British nuclear expert’s 17th floor UN death plunge ‘was not suicide’

[Ichingcarpenter]

Source: Daily Mail

A British nuclear expert who fell from the 17th floor of a United Nations building did not commit suicide and may have been hurled to his death, says a doctor who carried out a second post-mortem examination.
Timothy Hampton, 47, a scientist involved in monitoring nuclear activity, was found dead last week at the bottom of a stairwell in Vienna.


Professor Kathrin Yen, of the Ludwig Institute in Graz, Austria, which specialises in traumatology research, said she had more tests to complete on Mr Hampton, who had a three-year-old son with Ms Gryshcuk.

But she said one possible theory was that Mr Hampton was carried to the 17th floor from his workplace on the sixth floor and thrown to his death.
Professor Yen used new forensic techniques to detect internal bruising caused by strangulation which would not be visible to the eye.

She said: ‘In my opinion, it does not look like suicide. My example is that somebody took him up to the top floor and took him down.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-12243...

[Aragorn]

1. what a shock

So who would benefit from this guy's enforced silence? (His death was probably an unfortunate but necessary side effect.)

[Flabbergasted]

31. more info...

"He had been working for the Comprehensive Nuclear-Test-Ban Treaty Organisation (CTBTO) at the UN building and the Austrian Times has been told that Mr Hampton may have been involved in talks discussing nuclear testing in Iran. The UN has strongly denied the claims, although Mr Hampton's title - processing engineer - meant he was "part of the team maintaining and operating the International Data Centre Division application software to generate and distribute data products and services to CTBTOs 182 Member States".

This meant he was responsible for monitoring a vast array of technical data from hundreds of monitoring stations around the world in the hope of discovering any illegal nuclear activity - including Iran. In fact although CTBTO officials were reluctant to admit it, of the 300 plus monitoring stations set up globally there are at least two in the geographical area of Iran sending data back to Vienna.

In addition both the CTBTO and the IAEA that organised the recent Iran talks are in the same complex - the IAEA occupies A and B buildings while the CTBTO is in E building - both are covering the same subject matter."


http://www.austriantimes.at/news/General_News/2009-11-0...

[Ichingcarpenter]

70. I think the plot thickens and I did read this side of story

The culprits of this action are the pawns of the willing agents
of the criminal political power play going on between legally organize crime
that some are just discovering so corrupt and the up and coming startups....... Both sides are equally atrocious

AND THEY DO EXIST Major Fascist battle... but you don't hear it,
unless you open your eyes and ears.

The agent that perpetuated this ghastly death
was probably a free agent assassin that specialized in wet work
and didn't care who he worked for.

I found that the technology to choke someone, without leaving
noticeable marks , interesting and disturbing.
A normally educated pathologists would not detect this.


I also await the pathology report on the slain census worker.

[formercia]

2. Do not disagree with the powers that be.

If you take the King's Shilling, you do the King's bidding...or else...

[western mass]

3. I'd take it more seriously

if the souce wasn't a tabloid.

[Ichingcarpenter]

4. This is in the Austrian News also

But the second autopsy report isn't, The Medical Ludwig Institute in Graz
is not a slack institution but highly regarded

Austrian news

http://www.austriantimes.at/news/General_News/2009-10-2...


The Medical Ludwig Institute in Graz

http://www.meduni-graz.at/forschung

[windbreeze]

77. A friend of this guy wrote to

George Ure, last week...(urbansurvival.com)..after George had mentioned in his column, how suspicious it was that a nuclear scientist had taken a 17 floor fall to his death(with all that's going on in Iran vs nuclear)...The friend of Timothy Hampton told Ure that he felt his friend would not have committed suicide...that he had a brand new baby, and a whole lot to live for....if you care to read his letter to George...I thought it was interesting...because this is a full week or more ago...and now on DU...There are those saying it was not a suicide..

here's a link...scroll down...you will come to it, in lighter print...wb

http://www.urbansurvival.com/lastweek.htm

[LiberalFighter]

5. Bush and Cheney had a hand in it. Oh and Poppy Bush too.

[truth2power]

9. My first thought as soon as I read the OP. Cheney & Co.....

I think that evil fsck, Cheney, has both hands and both feet in the nuclear proliferation industry. Thus, why Valerie Plame was outed. That they gave a crap about what Joe Wilson said or didn't say is simply a diversion.

Cheney did have his assassination squads, after all.

So many people in a position to have critical information, dying mysteriously. What I don't understand is why anyone in that situation doesn't reduce what they know to some permanent medium that can be stashed in a safe place, so that if they're taken out at least the incriminating information would be made available.

[SpiralHawk]

45. "Smirk." - BFEE Skull & Boner Boyos

[Octafish]

6. Lots of people fall from tall buildings...

Robert B. Boettcher, who chronicled Rev Moon's influence on the US Government

John Kokal, who disagreed with PNAC regarding Iraq and WMDs

Paul Sanford, who was the first reporter to ask the White House press secretary McClellan about Karl Rove's role in the Valerie Plame affair

What's weird is how people who fall a great distance so often seem to be at odds with the War Party.

