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BlueJessamine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 03:39 PM
Original message
Gates Says He Is Outraged by Arrest at Cambridge Home
Source: Washington Post

Harvard scholar Henry Louis Gates Jr. cast his recent arrest in his home in Cambridge, Mass., as part of a "racial narrative" playing out in a biased criminal justice system. The professor who has spent much of his life studying race in America said he has come to feel like a case study.

"There are one million black men in jail in this country and last Thursday I was one of them," he said in an exclusive interview with The Washington Post Tuesday morning. "This is outrageous and that this is how poor black men across the country are treated everyday in the criminal justice system. It's one thing to write about it, but altogether another to experience it."

He was still outraged but he said he has had time to take a step back and will now apply the scholarship that has been his life's work to the issue of race in the criminal justice system.

snip

What follows is Gates's first public account of his arrest. He spoke to The Post in an hour-long phone interview while resting on Martha's Vineyard. Gates is a founder of the Root.com, (www.theroot.com ), a Web site owned by The Washington Post Co.



Read more: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/20...



Gates now hopes to make a documentary about racial profiling for PBS:

He said the documentary will ask: "How are people treated when they are arrested? How does the criminal justice system work? How many black and brown men and poor white men are the victims of police officers who are carrying racist thoughts?

"I want to be a figure for prison reform. I think that criminal justice system is rotten."

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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 03:43 PM
Response to Original message
1. And he puts this mess to constructive use, to help others and to teach.
Typical.
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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 03:46 PM
Response to Original message
2. Photo of the arrest, from the article >
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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. Oh, he was just "making a scene"
He was just "losing it"
He was just "being argumentative"

..at least, according to those on the other thread about this that twisted all logic and common sense- and themselves- into a pretzel to make it seem as if the police weren't doing anything wrong.

It just amazed me. Notice that now that the charges have been dropped and it's absolutely clear as day that Gates was not at fault for any reason, those people aren't posting on these threads any more.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. Even if he was just losing it and being argumentative, that's no reason to
arrest him. There's no requirement to be "sweet" to the police. You usually get better results when you do, but it's not mandated.

Once they established that the house was his, that his door was jammed, and that there was no break-in, they should have said, "Sorry for bothering you, hope you'll note our fast response time to the 911 call, have a nice night--oh, and would you like one of these officers to shove that jammed door shut for you until you can have it mended?"
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. I guess the black cop was a racist as well?
:shrug:

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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #12
17. It is no secret that that PD has had a history of racial insensitivity.
That black cop in the picture isn't the one making the arrest, now, is he?

I doubt he had any role in this effort beyond responding as "back up" to what was originally thought to be a robbery. Look carefully at what that guy is doing, too. He's "maintaining the perimeter"--a job usually given to the low man on the totem pole.

Do you honestly think the low man on the totem pole is going to start griping at the guy who writes his performance evaluation? Or to any of his buddies? That's a sure way to get a shitty record and reputation. He wants to feed his family and get promoted like anyone else.

Please.
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. Actually the black cop is there so he is part of the team.

Has it ever occurred to you that the the professor was being an a-hole?


I wasn't there and neither were you. Why are you assuming and then patting yourself on the back for it?
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:38 PM
Response to Reply #18
28. WTF is wrong with you? How many times do I have to tell you "So what?" before it sinks in?
There is no law against "being an a-hole." Certainly, you catch more flies with honey than vinegar, but police are not "our betters" and they do not mandate respect. They are our SERVANTS, capisce? Problems arise when they forget their role.

They did not--one more time--arrest him for B and E. They arrested him on a "disorderly" charge. They knew the house was his, they knew who he was. That is plain. Unless, of course, we're not to believe the Boston and regional TV stations, and we should believe you? Please.

I have also read the police reports, the statements of the AG and the news articles. I plainly have a better grasp of this situation than you do, because the police did what I predicted they would do--drop all charges and issue an apology.

You are plainly the one who is refusing to "get it" for whatever reasons you harbor. That's your issue, not mine.

Understand this--police are not gods, and they make errors in judgment. This was a beauty.
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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #28
32. Law against being a rich / important ass
normal people who dont get a national stage should act rationally when dealing with the police. If you are rich enough here you can buy your way out of any charge. Personally I have found being polite when the police showed up to my door to work better for me than my buddies who told them to go get fucked, they could play music as loud as the wanted. That ends poorly. Unless of course you are rich or important.

If they knew who he was and were out of line, he has recourse.

If they thought he was just a mere mortal and arrested him after he refused to provide ID and began flipping out, well then they will just apologize and call it a day.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #32
34. They arrested him AFTER he provided them with ID. n/t
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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:54 PM
Response to Reply #34
35. Only question is did he meet the statute's requirement for arrest
after that he is done. If the state does not prosecute that is another call. If he met the requirements he has no recourse.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #35
42. Of course he does. He's a black male. n/t
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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:05 PM
Response to Reply #42
74. Yeah, that is pretty much not going to fly any more..
eventually people will have to stop with that approach and actually deal with their actions. If the man was singled out because of race the officer is in deep shit.
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:05 PM
Response to Reply #74
163. And that is it exactly. IF.

IF the professor was getting angry at the officer, then not much will happen. Charges have already been dropped.

IF the officer just decided to be an asshole then he is in some serous shit.


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JayMusgrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 10:46 AM
Response to Reply #42
200. Arrested for being a black person. That's a crime we must punish
to the full extent of the law. :sarcasm:
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JonLP24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #35
46. This is the first thing that came up
A disorderly person is defined as one who:

* with purpose to cause public inconvenience, annoyance or alarm, or
* recklessly creates a risk thereof
* engages in fighting or threatening, violent or tumultuous behavior, or
* creates a hazard or physically offensive condition by any act which serves no legitimate purpose.

Conviction for Disorderly conduct in MA can be punishable by imprisonment for up to 6 months.

Disturbing the peace also falls under Chapter 272, with similar penalties. Some Massachusetts towns also have specific ordinances relating to disturbing the peace.

http://www.masscriminaldefense.com/disorderly.htm

also
Massachusetts courts have defined the term "disorderly" in other contexts. In Alegata, 353 Mass, at 303, 231 N.E.2d at 210-11, the Supreme Judicial Court of Massachusetts, interpreting the term "disorderly" within the meaning of the Massachusetts statute providing for criminal punishment of disorderly persons, Mass.Gen.L. ch. 272, 53, approved the following Model Penal Code definition of the offense of disorderly conduct for use in Massachusetts: A person is guilty of disorderly conduct if, with purpose to cause public inconve-
Page 6, 26 F.3d 1206, 1211

nience, annoyance or alarm, or recklessly creating a risk thereof, he: (a) engages in fighting or threatening, or in violent or tumultuous behavior; or (b) makes unreasonable noise or offensively coarse utterance, gesture or display, or addresses abusive language to any person present; or (c) creates a hazardous or physically offensive condition by any act which serves no legitimate purpose of the actor.

<snip>
http://www.precydent.com/citation/26/F.3d/1206

What I was reading something at PreCYdent website about DC in Mass. and probable cause plays factor. You also have a right to not to answer questions or question the orders and actions of a police officer. It was a long read and I had difficulty understanding how this pertains to Mr. Gates so I avoided from posting it down thread but it does contain the DC definition under Mass. law so I posted it to you.
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Flaneur Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:39 PM
Response to Reply #35
58. I guess that question has been answered now.
And who had no recourse? The arresting officer? Of course, he did. He could have chosen not to arrest Dr. Gates on that bogus charge.
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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:03 PM
Response to Reply #58
71. DA decides to prosecute..
you can be arrested for rape and meet the statute and not charged on the DA's approach.

If he met the statute's requirement and any other officer would act that way, then the officer was doing his job.
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Piewhacket Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:33 PM
Response to Reply #71
140. Not exactly.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:00 PM
Response to Reply #32
37. Don't give me "should." It is not against the law to behave like a rich/important ass.
It's a point I keep repeating, that keeps wooshing over your head, for some odd reason.

Police who arrest people for "being an ass" would be awfully busy if that were a law on the books.

This is an OLD man, on a cane, in his home--that they knew was his home, and he gave them his Harvard ID with his picture on it, that proved who he was.

Go back and actually read what I have written. Of COURSE it's a "better idea" to not give them a measure of shit, but there's no law against it.

They should have said "Have a nice night, Professor--sorry to have troubled you, but we got a report that someone had broken in to your house. Can we help you shove that door shut until the maintenance people get here?" Instead, they arrested the guy. Now, they've released him and they're going to get to spend half of the long hot summer learning how not to talk to people.

And the idiot who ordered the arrest? He's probably already had his "talking to," and I wouldn't be surprised if he gets a few more from higher ups before this is all water under the bridge.
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #37
43. You really need to relax a bit. If this is how you would behave in front
of an officer there's no telling what might happen.

:)
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:11 PM
Response to Reply #43
45. I'm quite relaxed, thank you.
Getting personal is usually the sign of a failed argument, you know.
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:57 PM
Response to Reply #45
119. You appear anything but...
Just a casual observation. :rofl:
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:00 PM
Response to Reply #119
122. I don't "appear" at all--do you think you have remote viewing skills, is that it?
That would explain a lot.

