Barack Obama: it is no longer essential to kill Osama bin Laden

[Freddie Stubbs]

Source: London Times

Barack Obama suggested last night that removing Osama bin Laden from the battlefield was no longer essential and that America's security goals could be achieved merely by keeping al-Qaeda "on the run".

"My preference obviously would be to capture or kill him," he said. "But if we have so tightened the noose that he's in a cave somewhere and can't even communicate with his operatives then we will meet our goal of protecting America."

His comments, in a CBS interview, represent a significant watering down of the "dead or alive" policy pursued by President Bush since the terror attacks of September 11, 2001. They also appear to contradict Mr Obama's own statements made in the election campaign.

As recently as October 7, in a presidential debate, Mr Obama said: "We will kill bin Laden. We will crush al-Qaeda. That has to be our biggest national security priority."

Read more: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_amer...

[DJ13]

1. I bet he recieved an intelligence briefing that said he's already dead

If he is dead, chasing after him would be a waste of time.

[onehandle]

9. That would make sense. I Do think he's dead.

And if he's dead, Bush has been lying.

[didact]

91. If he's dead, is Obama lying?

I agree with your statement, but if he's dead - wouldn't Obama's comments (quotes) in the story constitute he's lying too?

[Soylent Brice]

11. i can see that being the case.

[peace13]

24. If he is dead Obama should say that.

Is OBL going to live on indefinitely to scare the American people?

[Cha]

41. Maybe there's no

proof yet?

[Taverner]

53. "If you kids don't quiet down, OBL will gitchya!"

[peace13]

82. What I'm Sayin' !!!

You made me laugh. Peace, Kim

[Robb]

51. Damn, that's exactly what I was thinking. nt

[onehandle]

2. Oh...great.

That's all I got.

[Solly Mack]

3. I love life

[OhioChick]

4. ....

[sandnsea]

5. It's more than what Bush did

He isn't saying killing bin Laden isn't a goal. He said tightening the noose on him is the most important thing as to keeping the country safe.

[McCamy Taylor]

6. Maybe Obama is not going to assassinate foreign leaders? Would be a good US policy.

[bluestateguy]

True, but OBL is not a foreign leader of a nation-state

And the law banning assassination of foreign leaders would not apply in his case.

[bahrbearian]

44. Ok you first . since your not a foreign leader. It 's OK?

Tell that to JKF. Murder is Murder.

[bluestateguy]

46. bin Laden deserves to be murdered

Don't try to over-complexify what at the end of the day is really a very simple concept.

[Romulox]

52. Just to clarify: "murder" is an unlawful homicide. Killing a combatant in battle is not "murder".

[reggie the dog]

62. he deserves life in prison

or death on the battlefield, but if he surrenders he deserves natural life in prison.

[Freddie Stubbs]

14. I do not think that most Americans would classify bin Laden as a "foreign leader"

[dkofos]

7. That would also make it a waste of time, money and manpower to

escalate the Afghan war.

[sandnsea]

12. Pinning him down in a cave

will happen how?

[freedomnorth]

32. May I point your interest towards

U.S. preps south Afghan surge
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

[Wizard777]

8. He needs to be taken alive. He has valuable information.

9/11 was indeed a conspiracy. Unless of course one person was able to hijack and fly all four planes. We now need to see how far that conspiracy goes.

[DCKit]

21. BushCo shut down the investigations.

They know who, what, where, why and how.

If it wasn't MIHOP, it was LIHOP. They just didn't know how big it was going to be.

[KansDem]

34. What makes you think OBL has "valuable information" about 9/11?

Even the FBI doesn't credit him with involvement with 9/11:

MURDER OF U.S. NATIONALS OUTSIDE THE UNITED STATES; CONSPIRACY TO MURDER U.S. NATIONALS OUTSIDE THE UNITED STATES; ATTACK ON A FEDERAL FACILITY RESULTING IN DEATH

USAMA BIN LADEN

Date of Photograph Unknown

Aliases: Usama Bin Muhammad Bin Ladin, Shaykh Usama Bin Ladin, the Prince, the Emir, Abu Abdallah, Mujahid Shaykh, Hajj, the Director

DESCRIPTION

Date of Birth: 1957 Hair: Brown
Place of Birth: Saudi Arabia Eyes: Brown
Height: 6' 4" to 6' 6" Complexion: Olive
Weight: Approximately 160 pounds Sex: Male
Build: Thin Nationality: Saudi Arabian
Occupation: Unknown
Remarks: Bin Laden is the leader of a terrorist organization known as Al-Qaeda, "The Base". He is left-handed and walks with a cane.
Scars and Marks: None

CAUTION

USAMA BIN LADEN IS WANTED IN CONNECTION WITH THE AUGUST 7, 1998, BOMBINGS OF THE UNITED STATES EMBASSIES IN DAR ES SALAAM, TANZANIA, AND NAIROBI, KENYA. THESE ATTACKS KILLED OVER 200 PEOPLE. IN ADDITION, BIN LADEN IS A SUSPECT IN OTHER TERRORIST ATTACKS THROUGHOUT THE WORLD.

