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Bozita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 07:40 PM
Original message
BBC crisis over refusal to broadcast Gaza appeal
Source: Guardian UK

BBC crisis over refusal to broadcast Gaza appeal
Archbishop in attack on aid decision
Isolated Thompson urged to rethink

Caroline Davies, Vanessa Thorpe and Gaby Hinsliff
guardian.co.uk, Saturday 24 January 2009 19.55 GMT
Article history

The BBC was in crisis tonight as politicians including government ministers, religious leaders and senior members of its own staff condemned the decision not to broadcast a charity appeal to help the stricken people of Gaza rebuild their homes.

The corporation's director general, Mark Thompson, was left isolated as rival broadcasters ITV and Channel 4 agreed to put out the plea for aid made jointly by 13 British charities. The BBC has decided the broadcast of the appeal might be seen as evidence of bias on a highly sensitive political issue.

The Archbishop of York, John Sentamu, has accused the broadcaster of "taking sides". He said yesterday: "This is not a row about impartiality but rather about humanity.

"This situation is akin to that of British military hospitals who treat prisoners of war as a result of their duty under the Geneva convention. They do so because they identify need rather than cause. This is not an appeal by Hamas asking for arms but by the Disasters Emergency Committee asking for relief. By declining their request, the BBC has already taken sides and forsaken impartiality," the archbishop added.

Read more: http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2009/jan/24/bbc-gaza-pa...
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Bigmack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 07:52 PM
Response to Original message
1. I am NOT a religious person
BUT the archbishop is actually behaving in a TRULY Christian manner. Ms Bigmack
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Pale Blue Dot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 12:57 AM
Response to Reply #1
8. No, he is behaving in a truly MORAL manner.
The difference is profoundly important.
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WCGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 01:54 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. As an agnostic I beg to differ...
The true tenants of all the religions I am familiar with base their core values on ideas of communal living that have developed over thousands of years. In fact, if religion hadn't offered a place for morals to developer, we would be living in a profoundly different world.

The moral basis for Western Civilization, like it or not, springs from JudeoChristian value systems.

To project a modern exploitive "Christian" such as Pat Robertson and make his core value system the represent ive of all Christians is disingenuous. The values that provide a civilizing foundation for all of us in the West are Christian whether you choose to except that or not.


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booley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #10
31. I disagree
Given that so many non-Judeo/Christians share those same beliefs.

Hell, I can point to socio-biology and show that a moral system is inherent in our nature. Animals also seem capable of developing a moral code. It's just that isn't the only thing that drives people.

In any case, i don't care if it's a satanist or scientologist or a flying spaghetti monster saying this. It's the right thing to do.
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WCGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-26-09 02:51 AM
Response to Reply #31
50. The explain to me, if morals and value systems are wired in, why the
Eastern moral systems are somewhat different from ours.

That socio-biological inherent in our moral system is indeed true, though I believe more on the socio instead of the biological. But how that morality plays, in, for example the way different societies value the individual, out in the 21st century has a lot to do with the foundations developed within the core value systems set by religion or lack thereof.

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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 04:34 PM
Response to Reply #10
43. I beg to differ...
The moral basis for Western civilization -- and it's been a mixed bag, like the French Revolution -- springs from the battle against the real-existing Christendom (as opposed to Christianity or the imputed teachings of the probably fictional Christ).

The most important figure in this history was not some saint or Pope, but Galileo Galilei.
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WCGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-26-09 03:01 AM
Response to Reply #43
51. True, we are saying basically the same thing...
The religious or more succinctly, the spiritual basis for Christianity is simple; have compassion for your fellow man. It was Paul the apostle come lately that started to pervert that simple message. But that message that the individual is responsible for his relationship with a god paved the way for, in the west at least, the idea that an individual is capable, when following the basic tenant of Christ, of governing him/her self.

It matters not if Christ we real or fictional.