There also are a lot of hangings and shootings of those who oppose the powers that be. Lots. Too many.

That must be what they call a "coincidence."

[Ichingcarpenter]

7. McMafia is a book I would suggest to you

If you are unfamiliar with it. It just adds to the tainted tapestry that
you and I are aware of.

about this book McMafia

With the collapse of the Soviet Union, the fall of the Berlin Wall, and the deregulation of international financial markets in 1989, governments and entrepreneurs alike became intoxicated by forecasts of limitless expansion into newly open markets. No one would foresee that the greatest success story to arise from these events would be the globalization of organized crime. Current estimates suggest that illegal trade accounts for nearly one-fifth of global GDP.

McMafia is a fearless, encompassing, wholly authoritative investigation of the now proven ability of organized crime worldwide to find and service markets driven by a seemingly insatiable demand for illegal wares. Whether discussing the Russian mafia, Colombian drug cartels, or Chinese labor smugglers, Misha Glenny makes clear how organized crime feeds off the poverty of the developing world, how it exploits new technology in the forms of cybercrime and identity theft, and how both global crime and terror are fueled by an identical source: the triumphant material affluence of the West.

To trace the disparate strands of this hydra-like story, Glenny talked to police, victims, politicians, and members of the global underworld in eastern Europe, North and South America, Africa, the Middle East, China, Japan, and India. The story of organized crime’s phenomenal, often shocking growth is truly the central political story of our time. McMafia will change the way we look at the world.






http://www.amazon.com/McMafia-Journey-Through-Criminal-...

[jwirr]

13. Also read John Kerry's "The New War". It says about the same

thing.

[flyarm]

30. another book i would suggest: The Secret Team by L.Fletcher Prouty

"THE CIA AND ITS ALLIES IN CONTROL OF THE UNITED STATES AND THE WORLD"

[Ichingcarpenter]

32. Good Book also consider

Mark Lombardi and the Ecstasy of Conspiracy”.

hhttp://

Article about the artist.

http://observatory.designobserver.com/entry.html?entry=...

[flyarm]

50. Thanks , i have read lot about Mark Lombardi..in fact i posted it at the bottom section of this

thread!!

Thanks , i will get the book!!

[Liberation Angel]

10. Paul Sanford was a friend and I am convinced he was murdered

Thanks for the link to that thread, Octa...

I had not seen it.

I did some investigating on this --- Paul was also the man who brought the "under God" provision of the pledge of allegiance to the Supreme Court.

This type of assassination is not unusual and is a standard M.O. for the BFEE

We should never forget Paul who gave his life for liberty and justice.

I could not establish why he was murdered, but all the circumstances indicate he was on to a big story/case and was meeting someone in pursuit of the Truth. Unfortunately , he was vulnerable. Always a kind and good man, I am sure he would not have expected that such evil would take him down. He was just too good a human being...

Something important happened with the nuclear guy...

I wish we knew what he knew (but of course that is why he was silenced).

[jwirr]

14. I'm stupid but what does BFEE stand for?

[PatSeg]

17. The Urban Dictionary says:

Bush Family Evil Empire. I didn't know what it stood for either.

[jwirr]

21. Thanks to both of you. That is not only true but funny.

[unc70]

79. Nothing funny about the BFEE n/t

[druidity33]

18. Bush Family Evil Empire. nt.

[avaistheone1]

44. I am sorry about the loss of your friend. I think there are far too many scientists dying under

mysterious circumstances. Perhaps Paul is a case of kill the messenger before the messenger gets to leave the message?

Please post any updates you may receive on this story.

[Nikki Stone1]

51. +1

.

[Liberation Angel]

74. If people simply remember Paul's death and the circumstances...

it will help a lot. He had children and apparently a happy marriage and a solid interesting career devoted to human rights.

I just think it is important that we ALL remember that these things happened and that the powers that were may well have been behind it: it speaks to the

VERY important reason to PROSECUTE Bush and Cheney and Rumsfeld for the crimes we KNOW they committed

we may not be able to hold the bastards accountable for this murder (I suspect Rove as the architect of this murder as with James Hatfield) BUT we CAN try to be sure they are prosecuted for crimes against humanity and torture: if we can't get them for Paul's murder we CAN prosecute them for the murder of others which CAN be proved.

Thanks for the positive vibes. He and I were quite close at one time and his death still hurts and saddens me whenever I am reminded of it. But he would approve of us keepoing on the issue of prosecutions and doing it, in part, in his memory.

[avaistheone1]

89. k&R

[truth2power]

11. Correct. See my post above. n/t

[flyarm]

15. and..Dr. Gus Weiss fall from the Watergate complex

The suspicious fatal fall from the Watergate complex of ex-CIA and NSC official Dr. Gus Weiss Weiss. Weiss was adamantly opposed to the Iraq war and Weiss, uncharacteristically, went public with his protests.

I do remember shortly after 9/11/2001..possibly November 2001 someone was murdered at the UN in NY as well..I just can't find the story in my extensive files. But i will continue to look for the story..it was kept pretty silent then.and it was right around the time that American Airlines had an aircraft crash in Rockaway NY. I vaguely remember there was no Obit or much of a story until December 2001.

