
Original message
Students Take Over UC Berkeley
Source: SF Gate

UC Berkeley students took over a campus building in protest this morning, a day after the University of California regents voted to raise tuition by 32 percent.

An undetermined number of protesters barricaded themselves at about 6 a.m. inside Wheeler Hall, which houses the English department.

Several demonstrators wearing bandannas opened a window, displayed a sign reading "32% Hike, 900 layoffs" with the word "Class" crossed out in red. They used a bullhorn to denounce the regents' decision and to rally support from a group of students chanting outside.





Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/1...



I know that there is also a takeover at UC Santa Cruz too. God love the students! At least they are trying to fight back.
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rurallib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 10:53 AM
Response to Original message
1. The Reagan legacy continues to give.
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 10:54 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. Yep. nt
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Yavin4 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:49 AM
Response to Reply #1
27. I Am 45 Years Old, and It's Amazing How Much Fucking Damage
that asshole has done to my life.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #27
42. Ironic. He lived off of taxpayer money while decrying taxpayers.
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moonlady0623 Donating Member (145 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #27
43. I'm 57
and agree completely. His signature is on my diploma from California State University Chico. Kinda mars it imho.
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XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #43
98. I got Arnold's siggy on my diploma
x(
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cyclezealot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 09:20 PM
Response to Reply #98
138. really. not sure I 'd then want to post it in a public place?
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XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #138
142. I'm not quite sure what you're getting at
:shrug:
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 08:18 PM
Response to Reply #27
102. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
starroute Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:36 PM
Response to Reply #1
53. It was the '64 Berkeley sit-in that jump-started Reagan's career
Reagan was elected governor of California in 1966 partly on a promise to "clean up the mess in Berkeley." And the arrests of the 1964 protesters were carried out on the orders of then-assistant district attorney Ed Meese.

I've kept thinking about that lately -- and wondering just how things went so badly off the tracks. It would be nice if the story had a different ending this time around.



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pink-o Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 03:35 PM
Response to Reply #53
81. Check out this whole expose re Reagan, J Edgar Hoover and Pat Brown
It was written in the Chronicle in 2002, and to this day, I don't get why it's not being screamed across America.

Oh, yeah, maybe I do. St Ronnie of Reagan can never be badmouthed by the salivating, corporate media! :mad:

The whole list of articles:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/qws/as/qr?scope=term&sour...


The specific one Re Reagan's illegal hiding info in collusion w/Hoover in order to run for Gov:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2002/0...
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robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 06:26 PM
Response to Reply #81
95. Bookmarking this thread for those links.
That's an excellent find!
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rurallib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #95
135. me also
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 04:23 AM
Response to Reply #95
145. Good idea. Thanks.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 08:54 PM
Response to Reply #81
105. Thank you -- looked at a lot of it ... and wonder if we will be any smarter next time around?
Edited on Fri Nov-20-09 08:54 PM by defendandprotect
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rurallib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 09:00 PM
Response to Reply #105
136. I daresay we were smarter then
and the demogogues won. Now after decades of dumbed down schools and FUX NOOZ do we have a chance?
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-22-09 08:17 PM
Response to Reply #136
143. Granted ... consumerism and plastic surgery, celebs and other nonsense seem to
be clouding the minds of citizens --

Can't argue with you there -- !!

But I can only hope that GOP propaganda/"Swiftboating" may be losing its force.

Only 20% of voters now identify themselves as Repugs . . .!!



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catzies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-22-09 08:52 PM
Response to Reply #81
144. Reagan hid info that could derail a run for office...although it wasn't in October
Edited on Sun Nov-22-09 08:53 PM by catzies
I'm not surprised!
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superconnected Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #53
83. Wow I forgot all about Ed Meese. I hated him when I was in HS.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 08:28 PM
Response to Reply #53
103. Interesting to hear the memories -- and still can't imagine that Swartzenegger was elected!!
Reagan had a certain democratic aura about him -- and not enough people knew the

truth. But Schartzenegger!!

Also they did a very successful job of branding youth as dangerous --

from "juvenile delinquent" of the 1950's onward to the civil rights/human rights challenge

to authority of the late 60's.

Same here in NJ if you start talking about "taxes" -- people go nuts.

They seldom ask nor or they told WHO the taxes will apply to!!!

We need to tax the hell out of the corporations and elites --

Restore all NEW DEAL restrictions/regulations on capital --

Meanwhile . . . after W, as far as I can see our $1.00 is worth .50 cents now???!!!

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struggle4progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 07:54 AM
Response to Reply #53
120. The Berkeley Student Rebellion of 1964 (Mario Savio)
... The University was apparently under considerable pressure to "crackdown" on the student activists from the right-wing in California business and politics ...

The liberal University of California administration would have relished the opportunity to show off in the national academic community a public university enjoying complete political and academic freedom and academic excellence. And if student politics had been restricted either to precinct work for the Democrats and Republicans, or to advocacy (by public meetings and distribution of literature) of various forms of wholesale societal change, then I don't believe there would have been the crisis there was. In any case an accommodation between the bureaucrats and the students could more easily have been achieved. The corporations represented on the Board of Regents welcome Young Democrats and Young Republicans as eager apprentices, and sectarian "revolutionary" talk can be tolerated because it is harmless. The radical student activists, however, are a mean threat to privilege. Because the students were advocating consequential actions (because their advocacy was consequential): the changing of hiring practices of particular establishments, the ending of certain forms of discrimination by certain concrete acts -- because of these radical acts, the administration's restrictive ruling was necessary.

Which is easy to understand. The First Amendment exists to protect consequential speech; First Amendment rights to advocacy come into question only when actions advocated are sufficiently limited in scope, and sufficiently threatening to the established powers. The action must be radical and possible: picket lines, boycotts, sit-ins, rent strikes. The Free Speech Movement demanded no more -- nor less -- than full First Amendment rights of advocacy on campus as well as off: that, therefore, only the courts have power to determine and punish abuses of freedom of speech ...