Please consider that Gutenberg was perhaps the single most important non religious figure since the fall of the Roman Empire. The ability to spread the wealth knowledge around was extremely important to Galileo and others.
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-26-09 09:20 AM
Response to Reply #51
55. Is that really a Christian idea, per se?
Compassion is a universal. As you say, Paulist Christendom lacked for it. The challenge to its tyranny may have come from people who used the Christian rhetoric, but to promote logical, empirically-based and universalist ideas. They wanted to stay off the stake, so they used the Christian rhetoric.

And I'm sure Gutenberg was religious! Please don't confuse "religious" with "clergy"; you can even be clergy and not the least religious.

But agreed on Gutenberg: his achievement set off the whole transformation and led to Galileo and Luther and the Enlightenment and modern nationalism and much else besides, including good and some very, very bad!
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 07:19 PM
Response to Reply #10
46. Complete bullshit, given that we are wired for altruism.
The Enlightenment gave us our true morals, not the religious ignorance it fought.

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WCGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-26-09 03:05 AM
Response to Reply #46
52. If we are all "wired" for altruism as you say, then why do Eastern
value systems put more emphasis on the collective than on the individual?

You are confusing, as it is easy to do, the religion that devolved through the centuries of use as a tool of secular power with the basic tenants of that religion.
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Solon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-26-09 04:58 PM
Response to Reply #52
57. First off, not all eastern value systems are the same, second, I don't see how...
they are mutually exclusive. Collectivism, taking care of the group, is the hallmark of altruism, its selfishness that focuses on the individual.
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WCGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-09 02:07 AM
Response to Reply #57
60. Western morality is based on the individual.
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Solon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-09 09:37 AM
Response to Reply #60
61. How so? Can you give me an example? n/t
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-26-09 05:16 AM
Response to Reply #10
53. The underlying principles did not originate with Jews or Christians, though.
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WCGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-09 02:03 AM
Response to Reply #53
58. But they were codified and spread around...
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CLANG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 05:11 PM
Response to Reply #8
44. As a secular humanist, the distinction is very important to me.
Moral=Religious <> Atheistic=Immoral

(and that's being as polite as I can).
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WCGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-09 02:06 AM
Response to Reply #44
59. I don't see it that way...
Morality is not the sole property of the religious. I am saying that the moral codes we adher to in today's world spring from religion. There were no secular humanists in prebiblical time.
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rizlaplus Donating Member (19 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 09:51 AM
Response to Reply #1
20. 11 million Muslims who perished
11,000,000 Muslims have been violently killed since 1948, of which about 60,000, died during the sixty years of fighting Israel, or just about 1 out of every 180 Muslim fatalities . . , over 90 percent of the 11 million who perished were killed by fellow Muslims. Remind me again who it is the is most vociferous in condemning Israel!
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AlbertCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 10:40 AM
Response to Reply #20
23. Oh look! The Judeo/Christian value system!
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Lost-in-FL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 12:04 PM
Original message
...
:spray:
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Purveyor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 06:26 PM
Response to Original message
45. Thank you for posting... K&R eom
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Lost-in-FL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #23
27. duplicate post,nt
Edited on Sun Jan-25-09 12:04 PM by Lost-in-FL
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arikara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #20
40. Unreal.
What a crock of bullshit.

I really dislike this pukey smiley but it fits here.

:puke:
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JohnyCanuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 08:31 PM
Response to Original message
2. Video - George Galloway on the BBC,
or as he calls it, the Bloody Biased Corporation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lg3bi3bH2kI
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barb162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #2
36. I prefer Galloway begging for milk on his hands and feet like the fool he is
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 07:20 PM
Response to Reply #36
47. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
barb162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 03:20 PM
Response to Reply #2
39. Here's Galloway being thrown out of Parliament, another good one
Edited on Sun Jan-25-09 03:20 PM by barb162
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 09:46 PM
Response to Original message
3. K&R n/t
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JohnyCanuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 11:24 PM
Response to Original message
4. Tony Benn (former MP, cabinet minister and BBC producer) has his say on the controversy
in a BBC interview:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OD1-jjQguyI&feature=emai...

