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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 06:07 PM
Original message
Obama: Honduran coup 'not legal'
Source: USA Today

Obama: Honduran coup 'not legal'
Posted by Michael Winter at 04:35 PM/ET, June 29, 2009

President Obama says that the coup in Honduras was "not legal" and that Manuel Zelaya remains the president.

Obama said the United States would "stand on the side of democracy" and work with the international community to restore Zelaya peacefully. He made his comments after meeting with Colombian President Alvaro Uribe in Washington.

In a rare move, Zelaya was invited to address the U.N. General Assembly, whose head has called a special session of the world body to denounce the "criminal military coup."

Zelaya was bundled into exile in Costa Rica after soldiers stormed the presidential palace yesterday morning. Today, hundreds of protesters gathered outside the gates and confronted soldiers.



Read more: http://blogs.usatoday.com/ondeadline/2009/06/obama-hond...
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 06:09 PM
Response to Original message
1. Obama Says Coup in Honduras Would Set a "Terrible Precedent"
Obama Says Coup in Honduras Would Set a "Terrible Precedent"
June 29, 2009 5:19 PM

Sitting in the Oval Office with Colombian President Uribe, President Obama said that the "coup" in Honduras would set a "terrible precedent."

The President said that the US still believes Manuel Zelaya is still President of Honduras.

"President Zelaya was democratically elected, he had not yet completed his term," Obama said this afternoon, "We believe that the coup was not legal and that President Zelaya remains the President of Honduras, the democratically elected president there."

Obama said that the US has joined with all the countries in the region, and with the OAS to see if this can be resolved in a "peaceful way."

"I think it would be a terrible precedent if we start moving backwards into the era in which we are seeing military coups as a means of political transition, rather than democratic elections," Obama said, "The region has made enormous progress over the past twenty years in establishing democratic traditions in Central America and Latin America. We don't want to go back to a dark past."

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2009/06/obama-s...
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subcomhd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 06:17 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Did Uribe say anything?
I would guess that deep in his dark hear he is for the coupsters.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 06:20 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. If Uribe has a heart, it's probably not all that deep in the first place. n/t
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 06:22 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Haven't heard a word from the slimy little fascist killer. Sure, he's exactly on their side.
Having that coup succeed would give him a second ally in Latin America, along with Peru's Alan Garcia.
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arcos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 10:32 PM
Response to Reply #5
29. He condemned the coup...
You know I think he's a fascist pig, but all governments in the continent have unanimously condemned this.

http://www.eltiempo.com/mundo/latinoamerica/ARTICULO-WE...
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arcos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 10:31 PM
Response to Reply #3
28. ALL Presidents in the continent have condemned the coup, including Uribe...
I think he's a fascist pig, but it has to be clear that this coup has been condemned by EVERYONE.

http://www.eltiempo.com/mundo/latinoamerica/ARTICULO-WE...
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-01-09 03:27 AM
Response to Reply #28
46.  It's a huge surprise, but it's a good one. At least he felt peer pressure enough to condemn it.
It's not like Uribe to vote against (at least officially) the interests of the oligarchy.
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Oregone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 11:10 PM
Response to Reply #1
31. LOL. I think the US has already set a terrible precedent in the coup area
:)
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subcomhd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 06:13 PM
Response to Original message
2. I think the UN thing is big.
It's going to be hard for these guys to hang on. They represent about a dozen wealthy families - who I'm guessing can be made to feel the pain pretty quickly. I think the moment they go to Santender and try to use the ATM machine and see they can't access their money, this thing will be over.
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cigsandcoffee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 06:49 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. Indeed. I sense a sternly worded letter in their near future. n/t
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rpannier Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #2
15. The new government will probably do what other oppressive governments do
Open their resources to one of the 5 permanent members, thus assuring them of a 'no' vote on any resolution.
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Hippo_Tron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-30-09 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #15
38. Do they have enough useful resources to actually bargain with?
No oil or uranium as far as I know.
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rpannier Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-30-09 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #38
45. Neither did Costa Rica
But they got Chinese aid and support by agreeing to refuse to recognize Taiwan as anything but a Chinese province