FBI's Ten Most Wanted

Nowhere does the FBI say OBL was involved in 9/11...

[reggie the dog]

63. Perhaps OBL could tell us just

which neocons did 9-11.

[KansDem]

65. Good point...

Hold him as a material witness.

Oh, and put him in protective custody, too!

[No Elephants]

74. Bin Laden was on video talking about how they never thought the buildings would

collapse. He was saying that they thought they would do only some damage to a couple of floors. He seemed happy, too.

[No Elephants]

73. It goes to Bin Laden and those who financed him.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

10. I guess nobody told Barack

that UBL is in fact dead (or changed costumes).

[jsamuel]

13. or possibly under the protection of an US ally

[reggie the dog]

64. well at least Obama is CONCERNED by OBL

[asksam]

80. or that he never existed...

... and, like Emmanual Goldstein in Nineteen Eighty Four, is just a bogeyman, in this case, created by the Rethugs.

[balantz]

15. Bhutto knew bin Laden was already killed. I posted this video link earlier in another thread:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f1uLdmct8_E&feature=rela...

[Sebass1271]

17. if he was already killed.. how come HE just released a new

tape calling for another jihad??

explain that to me fellow duerss!!!

[balantz]

19. Have we been shown definitive proof that is actually a tape of bin Laden? n/t

[Rosa Luxemburg]

69. nobody can prove it

[DCKit]

23. Yeah, yeah. And a year ago we had a video of a strangly younger, fitter OBL.

They had to go with audio-only to prevent further derision.

OBL is dead. Long live OBL.

[teknomanzer]

47. You explain...

how a man on the verge of kidney failure survives in the wilderness of Afghanistan.

[Sebastian Doyle]

49. How did John Lennon just release a new commerical for the "Laptops for kids" thing?

How did Natalie Cole record a duet with her father some 40 years after he died? How did Gene Kelly make a Diet Coke commercial with Paula Abdul a while back?

Osama's been the executive director of Hell-Qaeda for years. All of his terrorist attacks now are strictly for Satan's benefit, not "The Great Satan's".

[Hugabear]

57. PROVE to me that was Osama Bin Laden

I'm sure you have access to the original tape, an original un-doctored photo of Bin Laden, and sophisticated software to analyze the two and make that determination? Or perhaps you were there when Bin Laden made the tape?

If your answer to both is no, then how can you possibly sit there and tell us that it was definitely Bin Laden.

[tblue37]

70. He used to always release video tapes. Now he never does.

It is easier to fake an audio tape than a video tape, I imagine.

[edbermac]

16. Sorry, but I'd like to see OBL swinging at the end of a rope.

Keep al-Qaeda on the run AND try to get OBL. I don't care if he is sitting alone in a cave; I don't want the whole world seeing that he 'got away' with 9/11.

[Pastiche423]

55. What makes you think he was responsible for 9/11?

[edbermac]

85. Uh, maybe because he claimed responsibility for 9/11.

AMMAN: Al Qaeda terrorist network leader Osama bin Laden said in an audiotape broadcast by the Al Jazeera satellite channel that he himself had

assigned 19 people for the Sep 11, 2001, attacks in the US.

"In fact, brother Zacarias Moussaoui has no connection whatever with the Sep 11 operation," Osama bin Laden said in the audiotape that Al Jazeera on Tuesday reported was posted on a website.

"I am the man responsible for the recruitment of the 19 people who carried out the attacks, and I did not assign any task to Moussaoui," he added.

Moussaoui was recently sentenced to life in prison without possibility of parole, sparing him the death penalty by a US jury.

Osama bin Laden contended that Moussaoui's confession to having a role in the Sep 11 attacks was "null and void, because it was extracted under pressure".

"Moussaoui was arrested two weeks before the September events, and if he knew anything about (the operation), we should have told (9/11 ringleader) Mohammed Atta and his brothers to leave the US at once," the Al Qaeda chi

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1550477....

[rcrush]

18. He's gonna be living in W's guest house in Dallas.

Right after W issues a pardon for Osama on monday. Then they are all going to be caught on film sitting infront of a pile of money laughing and doing coke off Cheneys ass.