This link can be used to make an online donation to the UK's Disaster Emergency Committee's Gaza fund: http://www.dec.org.uk/donate_now . I just sent them a few pounds myself. I would probably never have heard about them were it not for this controversy. It would be ironic if they ended up getting more donations through all this publicity than if the BBC had just gone ahead and aired their appeal for donations without a fuss.
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bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 11:32 PM
Response to Original message
5. Burn the BBC a new one!! This is outrageous pandering to Israel. Gaza is a shambles
and in dire need of all the help it can get.

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Truth2Tell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 12:17 AM
Response to Original message
6. At least American stations are broadcasting the US appeal
for aid right?

Oh wait....
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emilyg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 12:52 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. Ha. Sure.
:shrug:
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 03:50 AM
Response to Reply #6
13. Amy aired a message from United Palestinian Appeal -- which is registered
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Truth2Tell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 02:32 PM
Response to Reply #13
33. Amy is an exception, as usual. nt
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pork medley Donating Member (262 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 05:35 AM
Response to Reply #6
16. All American stations are requesting you look deep in your hearts, dig deep in your pockets..
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EstoniaKat Donating Member (29 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #6
38. And this is preventing all of you ...
From donating your time and money to a cause you feel is important, right?

Right?
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scarletwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #38
42. That's completely beside the point. The point is the difference between a trickle of donations
from the few people who happen to find out there's an aid organization collecting them, and having the aid effort actually publicized to a national audience.

sw
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Truth2Tell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-26-09 12:45 AM
Response to Reply #38
49. Miss the point much?
It's not preventing me from doing anything, but it is preventing most Americans from even knowing a crisis exists.
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barb162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 01:35 AM
Response to Original message
9. Does it broadcast appeals for other crises, like famines, droughts, wars?
Not that I remember.
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Scurrilous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 03:29 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. Yep...
...the BBC has never participated in a famine relief effort.

And in other news, Bob Geldof still doesn't like Mondays.
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tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 04:57 AM
Response to Reply #11
14. ROFLMAO!
:rofl:
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muriel_volestrangler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 03:44 AM
Response to Reply #9
12. Yes; for instance, there was a broadcast appeal for Congo a few months ago
See DEC's front page: http://www.dec.org.uk /

and that was a crisis caused by fighting. They also had broadcasts for Darfur and Chad, and Kosovo. There have been broadcasts for other disasters, such as the Indian Ocean tsunami.
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LeftishBrit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 05:19 AM
Response to Reply #9
15. Certainly it has.
Edited on Sun Jan-25-09 05:20 AM by LeftishBrit
The Disasters Emergency Committee is a joint group of very mainstream charities, which collects money for relief for all sorts of disasters - from the Tsunami to the Congo war. The BBC normally broadcasts their advertisments.

The BBC also broadcasts charity campaigns and events from Live Aid and Comic Relief, etc, and have their own annual Children in Need appeal.

So this is an unusual decision. It does not come from the government, and is probably some individual(s) in the BBC being bloody-minded.

For anyone who wants to donate, the link is:

www.dec.org.uk
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teknomanzer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #9
35. Here is some pertinent info on your question...
Excerpt from Wiki on Mr. Geldof.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Geldof

On 13 July 1985, Geldof and Ure organized Live Aid, a huge event staged simultaneously at Wembley Stadium in London and John F. Kennedy Stadium in Philadelphia. Thanks to an unprecedented decision by the BBC to clear its schedules for 16 hours of rock music, the event was also broadcast live in the UK on television and radio.


So, yeah, I'd say they have a history of doing stuff like that.
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steaa Donating Member (83 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 06:57 AM
Response to Original message
17. point
Edited on Sun Jan-25-09 07:30 AM by steaa
BBC and Sky News are both broadcast and available in Israel, unlike ITV and Ch4 who have chosen to show the appeal.

In my opinion they are under pressure from the Israeli government not to show it because of this fact. Or alteast things seem to point in that direction.