The only one who thinks you are funny is you, FWIW.
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #122
127. Temper, temper...
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:38 PM
Response to Reply #127
147. You really should try to control yours.
Perhaps if you got a life you wouldn't run around the internet behaving like a childish little boor, hmmmm?

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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:42 PM
Response to Reply #147
150. I have a life, MADem, and I am in control. ;D

Some us us though apparently are not... :eyes:


One question. Were you there?
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:52 PM
Response to Reply #150
154. Yes, by your comments, it is sadly apparent what kind of pathetic life you have. NT
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:00 PM
Response to Reply #154
161. Really? Tell me all about my life.

This should be fun.


I'm sure that you will give my life a thorough talking to.



Ready, set, go.
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Iowa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #43
67. A good example of Caspar Milquetoast reasoning.
You appear to be proposing that people should just "relax" when it comes to police misconduct... a recipe for totalitarianism. Some things are best approached with strength and passion; this is one of those things.

Even worse, you're suggesting that one has an obligation to "behave in front of an officer", like a good little soldier. God, what a wimp.

Try listening to what MADem is saying. You might learn something.
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #67
124. I never said that and you very well know it.
The police received a call. It was their job to investigate.

Now I wasn't there. Were you?



I'll tell you what. If you ever get pulled over go right ahead and act up to the officer. See how that works out for you.


My how the lovely DUers will stop at nothing to tell me what I have said and what I think. ;)
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Raschel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-23-09 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #37
222. All this hollering about how Gates should have behaved. It didn't work too well for
the sports star (forgot his name) who was detained and treated like dirt while his mother-in-law was dying in the hospital.

That sports star was as POLITE AS COULD BE. He followed all the rules. It didn't matter.

The people that make this "behavior" excuse and other excuses for police don't realize that they're cutting off their nose to spite their face.

The police have become more and more bold and have moved on to the White community.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:11 PM
Response to Reply #32
79. In all likelihood, he was polite, at least at first.
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #28
41. There is nothing wrong with me. What is wrong with you?

You seem to be over agitated, and it you want to hassle the police when they're doing their job then go for it.

Let's see how it works out for you.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #41
47. Again, getting personal is the sign of a failed argument. I am not "over agitated,"
but I am a bit annoyed at your inability to comprehend the written English language.

Try actually reading what people write, and not making up foolishness... let's see how that works out for you.
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:53 PM
Response to Reply #47
116. Well, then you failed a few arguments back. ;D

And now those evil white people are all the same??

:rofl: You should take your show on the road.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:12 PM
Response to Reply #116
131. I think you are the one who needs to take your show on the road--far, far away. NT
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:17 PM
Response to Reply #41
82. If a cop is in my living room, acting like a jerk when I have done nonthing more than come
into my own home, I just may hassle him. He was shown two forms of ID AND THEN called in the Harvard University police. And refused to give his name and badge number. I appreciate that he had received a call, but no one was obligated to let him in or to answer any of his questions. Yet, Professor Gates did. At what point is enough enough?
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #82
94. Guess what the cop's name was? Drum roll.....and no, I am not kidding!
Jim Crowley.
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-23-09 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #94
217. Now that deserves a Drumroll~


Unreal!
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #82
118. Sigh...

If you hassle a cop then be prepared for the consequences of such an action. It's really not rocket science.

But nobody that is posting here and getting all testy was actually there.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:09 PM
Response to Reply #118
128. Show us where he "hassled" the cop? You haven't made your case.
You also are discounting the statement of an elderly and esteemed academic who has a long record of being a reasonable individual.

I guess standing up for one's rights is "hassling" now?

How dare the Professor "sass his betters?"

Unless you were using your "remote viewing" skills, pal, YOU weren't there either.

Oh, how about a little :rofl:
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:16 PM
Response to Reply #128
132. Laughs all around, MADem...

Since I was responding to no elephants comment "If a cop is in my living room, acting like a jerk when I have done nonthing more than come into my own home, I just may hassle him" it would appear that you are too quick to the draw. Perhaps you should read through the string before you make baseless accusations.


And I'll ask this again. Were you there? I know I wasn't.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:27 PM
Response to Reply #132
135. If you weren't there, then, by YOUR argument, you should just hush up, now, shouldn't you?
IF you were taking your own advice, that is.

Pssst. This is a discussion board. If you don't want your comments to be remarked upon, I'd suggest you not make them.

You took the POV that "hassling" cops was not on, and tried to justify it as well.
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:40 PM
Response to Reply #135
149. Now, now, MADem. Can you ease up on the reactionary posts?

My POV is that if (see the 'if' in italics?) the professor hassled the cops then he should have thought better of it.


But if the cops arrested the professor illegally then the have some explaining to do.


By the way, were you there?
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:50 PM
Response to Reply #149
153. Now, now, board disruptor, could you ease up on the "right up to the line"
commentary ....and perhaps take your own advice?

By the way, you were not there.
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #153
160. You weren't there either, but you have a TV. Good for you.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:06 PM
Response to Reply #149
164. Now that's really objective. How about "If the cop hassled a well-dressed.
wealthy, famous man in his own home for doing nothing but being in his own home, the cop thought have thought better of it? Or either one should have thought better of being anything but appropriate?

Your POV has been obvious.
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:39 PM
Response to Reply #164
177. Well...

The wealthy, famous man is only famous in certain circles. He's not a readily identifiable celebrity (i.e actor or sports star - - I cringe when I think about that, but most people probably wouldn't know him from an average guy on the street), although I do not doubt his celebrity or credentials.

The cop was answering a call. It would appear that he wasn't just driving around looking to arrest somebody. The cop probably wishes that he called in sick that day.


Now I really don't know the cop or the professor. They could both be assholes on a bad day.


Now were you suggesting that my POV was disingenuous in any way?
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Iowa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #28
53. Well said! n/t
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Flaneur Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:38 PM
Response to Reply #18
57. I get the feeling you would know quite a bit about being an a-hole.
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fishwax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #12
25. why do you say that?
:shrug:
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:38 PM
Response to Reply #25
29. It was a response of Sarcasm...

Everybody is getting all worked up, and they weren't there.

Were all the cops racist? It's an easy epithet to throw around.
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fishwax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:45 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. it's an easy epithet to throw around, but there's no evidence Gates was doing that
According to the police report, he said that to the specific officer who arrested him.
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Flaneur Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:36 PM
Response to Reply #12
56. Cops is cops. They're not black or white, they're blue.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:03 PM
Response to Reply #12
70. Four Things: You are seeing the end of the incident. All of these cops were not involved at first
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 06:07 PM by No Elephants
Two. The only thing you see that cop doing is standing there, facing the crowd, so why would you even ask that?

Three. Yes, African Americans can be racist about African Americans.

Four. it doesn't matter to me whether the cops were racist per se or not. The issue is whether their conduct was warranted (no pun intended). It wasn't and their own department says so. But, since so few wealthy white professors get arrested for being in their own homes, it is not a huge leap to think race might have been a factor.
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jonestonesusa Donating Member (630 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 03:24 AM
Response to Reply #70
195. Bingo!
Let's consider the likelihood of this kind of thing happening to Paul Krugman or Larry Summers while he was at Harvard.

I think we can safely assume a 0% chance of this happening, and this would have nothing to do with how sweet we all know Larry Summers would be to the cops compared to Gates.
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EndersDame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 12:00 AM
Response to Reply #12
191. It would be wise to listen to NWA as they elucidate on this subject
"And on the other hand, without a gun they can't get none
But don't let it be a black and a white one
Cuz they slam ya down to the street top
Black police showin out for the white cop"
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Winterblues Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-23-09 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #12
218. We all know a black cop could never ever be racist against another black man..
:shrug:
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DesertDiamond Donating Member (838 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:20 PM
Response to Reply #9
49. Once it becomes accepted that one can't speak one's mind to a cop -- short of physical agression --
such a society is in trouble. And I think we're there.
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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #49
75. I 'm going to kill you (communicating a threat)
cant do that. There is a pretty long list of stupid shit people say to the police. Not acting like an ass or saying stupid shit makes life just a bit easier.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:23 PM
Response to Reply #75
85. The police report does not say that Gates threatened the cop, though. And you can bet it
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 06:28 PM by No Elephants
would be in the report if Gates had done that.

By the time that officer wrote that report, he knew who Gates was. And he knew he'd better make that report as good as he possibly could. And it's still both lame and fishy.

Interesting that you are making up stuff that is not even in the police report.

How many times do people get arrested rightfully for disorderly conduct that consists of asking an officer who is in the home for his name and badge number? The report does not even mention Gates being loud until he was outside, and, by that time, he was cuffed.
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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #85
93. My response was to the poster who said you should be able to say anything
to the police. Read the upstream post, you may want to correct your post.
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DesertDiamond Donating Member (838 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:01 PM
Response to Reply #93
100. Point taken. So actual verbal threats, I would agree. However, in my view the definition of "threat"
has been extended in some cases to mean "threat to my feeling I should be treated as a person of power and authority." Beyond assaults or threats, police and citizen are equals, but we do have some cops out there who don't see it that way.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:21 PM
Response to Reply #49
106. It's pretty plain that this cop did not like the professor's "tone."
And that's the cop's problem. A big problem, now, I suspect.
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superconnected Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:14 PM
Response to Reply #6
168. have you missed the part where gates is going to make money from the publicity for this?
I see you absolutely missed the part where he provoked this to happen.