Then there was the woman in Britian who supposedly jumped from her hotel room window

[PassingFair]

22. I've been trying to find news items on her....can't seem to google the right combination...

but her death was VERY suspicious!

[flyarm]

24. Kathy Ward..she was an American , lawyer for Rolls Royce. Living in Britian

and became a British Citizen


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/im-ba...

[PassingFair]

28. Thanks...I didn't know that there were pictures of her jumping....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...


I don't think that was even discussed in the above link.

[flyarm]

34. AHH in that thread i posted the following of which i referenced further down thsi thread

this one always baffled me as there were no real stories about it..it was found in an Obit at the time a relatively long period after the guy died , with all the NY media ignoring it and no mention of it on any NY media networks..at the time i thought it was so weird..but this is what i had in a post on the thread you posted above..

the link for the following no longer works for this next one..but i never heard this on msm..never..isn't that weird ..a death at the UN and no mention by msm??

Welcome to AJC!

Body Is Found Inside U.N. Headquarters

NEW YORK (AP)--A body was found inside United Nations headquarters on Monday, a U.N. spokesman said. U.N. security and the New York police department are investigating the matter.

The U.N. spokesman said the person had been shot, and that the body was discovered inside the building's third-floor lounge at about 11:30 a.m. He declined to give any details on the deceased person pending notification of the family.

The spokesman, speaking on condition of anonymity, said the world body considered the shooting an ``isolated incident.''


AP-NY-12-01-03 1433EST

Copyright 2003, The Associated Press. The information contained in the AP Online news report may not be published, broadcast or redistributed without the prior written authority of The Associated Press.

[SpiralHawk]

46. Whoa - she was linked to Abramoff. Repulbicon sleazebaggery unending

The Republicon Rot is so pervasive, so dark, so evil.

Shudder.

[flyarm]

48. umm..i would say ..it is pervasive on both sides of the isle..one does it ,the other covers it up!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
posted by IPaint

Obama's latest use of "secrecy" to shield presidential lawbreaking "The Obama administration has, yet again, asserted the broadest and most radical version of the "state secrets" privilege -- which previously caused so much controversy and turmoil among loyal Democrats (when used by Bush/Cheney) -- to attempt to block courts from ruling on the legality of the government's domestic surveillance activities. Obama did so again this past Friday -- just six weeks after the DOJ announced voluntary new internal guidelines which, it insisted, would prevent abuses of the state secrets privilege. Instead -- as predicted -- the DOJ continues to embrace the very same "state secrets" theories of the Bush administration -- which Democrats generally and Barack Obama specifically once vehemently condemned -- and is doing so in order literally to shield the President from judicial review or accountability when he is accused of breaking the law.

...What makes this most recent episode particularly appalling is that the program which Obama is seeking to protect here -- the illegal Bush/Cheney NSA surveillance scheme -- was once depicted as a grave threat to the Constitution and the ultimate expression of lawlessness. Yet now, Obama insists that the very same program is such an important "state secret" that no court can even adjudicate whether the law was broken. When Democrats voted to immunize lawbreaking telecoms last year, they repeatedly justified that by stressing that Bush officials themselves were not immunized and would therefore remain accountable under the law.

...Yet here is Obama doing exactly the opposite of those claims and assurances: namely, he's now (a) seeking to immunize not only telecoms, but also Bush officials, from judicial review; (b) demanding that courts be barred from considering the legality of NSA surveillance programs under any circumstances; and (c) attempting to institutionalize the broadest claims of presidential immunity imaginable via radically broad secrecy claims. To do so, he's violating virtually everything he ever said about such matters when he was Senator Obama and Candidate Obama. And he's relying on the very same theories of executive immunity and secrecy that -- under a Republican President -- sparked so much purported outrage. If nothing else, this latest episode underscores the ongoing need for Congressional Democrats to proceed with proposed legislation to impose meaningful limits and oversight on the President's ability to use this power, as this President, just like the last one, has left no doubt about his willingness to abuse it for ignoble ends."


http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald /

[SpiralHawk]

56. Dems are somewhat complicit, but the Republicon Rot is overwhelming

The Republicons are a plague upon decency and honor...as the demonstrate repeatedly

[flyarm]

72. it seems to be getting worse and complicit by the day.......

thanks to ipaint for posting this..

Obama Administration To Preserve Bush-Era Policy Of Intrusive Laptop Searches
"The Obama administration will largely preserve Bush-era procedures allowing the government to search -- without suspicion of wrongdoing -- the contents of a traveler's laptop computer, cellphone or other electronic device, although officials said new policies would expand oversight of such inspections.

The policy, disclosed Thursday in a pair of Department of Homeland Security directives, describes more fully than did the Bush administration the procedures by which travelers' laptops, iPods, cameras and other digital devices can be searched and seized when they cross a U.S. border. And it sets time limits for completing searches.

But representatives of civil liberties and travelers groups say they see little substantive difference between the Bush-era policy, which prompted controversy, and this one.