Accordingly, the schools have become training camps -- and proving grounds -- rather than places where people acquire education. They become factories to produce technicians rather than places to live student lives. And this perversion develops great resentment on the part of the students. Resentment against being subjected to standard production techniques of speedup and regimentation; against a tendency to quantify education -- virtually a contradiction in terms. Education is measured in units, in numbers of lectures attended, in numbers of pages devoted to papers, number of pages read. This mirrors the gross and vulgar quantification in the society at large -- the real world -- where everything must be reduced to a lowest common denominator, the dollar bill. In our campus play-world we use play money, course units ...

http://www.fsm-a.org/stacks/mario/savio_studrebel.htm
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wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:37 PM
Response to Reply #1
54. Not just Reagan
He made the mean-spirited ideology popular. The main culprit here, though, is Proposition 13, which made it impossible to raise taxes. We have to have a 66% majority to do that. Also, the state legislature has to have a 66% majority to pass a budget, so of course, the R's F it up year after year after year.

California has been sliding downhill since (IIRC) 1978 when Prop 13 passed. When the rest of the economy went all to hell, thanks to Bush (which, of course, you can trace back to Reagan's ideology), we plunged off the cliff entirely.

It's an utter and complete disaster, but Prop 13 is the most responsibile for the state my state is in.
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YOY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 02:43 PM
Response to Reply #1
70. I've already heard uneducated (or mommy&daddy paiducated) conservatives call them whiners.
n/t
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bbinacan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 09:28 PM
Response to Reply #1
108. What the hell does Reagan
have to do with this? I think you are reaching here.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 03:54 AM
Response to Reply #108
117. I think it was Reagan who made California universities
charge tuition again. If I understand correctly the universities were free for a while and Reagan said people did not appreciate free education so fees were brought back to make people take education seriously again or some BS. Basically too many of the wrong people had received educations when the universities were free.
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Hepburn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 06:40 AM
Response to Reply #117
118. Yes.
I was a student in the UC system when the asshole did that.

Fuck him.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #118
124. and may we shit on his grave
California had the best university system in the world until Reagan ruined it.
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rurallib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 09:06 PM
Response to Reply #108
137. I think there are some links upthread that will throw some light on the subject.
let's just say the children were naughty so governator reagan spanked them. Justa as he would later do to PATCO.
This made it OK to start the re-engineering of both education and labor systems
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 06:15 AM
Response to Reply #108
155. To the contrary, Reagan has a lot to do with tuition at California schools, today's economy, the
culture of greed, etc. Maybe you should read the thread again.

No one is being unfair to poor, dear Ronnie.

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Lasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 03:13 AM
Response to Reply #1
116. "If there has to be a bloodbath, then let's get it over with."
--Ronald Reagan (Governor of California), quoted in the San Francisco Chronicle, early morning edition, May 15, 1969. (Reagan reveals how he intends to quell student protests in the city of Berkeley, California. Protesters were teargassed and fired upon with buckshot, killing one, blinding another, and wounding 128. Reagan would later declare a state of emergency in the city and send in 2,700 National Guard troops.)

http://thereaganyears.tripod.com/reaganquotes.htm
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Liberalynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #1
130. Mr. 666 himself.
Edited on Sat Nov-21-09 01:21 PM by Liberalynn
Still despise him to this day. His effect is even being felt in my little corner of the USA. They are going to lay off over half of our paid firefighters just so they don't have to raise taxes.

I guess the few cents they save per tax payer will be worth the possible loss of life. The word according to their glorious St. Ronnie.

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mddem9850 Donating Member (50 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 07:32 PM
Response to Reply #1
133. Yeah, dumb windbag he was
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 04:28 AM
Response to Reply #1
146. You can trace Reagan's policies straight to the TARP bailout and today's black hole economy.
Edited on Mon Nov-23-09 04:29 AM by No Elephants
Of course, he had help from all his successors in office, his Party and the DLC (for which we can also "thank" Reagan, in a way).
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Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 10:54 AM
Response to Original message
2. $750 Billion+ PER YEAR on Defense. How much on education???
:banghead:

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rayofreason Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 02:31 PM
Response to Reply #2
66. About a $Trillion in public funds
http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/us_education_spendi...

and probably not that much less in corporate spending (internal training, etc.).


Where do you get $750 billion in military spending?
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Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 03:43 PM
Response to Reply #66
82. A whopping $91.7 Billion in Federal spending on education.
Edited on Fri Nov-20-09 03:46 PM by Roland99
And your link shows even higher Defense spending (I guess lumping all the supplementals into the mix)


I meant to state on higher-education (college/university).

Of course local governments spend a lot on education via property taxes and such for elementary, middle, and high schools. But what about beyond that? What can one do with a high school education in this global economy other than a menial service job?

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rayofreason Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 05:20 PM
Response to Reply #82
89. You need...
...a good K-12 education to continue to post-secondary education. And our educational system is quite flexible in allowing a wide variety of post-secondary pathways at any time in a person's life. And as a society we spend far more on education than we do on defense.

Of course the quality of what you get is only loosely correlated with what you spend. Take a look at this:

http://www.mckinsey.com/App_Media/Images/Page_Images/Of...

In addition to making a great case for closing the performance gap between white and minority kids, the comparison between states, districts, and schools is devastating. Policies matter, not just money.
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Neoma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 08:13 AM
Response to Reply #89
121. Or the equivalent of it.
Don't forget the self taught or those homeschooling.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 05:40 AM
Response to Reply #66
152. Bear in mind that liars figure and figures lie. All kinds of things get buried in all kinds
Edited on Mon Nov-23-09 05:46 AM by No Elephants
of places in the federal budget.

This is an example that has nothing to do with education or defense, but it angered me enough that I will probably remember it until I die, even if I get Alzheimer's.

Until the 70's or 80's, very little was spent on researching women's health. Almost as soon as the feds announced that they were going to start remedying that {finally), the feds used money earmarked for research on breast cancer to buy assets from Russia's space program. (Until policies changed, even most breast cancer research done with federal money had been done on men.)