He's making a documentary on racial profiling. Hello. Break into his own house, refuse to show id, cause a stir with the cops then finally show it, and then announce now that this happens he'll make a documentary. Sorry, he's in it for the money, you are a sucker, and the white people see the problem because we know even being white the behavior isn't right and would get us arrested. I don't doubt I'd be arrested if I did what he did.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #168
172. I gotta edit my post--you were being sarcastic, yes?
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 09:29 PM by MADem
I was pointing out how rich he was, but I'm hoping that your post was sarcastic.

He owns a good sized home in pricy Cambridge. He vacations on the VINEYARD...where he has a second HOME.

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fishwax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 12:21 AM
Response to Reply #168
193. wow. Are you serious?
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:03 PM
Response to Reply #2
38. Unfuckingbelievable.
I keep staring at this picture and it just keeps getting more wrong.
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timeforpeace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 03:49 PM
Response to Original message
3. Did he get an apology, and/or an explanation?
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BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 03:51 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Pfft. White folks don't apologize to black folks. We just yell at them for being "tumultuous"....
Get with the program.
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timeforpeace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:06 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. Anyone else know if he got an apology, and/or an explanation?
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JonLP24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:14 PM
Response to Reply #7
13. Here is the PD statement to the press
uly 21 (Bloomberg) -- Police in Cambridge, Massachusetts, dropped a disorderly conduct charge against Harvard University African American studies professor Henry Louis Gates Jr., calling his arrest last week regrettable and unfortunate.

This incident should not be viewed as one that demeans the character and reputation of Professor Gates or the character of the Cambridge Police Department,
said a statement today issued jointly by Gates, the police, the city of Cambridge and the Middlesex County district attorney. All parties agree that this is a just resolution to an unfortunate set of circumstances.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=a0H...

It is not clear if they personally apologized to him.
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timeforpeace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:31 PM
Response to Reply #13
21. Thanks.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:20 PM
Response to Reply #13
84. The officer has not apologized. Gates has asked for an apology.
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timeforpeace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:50 PM
Response to Reply #84
114. The officer should apologize.
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 03:53 PM
Response to Original message
5. GOOO SKIP!!!
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 04:24 PM by Karenina
Methinks some serious officer training may come out of all this. So much has run amok with the militarization of the police force.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:08 PM
Response to Original message
8. Deleted sub-thread
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Commie Pinko Dirtbag Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:11 PM
Response to Original message
10. Wait, I remember something. Is he one of the "senseis" in this Linux ad?
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 04:12 PM by Commie Pinko Dirtbag
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TreasonousBastard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:12 PM
Response to Original message
11. Of course he is, but the real problem..
is that everyone talking about this...

WASN'T THERE!

Was the cop an obnoxious asshole? maybe

Did Gates fly off the handle? maybe

I can understand a cop being an asshole, and I can understand a guy getting hassled by a stuck door and an ignorant cop after an 18 hour plane ride blowing his stack at the last straw.

But, the thing is that I wasn't there, so I have no idea whether the cop was a complete asshole and Gates was meek as a lamb dealing with him, or Gates blew up at him from the getgo.

It's he said vs he said, and everyone's taking sides according to their own biases.

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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:19 PM
Response to Reply #11
16. I posted this last night, and it is simple. "Don't hassle a cop that is responding

to a call. It is your duty to comply with their request.

1) Don't yell at them.

2) Don't touch them.

3) Let them do their job.


If they mess with you after all of the above then you can file charges and see if that floats.
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timeforpeace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:34 PM
Response to Reply #16
23. If that photo above is any indication, he didn't take your advice.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:31 PM
Response to Reply #23
88. Um, he's already cuffed in that photo. And you don't know what, if anything, he is saying
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 06:34 PM by No Elephants
or how loudly he is saying it (or to whom), from a photo. He could have been saying ow. Or asking a neighbor to call Ogletree. So, what advice are you implying he failed to take?
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Demoiselle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #16
27. That's sensible advice, I guess....but
it occurs to me that your list presupposes that police must be treated with kid gloves because they not really rational.
I know, I know that their jobs bring them into possible harm's way on a fairly frequent basis, and that would certainly make ME nervous very wary and maybe a little weird. I couldn't do the work that police do and I'm grateful to them for doing their jobs. Still....it seems to me that your advice presupposes that any cop we come across might, in fact, be a time bomb. Or at least, stubbornly incapable of common sense observation.

I'm still getting over the story of the young woman who was cut off by the 9-11 contact because, in her panic and frustration, she used an obscenity.

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ieoeja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #27
48. You hit on a good point there. Cops seem to be the biggest pussies in the world.

Okay, I shouldn't have called them pussies. Because most women I know don't get their feelings hurt as easily as cops do. So the comparison was an insult to everyone with a vagina.

I spend a lot of time around cops. On just about any given night I will hurt their feelings. Usually, I at least know I'm going to upset them even if I know their upset is unjustified. But a lot of times I don't have a clue what I said to get them all riled up. The most innocuous comment can set them off.


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ieoeja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #16
40. I can yell at them all I want.

It's one thing to suggest yelling at cops is stupid. But if a cop abuses his power and arrests someone for that, then they are wrong both morally and legally. You may never be able to prove it legally, which is what makes it stupid. But the cop is still wrong.

Do you agree? Because the tenor of your posts sound like you are perfectly happy with bad cops.


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Iowa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:04 PM
Response to Reply #16
72. Bullshit.
It depends on what they're doing.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:39 PM
Response to Reply #16
92. Gates did comply with the request. No evidence, even in the police report,
that he raised his voice until after he was cuffed. No evidence, even in the police report that he touched the cop. He did not interfere with their doing their job, not one whit.
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Piewhacket Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 10:47 PM
Response to Reply #16
188. Nonsense. Where do you get these crazy ideas.
There is no duty to comply with a REQUEST of a police officer.
Where did you get such an idea? Perhaps from some police officer training school
where they teach you just enough to get you sued for falsely arresting
someone for failing to follow your bad financial advice? Just asking.

Of course NONE of your post has ANYTHING to do with the case at hand, since Gates
neither refused any order nor interfered with any police officer except to
ask him for his badge, which might have annoyed the officers little feelings. Awww.

AFTER THE OFFICER DETERMINED THE CALL WAS A FALSE ALARM and there was no reason to
continue the officer provoked Gates into stepping onto his porch where he fabricated
a pretext to arrest him.

So let that be a lesson not to step out onto the porch when an officer "requests" it,
huh?

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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 11:05 PM
Response to Reply #188
189. Full marks--right on the money!
:thumbsup:
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:31 PM
Response to Reply #11
20. From the reports I have seen, he was not meek as a lamb, but so what?
They knew who he was. He gave them his Harvard ID. They knew whose house it was, too.

They didn't arrest him for B and E. They arrested him for being "disorderly" because he was giving them a bit of shit.

They should have responded as I suggested elsewhere in this thread. They would have made a friend instead of an enemy.

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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:36 PM
Response to Reply #20
26. Well, this is a life lesson for you. Don't give shit to the Cambridge police.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #26
30. Yeah, otherwise they'll have to go to more sensitivity training, which is in their future. NT
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:03 PM
Response to Reply #30
39. Perhaps...
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #39
51. Probable. The mayor plans on apologizing personally, and has asked for a full investigation
into the matter.

See the video in this link: http://www.boston.com/news/local/breaking_news/2009/07/...
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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:56 PM
Response to Reply #51
64. Christ, the cop apologista NEVER gets it, does it? n/t
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:33 PM
Response to Reply #64
89. I guess not.
I actually have a lot of respect for many police officers. It's a tough job. However, it is a job where the officer is required to deal with the public--a "customer service" position, if you will, in addition to the "protect and serve" aspect.

It bothers me when a lousy, impatient, and perhaps even incompetent cop doesn't have the self-control to do the job properly. That person makes the good police look bad, and that's a shame.

There's just no reason to make excuses for shitty policing. The Cambridge Police and the city got the bubble pretty quick--they shut this shit down because they knew their officer overreached and behaved badly. The minute they understood that a) The house belonged to the Professor; b) The man standing before them WAS the Professor, that should have been it. "Sorry to have bothered you, we got a report that your house was being burglarized, have a nice night" would have done it. "Can we help you close your door while you wait for maintenance" would have been A-Plus "community relations."
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:51 PM
Response to Reply #89
115. For one who has respect for the police you seem sho ready to lynch one.

Yeah, yeah I know. It's tough being so right as you are.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:58 PM
Response to Reply #115
120. Nice use of language, there. "Lynch?" That couldn't have been accidental or incidental, now could
it?

I hold people accountable for their behavior. You, apparently, do not. You believe that some people (cops) are more equal than others (black homeowners), is that it?
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:06 PM
Response to Reply #120
125. I chose my words carefully to illustrate a point.

It is the common knee-jerk reaction to scream holy hell before all the facts are in and be judge jury and executioner.


Take a bow, MADem.