"It's a disappointing ratification of the suspicionless search policy put in place by the Bush administration," said Catherine Crump, staff attorney for the American Civil Liberties Union. "It provides a lot of procedural safeguards, but it doesn't deal with the fundamental problem, which is that under the policy, government officials are free to search people's laptops and cellphones for any reason whatsoever."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/20 ...

[defendandprotect]

78. This is the only way that the right wing can come to power and hold it -- violence!!

[Ichingcarpenter]

29. The Swedish Helicopter Bank heist

A month ago ........ was done by Serbian Right Wing Para Military.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...


Four Major bailed out US banks finance cluster bombs with taxpayers money


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

The ties that bind......

[flyarm]

38. The top five loan providers were Bank of America , Citigroup , JP Morgan , Barclays and Goldman Sach

from your link..and thank you for that link !!

Top banks fund cluster bombs as ban nears -
LONDON, Oct 29 (Reuters) - Leading banks have funded cluster bomb-makers to the tune of $5 billion in the past two years despite an international accord to ban the weapons, a study said on Thursday.

The top five loan providers were Bank of America , Citigroup , JP Morgan , Barclays and Goldman Sachs , the study said on Thursday.
The researchers used publicly available information, such as that supplied by stock exchanges and financial databases, to produce their study.

Bank of America and JP Morgan declined to comment while Citigroup and Goldman Sachs also had no immediate comment.

Nations agreed to outlaw cluster bombs in May 2008. The resulting convention will come into force when 30 countries have ratified it -- 23 have already done so. Neither the United States nor Britain, where the top five loan providers are based, have yet ratified the treaty.
The Convention on Cluster Munitions includes a ban on assisting anyone to make the bombs.



read that again..

The top five loan providers were Bank of America , Citigroup , JP Morgan , Barclays and Goldman Sachs

slap me silly and call me surprised!!

And who are all the boys club working with the Obama administration..lots of them,.Goldman Sachs..and we wonder why this administration will escalate the war in Afganistan?????

Death , Bombs, Money and Banks and Wall Street..is there any wonder we can't get health care reform??????

This administration is up to its eyeballs in the same corruption as the last one! And those of us who have warned about it..are called Racists , whinners, doom and gloomers, haters..and on and on and on...

so what would the cheerleaders call those who are dining on and drinking martini's and getting our tax dollars and building cluster bombs and selling them illegally or legally?? I guess the cheerleaders don't like to look at them and think badly of them..they only attack the truthtellers!!

ahhh i have got to go put my head under a rock like the so many cheerleaders around here..just to keep some sense of sanity i guess!

[truth2power]

53. There are those of us who understand, and agree with what you are saying.

Don't expect any real change from Obama. Yes, he has a beautiful wife and delightful kids. They planted and harvested veggies on the WH lawn, for which I applaud them.

Obama is not stupid, and he's not a psychopath (in the clinical sense) like Bush was. But he's complicit in a lot of the corruption, IMO.

I notice that he speaks of our "mission" in Afghanistan in only the vaguest of terms. He knows why we're really there, and it's not to help the women or children or to root out terrorism.

Funny thing, all this activity in Helmand Province. Coincidentially, where the Caspian oil and gas pipelines are proposed. Why isn't Obama talking about this?

And why does he still have Geithner around? I watched him (Geithner) on MTP this a.m. weaseling out of answering an important question about "What is a safe job?" Interesting how he did that.

Until we get the money out of the system (not in my lifetime, certainly) it's going to be same ol', same ol'.

[flyarm]

57. I am in no mood for tainted veggie gardens...at the WH..

when my tax dollars are going to bansk and Goldman for cluster bombs and secret NSA spying on Americans!

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://www.dailyfinance.com/2009/07/30/michelle-obamas-... /

When First Lady Michelle Obama planted an organic vegetable garden on the White House lawn in March 2009, she hoped to both set an example of healthy eating and to grow tasty edibles for her daughters and husband. But Michelle's organic dream has been dashed by a nasty toxic legacy lurking in the soils of 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue. It turns out that a previous Presidential gardening team had used sewage sludge for fertilizer.

This is a fairly common practice with one huge problem. Sewage sludge tends to be laced with anything that people pour down the drain and often contains heavy metals. Not surprisingly, the National Park Service tested the dirt beneath Michelle's garden and found the plot has highly elevated levels of lead averaging 93 parts per million. That's below the 400 ppm that the Environmental Protection Agency says is a threat to human health. But I'd wager that Sasha, Malia and Barack won't be getting arugula or tomatoes from this garden any time soon.

***oh and it was the Clintons that fertilized with the tainted sludge...just to make sure it is clearified.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx



Who's in Big Brother's Database?
The Secret Sentry: The Untold History of the National Security Agency
by Matthew M. Aid

Bloomsbury, 423 pp., $30.00

On a remote edge of Utah's dry and arid high desert, where temperatures often zoom past 100 degrees, hard-hatted construction workers with top-secret clearances are preparing to build what may become America's equivalent of Jorge Luis Borges's "Library of Babel," a place where the collection of information is both infinite and at the same time monstrous, where the entire world's knowledge is stored, but not a single word is understood. At a million square feet, the mammoth $2 billion structure will be one-third larger than the US Capitol and will use the same amount of energy as every house in Salt Lake City combined.