Rationale? To study the effects of weightlessness on breast cancer. Wink. Wink. Yet, that money would have shown up as research re: health and, more specifically, women's health.

Bearing in mind that example, I'm sure a lot of defense programs could be easily classified as education, or almost anything, really.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #2
107. I've read that at times 50% of our Federal education budget was for CIA -- !!!!
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 10:54 AM
Response to Original message
3. Calif voters and ledge. keep voting for more services and make it impossible to increase taxes.
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Cant trust em Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 10:55 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. Bingo. The politics in this state are so backwards.
It's really frustrating living here sometimes.
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:14 AM
Response to Reply #5
11. It must be. My firm did a ton of polling there so I focused on the state for
a long time. This crash has been coming for a looooong time. But you know that.

What do you think of www.rtumble.com ?

They need to have hearings on the financial catastrophe that was engineered by Enron, etc.
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Cant trust em Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:18 AM
Response to Reply #11
15. I haven't been to rtumble for a while.
I'm applying to public policy schools right now. I want to study california political reform.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 04:42 AM
Response to Reply #15
147. Cool. Best wishes.
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bikingaz Donating Member (110 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 06:07 PM
Response to Reply #3
92. Yep & just wait till when they get to pay the bill for the US debt
This is what mortgaging our kids future means.
Some one else has to pay, not me.
Cuz we don't care who pays as long as it ain't me.

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fishwax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 10:57 AM
Response to Original message
6. Also at UCLA
:kick:
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Brother Buzz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #6
23. UCD - 52 individuals were hauled away in the Black Maria
Yolo county sheriff processed and released them. I anticipate an encore performance today.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:31 PM
Response to Reply #23
50. Awesome. This is impressive. And well timed, too.
Aren't finals just after TG holiday? Isn't UC off starting this pm?
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jemsan Donating Member (245 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 10:57 AM
Response to Original message
7. Good for them!!!
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Gregorian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 10:58 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. First words out of my mouth.
That's disgusting! The last think this nation needs is more uneducated people. And that's what we're going to get with all of these high prices.

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bulloney Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:17 AM
Response to Reply #8
14. Colleges have been a microcosm of our economy.
College boards approve huge raises for their presidents and other executives while jacking up tuition and room-and-board several times the rate of inflation. Like, they don't think they're pricing themselves out of the market?

It's all about the elite, and screw the little guy.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #14
22. After the report I saw on Amy's show today, I think education is just their cover
not their market. It was unreal.

http://www.democracynow.org/2009/11/20/students

Audio, video, transcript at link.
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Daphne08 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #22
44. I urge everyone to listen to it. n/t
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mod mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:30 PM
Response to Reply #22
49. damn-site down for maintenance. Will you elaborate?
:hi:
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:32 PM
Response to Reply #49
51. It's up now!
:hi:
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mod mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:55 PM
Response to Reply #51
60. Excellent coverage as usual. Thanks
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 04:51 AM
Response to Reply #14
148. +1. The Boston area has so many schools, hospitals and churches, each of
which keep acquiring more real estate, all tax exempt. As a result, the rest of us pay real estate taxes so high that people cannot afford to live here, even if their mortgages have been paid off. Meanwhile, the heads of the schools and hospitals make millions in salary, get free housing, etc. It's disgusting. (Don't know as much about the churches.)

In general, though, Not for profits are not what they used to be. Not even close. Both at the federal and local levels, we need to look again at the tax exemptions.
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wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #8
56. More uneducated people is exactly what the Republican party needs, though
Who do you think is in line to get Palin's autograph? Without massive ignorance, Bush could never have gotten away with his crimes.
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alp227 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #56
113. Oh yeah, "College" Republicans!
Edited on Fri Nov-20-09 11:08 PM by alp227
Because doesn't the GOP need more of THOSE types of people (y'know, those from the filthy rich, anti-tax, prep school-enrolling, trust-funded families) attending the public universities to swing the political scene to the right no matter how loony?

There are really organisations out there trying to infiltrate higher education with right-wing dogma. Intercollegiate Studies Institute, Students for Academic Freedom (and anything else funded by David Horowitz), and Young Americans for Freedom are just a few examples besides the College Republicans.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 05:20 AM
Response to Reply #56
150. The Republicans figured out how to have it both ways, though. Educated folk tend
Edited on Mon Nov-23-09 05:23 AM by No Elephants
to earn more and vulnerable to becoming "tax bracket Republicans." And, the Lee Atwaters and Karl Roves figured out how to appeal to the jingoistic, the easily led, etc.

Democrats need some strategies. Otherwise, they are stuck with becoming more and more like {semi} pro-choice Republicans in order to win elections. And this nation does not need two corporatist major parties, especially since the two major parties disempowered third parties (and therefore also voters).

I;m so sick of the Demlicans and Republicrats -- and America is so sick from them.
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no_hypocrisy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 10:59 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. That's tradition I can get behind.
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Tikki Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:54 AM
Response to Reply #7
28. +10
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MaineDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:07 AM
Response to Original message
10. Again?
Didn't they do this in the 60s?

Power to the people! ;)
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question everything Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. Except, in the 60s, it was about war and civil rights
now it is about money.

Where have thy been the past six years? With two wars, with the surveillance? Where have they been the past year with Wall Street greed, with loss of jobs and medical care?
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #13
19. Um, some of the busiest activists in the Bay Area work or study at Cal.
Edited on Fri Nov-20-09 11:23 AM by EFerrari
They were with us at Beach Impeach, with World Can't Wait, with Code Pink. That's where.

/oops
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Coventina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #13
20. Well, it's hard to hold college students responsible for the last 6 years.
Plus, you have to keep in mind that for many of these students, issues such as 401k, jobs & medical care haven't been on their radar. They'll get hit with all of that very soon, but probably haven't been exposed to it yet.