One more question. Were you there? I know I sure wasn't.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:31 PM
Response to Reply #125
138. You chose your words carefully in an effort to be a board disruptor.
You're doing a fair job of it, too. Keep it up. I hope everyone gets a good look at you.

One more time--since you weren't there, and by your measure, only people who were there should have anything to say about this, perhaps you'd better hew to your own standard and remain silent. You certainly haven't had a single constructive sentence in this entire thread.
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #138
146. Please, everybody look at me.

I'm not a disruptor, MADem. I'm also not doing the knee-jerk reaction that any in this thread are.


Were you there?
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:43 PM
Response to Reply #146
152. I was there to hear the mayor, the AG and others say that this was a
bad effort on the part of the Cambridge PD. I was there to hear the professor's side, and the cops. Right on my magic box called a television set.

I'm a local, see?

But hey--you weren't there, so why are you commenting? By your very standard, you need to just zip it, Skippy. Why? You weren't there.
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:57 PM
Response to Reply #152
158. Maybe you think I should move out of state as well?

:shrug:
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:02 PM
Response to Reply #158
162. I think you should take your own advice. NT
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:08 PM
Response to Reply #162
165. Well, I won't be doing that anytime soon.
Too bad, you're stuck with me. ;)
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:49 PM
Response to Reply #64
113. I am neither a cop or Professor apologista...

My, my. I love how the DUers love to jump to conclusions. :)
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:42 PM
Response to Reply #26
95. Not really. There's no evidence he gave them "shit" before they cuffed him.
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 06:44 PM by No Elephants
He asked for a name and badge number, That is his right. The officer kept telling him to step outside his won home, which Gates had no obligation to do. And as soon as he did step outside, the officer cuffed him. That's when the police report says Gates was yelling, but Gates's attorney did not say Gates was yelling. So take your pick.
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:00 PM
Response to Reply #95
123. There seems to be a small misunderstanding that

instead of trying to butt heads with the police you should make their departure that much more hasty by helping them complete their business and being on their way.

This just seems like a lesson lost on some people here.



Flame away.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #123
157. This guy HAD completed his business as soon as he saw two forms of ID.
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 08:56 PM by No Elephants
At that point, Mr. Cop should have left. Instead, he called the Harvard University Police. He was not about to leave.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:36 PM
Response to Reply #20
90. How many reports did you see? By whom were they written? Did you see Gates'side,
as contained in the statement his lawyer gave the media?
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:55 PM
Response to Reply #90
98. He admits he yelled (as much as he was able) once. He had bronchitis at the time.
He said so in an interview by telephone from his home in the Vineyard today.

He disputes the cop's version of events on a number of other levels, though.

My point remains--it's not against the law to yell at a cop. Or anyone.

Why don't you try reading all of the comments I have contributed to this thread, and reading all of the links I have offered.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:35 PM
Response to Reply #98
110. When I read a thread, I hit View All and read top to bottom, responding as I go. We'll both have
to live with that method, until I decide to change it.

If he admits raising his voice once, then he raised it once. But the point at which he raised it is quite relevant.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:44 PM
Response to Reply #110
112. My point remains that it doesn't matter if he conducted the entire conversation
at high C with Ethel Merman's decibel level--the cop overstepped.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #112
159. I understand your point. But he did not do that, so why make it sound worse than it was?
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:10 PM
Response to Reply #159
166. Who is "making it sound worse?" What's worse is that the police officer
behaved in an unprofessional manner.

I have argued throughout this thread from the CONDITIONAL. "IF" he was loud, "IF" he was argumentative, "IF" he challenged the police officer....and my point has remained, throughout, that it doesn't matter "IF" he did any of those things.

Speaking sharply to a cop isn't against the law. Speaking LOUDLY to a cop isn't against the law.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:30 PM
Response to Reply #166
174. Nope. Not against the law. But only the police report says that he yelled. he denies it, and he
denies it after the charges were dropped.

NOw, who has more incentive to lie, a cop who gets to the station and learns he has just messed with a very famous and beloved man, then goes to write up his report, or Professor Gates, after the charges have been dropped. Either they were both inappropriate--Gates only after things had gone way too far, or only the cop was inappropriate. It was never about Gates yelling at the cop from the jump. And I think that is important.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #174
176. He acknowledged that he raised his voice (as much as he was able--he had bronchitis)
when he spoke to the officer at one point. He said so.

But it still doesn't matter if he screamed every sentence he spoke. That wouldn't justify his arrest, either, see?

A key point here is that the Professor shouldn't have to "modulate his tone" and "speak sweetly" to make the cop go away.

See, the whole "yelling at the cop" thing IS part of the point. A big part, in fact. The cop wasn't given sufficient "deference" from Gates, and that's why he made it personal--see? It doesn't matter if it was "yelling," or mere "snippiness." The cop's ass wasn't kissed, and he didn't like that. That's why the old man was arrested.

He gave the cop two IDs, established himself as the owner of the property, and at that point the cop should have said "Sorry to have troubled you, Professor. We had a report of a break in here and responded as quickly as we could. Apparently a passer by saw you and your driver wrestling with the door and came to an incorrect conclusion. Have a nice day--and can we help you close that door until you can get it repaired?"

THAT was the right thing for the cop to say--not "You're under arrest."
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:17 PM
Response to Reply #98
170. From one of the links you gave:
. I was suffering from a bronchial infection. I couldnt have yelled. . . I dont walk around calling white people racist.

This is why I am asking what reports and who wrote them. We have Gates's story, both from GAtes and from his lawyer. We have the police report. We have the comments from the police department, written and oral. We have the comments of the mayor. Do we have any reports from anyone else? Like an eyewitness?
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 10:02 PM
Response to Reply #170
183. From the Globe article:
This afternoon in an interview, Gates said he never yelled at the officer other than to demand his name and badge number, which he said the officer refused to give.

Here's the short version of the sequence of events, from his lawyer: http://www.theroot.com/views/lawyers-statement-arrest-h...
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #11
22. The cop went the Alpha Male JACKASS route
when he did NOT leave an exhausted, irritated, slightly disabled old man IN PEACE after establishing his identification. No matter WHO he might be. Punkt. Feierabend.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:48 PM
Response to Reply #22
96. I would not character Gates as slightly disabled. He limps quite noticeably. He may or may not be
in pain. He had also picked up something in his lungs that gave him difficulty breathing. He may not may be able to get around without a wheelchair, but that is a lot of stuff to deal with.
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:24 PM
Response to Reply #96
107. I wonder if "WonderCop"
noticed the airline tags on Skip's bags. Is it too much to speculate that they would have been in the vicinity?
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #107
145. I'm guessing they were. He was on the phone with the maintenance company
about the door when the cops arrived.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:51 PM
Response to Reply #11
97. Because no one should ever post on a message board based on news stories and
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 06:53 PM by No Elephants
police reports unless the posters were actually there? Maybe that's true, but I don't recall that standard being set for many subjects here.

And many of us are quite familiar with Gates, either because of being in his class or having watching his many PBS series, or both. And we do not know him to be a belligerent man. To the contrary.
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TreasonousBastard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 12:16 AM
Response to Reply #97
192. Post all you want, even about things...
you don't know anything about. Can't stop anyone from posting from a state of extreme ignorance-- and far too many posts I've seen on the matter DO reflect personal prejudice, making assumptions not based on any verifiable facts. Some automatically blame the cop for being racist, or just a jerk because he's a cop, and some blame Gates for flying off the handle without provocation. And everyone is so cocksure they are right.

But, seems that's what internet boards are mostly about, and why they are taken so seriously.

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ellie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:15 PM
Response to Original message
14. I hope Mr. Gates
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 04:18 PM by ellie
sues the police department for all its worth.
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timeforpeace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:34 PM
Response to Reply #14
24. There can be no doubt he will do that.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #24
178. I don't think he will, actually.
He's a wealthy man. He doesn't need money. If he sued, he'd sue for a dollar and an apology, or he'd donate the money to a local charity.

The mayor of Cambridge is an Equality Movement Trifecta-- a black, gay woman. He'd be fucking her over if he sues her police department. He'd be taking money out of her already-strapped coffers, and forcing her to realign her budget.
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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #14
33. He would have to show damages..
the police not knowing you are special and letting you talk shit to them and refuse to identify yourself is not "damage"

Now if the police were actually out of line then he may get more than an apology.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:44 PM
Response to Reply #33
60. How special do you have to be to stand in your own home?
Let's run it down. He had ID, he had his house keys, his luggage was on the porch and his driver was there with a car. He was inside his home. He's an older guy with a cane.

Does that say burglary to you?
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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:09 PM
Response to Reply #60
76. The police can ask you to produce id
if you dont, you can be jailed. If they get a burglary call they can detain you, in your home, until they determine who is who.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #76
78. And he did. Two pieces of ID. They arrested him AFTER he provided it.
These responders had a hardon. That's what happened. Maybe they need a vacation.
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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:14 PM
Response to Reply #78
80. We shall see, if he filed out a false report
the officer is quite fucked. If he acted improperly he should be punished. If he decided not to take shit from a guy with a chip in his shoulder then he may have exercised bad judgement, but broken no law.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:19 PM
Response to Reply #80
83. I think what happens is these guys are out there too long
and they lose perspective. It's hard to blame them when they are moving targets every minute they're on the street.

