Despite Reports, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed Was Not Waterboarded 183 Times

[sabra]

Source: "Fox News"

The New York Times reported last week that Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the alleged mastermind of the Sept. 11 terror attacks, was waterboarded 183 times in one month by CIA interrogators. The "183 times" was widely circulated by news outlets throughout the world.

It was shocking. And it was highly misleading. The number is a vast inflation, according to information from a U.S. official and the testimony of the terrorists themselves.

A U.S. official with knowledge of the interrogation program told FOX News that the much-cited figure represents the number of times water was poured onto Mohammed's face -- not the number of times the CIA applied the simulated-drowning technique on the terror suspect. According to a 2007 Red Cross report, he was subjected a total of "five sessions of ill-treatment."

"The water was poured 183 times -- there were 183 pours," the official explained, adding that "each pour was a matter of seconds."

...

The memos did not note that the sessions would be made up of a number of short pours -- the ones the U.S. official said lasted "a matter of seconds" -- and that created the huge numbers quoted by the New York Times: 183 on Mohamed, 83 on Zubaydah.

Pours, not waterboards.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/04/28/despite-repo... /

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Sorry for posting Fox News - but it appears they are trying to create a new talking point

[Kittycat]

1. It's still Torture, and it's still a War Crime. It only takes one incident.

[47of74]

2. It doesn't freaking matter!

It doesn't freaking matter if it was done one time or a million. Even once was still wrong! And whether they call it waterboarding or some bulls--t name like pours doesn't change the fact that it was and still is wrong!

[WillBowden]

3. "The water was poured 183 times -- there were 183 pours," the official explained, adding that "each

Oh, well that makes it ok then.

<sigh>

[zazen]

4. sort of like "electrocutions," not "electrocution sessions:" whew, that's a relief!

[droidamus2]

9. exactly

Well you see, there were only five electrocution 'sessions' and the numbers were inflated by counting each of the 385 jolts the prisoner was given. So you see it wasn't as bad as some in the media made it out to be. I mean only 5 sessions isn't that many is it'. What a bunch of crap. I get so tired of these idiots thinking that the majority of the American people are stupid enough to fall for this stuff (of course there is a sizable minority that does which is sort of scary in and of itself)

[canetoad]

5. So he was tied/held down 5 times

then they poured water on his face 36 times during each of these 5 sessions. That is amazingly humane.

[CJCRANE]

22. That's just as bad!

(Don't worry I got your sarcasm).

It doesn't sound very effective if you have to do it 36 times in one session. They initially told us it works in seconds.

[lakercub]

34. It probably does work in seconds

although the information gathered could well be, and probably is, crap. The other 35 "pours" were just for sport.

[yellowcanine]

26. Exactly. They could have done 200 pours, for example, and then there would be something to squawk

about. These idiots just keep digging the hole deeper.

[Moonwalk]

41. Humane indeed. Remember...

...Each pour was only a few seconds. Why, by that count the sessions couldn't have lasted more than two minutes! Glad Fox News set the record straight. Nice to know we can rely on them for truth and accuracy.

[glitch]

6. They are scrambling for cover. nt

[NOW tense]

7. Well that changes everything!

[Solly Mack]

8. Pathetic

[Bolo Boffin]

10. The suspect was shot one time with 19 bullets. The time each bullet was in the body was brief.

The suspect was stabbed one time with 48 insertions of the blade. Most of the insertions could only be described as lacerations, not fatal wounds.

What a hideous, hideous piece of self-justifying mendacity.

[stillcool]

11. They counted?

Okay Fox...if you say so.

[Canuckistanian]

12. They still stopped him from breathing 183 times

I don't give a flying fuck what time span it was done in.

This is splitting hairs.

[madmom]

13. But if it wasn't torture, why should it matter? 183 pours vs 183 "sessions" tomato vs toMAto!

[alcibiades_mystery]

14. Ay yay yay

That's the best they can do?

[ThisThreadIsSatire]

15. Subject the concerned citizens at FOX News to merely 'a pour'

... 178 times, then 5 'real' waterboardings.

I want to see what they'll confess to!

[HelenWheels]

16. Fox is an entertainment network not a news network

I know, we already knew that.

In February 2003, a Florida Court of Appeals unanimously agreed with an assertion by FOX News that there is no rule against distorting or falsifying the news in the United States. http://www.relfe.com/media_can_legally_lie.html

[MessiahRp]

17. This is like saying... "We should only get 5 life sentences rather than 183 life sentences".

It really doesn't matter because the crime was still committed and there should be a hefty penalty... be it 5 times or 183 times we still broke the LAW.

Dumbasses.

Rp

[Wizard777]

18. So their defense is like spliting hairs on the difference between a Mass Murder and a Serial Killer.

Ooookay.

[populistdriven]

19. I bet they count one bucket as "a pour"

[yellowcanine]

27. If you hold someone's head under the water for 10 minutes how many "pours" is that?

[sweettater]

28. I know this is no

laughing matter, far from it.......but you made me laugh. shame on you.

Exactly what constitutes a "pour"?

[matt819]

20. Okay, then, 183 pours is okay

A pour - sounds much better than waterboarding or the more generic torture. Sounds almost elegant, like they were served wine during a candlelight dinner. Now we're going to hear discussion of short pours, long pours, time between pours, number of pours per session, duration of session, time between sessions, as if this is acceptable. What world are these animals living in?