This is their first big slap in the face of the new, cold reality facing this country. I'm glad they are reacting. For many of them, it will lead to them learning about the other issues you bring up.
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blue97keet Donating Member (390 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 12:37 PM
Response to Reply #13
40. Time to burn credit cards (instead of draft cards)
Even war is all about money. :sarcasm:
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caseymoz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:36 PM
Response to Reply #13
52. Hit them with high student loans and you kill the protesting spirit.

Universities were ruined when they made them loan-based. With student debt so high, they are afraid to ruin their employability later on. There's a reason why debt is the principle means used these days to put people into slavery.
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wickerwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #52
73. Bingo,
plus by jacking up tuition and other fees, they make college unaffordable for even the middle class unless they either join the army or go tens of thousands of dollars into debt.

Be a soldier, a debt-slave or a janitor. Those are the choices facing most young people today.

And the second you pay off one degree, it becomes obsolete and you need to start the whole thing over again. Don't expect your employer to pay a red nickle to train you for the job anymore. They'll replace you in a heartbeat with the latest desperate schlubs with $60,000 loans to work off.

I hope universities across the country join a general strike.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 05:11 AM
Response to Reply #52
149. Excellent point. That is probably when the tuition and salaries started climbing out of
sight as well. Then the credit card companies started handing cards out to incoming freshmen. So, by the time kids got out of college, they were in debt up to their eyeballs.
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Robb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #13
74. ...And getting drafted.
Thereby making it personal. :shrug:
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Riverman Donating Member (759 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 03:25 PM
Response to Reply #13
79. Absolutely! Glad you Said It! Prop 13, Reagan, personal greed,
All have played a role in bringing down Calif and the rest of the US. Unfortunately, these young people have been severly conditioned by the parents of my generation, who did protest war and racism in the sixties and seventies, including me, and then raised a family only to encourage the children to get the best possible education, made competition for the seats at the best universities the be all and end all of life for students. Now, these kids feel let down because the system their parents and older generations created are not keeping the promises, the jobs will not be there to justify the cost of tuitions and back-breaking student loans. Students from pooer families - of all racial, and ethnic packgrounds will be the first to be sacrificed and they know it as reflected by the protests at UC campuses this week. I am paying back-breaking Sallie Mae loans for one of my off-spring and the other is yet to get to a four year school. No end in sight of debt for education, as home values and income due to pay cuts and furlough pile on!

I want to protest too! And, have and will continue to do so. But not to help already prividged kids continue to get a leg up at the UC schools, but for the young people who sign up, for good motivations to go fight the oil/resources wars going on now, for the people without jobs, homes and access to medical treatment, for the children going to bed, if they have one, hungary every night in "the greatest country in the world!"

I protest that the democrats who I have been voting for my whole life, do not act from our common interests, but only from the interests of the corporation who buy their enxt election!

Where are the young people on the campuses! Is it their personal greed that they are upset about? Or, can they take that anger and re-direct to take action in non-violent demonstrations, sit-ins, boycotts to force the kind of real change that we can believe in! It ain't coming from Obama nor the majority of the democrats!
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Misanth Donating Member (8 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #13
109. Where have we been?
We've been working two jobs on top of our full credit loads to try and keep up with our tuition.

We've been saddled with the new requisite of unpaid internships in the vain hope of being considered "employable" when we graduate.

We've been picking up the childcare of our younger siblings as our parents lose their rights as workers.

We've been taking 5 years to graduate as we are screwed out of our prerequisites.

We've been taking higher course loads in an attempt to patch the holes left by our public secondary education.

That's where we've been. If you want to play that game, where was everybody else every time states gave higher education the ax? What exactly did you think would happen? This is about war. It's about a class war. And this is about rights. It's about our right to become educated, informed citizens of our own country regardless of our parents' income. My entire generation has been strapped down to ruinous debt for the rest of our lives. It threatens to completely destroy any hope this country has of an educated population and a stable middle class. And you want to sit there and sneer at us that this is just "about money"? Seriously?
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 07:26 AM
Response to Reply #109
158. Of course. Blaming any of this on college kids is very unfair.
College kids were among those in the vanguard of the anti-war movement because their asses were about to get sent to Vietnam as soon as they graduated and lost their student deferments. Or their boyfriends, fiances and husbands.

Those who demonstrated then had a direct stake in demonstrating, just as these kids have now. It was not all idealism and sacrifice.

And your points are more than valid. Sadly, almost all of us have been sheeple since about 1789, with the exception of the Great Depression and the civil rights era, which overlappe with the Vietnam Era. And even at those times, demonstrators were in the minority.

On bahalf of those older than you, I apologize from the bottom of my guilt stricken heart.





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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 07:40 AM
Response to Reply #109
160. P.S. Welcome to DU, Misanth.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 05:29 AM
Response to Reply #13
151. I had the exact same thought. But, I am glad to see the protest spirit nonetheless. It's
time people in America start caring enough about themselves, their futures, their future generations, etc. to rise up over something, even if it's being overcharged. Because that is what America has come to be about--money and bleeding Americans for money, whether through tuition, taxes, consumer goods or whatever.

Go, kids!
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:20 AM
Response to Reply #10
18. And in the late 80s during the South Africa divestment protests. n/t
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stray cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:14 AM
Response to Original message
12. That should solve the budget problems in CA.....
after all protests result in decreased deficits :rofl:
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #12
21. It's not a deficit problem, it's an allocation problem.
The university had a boom year last year but since undergraduate ed is not a priority, the students are getting shafted.
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frazzled Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:18 AM
Response to Original message
16. The faculty should be protesting
They're all being put on furloughs--resulting in an 8% pay cut.
California is in deep deep doodoo, and it's not just from the recession: it's years of bad tax policy that is incapable of sustaining its higher education system.
Frankly, $10,000 for tuition at one of the nation's top public (probably THE top public) university is still a bargain. Though I totally understand the shock of getting a 32% increase all at once. Still, a degree from Berkeley would cost $40,000--still one quarter of what the equivalent degree from one of the country's better (and even not so better) private universities costs.