But, there's something really wrong with the way the cop business is conducted in this joint. And it probably has something to do with not taking good enough care of trained officers. They probably need more time off, more therapy or training or something. What we're doing is not working.

I feel pretty lucky because the cops where I've landed have been excellent for the most part. But there are districts right here in town that are a horrible mess and the civilians that bump into it aren't famous and we never hear about the collateral damage.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:02 PM
Response to Reply #80
101. The police report says Gates provided two forms of ID. It also says that
the cop's response to that was to call the Harvard University Police.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:58 PM
Response to Reply #33
99. Spin much? Gates's problem is not the cop did not know Gates is special and
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 06:59 PM by No Elephants
you don't know that he said anything out of line. He showed two forms of photo ID, one of which showed he was a college professor. The cop's response was not, at that point, to say, well, obviously, you did not break in. Whoever called us was mistkaen. Sorry to have bothered you. Instead, at that point, the cop called in the Harvard University Police. Why? It's then that Gates seemed to have picked up a phone--in his own home--and asked the cop for his badge number and name.
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nolabear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:15 PM
Response to Original message
15. May I extend my apology, Mr. Gates (Dr. Gates?)
for the treatment you got at the hands of the police. We made them what they are. I hope somehow we can make them into something better. I get the fear factor; police do get shot. But this seems to have been sheer "can-get-away-with-it" racism. And I'm ashamed that that exists when the idea is "To protect and serve." EVERYBODY.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:08 PM
Response to Reply #15
103. I am not sure Professor Gates is going to read this thread. You could probably
reach him via Harvard University though, maybe even by email.
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wordpix2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:29 PM
Response to Original message
19. I was nearly arrested once for asking a DEP officer why he was asking for my ID
I had been standing near the shore up to my waist in a pond at a state park in a no swimming zone. I wasn't swimming, just standing and cooling off.

Some of these officers can be such jerks. And I'm white.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:05 PM
Response to Reply #19
102.  I think you may have taken "swimming" too literally. "No swumming" usually means don't go in.
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Panhandle Dem Donating Member (15 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 04:55 PM
Response to Original message
36. Considering we have only one side of the story I'll have to
go with instinct and experience. Having been a police officer, a police supervisor and a police administrator I am painfully familiar with this type of situation. This was a situation destined to go bad from the start. Just reading Gates explanation shows he had a chip on his shoulder.

What Gates fails to realize (or maybe he did realize it but saw the potential for a confrontation) is that the police were dispatched to his home and were responding to a burglary in progress call. This is a highly dangerous call for the responding officer and he was putting his life on the line to protect Gates property. So... the officer shows up and the drama begins.

In Gates own words, the police officer was on his porch asking him to come out. This is a way for the officer to remain in control of the situation and protect himself. He goes on to say that he "Instinctively" knew not to go out to meet the officer. What a load of crap. At that point he already had in his mind that he wasn't going to take direction from a lowly police officer. How dare the police show up to investigate a burglary called in by a neighbor. The fact that he would consider the officer asking for identification from him as some sort of affront is also ridiculous. How else would the officer know he was dealing with the home owner and not some slick talking burglar?

Of course Gates next logical step was to get angry and start demanding the officers badge number. I have been in that situation many times and the person demanding the information (badge number and name) was always trying to intimidate me with that ploy. In this case I have no doubt Gates was doing it for the same reason. Mind you, at that point the officer had only responded to a burglary, made contact with a subject who claimed to be the homeowner and asked for identification... What else should the officer have done?

Of course Gates tries to explain away that he was giving the officer grief by saying "I weigh 150 lbs and I'm 5'7". I'm going to give flack to a big white guy with a gun" YES! You are already giving flack to that "big white guy with a gun". So here we have the real problem. Gates had his mind made up that a big white guy was there not to investigate a burglary but instead to assault him for being black.

And then... the icing on the cake. Gates starts into the whole "your only doing this because I'm black". Now the situation went from the officer possibly being able to calm the guy down and talk some sense to him to completely hopeless. At that point the "big white guy with a gun" was fighting a losing battle.

This is where the officer made his fatal mistake. One thing I always tried to instill in my patrol officers was to never allow a situation to become personal. This one became personal. The officer became offended and decided to not take any more crap from Gates. So the officer went for the one charge that might stick which was a "disturbing the peace" charge where I come from and made the arrest. For that I fault the officer. He let it become personal.

As you can no doubt tell I am passionate about this. I have not posted much to this site but I read it every day. Many times in the past I have seen the police put down for the job they do and this time I felt I had to respond. I have been in the shoes of the officer and have had to deal with people like Gates. Gates has no problem demanding equal treatment for himself while he has already decided that the "big white guy with a gun" hates him for the color of his skin. Talk about a hypocrisy!

Anyway, at this point I am rambling so it's probably a good time to stop writing because the other thing I always told my officers was to never respond to something when you are mad. Guess we don't always take our own advice do we?
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:10 PM
Response to Reply #36
44. "This one became personal." And that's why the PD apologized.
As I have said, there's no law against being an ass. If, after they figured out via the Harvard ID card that this was the same Gates who owned the house, they should have said "Sorry to have troubled you, are you OK? Can we help you get that door closed until maintenance arrives?"

Instead, the cop--the guy with the gun--escalated the situation and showed the obstreperous old man who's boss. That guy with the gun needs retraining, at a minimum. He may not have the temperament to be a police officer at all. I think someone with a short fuse who arrests a querelous old man with a cane probably should be permanently assigned to the property room.

Being a police officer is most assuredly not an easy job. You will run into asshole "customers" and not infrequently, either. That does go with the job--and people who can't adapt to that reality and "let it roll off their back" need to find a new line of work. The guy who arrested this old man fucked up. Pretty flagrantly, too.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:35 PM
Response to Reply #36
55. What a pantload. Gates was in his own home, with ID, with his KEYS
and in the presence of his DRIVER. After identifying himself to the officer, that should have been that.

That he was arrested is an indication that it was the police that were behaving in an unprofessional manner. Not only that, but damage to his front door should have been looked at because it's a sign of attempted forced entry while he was away. And that got lost while these racist assholes had to throw their weight at an older, disabled, ill black man.

But nice try.
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Iowa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #36
77. I second what EFerrari said... "What a pantload". n/t
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:28 PM
Response to Reply #36
108. We don't have only one side. There was a police report. Bear in mind, too, that when
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 07:59 PM by No Elephants
the cop first arrives, Gates has no idea why he is there. The cop tells him. Gates shows him two forms of ID, with photo and address, his driver's license and his Harvard University Id. The cop does not let it end there, but chen calls the Harvard University police. Why? He should have stood down and left once it was obvious that he was dealting with a Harvard University professor who was in his own home.

It's then that Gates starts asking for the badge number and name, which Gates has a right to know, but the cop does not answer him.

And, yes, he is asking him to step out. But the man has done nothing wrong and does not feel comfortable stepping out. No law requires him to do so. In fact, no law required him to answer any questions at all, or show him any ID at all. And when he does step out, he gets cuffed.

We know a lot about Gates, his physical condition, his demeanor, his dealings with thousands and thousands of people all around the world. He is a gentle, respectful soul. He's never had an issue with anyone, except that his wiki says some African American groups think he's too moderate.

And this older, disabled man started this incident by being belligerent for no apparent reason? I doubt it. Calling the Harvard University police was over the top. NOt leaving after being shown two forms of ID was over the top.

Sorry, I have seen cops be jerks, just because they can be. I have also been an up close witness to cops beating a guy for raising his voice, including knneeing his spine and kicking him in the head. So I know cops are brave and often face danger. And I appreciate that, but I know they can be jerks, too.

Did Gates feel unjustly harassed after the Harvard U police were called and raise his voice? In his own home? Maybe, but that is not a reason to arrest anyone.

Was this cop a a jerk? Sure seems like it. Was he a racist jerk, too? I don't know. But I think he was probably a jerk, and more of a jerk than Gates was being.

Om edit: The other information we have is from the Police Department. They did not find the officer blameless, and, as your own post indicates, they are usually on the side of the officer.

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Piewhacket Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:31 PM
Response to Reply #108
137. I think you got it pretty much right No Elephants.
A request for id was, under the circumstances, reasonable.
A reasonable person might have asked why, then complied.

But then having satisfied himself of the identity of the owner in
possession, and no indication of impropriety, the officer
should have courteously identified himself then left...
he might have got a commendation from Gates for that
professional level of service... but alas he didn't leave.

The conduct of the officer beyond that point could have been
unlawful police harassment, and the arrest preemptive and retaliatory.

The "joint statement" of the police (police spokesperson Keanes?)
criticizing Gates, and later defending the officer concerning
this incident was quite inflammatory, contradicted by even the police
version of events, and was very ill advised.

I was moderate on this issue before the police statement. Now
some heads on the city and police department, possibly the commissioner
himself (Haas?), should now roll.