In some circumstances it doesn't take much to get Chinese support
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pleah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 06:27 PM
Response to Original message
6. "not legal" I thought the whole point of a coup was to bypass the legal avenues.
Or, am I behind the times, again, and they became legal? :shrug:

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subcomhd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #6
16. ah, a fellow nit-picker
yeah, an illegal or not legal coup is a redundancy.
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Moondog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 08:54 PM
Response to Reply #6
20. It sort of ignores the obvious, doesn't it?
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Psychic Consortium Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 06:28 PM
Response to Original message
7. This is not good news for those who staged the coup.
When Obama fires a shot over the bow, it is best to pay attention.
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 06:45 PM
Response to Original message
8. Thank You Obama
this I agree with you on. I am glad...
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subcomhd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 08:45 PM
Response to Reply #8
19. Thank you FH, for giving credit where it is due.
as an Obama "apologist" I have made a mental note to never drop the "pony" line on you. :-)
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-30-09 09:24 AM
Response to Reply #19
36. lol... no worries
I'm a harsh critic but I will applaud Obama when I think he does right.
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Ken Burch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 09:03 PM
Response to Reply #8
23. Thank you Mr. President. It's time our country did the right thing in Latin America
At least once.

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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-30-09 09:22 AM
Response to Reply #23
35. .
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Downwinder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 07:09 PM
Response to Original message
10. When has Chiquita Brands International ever worried about legalities?
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ohio2007 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 07:10 PM
Response to Original message
11. Did he only have seven months left in office ? No power to impeach written in their constitution ?
Maybe they should put it in.

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 07:22 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. It was handed to them by the Reagan administration. lol
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subcomhd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 08:40 PM
Response to Reply #12
18. LOL is right
EF - you almost runied my keyboard with the Shiner Bock that came through my nose.
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Ken Burch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 09:01 PM
Response to Reply #11
21. You can't seriously be defending a constitution designed to give the rich and the military control
of the Honduran government.

Do you not remember what Latin American generals were like in the Seventies and Eighties? Clue: they're exactly the same now.
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humbled_opinion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 07:23 PM
Response to Original message
13. The Nuts on the Right
Will be out criticizing this.... anything Obama does they seem to be on the opposite side... LOL ... What are they going to say they support a COUP where the military runs the country instead of the Democratically elected leader?.... What fools.... Of course they will say Obama is in agreement with Chavez ...blah, blah, blah...

Ashame they haven't figured out yet that all of thier pissing and whining is falling on deaf ears.
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totodeinhere Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-30-09 02:18 PM
Response to Reply #13
41. The freepers are saying that it was a legal change of government because it was ordered by the...
country's supreme court. I kid you not.
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troubledamerican Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 07:53 PM
Response to Original message
14. According to MULTIPLE so-called "progressive DUers" Obama is wrong -- it IS legal
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Of course, some of these DUers have landed gentry family backgrounds in LATAM, and they probably are Freeper sleeper cells.
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Ken Burch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 09:02 PM
Response to Reply #14
22. You Think?
n/t.
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troubledamerican Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 09:13 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. Isn't that thread remarkable? Naked Neocon DUers, exposing themselves.
Thanks for your yeoman's work over there. I dropped about a dozen comments on that thread backing you up, and so far, none of the landed LATAM gentry have replied, but I'm waiting to ask their opinion on the legality of the assassination.
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Ken Burch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 09:32 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. FYI, the reports we're now getting are that Ham wasn't actually killed
Thanks for your support. It's times like this that you really see what some people are about, isn't it?