Watch out for Jerry Brown becoming governor: he'll be telling the faculty once again, as he did when he was governor before, that they are being paid in "psychic" dollars--they should be so proud to be teaching at a place like Berkeley that they should be privileged to take an 8% pay cut. Tell that to a young, not-yet-tenured faculty member with two young kids, not a great salary to start with, and rent or mortgage payments to meet.
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wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #16
57. When I went to call in the 70's...
My fees (no tuition) was $750/year. You're right that $10,000 is cheap compared to private schools, but this is still an utter tragedy. You used to be able to get a good education in CA no matter how much money you had.

:cry:
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frazzled Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #57
85. My guess is that financial aid will be preserved for students who can't afford ...
the tuition. But there are a lot of middle and upper-middle-class kids at Berkeley whose families could afford that tuition. Having them pay will allow the students who can't to continue to attend. A Berkeley education is worth as much as a Harvard or Yale degree, so I think people will pony up.

I am not condoning the slashing of education funds (there's a good chart in today's NYT about the California system over the last decade or so) as a way to balance the state's budget crisis. But it is a crisis. What are they going to slash? Firefighters? Police? It's rough. They are going to have to reform their whole system, which prevents tax hikes through referenda and allows millionaires to pay little property tax. Maybe they're getting the idea that if you want to spend (on things like a great university system), you have to tax. Time for a liberal!

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wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 04:45 PM
Response to Reply #85
88. We need to get rid of the ballot proposition system
It also brought us PropH8 and three strikes.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #85
91. The University makes its own money and how many middle class families
Edited on Fri Nov-20-09 05:34 PM by EFerrari
do you know that can whip out $20K year for four or five years? These wouldn't be the same people that are losing their homes, would they?
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frazzled Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 10:49 PM
Response to Reply #91
111. Where did you get that figure?
It's $10,000.

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 11:13 AM
Response to Reply #111
127. Not $10K a semester? Even so, that prices a lot of middle class people
Edited on Sat Nov-21-09 11:14 AM by EFerrari
right out.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 05:58 AM
Response to Reply #16
153. Fat chance. Tuition pays faculty salaries.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:19 AM
Response to Original message
17. Go, Cal!
I don't imagine my friends in English offered much resistance. lol
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Arugula Latte Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:41 AM
Response to Reply #17
24. I was an English major at Cal.
We were a feisty bunch!

Okay, not really. :P
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:44 AM
Response to Reply #24
25. No, we weren't..
:rofl:
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ej510 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:44 AM
Response to Original message
26. All of our state schools are doing it whether it is UC or CSU.
I imagine USC and Stanford, right along with other private schools will be next.
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jemsan Donating Member (245 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #26
29. The police are in riot gear and are trying to break down the doors to Wheeler
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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #29
38. UPDATE from TWITTER
Students are holding Wheeler Hall hostage! Police have arrested three, pepper spray being used @ucbprotest @mark_yudof #Cal #Berkeley #UPTE
13 minutes ago from web
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:29 PM
Response to Reply #38
48. Is it campus police or Berkeley PD?
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Unvanguard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #26
41. They are not as dependent on government subsidies, so California's budget problems are not theirs.
Private schools nationwide are having to cut costs, but not at the same scale.
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Love Bug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 12:01 PM
Response to Original message
30. Now, THAT's a headline I haven't seen in awhile...
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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #30
34. I know!
The only good thing about this seems to be that the students are learning about the importance of getting involved. I just hope noone gets hurt.
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Joey Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 12:03 PM
Response to Original message
31. Good for them!
It's time to take a stand!
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LuckyLib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 12:03 PM
Response to Original message
32. Other institutions have been raising tuition annually for years.
Those students have seen 32%, just not all at once.
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DU GrovelBot  Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 12:03 PM
Response to Original message
33. ## PLEASE DONATE TO DEMOCRATIC UNDERGROUND! ##



This week is our fourth quarter 2009 fund drive. Democratic Underground is
a completely independent website. We depend on donations from our members
to cover our costs. Please take a moment to donate! Thank you!

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dotymed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 12:13 PM
Response to Reply #33
35. Thank God for students.
All Americas should take to the streets for Education,Health
Care, Wars, Poverty....the list is so long..... Peaceful
resistance, as shown by the civil rights movement can bring
positive change. We should all be protesting.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 06:10 AM
Response to Reply #35
154. America's size, suburbs, exurbs, etc., etc., and the evisceration of unions/labor
make it hard to "take to the streets." In large parts of the country, we don't even have streets. The European model is semi-impossible here.

We need to think of a way to mobilize the nation and perhaps a different battle cry than "take to the streets."
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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 12:22 PM
Response to Original message
36. UCSC Students Occupy Admin Building & Issue Demands
http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2009/11/19/18629342.ph...

On November 19th at around 2:45 PM, UCSC's Kerr Hall, which contains the offices of the administration, vice-chancellors, and chancellors, was occupied by students. Hundreds of students who are occupying the lobby created a list of demands which was read and given to UCSC's Executive Vice Chancellor David Kliger and Vice Chancellor of Student Affairs Felicia McGinty. The prior day, November 18th, hundreds of students occupied the Kresge Town Hall.



Glad to see that more protests are happening!!!
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optimator Donating Member (606 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 12:25 PM
Response to Original message
37. cool
.
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jemsan Donating Member (245 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #37
39. If you really want to understand the situation at the UC's then read this..
Edited on Fri Nov-20-09 12:32 PM by jemsan
This is an open letter to UC written by Bob Meister, President, Council of UC Faculty Professors and Professor at UCSC. It is excellent!


http://api.ning.com/files/WCRheXJCb *ED2yVwAYpgDD9HFF0QpKANsnRJAcFq2aOgQmFgFpWObFIu-odvFI1mTHUTGVc7rNRndjfDLFZDmj9w3PnRC7UH/They_Pledged_Your_Tuition.pdf

You will have to copy and paste it to get to the link, as the hypertext is not working for some reason.