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Gormy Cuss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-23-09 10:24 AM
Response to Reply #36
214. I'm sorry, but this is a good description of how poorly we train law enforcement.
C'mon now. Gates is a middle-aged professorial type living a stone's throw from Harvard yard. If the cop arrived to find a middle-aged white guy wearing a bow tie and a tweed jacket the cop would have moved along after seeing ID even if the professor was ranting at him. The cop would recognize that messing around with someone with the power and privilege associated with that affiliation was too much trouble.

For the record, I lived and worked in that area for years. I've seen the deference accorded to Harvard types by Cambridge cops.
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MicaelS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:25 PM
Response to Original message
50. Plenty of blame to go around
Both on Gates' part and on the cops. Everyone concerned acted like an ass. It was news because Gates is famous. If he was not, this would have never made the news.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #50
52. You have no idea how he behaved, do you?
This is a man with ID who let himself into his back door with keys and was examining damage to his front door, with his lugggage on the porch and in the presence of his driver.

How you get "ass" from that and not "idiot cops" is beyond me.
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MicaelS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:51 PM
Response to Reply #52
61. Sure I do, the words from his mouth at the link
Which you must have not read.

Before he could finish the conversation, a police officer was standing on his porch and asking him to come out of the house.

"Instinctively, I knew I was not to step outside," Gates said, describing the officer's tone as threatening. Gates said the policeman, who was in his 30s and several inches taller than him, followed him into his kitchen where Gates retrieved his identification

"I was thinking, this is ridiculous, but I'm going to show him my ID, and this guy is going to get out of my house," Gates said. "This guy had this whole narrative in his head. Black guy breaking and entering."

After handing the officer both his Harvard and Massachusetts state identification, which included his address, Gates said he began to ask the officer this question, repeatedly. "I said 'Who are you? I want your name and badge number.' I got angry."

According to Gates' account, the officer refused to give it. The police report says, however, that the officer identified himself.


"I got angry."

Getting angry with the cops on the scene is a very bad idea. They have the badge and the guns and sworn powers of arrest. His anger fed their anger, which fed his anger, which fed their anger..... repeat as many times as you wish.

The driver had LEFT.

Gates described his driver, whose car service Gates uses regularly, as a large, Moroccan man. The driver brought Gates's three bags to the front door, but when the professor tried to turn the lock, it would not budge. After going around and unlocking the rear door, Gates returned to the front, which still would not open.

"I thought it had been latched from the inside by my secretary who comes to get the mail," Gates said, "but the lock had been tampered with. I said, 'Let's just push it.'"

He was wearing a blue blazer and leather shoes, he said. The driver, dressed in a black uniform, began to lean his shoulder into the door to try to force it open. They pushed for 15 minutes and got the door free. The driver then left. Gates said he would later find out that a neighbor called to report two black men wearing backpacks were breaking into his house.


So cops rolled on a burglary call looking for TWO black men, not one. One was all they saw, they were probably thinking "OK where's the second one?" They were on edge because cops have been killed on burglary calls.

I'm not excusing what the cops did, they overreacted, but I'm not going to excuse Gates' behavior either, he overreacted, too. That's my opinion, yours may differ.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:55 PM
Response to Reply #61
63. Okay, the driver left. That still leaves you with an older black guy
with a cane, luggage, keys to the house and ID.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #61
175. A mistake to get angry with cops "on the scene?" On the scene of what? Professor Gates
lawful return to his own home from China?

Getting angry is not a mistake. It's an emotion. People have them, usually unbidden. Acting on the anger would have been a mistake. But Gates said he did not do that. You're saying it was a mistake for Dr. Gates to have an emotion.

You wanna think about that?
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tj2001 Donating Member (685 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #50
54. If Gates was not famous, he'd be begging for mercy from the D.A.
cuz a police report is the word of God as we know it
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #50
59. Maybe not. Gates is disputing the cop's assertions. He also said he had bronchitis at the time, so
he wasn't doing much in the way of yelling. http://www.boston.com/news/local/breaking_news/2009/07/...



Gates accused the officer who arrested him at his Cambridge home of having a "broad imagination" when he summarized last Thursday's confrontation in police reports, and he denied making several inflammatory remarks.

I believe the police officer should apologize to me for what he knows he did that was wrong, Gates said in a phone interview from his other home in Marthas Vineyard. If he apologizes sincerely, I am willing to forgive him. And if he admits his error, I am willing to educate him about the history of racism in America and the issue of racial profiling Thats what I do for a living.. . . .This afternoon in an interview, Gates said he never yelled at the officer other than to demand his name and badge number, which he said the officer refused to give. The officer, Sergeant James Crowley, said in the police report that he did state his name. He also said Gates unleashed a verbal tirade, calling him racist, telling him that he did not know who he was messing with, and threatening to speak to his mama outside.

The police report is full of this mans broad imagination, Gates said in response to a question on whether he had said any of the quotes in the report. I said, Are you not giving me your name and badge number because Im a black man in America? . . . He treated my request with scorn. . . I was suffering from a bronchial infection. I couldnt have yelled. . . I dont walk around calling white people racist.

Gates continued, Im outraged. I shouldnt have been treated this way but it makes me so keenly aware of how many people every day experience abuses in the criminal justice system ... No citizen should tolerate that kind of poor behavior by an officer of the law. . . This is really about justice for the least amongst us.

Because of his arrest, Gates said he plans to make racial profiling and prison reform central intellectual and political issues he wants to explore. Hes also considering a new documentary on racial profiling.

Because of the capricious whim of one disturbed person . . . I am now a black man with a prison record, Gates said. You can look at my mug shot on the Internet.




That aside, the only "blame" to go around belongs to the idiot who cuffed and arrested this Professor. It's simply not against the law to be a jerk. If it were, the prisons would be ten to a cell!

They knew who he was, they knew it was his house, and they knew he was irritated.

"Sorry to have bothered you, we got a report of a break-in here. Hope you can get that door fixed--would you like us to help you get it closed until you can get it mended?" would have been a a great "community relations" move.

Read this. It's instructive: http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=10...

As an anecdotal aside, I can't believe the officer's name is Jim Crowley. If you wrote that in a novel, people would call it a lame device.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:11 PM
Response to Reply #59
129. "threatening" to speak to his mama outside? That's a threat? Even if true, that's a threat?
:rofl:

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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:34 PM
Response to Reply #129
141. The dialogue almost sounds like caricature. I'm wondering if Officer
Jim Crowley has been watching a little too much "Sanford and Son" on the tee vee.
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Panhandle Dem Donating Member (15 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:53 PM
Response to Original message
62. No, they apologized because they didn't have the balls to stand
up to a bigot! The charge was legit. His being obstreperous (wow, big word) has nothing to do with my argument. Although, being obstreperous was enough to support the misdemeanor charge against Gates.

Please remember, not every cop is a jack booted thug. Try not to paint them all with the same broad brush the way Gates did.
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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #62
66. Nice try, but that's a fail.
All charges dropped. Because the cops were wrong, and they know it.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #62
68. LOL
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Iowa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:15 PM
Response to Reply #62
81. What a load of crap. n/t
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Piewhacket Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:25 PM
Response to Reply #62
86. Welcome to DU "Panhandle Dem". Now for your initiation...
first, every cop IS a jack-booted thug, its what they do, its what they are.
Glad to straighten you out on that, because its unwise of DUer's to go through
life in such a clueless state, assuming you intend to continue as a DUer.

Obstreperousness is not a crime, in case you were wondering. If it were, you
would likely be cooling your heels in the tank even now, don't you think?

Additionally, after reviewing the articles AND the excerpts from a less than
impressive police report what is CRYSTAL CLEAR is that the arrest was
improper. CRYSTAL CLEAR. Thats why the charges were dropped. Because they were not
going to stand up, and the celebrity of the case would have further
humiliated and discredited the Cambridge police department.

The commissioner no doubt appreciates that a police department in which
the officer are not believed is completely worthless.

I do not think this rises to the level of a crime, but kidnapping and
false imprisonment are both felonies, in case you were wondering, and
police are not immune, and yes we Califonians send police to prison every
day for such things. It is rare, we hope, but no one is above the law.
Whether the impropriety rises to the level of a civil rights case is
up to Gates and his attorney. But at minimum some discipline and
retraining of officers and their tactics appears appropriate.

In any event, police officer everywhere should be decrying this level
of police stupidity unless the level of stupidity is so advanced that
they have no remaining ability to comprehension of it. For if they
think criminals are a danger to them, let them more carefully reflect
on how dangerous a criminal jury which doesn't believe them can be.

Happy to straighten a fellow DUer out on these things. Welcome to DU.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:37 PM
Response to Reply #62
91. A bigot, eh? Oh really? You don't know a thing about the City of Cambridge.
This isn't over, FWIW. The cop may have fudged some of his report. It's being disputed.

And sorry, being obstreperous is not against the law. Try again--or don't.
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fishwax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:20 PM
Response to Reply #62
105. lol
:eyes:
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fishwax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:30 PM
Response to Reply #62
109. Gates didn't do any such thing
You're just making shit up.
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 06:33 PM
Response to Reply #62
206. it's good you are in the pan handle
stay there
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Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 05:57 PM
Response to Original message
65. No shit, Dr. Gates! Where you been?? Oh, I know, tracing
the geneology of celebrities. Now that you've become a 'statistic,' however, the disproportionate number of minority incarcerations suddenly becomes a matter of urgency. Hmmmmmm.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #65
69. He used celebrities because they brought attention to the project.
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 06:02 PM by EFerrari
Seriously, what is that matter with you? Henry Louis Gates has done more for this country than a hundred other people.