[sweettater]

32. Pour?

shot glass, wine glass, beer glass, or the whole keg. which is it you yellow bellied sap suckers???????

[RalphieD]

21. Not good enough

He didn't even have any good information.  He didn't tell them
anything.  They were just being mean to him and getting their
rocks off and reporting to Cheney.

[yellowcanine]

23. "183 pours, each pour a matter of seconds" Well alrighty then! What's the fuss?

Damned towel headed terra-ist anyway.

[CJCRANE]

24. Anything that has to be done 183 times

isn't very effective and doesn't "work in seconds" as we were previously told.

It doesn't matter whether they call it "pours", "splashes", "squirts" or "face freshening".

[Piewhacket]

25. Oh, Really? 183 is good enough number until a war crime tribunal counts em.

Fox don't know anything, or how many times,
all they know is 183 isn't the number, and that's their
story and they are sticking to it.

Ignore the lie machine. 183 is the number until someone officially
counts them up during the criminal trials of Bush and Cheney.
then we'll all know for sure.

[tomm2thumbs]

29. and it actually wasn't water - it was tea - really it was a tea party - no harm, no foul

and the smacks into the wall - it wasn't about trying to hurt him - they were giving him 2 lumps because it goes with his tea. You see, it is all very dignified and harmless

[harun]

30. Why is anyone believing this? "A U.S. offical" doesn't mean diddly

get the real truth out.

[Hawkowl]

31. How long on the board?

How long was he strapped to the board or chair? Five sessions of what duration? The way these fuckers operated, he could have had 5 sessions of 3 days of pouring. I Don't give a goddamn if he was only waterboarded, "poured" on once. The people who did this need to be imprisoned for a very, very, long time.

[Bonhomme Richard]

33. "each pour was a matter of seconds." No. Each pour was a matter of...

pints, quarts, or gallons.
Torture, plain and simple.

[nbcouch]

35. Torture supporters know no shame

That's a foregone conclusion ... some cretin wrote a letter to the editor of our local paper, claiming that's it's not torture unless it inflicts severe physical pain. That argument lets all practitioners of psychological terrorism off the hook - brilliant! Soooooo, if I tie you to a chair, gently, empty a revolver and load it with one bullet in front of you, forcing you to watch, and then hold the gun up to your head, repeatedly spinning the cylinder and then pulling the trigger, that's OK. No physical pain involved, even after 183 trigger pulls - everyone got that?

[shraby]

36. This part bothers me too:

"testimony of the terrorists themselves."
I'm sure the ones being waterboarded counted the number of "pours" and actually kept an accurate count right up to number 183. It's so ridiculous it would be laughable if the subject were so tragic.

[RedCloud]

37. So if they get horsewhipped 50 times each session, but only five sessions...

Wing nuts never could get past the first grade with their math skills...

[Aviation Pro]

38. You know who kept accurate records of their own atrocities....

...yes, you guessed it, the Nazis.

[Spazito]

39. This is what the defenders of torture have been reduced to???

Holy crap, the desperation of the defenders has become beyond ridiculous.

[hedgehog]

40. It was torture the first time they did it, it was torture the last time.

[No Elephants]

42. Gee, I wonder which official familiar with torture is giving Fox classified into. Some Dick or .

another, I guess.

[bitchkitty]

43. Ah! So they tortured just a little bit. That excuses it then. n/t

[Festivito]

44. How many pours did the executed Japanese commit? /nt

[TacticalPeek]

45. One hundred and eighty-three lashes for ye, matey, delivered Monday-Friday.

Aarrgh, we don't want to overtax the doctor's sensibilities.

[gratuitous]

46. Okay, so when Sean Hannity gets waterboarded

Let's all remember that a "session" isn't just one pour, it's multiple pours, and Hannity isn't to know ahead of time just how many pours or how long the session will last. I'll bet we could have him singing "I'm a pretty, pretty princess" before his session is over.

For anyone who is still ambivalent about all this: This. Is. Disgusting. And. A. Disgrace. Prosecution to the fullest extent of the laws of this land (including the Constitution and all treaties) is the only reasonable option.

[DebbieCDC]

47. Well if it's no big deal, when's Hannity going to live up to his promise?

Could he take 183 "pours"??? C'mon Sean let's see those cojones.

[tblue37]

52. I for one do NOT want to see Sean's cojones--even when he is

teabagging with them.

[JayMusgrove]

48. Fixed Noise? RIGHT!!!!!!!!!

I believe everything I hear from them. ALWAYS!

<<"according to information from a U.S. official and the testimony of the terrorists themselves.">>

I am always inclined to believe people Fixed Noise labels as "terrorists", too!

[jmowreader]

49. This is obviously the equivalent of...

"He fell down the stairs twenty-seven times then stabbed himself with a knife thirty times and shot himself in the head fourteen times."

[daleo]

50. It's like being punched 183 times

But in only 5 different beatings. It's still a lot of abuse.

It seems like a distinction without a difference.

[Butch350]

51. Gee thanks! That makes only light waterboarding.

[Old Hank]

53. Why would they pour water if not to engage in torture

Do Fox and its anonymous official expect us to believe that the CIA expected to achieve anything by simply washing the detainees' faces? Ludicrous.