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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:07 PM
Response to Original message
45. 32% hike????? holy shit.
thank you arn-old, thank you enron, thank you goldman sacks, thank you moron*, thank you neo-cons, thank you to all you fucking bastards that totally destroyed this nation in a hostile grab to create a "permanent majority" which resulted in the trashing of a whole nation.

the republican motto, "make them stupid, so they don't actually think like Democrats".

repukes, out to destroy our nation, one mind at a time.

fucking bastards.
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NorCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 02:21 PM
Response to Reply #45
65. meanwhile the President makes $880,000/year
Check out what the Chancellor's and Regents make. Oh, and they aren't facing paycuts....

UC chancellor got $97,500 "relocation allowance":
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4176/is_2006022... /

Ex-chancellor to leave UC, pocket cash:
He won't need to return salary he was paid during year's leave:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/200...

The chancellor's and Regents make $400,000 salaries, etc., and get raises. Meanwhile the students get 32% fee hikes, it's outrageous.

I just graduated from Cal (Ph.D, chemical engineering) this last May, and the UC budget situation is out of control. The technical employees and administrative staff are striking this week as well (they've all received paycutts/layoffs, etc.), so Berkeley campus is blowing up right now. I hope the students and employees can keep their momentum up.
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jemsan Donating Member (245 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #65
110. If only the Regents took cuts too...haha ,god forbid a janitor should keep his/her job!!

"Relocation allowances are paid separately from actual moving expenses and are intended to help new hires adjust to higher living costs in California, said UC spokesman Paul Schwartz.

In Birgeneau's case, he used his relocation allowance to buy a car and furniture for his private apartment at University House, the chancellor's on-campus residence that also serves as a public venue for receptions, parties and staff meetings, among other events.

Once Birgeneau arrived, the university spent $131,703 to remodel his California Hall office, according to information released as part of a public records request filed by the Oakland Tribune.

University officials also spent $76,945 on deferred-maintenance repairs and renovations to both the public and private portions of University House, in addition to other annual maintenance costs.

Later, they would spend $69,306 on six area rugs for the public area of the home. A campus spokeswoman said the rug purchase was not affiliated with Birgeneau's hire and was part of continued upgrade and maintenance at the home."
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alp227 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:22 PM
Response to Reply #65
115. I say create a ballot initiative for next year to make the UCs manage their money better
Californians have shown bigotry on the ballots. They eliminated marriage equality (Prop 22 in 2000, 8 in 2008), treated illegal immigrants like dirt (187 in 1994, but this was thrown out in federal court thankfully), and discarded bilingual education (227 in 1998). On the brighter side, propositions have reduced class sizes (1A in 1998) and prohibited legislators from getting pay raises during deficit years (1F in 2009), then the people should be able to make the UC/CSU systems manage their money better through a ballot proposition.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 06:47 AM
Response to Reply #65
156. I bet salaries are only the tip of the iceberg. In Boston and Cambridge, free housing in
Edited on Mon Nov-23-09 06:51 AM by No Elephants
very high priced areas (not subject to real estate tax), travel, etc. are all part of compensation for university brass and favored faculty. (Those who posted on the Prof. Gates arrest may recall that Harvard U. was the owner of record of his residence.)

Thing is, though, if the smarties are getting bonuses of $50 million a year, plus salary, plus perqs, how can universities compete? Do we want the best and the brightest teaching our kids in our schools and universities, or only those who could not get better paying jobs anywhere else?

And, if we settle for (or at least risk settling for)only those who could not get much, much better paying jobs elsewhere, where will our families and our country be in another generation or two?

It's a dilemma. I don't know the solution, but we have to look a the big picture.
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Jackpine Radical Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:14 PM
Response to Original message
46. Shades of 1963 and the FSM.
I wonder how old Mario Savio is now.
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TheCentepedeShoes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 06:52 PM
Response to Reply #46
97. I was 14
Edited on Fri Nov-20-09 06:58 PM by TheCentepedeShoes
and visiting aunt/uncle in San Jose in the summer of 63
Cousins took me to visit UC
Summer of much enlightenment
Mario Savio and the FSM happened after I returned to TX

Checking Wiki Mario died in 96
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Jackpine Radical Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 07:07 PM
Response to Reply #46
100. My memory played me false. It was 1964.
And, to answer my own musing, Mario Savio died in 1996, at age 55, of a heart condition.

Here is the first part of his Wikipedia entry:

Mario Savio (December 8, 1942 November 6, 1996) was an American political activist and a key member in the Berkeley Free Speech Movement. He is most famous for his passionate speeches, especially his "put your bodies upon the gears" address given at Sproul Hall, University of California, Berkeley on December 2, 1964:
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clixtox Donating Member (941 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 08:18 AM
Response to Reply #46
122. FSM = October & November 1964 N/T
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Jackpine Radical Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 01:45 PM
Response to Reply #122
131. Yes, indeed.
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Capn Sunshine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:22 PM
Response to Original message
47. FIGHT THE POWER!
Nice to see the students taking initiative. All of us former firebrands* were wondering when somethng would take hold on campuses.




*SDS, SMC, 1969-75. you?
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #47
59. Divestment at Cal, 1985.


And there's my buddy David who only goes to meet women

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Capn Sunshine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #59
61. right on!
I swear, being in the movement was a great way to meet chicks. I bet 10% of dudes were there for that express purpose. Wasn't why I did it, more of a fringe benefit, meeting and hanging with simpatico people.
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Ken Burch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:37 PM
Response to Original message
55. Good for the Students!
This also needs to be tied into the antiwar movement.

If we were OUT of Iraq and Afghanistan, there'd be enough federal money available to make these kinds of choices unnecessary. Money for learning...NOT FOR DEATH!
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Haole Girl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 01:45 PM
Response to Original message
58. Radical!
In the original sense.

I wish them all the luck.

If nothing else, they drew attention to the problem. That is sometimes step #1.