Read something. Soon.
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Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #69
87. There is nothing 'the matter with me.' I am well aware of the
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 06:29 PM by Fire1
literary and cultural contributions of the esteemed Dr. Gates, thank you very much. As professor, dept. chair, historian, editor-in-chief, cultural critic and serving on numerous prestigious boards. I am not familiar, however, with any specific contributions he has made to this 'country' nor was that even addressed in my post.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:15 PM
Response to Reply #87
104. Dr. Gates has been more effective than anyone else to date
in restoring lost history which is an inestimable step in repairing this trainwreck that is post-slavery America.

For that alone, he will eventually get his own holiday.

from Wiki:

Gates has been the recipient of nearly 50 honorary degrees and numerous academic and social action awards. He was named a MacArthur Fellow in 1981 and was listed in Time among its 25 Most Influential Americans in 1997. On October 23, 2006, Gates was appointed the Alphonse Fletcher Jr. University Professor at Harvard University. In January 2008, he co-founded The Root, a website dedicated to African-American perspectives published by The Washington Post Company. Gates currently chairs the Fletcher Foundation, and is a member of the Council on Foreign Relations. He is on the boards of many notable institutions including the New York Public Library, Jazz at Lincoln Center, the Aspen Institute, the Brookings Institution, the Studio Museum of Harlem, the NAACP Legal Defense Fund, HEAF (the Harlem Educational Activities Fund), and the Center for Advanced Study in the Behavioral Sciences, located in Stanford, California.<2>

In 2002 the National Endowment for the Humanities selected Gates for the Jefferson Lecture, the U.S. federal government's highest honor for achievement in the humanities.<12> Gates' lecture was entitled "Mister Jefferson and the Trials of Phillis Wheatley"<13> and was the basis for his book The Trials of Phillis Wheatley.<14>

In 2006, Gates was inducted into the Sons of the American Revolution after he traced his lineage back to John Redman, a Free Negro who fought in the Revolutionary War.<15>

The popular Harvard-area burger restaurant, Mr. Bartley's Burger Cottage, sells a Professor Skip Gates burger topped with pineapple and teriyaki sauce.

Works

Bibliography

Books (author)

* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr. (1987). Figures in Black: Words, Signs, and the "Racial" Self (First edition ed.). New York: Oxford University Press. ISBN 019503564X.
* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr. (1988). The Signifying Monkey (First edition ed.). New York: Oxford University Press. ISBN 0195034635. American Book Award
* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr. (1992). Loose Canons: Notes on the Culture Wars (First edition ed.). New York: Oxford University Press. ISBN 0195075196.
* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr. (1994). Colored People: A Memoir (First edition ed.). New York: Alfred A. Knopf. ISBN 0679421793.
* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr.; Cornel West (1996). The Future of the Race (First edition ed.). New York: Alfred A. Knopf. ISBN 067944405X.
* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr.; McKay, Nellie Y. The Norton Anthology of African American Literature (First edition ed.). W. W. Norton. ISBN 0393040011.
* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr. (1997). Thirteen Ways of Looking at a Black Man (First edition ed.). New York: Random House. ISBN 0679457135.
* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr. (1999). Wonders of the African World (First edition ed.). New York: Alfred A. Knopf. ISBN 0375402357.
* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr. (2000). The African American Century: How Black Americans Have Shaped Our Century (First edition ed.). New York: Free Press. ISBN 0684864142.
* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr. (2003). The trials of Phillis Wheatley: America's first Black poet and her encounters with the founding fathers. New York: Basic Civitas Books. ISBN 0465027296.
* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr. (2007). Finding Oprah's Roots: Finding Your Own (First edition ed.). New York: Crown. ISBN 9780307382382.

Books (editor)

* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr. (1999). Africana: The Encyclopedia of the African and African American Experience (First edition ed.). New York: Basic Civitas Books. ISBN 0465000711.
* Crafts, Hannah; Gates, Henry Louis, Jr. (2002). The Bondwoman's Narrative (First edition ed.). New York: Warner Books. ISBN 0446690295.
* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr. and Hollis Robbins. (2004) Searching for Hannah Crafts: Essays in the Bondwoman's Narrative. New York: Basic/Civitas. ISBN 0465027148
* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr. (2008) The African American national biography, New York, NY : Oxford Univ. Press, ISBN 9780195160192
* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr.; Yacovone, Donald (2009). Lincoln on Race and Slavery. Princeton, NJ: Princeton University Press. ISBN 9780691142340.

Articles

* Gates, Henry Louis, Jr. (1 December 2008). "Personal History: Family Matters". The New Yorker 84 (39): 34-38. Abstract and related family history materials.

Filmography

* From Great Zimbabwe to Kilimatinde, BBC/PBS, Great Rail Journeys, Narrator and Screenwriter, BBC/PBS, 1996.
* The Two Nations of Black America, Host and Scriptwriter, Frontline, WGBH-TV, February 11, 1998.
* Leaving Eldridge Cleaver, WGBH, 1999
* Wonders of the African World, PBS, October 25-27, 1999 (six-part series) (Shown as Into Africa on BBC-2 in the United Kingdom and South Africa, Summer, 1999)
* America Beyond the Color Line, Host and Scriptwriter, (four part series) PBS, 2004.
* African American Lives, Host and Narrator, PBS, February 2006
* African American Lives 2, Host and Narrator, PBS, February 2008
* Looking For Lincoln, Host and Narrator, PBS, February 2009

* * *

To trivialize his work as some kind of celebrity parlor game is simply sad.
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Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:29 PM
Response to Reply #104
136. Again, his accomplishments, personal, academic, literary
and otherwise was never up for debate. If his work has been trivialized, he managed that himself by marketing for his own personal gain. As for reparation of this post slavery 'train wreck,' there are many esteemed and learned scholars in the world of academia and the arts who have contributed as much. Dr. Alvin Poussaint, Dr. William Cosby, Dr. Maya Angelou and Toni Morrison, to name a few. His own holiday? Don't bet the farm.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:34 PM
Response to Reply #136
142. LOL. Now he's wrong for making a living?
There is no low too low.

And as important as all the figures you name are, they haven't done half as much as he has. And please, Bill Cosby is a reactionary idiot who doesn't belong on that list.
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Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:40 PM
Response to Reply #142
148. You have your opinion and I have mine. The essence of
debate. I'm not challenging you on your opinion nor trying to convince you, otherwise.
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 10:00 PM
Response to Reply #136
181. Marketing for his own personal gain? LOL. what is he supposed to do,
researh and write only for himself? Not share what he learns? Not use a station like PBS to make very valuable points about what slavery did to people? How just learning what a freed ancestor's name was reduced people to tears?
Seeing that does not make a powerful point with a wise audience (assuming they're not brain dead?)
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Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 10:36 PM
Response to Reply #181
187. In THIS instance he is an opportunist. As long as racial
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 10:38 PM by Fire1
profiling has been in existence, as well as, disproportionate minority male incarcerations, now he decides to add this to his dossier? Documentaries are all well and good for those who choose to see it. Activism and community relations is the beginning of change in policy and stereotype and puts the issue before the masses. Not for profit but for the common good.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 01:10 AM
Response to Reply #187
194. Gates singlehandedly made WEB DuBois's dream
of an encyclopedia devoted to black history come true.

And that's just ONE of his accomplishments.

You apparently don't know the common good when it's staring you in the face. Holy cow.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 10:24 AM
Response to Reply #194
196. Deleted sub-thread
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:41 PM
Response to Reply #87
111. Because literary and cultural contributions and teaching and being a historian,
etc. is not a contribution to this country? LOL.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:53 PM
Response to Reply #111
117. I don't believe the stuff I read here.
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 07:54 PM by EFerrari
Just his work on the Encyclopedia Africana alone should get him a Nobel prize. The man doesn't stop and his ideas are always big, multi-dimensional and spot on. I cut my critical teeth on Signifying Monkey and even though I didn't agree with him at every point, it was fresh air in a stagnant, self-absorbed community.

I guess unless you're shooting at brown people, your achievements don't mean much. :sarcasm:
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #117
126. But what contribution have you made to England besides writing,
Mr. Shakespeare?

But what contribution have you made to Rome besides your little biographies and histories, Plutarch?