Unlike Borges's "labyrinth of letters," this library expects few visitors. It's being built by the ultra-secret National Security Agency—which is primarily responsible for "signals intelligence," the collection and analysis of various forms of communication—to house trillions of phone calls, e-mail messages, and data trails: Web searches, parking receipts, bookstore visits, and other digital "pocket litter." Lacking adequate space and power at its city-sized Fort Meade, Maryland, headquarters, the NSA is also completing work on another data archive, this one in San Antonio, Texas, which will be nearly the size of the Alamodome.

Just how much information will be stored in these windowless cybertemples? A clue comes from a recent report prepared by the MITRE Corporation, a Pentagon think tank. "As the sensors associated with the various surveillance missions improve," says the report, referring to a variety of technical collection methods, "the data volumes are increasing with a projection that sensor data volume could potentially increase to the level of Yottabytes (1024 Bytes) by 2015."<1> Roughly equal to about a septillion (1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000) pages of text, numbers beyond Yottabytes haven't yet been named. Once vacuumed up and stored in these near-infinite "libraries," the data are then analyzed by powerful infoweapons, supercomputers running complex algorithmic programs, to determine who among us may be—or may one day become—a terrorist. In the NSA's world of automated surveillance on steroids, every bit has a history and every keystroke tells a story.

http://www.nybooks.com/articles/23231

[WHEN CRABS ROAR]

63. Yes, it is about the oil, always has been.

[Hissyspit]

54. Recommended Comment

I just started a new tradition. RC? +1 is o.k. I guess.

[chervilant]

59. No, dear

It's what they call a co-ink-a-dink. Mustn't give even the SLIGHTEST impression one might believe in conspiracy. One might take a nasty fall...

[New Dawn]

88. Thanks for posting this.

[orbitalman]

8. Sound like something Cheney would do. n/t

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

12. With an à la carte of buckshot in the face. nt

[Boxerfan]

16. Wasn't John Bolton involved in a similar incident??

A fall from a high office window or something similar. An aide of his if I remember correct.

[flyarm]

25. John Kokal...i think this is possibly who you are thinking of.

http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/112003_kokal....

[man4allcats]

19. Only one question:

Where was Dick Cheney when this happened?

[dipsydoodle]

20. Fuck.

That's truly awful.

[bertman]

23. Kicked so more DU'ers can read about this despicable history of political murder in the U.S.

Our corporate media are performing an extraordinary service to the Military-Industrial-Corporate Complex through their lack of investigation of the many "untimely" deaths listed in this thread. There are literally hundreds more over the last 50 years but we never hear about any major news service recognizing that these people were opponents of the regime in power and threatened them. Be assured that if this happened in Iran or Russia it would be a multi-week series in the New York Times.

Recommend.

[flyarm]

39. hell the NYT didn't even tell the story of someone murdered at the UN right under their nose!!

and forget about the NYT telling the story about Judith Miller and DrDavid Kelly in Britian.

the NYT is partners in the shadow government!

[flyarm]

26. another weird death..and I will never forget this man and his families grief..Brian Quigg..

hard to find anything on him now, he was writing about 9/11

most info has been scrubbed. all the info i had about him in my files has dissapeared from the web.

[Ian David]

27. If John Bolton had gotten his wish, he might have survived a 7-floor plunge. n/t

[Mrs. Overall]

33. Sounds like David Kelly's suicide.

[Eric J in MN]

40. I agree. NT

NT

[chatnoir]

35. From the CIA's own "A Study of Assassination"

which was found among their training files for “Operation PB Success” –– their 1954 operation to overthrow the democratically elected government in Guatemala. Declassified in 1997 in response to a Freedom of Information Act request.

Page 9:

2. Accidents.

For secret assassination, either simple or chase, the contrived accident is the most effective technique. When successfully executed, it causes little excitement and is only casually investigated.

The most efficient accident, in simple assassination, is a fall of 75 feet or more onto a hard surface. Elevator shafts, stair wells, unscreened windows and bridges will serve. Bridge falls into water are not reliable. In simple cases a private meeting with the subject may be arranged at a properly-cased location. The act may be executed by sudden, vigorous of the ankles, tipping the subject over the edge. If the assassin immediately sets up an outcry, playing the "horrified witness", no alibi or surreptitious withdrawal is necessary. In chase cases it will usually be necessary to stun or drug the subject before dropping him. Care is required to insure that no wound or condition not attributable to the fall is discernible after death.

Falls into the sea or swiftly flowing rivers may suffice if the subject cannot swim. It will be more reliable if the assassin can arrange to attempt rescue, as he can thus be sure of the subject's death and at the same time establish a workable alibi.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/3233614/CIAA-Study-of-Assassi...