:thumbsup:
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progressivebydesign Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 02:03 PM
Response to Original message
62. I'm confused. I keep reading "FEES", not tuition. They are different.
Truth is California universities and colleges are around 2/3 cheaper than neighboring states. it's a freakin' bargain. Try looking at tuition for Washington State to go to community college.. it's actually higher than going to a California University.

Tuition has risen an obscene amount in the past 10 years.. someone has to pay all those 100k salaries for administrative people, and support the fat cats.
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edbermac Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 02:04 PM
Response to Original message
63. Damn hippies!
Take a bath, get a haircut, and stop smoking that dope! :hippie:



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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 07:09 AM
Response to Reply #63
157. Cast of Hair?
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dubeskin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 02:17 PM
Response to Original message
64. Apparently last night some students locked themselves into Mrak Hall at UC Davis
I overheard it from some people on my floor (Freshman at Davis). I'm not sure if it's true, but it's what I heard.
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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 02:38 PM
Response to Reply #64
68. it's true
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Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 02:32 PM
Response to Original message
67. I'm proud of those kids!
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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 02:40 PM
Response to Original message
69. YAY!!!!!!!! SIT IN!!! SIT IN!!!
:woohoo: :bounce: :party:
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Imajika Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
71. The state is broke...
Either tuition goes up or services get cut right?

The state is already in another budget hole, one which could be even worse than last year. The public simply will not accept any tax increases, NO Republican will go along with any tax increases even if Arnold proposes them. State services are going to be slashed next year and in years going forward, there is just no way around that unless the state just completely defaults or the Federal Government bails CA out.

The state is flat broke, there is no more money. The only way for public universities to avoid fee and tuition hikes is to cut services - ie, fire teachers and administration, curtail university services, etc.

I just can't see what the solution is here. People scream "soak the rich", but it isn't going to happen. There probably won't be any tax hikes at all. So what can be done?
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wordpix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 10:08 PM
Response to Reply #71
139. state is broke, and Ahnold is uber-rich from movies & play acting a Terminator
is there something wrong with this picture?
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Harry Monroe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 02:59 PM
Response to Original message
72. Used to be it took a war for Berkeley students to take over a campus building
Now it's just about money!! *sigh*
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wickerwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 03:18 PM
Response to Reply #72
77. It's still about war.
Edited on Fri Nov-20-09 03:18 PM by wickerwoman
Poverty is violence.

Nobody should be starting their life $50,000+ in debt from a *public* university, no matter how good, and heading out into a totally jobless economy.

Nobody should have to become a soldier and risk their lives in Iraq in order to eventually earn a living wage.

It's not a fucking accident that these are the choices facing most 18 year olds today. And these protests are not about vanity or greed... they're about the death of opportunity in America, something that every single one of us should take very seriously.

What happens to a dream deferred?
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jemsan Donating Member (245 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #72
86. It's about more than just money. I wish the people on this forum knew what they were talking about.
This is about Yudoff treating the UC's as "businesses" not educational institutions. It is the beginning of the end for the world's finest university system. Just ask the prof's at the US's. They know what's really going on.
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marshall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 08:47 PM
Response to Reply #86
104. My university administration is already salivating about poaching faculty from California
For some time they've known how this would go down, and they've been poised to get the benefit.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #72
90. It's not just money. It's access to education.
Geeze.
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kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 03:09 PM
Response to Original message
75. Tax the rich. NOW. Without higher education for THE MASSES, we
are dead in the water.
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freddie mertz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 03:13 PM
Response to Original message
76. I am so proud of these brave students.
What is happening in CA and across the nation in Higher Education is a crime against our most important resource.

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Bigmack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 03:21 PM
Response to Original message
78. I got paid to go to college....
... the GI Bill. Of course, I really earned that money!

That was the old GI Bill.

When I got back from the Southeast Asia War Games, I got the GI Bill every month, the state of Michigan paid my tuition and books, and the NDEA loaned me money... payments and interest of 2% to start after graduation, and 10 years to repay the loan. I taught, and that reduced the loan principal by 10% per year of teaching up to 50%.
$3500 loan... halved by teaching = $1750 repaid over 10 years

Quite simply, the rich no longer want the middle and working classes to get college educations, so they are just pricing it out of reach for most Americans.

Kiss the scattered remains of the middle class goodbye!
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Mari333 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 03:26 PM
Response to Original message
80. did they burn their draft cards?
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winyanstaz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 03:49 PM
Response to Original message
84. You GO kids....at last...some people willing to take a stand!
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 04:26 PM
Response to Reply #84
87. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
tblue37 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 06:19 PM
Response to Reply #87
94. I tried to read your post, and it was interesting as far as I got, but after
Edited on Fri Nov-20-09 06:20 PM by tblue37
a few paragraphs I gave up. You really, really need to put some white space between paragraphs so it is not so hard to read your extremely long post on the computer monitor!
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Liberty Belle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 06:10 PM
Response to Original message
93. Go for it, kids!
My daughter just got admitted to UC and we are frosted over this; rates have ALREADY tripled in recent years.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 06:33 PM
Response to Reply #93
96. Congrats, Liberty Belle!
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Ratty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 06:59 PM
Response to Original message
99. Bastards pulled all the fire alarms
I know, I know. It's just I get grumpy when I have to stand out in the pouring rain with no dry place to go.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 07:25 PM
Response to Reply #99
101. If it makes you feel any better, most of them were out there, too.
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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 08:54 PM
Response to Original message
106. Tuition at Georgia public universities is paid for if you graduate High School with a 3.0 GPA.

Plus $300 for books per semester.

I'm not bragging, I'm recruiting.

If you move to GA and pay the first year yourself, the rest is free if you maintain a 3.0 GPA.

Its called the Hope Scholarship and I hope lots of DU members or their children come to Georgia.

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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #106
114. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 07:08 AM
Response to Reply #114
119. Georgia isn't without its issues, I agree.....