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:11 PM
Response to Reply #126
130. LOL. I heard that Herodotus guy has a huge ego.
:rofl:
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Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #111
144. Cultural contributions, certainly. n/t
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mix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #65
134. fail
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Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:31 PM
Response to Reply #134
139. 'fail' with no explanation, means nothing. n/t
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mix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:34 PM
Response to Reply #139
143. FAIL is a BRAND, --it is not meant to enlighten you.
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Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:43 PM
Response to Reply #143
151. Aka name calling. Gotcha. n/t
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mix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:53 PM
Response to Reply #151
155. No, you are simply not worth arguing with, given the extremeness and ignorance
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 09:00 PM by mix
of your statements. FAIL must on occasion be used. This was such an occasion.
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Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:54 PM
Response to Reply #155
156. The feeling is mutual. n/t
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Moochy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 10:32 AM
Response to Reply #156
197. the feeling is
fail
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Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 10:44 AM
Response to Reply #197
199. And it's mutual. n/t
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Bankhead_ATL Donating Member (248 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 06:05 PM
Response to Original message
73. I hope he got a wake call for this
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mix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 08:21 PM
Response to Reply #73
133. Who? And why do you hope such a thing?
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Bankhead_ATL Donating Member (248 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #133
171. no he said that black men need to not blame everything on the police
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mix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 07:59 PM
Response to Original message
121. I do not understand people who reflexively side with cops,
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 08:17 PM by mix
and immediately assume that being arrested means being guilty of some transgression, especially when race is involved. The Boston police department, along with Chicago's and LA's--and in spite of black officers serving--are bastions of institutional racism towards African-Americans. The Cambridge police department, whose officers arrested Gates, is clearly little different. Given the history of such institutions and the ongoing oppression of black men and women in America (look at our prison population), to side with such absolute certainty with the cops is reactionary and vile.

Shame is all I can say.
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:16 PM
Response to Reply #121
169. You see, I am not really siding with the cops inasmuch as shaking my head

at the knee-jerk reactions of some DUers here.


IF the professor started an argument with the police then it was dumb.

IF the police wrongly arrested the professor then it is even dumber.


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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:49 PM
Response to Reply #169
179. AT MOST, Gates got angry after the cop failed to leave when ID was presente.
Edited on Tue Jul-21-09 09:50 PM by No Elephants
And that is if you believe the police report. If you believe Gates, he never yelled or called anyone a racist, just asked or a name and badge number.

What the cop did wrong was fail to leave after he had been shown two forms of photo ID. The man was in his own house. No breaking and enteering had occurred. That should have been it. Case closed. Good night, Prof. Gates.

But the cop wasn't about to let that be it. And he called the Harvard U. Police. And that is when things fell apart.
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Moochy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 10:34 AM
Response to Reply #169
198. Ah so just a run-of-the-mill contrarian
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MUAD_DIB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 01:56 PM
Response to Reply #198
202. Nope. Whereas I like to have the facts before I come to a conclusion
the knee-jerk DUers are ready for a hanging.


And that is the painful truth...
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Moochy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 09:28 PM
Response to Reply #202
207. No, its quite the opposite from the truth
No one in this thread is "ready for a hanging" unless I've ignored them, and I can't tell.

But, do, carry on mis-characterizing your fellow DU'ers, since any and all evidence fits your narrative about DUers being "ready for a hanging" and "anti-cop".
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NashVegas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-23-09 10:47 AM
Response to Reply #202
215. Sadly
Yeah. In most of these stories, there are two assholes, but it's the cop who has the ability to push it to extremes, and often does.

That said, most DUers on these threads refuse to consider the possibility that people who get into arguments with police - when there are more productive outcomes that could be had via compromise - put others at risk by pointlessly wasting cops' time and attention.

Yeah, they're public servants but it's my tax dollars too, and, if you don't mind, I think my money is better spent on chasing bad guys than getting into arguments with a nude wizard who refuses to put his clothes back on at a public event. So put your pants on, asshole.
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superconnected Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:11 PM
Response to Original message
167. Somehow I doubt he decided on the documentary _after_this. And so soooon!
"Gates now hopes to make a documentary about racial profiling for PBS."

Explains it all. He was getting publicity. There's money involved. No wonder he provoked the cops.

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Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:28 PM
Response to Reply #167
173. Shouldn't there be a sarcasm tag in there somewhere? n/t
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #167
180. Yes, and he probably bribed his neighbor to call them. Because it is so hard
to provoke them when they are nowhere around, as has been the case for 58 years.

I think your post get the prize for all three Gates threads I've read so far. Kudos.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 10:06 PM
Response to Reply #167
184. Are you being sarcastic? Or was I too charitable upthread? nt
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marshall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 10:01 PM
Response to Original message
182. He needs to track down the "well meaning" neighbor who alerted the police
Did this neighbor have a grudge against him? Has the neighbor even identified herself or himself? Were they aware Gates had been on an extended trip and just returning home, or were they just nosing in where they weren't wanted or needed?
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 10:08 PM
Response to Reply #182
185. According to the reports, it was a "passer by."
It could have been anyone, from a jogger or biker to someone just wandering around Cambridge on a fine day.

It may have been someone who didn't even know who lived in the house.

The problem wasn't the call, it was the police's reaction after the Professor showed himself to be the homeowner.
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marshall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #185
203. I thought the issue was that he would not authenticate himself as the homeowner
Didn't he balk at being asked to show identifaction that proved he was the owner? Presumably a white man would have been taken at his word that he was the homeowner, whereas a black man was doubted and suspected to the point that he was offended enough to escalate the situation past where it should have been solved.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 06:23 PM
Response to Reply #203
205. That's the cops' story. The problem is, they arrested him AFTER
he did identity himself.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 10:52 PM
Response to Reply #203
208. He showed the guy not one, but TWO forms of ID.
One was his Harvard ID with his name and photo on it. The other was his valid MA driver's license with photo and home address on it.

It is at this point that the cop should have said "I beg your pardon, Professor, the person who called in the break-in apparently mistook you and your driver for thieves. We responded to that call, and we're sorry to have disturbed you but we're happy that no crime has taken place here. Have a nice day, now."

The cop, Sgt. Jim Crowley, apparently got creative when he wrote his report to attempt to justify the arrest. The guy should have used just an iota of judgment. An elderly man, with cane and suitcases, is on the phone calling the maintenance man because the door is jammed. An old guy on a cane is not a burglar. That should have been the first clue, right there. Even before the Professor produced ID, the name he gave matched the name on the house.

It was just a stupid, stupid bit of behavior on the part of the cop. And it's not like that neighborhood isn't "diverse," either.
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marshall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 11:56 PM
Response to Reply #208
209. We can look forward to the book, perhaps more than one, and possible movie
It has certainly turned into a "he said, they said, she said" scenario, which has all the trappings needed for good sales at the book store and the box office.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-23-09 03:18 AM
Response to Reply #209
211. This guy will surely incorporate this into his academic outreach efforts.
Book and movie? No. PBS, maybe. He's on PBS a lot, already.

Not so much "He said." The PD dropped the charge. The mayor has issued a formal apology. We know where the fault lies. You do not arrest a man on his own front porch for being uppity. That's the size of it.
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kwassa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 11:09 PM
Response to Reply #182
190. the neighbor has been identified, and is really a passer-by
She works Harvard Magazine as a fundraiser, and it would seem that she would recognize one it's most famous professors.

But, she didn't.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-23-09 03:26 AM
Response to Reply #190
213. The prof was INSIDE the house, pulling on the door, while the driver
(a quite large man) was on the outside, pushing....or so I understand.

Unless she had x ray vision, she wouldn't be expected to recognize the guy. Even if the prof was on the porch, she might not have recognized him from the street--there are hedges in front of the porch, which is quite shaded at high noon, when he got home.

He's not mad at her, in any event. He's said he'd want someone to call if someone was breaking in.

The problem is the cop's behavior. Plain and simple. His judgment is also at issue--elderly men on canes are not your typical burglars.
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Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-21-09 10:35 PM
Response to Original message
186. And he should be outraged.
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Infinite Hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 11:39 AM
Response to Original message
201. Considering the reason for arrest, one has to wonder if it was staged
to create discussion and a research study. He was arrested outside his home for pushing on the door? Hm...
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-22-09 06:20 PM
Response to Reply #201
204. No, it wasn't staged, America really is this racist and this stupid.
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Infinite Hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-23-09 11:14 AM
Response to Reply #204
216. The point is, it could still be staged...he could have had a neighbor report...
the issue in an attempt to study the police response. He's studied this area for years and has already said he's going to turn it into a research study.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-23-09 11:46 AM
Response to Reply #216
220. Yeah, because "staging" this sort of thing makes so much sense after you've just flown from
China, exhausted, with a bronchial infection.

I can't believe how many mitigators there are here on this progressive board.

This was not "staged." This is "how it is" in Cambridge.
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Infinite Hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-23-09 02:53 PM
Response to Reply #220
221. And I agree that's most likely the case. But we don't know with certainty. The only person who do
are those involved in the incident.
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Mimosa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-23-09 02:55 AM
Response to Original message
210. Gates should have called a LOCKSMITH
Gates must not be very bright. It is expensive to damage a door. Much less expensive to call a locksmith. A locksmith will come to a house or car in nearly no time and get a door open -with no damage to the lock- within one minute.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-23-09 03:21 AM
Response to Reply #210
212. Gates used his keys to get in through the back door
and he and his driver were checking out the front door after.

But, I'm sure you are bright enough to have read that in the reporting.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-23-09 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #210
219. He was on the phone, calling Harvard Maintenance, when the sergeant
arrived on his porch. He went through the back door AND turned off his alarm system and got the door open from the inside to get his bags inside.

Talk about "must not be very bright."

Didn't you read the reports before you chastised the man? Or is it just easier for you to blame the guy in his own house, who provided two forms of ID to the cop and proved he had the right to be there, and got arrested for his trouble?
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