[flyarm]

36. another one to look at is Mark Lombardi

another one to look at is Mark Lombardi

from my files..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Lombardi
do go read it all........

Drawn charts
In the early 1990s, Lombardi began researching the many scandals of the time, such as the BCCI scandal, or the Harken Energy scandal, or the Savings and Loan scandal; his thousands of index cards began to overwhelm his ability to deal with it. To cope, Mark began assembling them into physical outlines, and then into hand-written diagrams. They were intended to be a tool, to provide focus to his work, but he "...soon decided that this method of combining text and image in a single field (called a drawing, diagram or flow chart, whichever you prefer) really worked for me in other ways as well." This decision was spurred, according to Lombardi, while he was talking with a friend (Leonard Gumport, a lawyer in Los Angeles), about one portion of the Iran-Contra scandal, a one Saudi Arabian Adnan Khashoggi, whom Lombardi described as "the Saudi commercial agent and playboy arms dealer who had figured prominently in the Iran-Contra and had made large investments in the U.S. including in Houston. As Gumport spoke, I began taking notes, then sketching out a simple tree chart, showing the breakdown of Kashoggi's American holdings. Within days, I began making more of these charts, depicting other corporate networks I had researched. I was writing several pieces at the time and found the charts a useful, quick reference to the material at hand."

Initially, as the subject of one of his manuscripts, the primary focus was on the drug wars, but because of Pete Brewton's January 1990 newspaper series about the Houston S&L scandal, in which Brewton alleged the Bush family, CIA members, and Mafia members in a de facto conspiracy to steal vast sums of money, Lombardi shifted his emphasis to investigating the laundering of the stolen money. Interestingly, the scandals were not a completely abstract pursuit; one of his former classmate's husband was involved in the incidents; when he disappeared, the only portion of his body recovered was his jawbone.

After Lombardi divorced his wife in October 1996, Lombardi moved to New York City since that would get him away from Houston, and because his work was going to be shown in a show at New York's Drawing Center, called Selections: Winter 1997. Not least, one of his friends, Fred Tomaselli lived in New York, and had been trying to persuade Lombardi to move to Williamsburg, New York.

While for most of his career, Lombardi was an abstract painter of no particular note (he pursued it sort of as a hobby during his actual career as an archivist and reference librarian), six years before his death he switched to the pencil diagrams of crime and conspiracy networks that he would be come best known for.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

His death was by hanging..



but his friends said :

"When the news of Mark's death arrived, all of us thought that he was murdered. We assumed that he had made one too many accusations, and that someone made a phone call. We still don't know what happened. We'd read that the medical examiner ruled Mark's death a suicide, but we're unable to understand or accept the idea that Mark would kill himself right when he was at the top of his game."<1>

[flyarm]

37. Michael Edward Runyon Federal prosecutor supposedly committed suicide Sept 17th 2007

this I also had in my files.

This is an article that was in the St Pete Times newspaper..Friday Sept 21st,2007

This Federal prosecutor supposedly committed suicide Sept 17th 2007 the morning after federal prosecutor Roy Atchison was picked up in Michigan.

Why has this been kept so quiet ??.... and why was his death not reported from Monday Sept 17th until Sept.21 st ?

this was not online ..only in the paper...and a small blurb.


Michael Edward Runyon, 54, Tampa, Florida was found dead of a gunshot wound “termed a suicide” at 6:AM, Monday September 17, 2007 on the back patio of his Valrico, Fl. home outside Tampa where he was Assistant United States Attorney since 1991 and headed a multi-agency securities fraud task force.

Runyon’s death was not reported in the local media until several days later on Friday September 21, 2007.

Runyon’s death would have been on the front page of any other major metropolitan newspaper due to his work on internationally famous criminal and complex money laundering cases, had it not been for apparent White House intervention.

Runyon prosecuted some of the largest securities fraud cases and other financial/racketeering crimes that involved not only the BUSH Family, but also included the very intricate REFCO (Swiss/Austrian royalty) swindle, which has connections to WALLY HILLARD of 9/11 infamy, and very tight connections to a PRIVATE LOAN SEEKER in Chicago, MOHAMMED HUSSEIN MIRZA who was closely connected with the people indicted for the REFCO swindle.

http://www.insider-magazine.com/RefcoProbe/RunyonREFCOc...

In August 2002, Manhattan District Attorney Robert Morgenthau personally thanked Runyon for his involvement in the famous Evergreen Security fraud case. Runyon who was deeply involved in criminal cases at the United States Attorneys office in Tampa was quite possibly involved in the complex Aztec Environmental – Big Wheel Recycling case along with federal prosecutor Roy Atchison of Pensacola, Florida who was recently arrested in Detroit allegedly seeking sex with a 5-year old child.

jo_rPMDgW8J:pview.findlaw.com/view/1286822_1%3Fnoconfirm%3D0%26channel%3DLP+michael+e+runyon&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2&gl=us" target="_blank">http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cache jo_rPMDgW8J:pview...