"Impartiality" has never stopped the BBC from airing appeals for the Gulf, Former Yugoslavia (Bosnia etc..), Sudan, Kosovo, Liberia, Darfur, Chad etc.. Its obvious they are under pressure from someone in this case not to do so.
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scarletwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 09:51 AM
Response to Reply #17
21. Bingo. I do believe you've gone straight to the heart of the matter.
For certain the Israeli government wants to avoid exposing its citizens to any notions of having compassion for the Palestinians.

sw
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bobd0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 10:15 AM
Response to Reply #17
22. Apparently, AIPAC has a UK branch. K&R nt
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bushmeister0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 02:38 PM
Response to Reply #17
34. Bingo and bingo.
From the article:

"Greg Dyke, Thompson's predecessor as director general of the BBC, said the issue put the BBC in a 'no win situation'. He added: 'Outside of Iraq, the single biggest issue that caused complaints was the coverage of Israel. I can understand why the BBC has taken this decision, because on a subject as sensitive as the Middle East it is absolutely essential that the audience cannot see any evidence at all of a bias.'"

'Nuf said. Censor yourelf or get spanked.
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jeff30997 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 07:13 AM
Response to Original message
18. Well it's very obvious that...

ITV,Channel 4 and that Archbishop are anti-semites and Holocaust deniers! :sarcasm:

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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 08:19 AM
Response to Original message
19. recommend
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proReality Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 10:45 AM
Response to Original message
24. K&R n/t
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Poll_Blind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 11:22 AM
Response to Original message
25. K&R!
PB
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ohio2007 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 11:46 AM
Response to Original message
26. I suspect the follow up story would be
The British govt. now has in their possession the phone #'s of all the Hamas 'sympathizers' living in the country and contributing to organizations on the terror list..and will use that info, which is an invasion of privacy, to track down 'profiles' as they go about their daily lives.


No ?
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LeftishBrit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 12:39 PM
Response to Reply #26
29. No, not this time. The government actually support this appeal.
Edited on Sun Jan-25-09 12:43 PM by LeftishBrit
It's someone(s) in the Beeb itself who's being obstructionist.

ETA: And the government won't know who's contributed or not - it all goes through the DEC, which is independent.
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ohio2007 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. nice to know they don't have the ability
to check phone records in some countries ;)
http://www.technewsworld.com/story/65249.html
Unless ordered to turn over such phone records in the name of national security.

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muriel_volestrangler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #26
41. Oxfam etc. are not organizations 'on the terror list'
Even if they did get the details of the donors, they are people donating to humanitarian charities. Like the Archbishop of York, for instance.
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Jefferson23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
28. What a new low, they should be ashamed.
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DissedByBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 01:47 PM
Response to Original message
32. Don't worry. Iran will take care of it.
That is the cycle. Iran funds an attack on Israel. The local Muslims suffer. Iran rebuilds their homes and they forget who instigated the suffering in the first place. Then it starts again.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 03:03 PM
Response to Original message
37. This story has made it into the CNN crawl. n/t
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truebrit71 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 08:14 PM
Response to Original message
48. The Archbishop nailed it. The Beeb dropped the ball on this one...
...
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No Elephants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-26-09 05:26 AM
Response to Original message
54. Does politics trump human kindness? Does religion? Does being judgmental? If you
withhold human kindness from someone or some group because you judged them to be wrong, does that make you as wrong? Interesting questions.
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Liberal Elitist Donating Member (40 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-26-09 04:15 PM
Response to Original message
56. Appeal Video is on Guardian website
http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/video/2009/jan/26/dec-g...

Seemed pretty innocuous and uncontentious.

It only referred to "hundreds" of deaths, not the 1,300 generally reported.

It stressed the appeal was to aid the children, and did not apportion blame to anyone - IDF or Hamas or whoevever.

It compared the damage to natural disasters such as earthquakes - nothing about IDF tanks, planes, missiles, nor about Hamas using people as human shields.

All in all it was unbiased and balanced - so to me the BBC and Sky are themselves showing bias by refusing to air it

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