I'd hate to see what side those people would've been on back in the early Fifties "Red Scare" days.
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troubledamerican Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 10:20 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. Careful -- don't mistake them for authentic posters.
In the 1950s, they would've been what they are now -- members of the oligarchy/military/subservients pretending to be members of an opposition group, infiltrating for purposes of neutralizing an opposition movement.
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Hugabear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-30-09 01:54 AM
Response to Reply #14
33. Don't forget the right-wing fascists in this thread
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

I believe someone even said that because foreign dignitaries were "sticking their nose" in Honduran business, they deserved to be abducted!
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troubledamerican Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-30-09 02:47 AM
Response to Reply #33
34. Utterly creepy. At least in LATAM they know who to trust amongst themselves.
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OwnedByFerrets Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 08:36 PM
Response to Original message
17. Neither was the American one in 2000, but it still stood.
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 10:05 PM
Response to Original message
26. What was the US Air Force doing in Honduras on the weekend of the coup?
From US military website:

U.S. Air Force Teams Participate in Honduran Air Show, Donate Proceeds to Hospital

Posted On: Jun 26 2009 12:59PM
By Capt. Candace Park
12th Air Force Public Affairs


6/26/2009 - SAN PEDRO SULA, Honduras (AFNS) -- An international air show united aviators, air forces and Hondurans to share their love of flying to help save lives at a local hospital June 20 and 21 here.

More than 30 U.S. Air Forces Southern Airmen, a KC-135 Stratotanker, two F-16 Fighting Falcons and an F-16 demonstration team deployed to the Honduran Armando Escalon Air Base to participate in the show, which raised more than $35,000 for Mario Catarino Rivas Hospital here.

http://www.southcom.mil/appssc/news.php?storyId=1850

Isn't this a remarkable coincidence, or was this just a cover story?
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subsuelo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-30-09 12:53 AM
Response to Reply #26
32. Sharing their love of flying, of course
:sarcasm:
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ConcernedCanuk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 10:33 PM
Response to Original message
30. USA's Iraq invasion and occupation wasn't/isn't legal either
.
.
.

did I miss something?

Pot - Kettle

hmmmm

:freak:

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David__77 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-30-09 12:47 PM
Response to Original message
37. Now withdraw ambassador!
And declare it a coup and suspend aid! Anything less is material support of a fascist coup!
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-30-09 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #37
39. Some countries have already recalled their diplomats. It's the honorable response. n/t
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Ken Burch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-30-09 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #39
42. That, and if they're recalled, they're much less likely to be abducted.
n/t.
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Political Heretic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-30-09 02:08 PM
Response to Original message
40. Did Obama actually use the word "coup"
I had hear that the state department was tactically not using that word.

Don't read anything into the question, I'm asking because I don't know and thus haven't formed any opinion.
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-30-09 03:49 PM
Response to Original message
43. how many coups ARE legal...?
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-30-09 05:09 PM
Response to Original message
44. UN backs ousted Honduran leader
UN backs ousted Honduran leader
The Associated Press
Published: June 30, 2009
Updated: 02:04 pm

TEGUCIGALPA, Honduras - The U.N. General Assembly demanded the immediate restoration of Honduras' ousted president on Tuesday, but the man who replaced him said Manuel Zelaya could be arrested if he returns home.

The U.N. vote by acclamation added to an avalanche of international denunciations of the coup that removed Zelaya on Sunday, an action that raised fears of more of the military overthrows that have scarred Latin American history.

The world body called on all 192 U.N. member states to avoid recognizing any government in Honduras other than Zelaya's.

Zelaya then thanked the assembly for the "historic" resolution that expresses "the indignation" of people worldwide.

The Organization of American States planned an emergency meeting in Washington hours later to reinforce the pressure to reinstate Zelaya, whose foes claim he was plotting with Venezuela's Hugo Chavez to change the Honduran constitution in hopes of extending his rule.

The United States, which had privately expressed concerns to Zelaya about changing the constitution, has stood behind him since masked soldiers sent him, still wearing pajamas, into exile.

President Barack Obama said Zelaya remains "the democratically elected president."

"It would be a terrible precedent if we start moving backwards into the era in which we are seeing military coups as a means of political transition rather than democratic elections," Obama said Monday.

Zelaya also got support from Latin American leaders in Nicaragua on Monday, and said OAS Secretary-General Jose Miguel Insulza had agreed to accompany him back to Honduras on Thursday.

More:
http://www2.tbo.com/content/2009/jun/30/301404/ousted-l...
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