Michael E. Runyon
Firm: US Attorney's Office, Middle District of Florida

Address: Suite 3200
400 North Tampa St.
Tampa, FL 33602-3917
Map & Directions

[gateley]

41. Chilling -- the OP and the subsequent references. I was wondering

why nothing ever 'comes' of these stories, but I just have to look at the list of the deceased.

Can you imagine how frequently this really occurs and no one has an inkling?

This is horrifying, heartbreaking and infuriating. And one just feels so helpless.

Recommend.

[Ichingcarpenter]

47. We are all a ''Stranger in a Strange Land '' now.

Its almost like we grew up on another planet After the tapestry of legal criminal reality is revealed. There is something going on but we don't know
what it is, do we, Mr. Jones? Because something is happening here
But you don't know what it is
Do you, Mister Jones?


I don't believe this is a random type 'chaos theory' on what is happening
around these deaths

"You will not apply my precept," he said, shaking his head. "How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth? We know that he did not come through the door, the window, or the chimney. We also know that he could not have been concealed in the room, as there is no concealment possible. When, then, did he come?"

The Sign of the Four, ch. 6 (1890)
Sherlock Holmes




Stranger in a strange land.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stranger_in_a_Strange_Land

[Greyhound]

42. K&R.

One of these "suicides" may be the thing that finally clicks in the American mind and wakes them up to how and who runs our world.

[aquart]

43. What, AGAIN?

[flyarm]

49. Do read " THE SECRET TEAM" BY L.FLETCHER PROUTY

"The CIA and its Allies in Control of the United States and the World"

[anigbrowl]

52. A lot of people are muttering about a Bush connection, but based on what?

You know, there are probably conspiracy theorists over on free Republic suggesting that the Obama administration is somehow responsible, complete with lists of 'corroborating evidence' of everyone who ever committed suicide during a Democratic administration.

Then again, if it were murder, it could just as easily have been someone from Iran, Pakistan, India or North Korea, all countries with a history of covert nuclear development. If you want to posit a Bush connection, I think you need to come up with something better than 'well, they're capable of anything'. Assassination has been around as long as politics, it's not like there's some sort of GOP monopoly on it.

To assume that those with whom you disagree are incapable of malice is naive. To ascribe all possible malice to those with whom you disagree is paranoid.

[Ichingcarpenter]

58. Moral relativism vs Value-pluralism

The metaethics in this thread are not in question.




There is enough data and links in this thread
to question your reality and should.

[anigbrowl]

60. I invite you to try again

I already read the entire thread and my reality has not been shaken, because it wasn't a naive reality to start with. The reasoning in this thread is of the form 'BFEE is bad, would 'suicide' people - therefore it must have been the BFEE'.

That is just illogical. Nobody has made a strong argument about why this guy's unfortunate death would benefit the BFEE, or why they might want to take revenge on him, or anything of the sort. Meanwhile, we have the fact that he was somehow connected with nuclear proliferation oversight, and we know there are multiple countries that are engaged in nuclear proliferation with varying degrees of secrecy.

So why the harping on the BFEE angle? I can see just as many reasons to suspect, say, the Russians, who have a fine covert operations tradition of their own. There are other countries that engage in shady practices besides the US, you know. Ascribing all ills to the BFEE suggests a serious lack of imagination or awareness about the rest of the world.

[peacetalksforall]

80. You are stuck on boundaries - countries political opposites. This is international.

This is about earth resources, including humans.

This is about control.

This is about subservience and obedience. No protests. No truths.

This is about building an infrastructure to carry it off.

A war against the people with no borders.

Over-under. Kings-serfs.

Their real challenge is keeping a balance. We must keep buying. Capitalism pretense. The conglomerates must make some money.

"They' have already done many things right for their purposes. They have carried off many successes. Starting with the media and religious radicals. All are carrying off their roles perfectly.

[anigbrowl]

81. So still no actual evidence? Disappointing.

I mean, you could argue that the BFEE is all these things, but it's kind of naive to assume that all ill-doing is concentrated among this one group. I have no seen any evidence of how they are supposed to be benefiting from this guy's death or anything, the post above is just random buzzwords about how bad they are.

Frankly, most of this thread seems unhinged.

[chervilant]

64. hmmm...

"To assume that those with whom you disagree are incapable of malice is naive. To ascribe all possible malice to those with whom you disagree is paranoid."

Lovely quote there, anigbrowl, but almost entirely unwarranted in this thread. The musings of those who've replied herein above are overwhelmingly matter-of-fact--mere acknowledgment of that which we all know to be true--at least, those of us all who are no longer mired in ignorance.

Thus, more appropriate is the age-old adage, "ignorance is bliss." Most humans ostrich their way through life, clinging ferociously to conservative memes, seldom questioning the macro-level manifestations of homo sapien sapiens' worst traits--the hierarchy, the hedonism, the narcissism, the fears...

Those of us who DO see, those who DO contemplate these grim manifestations of humanity's worst--conflated with the now exponential change we've inflicted on ourselves and on this planet--we KNOW we're witnessing something catastrophic, something we can only begin to suss out....

On that note, I am reminded of something key that Gandhi said,

When I despair, I remember that all through history the ways of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants, and murderers, and for a time they can seem invincible, but in the end they always fall. Think of it--always.