But more seriously, GATech and UGA are in the top 25 National Public institutions with world class faculty with high standards. And if you can impress them enough to maintain 3.0 the tuition is free. What does it cost to go to the flagship schools in your state? At least GA got the Hope Scholarships right. Plus we have SEC football. ;)

Best Colleges: Top Public Schools: National Universities

University of California--Berkeley
Berkeley, CA 1
University of California--Los Angeles
Los Angeles, CA 2
University of Virginia
Charlottesville, VA 2
University of Michigan--Ann Arbor
Ann Arbor, MI 4
University of North Carolina--Chapel Hill
Chapel Hill, NC 5
College of William and Mary
Williamsburg, VA 6
Georgia Institute of Technology
Atlanta, GA 7

University of California--San Diego
La Jolla, CA 7
University of Illinois--Urbana-Champaign
Champaign, IL 9
University of Wisconsin--Madison
Madison, WI 9
University of California--Davis
Davis, CA 11
University of California--Santa Barbara
Santa Barbara, CA 11
University of Washington
Seattle, WA 11
University of California--Irvine
Irvine, CA 14
Pennsylvania State University--University Park
University Park, PA 15
University of Florida
Gainesville, FL 15
University of Texas--Austin
Austin, TX 15
Ohio State University--Columbus
Columbus, OH 18
University of Maryland--College Park
College Park, MD 18
University of Pittsburgh
Pittsburgh, PA 20
University of Georgia
Athens, GA 21

Clemson University
Clemson, SC 22
Purdue University--West Lafayette
West Lafayette, IN 22
Texas A&M University--College Station
College Station, TX 22
University of Minnesota--Twin Cities
Minneapolis, MN 22
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Tuesday Afternoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 10:36 AM
Response to Reply #119
126. interesting to note the ratio of
Georgia schools listed against the number of Ohio school listed ....
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roamer65 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-20-09 10:51 PM
Response to Original message
112. Hopefully it spreads to the University of Michigan.
Edited on Fri Nov-20-09 10:55 PM by roamer65
U of M and UC Berkeley were the SDS hotbeds of the 1960's.
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RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 08:38 AM
Response to Original message
123. Class warfare.
Literally and figuratively.
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jemsan Donating Member (245 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 10:34 AM
Response to Original message
125. Video of police beating students from yesterday's rally...
The UC regents approved collateral for a whole bunch of construction bonds BEFORE the fee increase. This is what the fee increases are going to go for..not teacher salaries or classes. They knew they were going to increase it. They knew they were to do it way before the Regents ever met.

Additionally, last year the UC attained the status of financial emergency, giving all administrative power to Yudof. Yudof can do whatever he wants. So, even IF the regents board voted no on the fee hike, he would have overrode them and passed the 32% fee hike anyways because they already promised the money for the construction bonds. This is what people should understand about this situation.

Everyone should watch this video of the protest.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1PuiY4Go8Y



It shows police officers beating students for not moving. The students NEVER provoked the officers in anyway, yet they kept beating them. People's hands were broken. People were shot with rubber bullets. One student was hit across the head and the police officer laughed at him. This doesn't make the evening news.
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clixtox Donating Member (941 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 07:27 PM
Response to Reply #125
132. The American police today are militarized to suppress dissent...

and maintain the oligarchy.

They are way overpaid, they could never make the money they do in any other job.

They have been indoctrinated to believe that most citizens, especially minorities and poor folks, are dangerous and need to be controlled.

Police have weapons previously only used against enemies of the state, foreigners.

Those patriots among us who see the truth are suppressed, preemptively harassed, arrested on bogus charges and vilified in the M$M.

Those of us who are not intimidated, and are willing to demonstrate in the streets, are considered by our masters as "un-American" traitors.

Today's police are, too often, analogous to the Nazi's "Brown-shirts".

Believe it or not!

I grew up in Berkeley and this realities genesis was apparent, even back then, in our streets. Whole neighborhoods around CAL, south and west, were being tear-gassed. There were "checkpoints" at intersections, curfews and beatings by police. People, involved students or not, were swept up off the streets, mass arrests. Not for anything they did or didn't do, they were just in the wrong place, near the campus. A younger brother was arrested just after leaving Berkeley High School (located just 2 blocks from UCB), while walking with other school kids to the bus stop. He had no idea what was happening politically but was held for hours in very confusing and brutal confinement. He was not unique, one of dozens, possibly hundreds, of "innocent" citizens whose civil rights were trampled on and ignored.


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Kievan Rus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 07:34 PM
Response to Reply #125
134. I'm from Pittsburgh. We're used to it here after the G-20.
Edited on Sat Nov-21-09 07:36 PM by Kievan Rus
F*** the rich, f*** Wall Street and f*** New York City.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 07:36 AM
Response to Reply #125
159. Good lord. Thanks.
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Red1 Donating Member (247 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 11:59 AM
Response to Original message
128. Spoil Brats....
Where the hell was that rebellious attitude when it was needed to protest the iraq occupation?
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marshall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #128
129. People generally don't care about stuff until it directly affects them
Vietnam war era protests were fueled by the threat of the draft. Young men in college, even if they got deferrals, were always in danger of being shipped off to the front lines at the whim of the powers that be.
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wordpix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 10:11 PM
Response to Reply #128
140. face it, you're not going to get protests like that without a draft
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 07:45 AM
Response to Reply #128
161. You mean, when these kids were 11 years old? See also, Misanth's post upthread.
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time_has_come Donating Member (872 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-21-09 10:36 PM
Response to Original message
141. It's kind of sad though that the only thing that gets students active these days...
...is a threat to their pocketbook.

Where are the students barricading themselves in an Exxon station or head office to protest their global warming denial campaign?

As long as their tuition doesn't go up students today are sedentary.

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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 07:48 AM
Response to Reply #141
162. Disagree. Posts upthread covered the topic.
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beyond cynical Donating Member (150 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-23-09 12:47 PM
Response to Original message
163. I wonder how many associate deans the California state university system employs.
I wonder how many they need?
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