(BTW, when I use the word 'catastrophic,' I do not intend to imply 'disaster' or 'the end.' I mean that we humans have dealt ourselves both Death and the Tower from the Tarot deck, and now we must play the hand we've dealt...)

[flyarm]

66. excellent reply+1!! thank you! n/t

[anigbrowl]

82. None of which has anything to do with the question (of why we should suspect Bushco particularly)

I mean, it's true that wicked deeds are carried out by the wicked, and the wicked exploit the ignorance of the gullible masses, but this is kind of like saying that all crime is carried out by criminals - well, duh. You might as well just say 'followers of Satan' or something, because this is essentially a religious argument.

Let me try to simplify this:

A guy seems to have been murdered, which is Bad.
'Bushco' refers to the soft of people who ran the last administration, who are also Bad.

That does not mean Bushco had anything to do with murdering this guy - because there are other people besides Bushco who are Bad.

[SDuderstadt]

83. AB...

I love you, man, but let me point out that you are trying to reason with DU's "shoot first, ask questions later" crowd. Opt for your sanity here.

[chervilant]

85. Be careful

who you include in your "shoot first, ask questions later" crowd--I might be left with the impression that you lack the intellect to understand my post. Then, we would both be wrong, wouldn't we?

[SDuderstadt]

87. Since I wasn't talking to or about you, I don't know why you're responding...n/t

[chervilant]

90. hmmm...

...a rather disingenuous effort on your part, methinks.

[chervilant]

84. hmmm...

Actually, I said nothing about Bushco. Bushco--like many before them--was just a front for the Corporate Megalomaniacs who have usurped our government--who are far bolder these days about how they 'run' things.

In fact, some here on DU are starting to grumble about Obama's apparent duplicitous behavior of late, but I am NOT surprised by anything our politicians do these days, since they are just a thin veneer over the real power brokers.

Your simplification suggests a tautology (I presume you meant "sort of people" in your second statement?), but again, this is your contention, not mine.

On a macro-level, our species' hedonism manifests in behaviors that may seem conspiratorial, particularly since secrecy has long been paramount to the actual power brokers--at least until the recent past. However, sussing out exactly who killed this guy is rather meaningless in the greater scheme of things, isn't it?

[no_hypocrisy]

55. Told you so.

[cleverusername]

61. No great surprise here

D'oh!

[lib2DaBone]

62. Let's Roll. Surge in Afghanistan ...invade Iran...We don't need no stinkin' health care..

[Enthusiast]

65. I suspect Tim Hampton

was killed because he had knowledge of an impending dirty bomb terrorist attack on the U.S. planned by Dick Cheney in an effort to prove Obama isn't keeping us safe. Now this is only a guess.

[flyarm]

67. we may always have to guess to the reasons and guess why these people really died..

but one thing is a constant..these people are dead, many of suspect reasons or suspect suicides, and many died with information that would have hurt those in power.In many many cases.

And that is tragic.

[Ichingcarpenter]

68. It is the assassination of scientists and the general intelligencia which

is always.........

most disturbing.

But that is the totalitarian Fascist way.

[flyarm]

69. correct you are! thank you!! n/t

[chervilant]

86. THIS

is exactly the point! We may never find out who did what to whom...or when...or WHY! But, we can certainly see a pattern of 'suspect' deaths or 'suicides' of individuals whose knowledge posed or poses a threat to "those in power." Tempting though it may be for some on DU to disparage such musings, what you've posted herein above is the essential point.

I am reminded of Karen Silkwood, who died in a mysterious car 'accident' while on her way to deliver information which allegedly would have put Kerr-McGee in the hot seat, so to speak, over safety violations involving plutonium fuel rods. At a time when anti-nuclear activism was making a huge difference in public perceptions of the nuclear industry, such safety violations could have resulted in costly lawsuits and/or the complete dissolution of the company. Actually, Kerr-McGee did close its nuclear fuel plants in 1975, and one has to wonder how big a role Silkwood's activism and her mysterious 'accident' played in this outcome.

I have another quote for anigbrowl, in case he/she is reading this: "Power corrupts; Absolute Power corrupts absolutely." Those who have absolute power can 'disappear' anyone who threatens their hegemony, and we peons can do very little about it, until and unless we organize on a level unprecedented thus far in human history. I don't think macro-level teamwork is likely in our immediate future (despite Gandhi's remarkable success). We here in the US are so busy snarfing the bipartisan red herrings promulgated by the corporatists (bent on distracting us from the real issues), I doubt that any but the smallest number of us have a CLUE what's really going on...

[maglatinavi]

71. murders

The messages in this thread have made me physically sick... I couldn't finish reading them all ...

[flyarm]

73. it is very disturbing..and gives one nightmares..but some of us have been keeping this info

and keeping track of these murders for years..someone has to ..these people should be remembered, and the truth should be fought for!

We the people, have that obligation.

[The abyss]

75. Excellent thread – outstanding discussion!

Recommend!

Great information.

[Endangered Specie]

76. Putin Push?