[John Q. Citizen]

20. Bin Ladin was always a joke on us.

[smiley]

39. so true....

He's a myth perpetrated in order for the powers that be to continue their 'GAME' of lies.

[Autumn]

22. Hard to kill

a dead man.

[lazyriver]

25. There is no Keyser Soze!!!

Obama has probably learned in top level briefings what many have suspected for some time now - bin laden is dead and has been for years. Bush has been using him as a straw boogie man to keep us all scared.

[WriteDown]

And he's decided to keep this from us? nt.

[lazyriver]

40. Maybe. It seems a little strange he would make a point to

suddenly mention getting bin laden is not that important now that the job is actually his to perform. What's changed since the campaign and his tougher rhetoric besides the level of intelligence info he now gets? Obama's got a huge mess to clean up in Afghanistan just as everywhere else the boy king and his dark overlord left their sticky little fingers. I wouldn't blame Obama if he kept bin laden "alive" for a couple years longer if it meant getting that country back on its feet and out of the cycle of poverty, corruption, and violence we helped to create. There will be many things Obama will keep from us. He'll have to. It's the very nature of the job. It seems naive to think otherwise.

[John Q. Citizen]

43. So you welcome being lied to for a "higher cause?"

No wonder we are so fucked.


PS

I'm not trying to be mean or nasty. It's just that when people agree to be lied to as long as they are promised that it's for a noble reason then i find that scary. Can you see why I might?

[lazyriver]

56. Never said I welcomed it and I certainly can see why you would

find acceptance of dishonesty scary. I do too even though I'm arguing that I believe we are being lied to right now on bin laden and I'm not getting worked up about it. I understand we have been lied to for unjust causes quite a bit in the last eight years and I don't expect lying to disappear as a practice in government. Do I want total honesty and transparency from my government? Of course I do. Do I think I'll get it? Sadly, no. Will we have more honesty from Obama? I'd be stunned if we didn't but complete honesty? Please, it won't happen. If there is going to be lying, (and let's just accept for the sake of this argument that there will) isn't it better if the cause is actually to end a war rather than start one?

[MADem]

50. There will be many things Bush will keep from us. He'll have to. It's the very nature of the job.

It seems naive to think otherwise.

I didn't buy THAT excuse, either. The occasional thing, sure. MANY things? Hell, no.

It's not too cool to try to tell us to eat that ghastly reasoning because Obama's in charge, now. Especially about this particular character.

[lazyriver]

60. Perhaps "many" was a poor word to choose but why would

"occasional" be any better if we're talking about honesty? There is honesty and then there isn't.

My premise in reasoning this way is that I believe Obama, unlike Bush, does not want war. I believe Obama to be a good person at his core where Bush is not and never could be. So, yes, if Obama wants to stop the insanity that is Afghanistan, and keeping the idea of bin laden alive even if he's known to be dead helps him accomplish that goal, I could give him a little leeway. Now, if the goal is to keep bombing the hell out that poor country to keep the wheels of the old war machine turning, everything changes. I'd prefer total honesty but just don't think we'll see it.

[MADem]

66. When NATIONAL SECURITY becomes an issue, it's a different thing entirely.

But when every issue is portrayed as a "National Security" issue, then something stinks.

Bush was the guy who said, before he was elected, that he wanted to be a bit of an isolationist. He criticized CLINTON for "adventurism" in Bosnia and told us that he'd AVOID "foreign entanglements." He suggested that he'd "jawbone" his OPEC buddies to "open the spigots."

And since his VP was the SECDEF who designed the drawdown of the military that happened in the nineties, well, why would anyone doubt him?

We saw what happened with those promises!! Straight down the crapper they went--and it was a painful process, too....





On the bright side, Bush has taught us to be leery of our leaders. In that respect, he's kind of done us a favor. I don't like worship on either side of the aisle, because politicians aren't gods, and they'll always fuck up a little, anyway. Some fuck up a lot--like Bush did.

[AwakeAtLast]

78. He's not President yet

Disclosing secret info right now might not be the best idea. Give him some time - only 5 more days!

[TroglodyteScholar]

68. No Keyser Soze???

How about Emmanuel Goldstein?

[nbcouch]

26. Let's get this straight...

...killing OBL has NEVER been essential or necessary!

Keeping OBL around was in fact essential to the BushCo cowboy/boogeyman mythology, but killing one guy, no matter WHO it is, will not stop al Qaeda. Kill their "leaders" and new ones will arise overnight to take their place. If you want to stop al Qaeda, you must first understand what motivates them, and once you understand that you will realize that it is not their nominal leader that keeps them going. They are driven by anti-American ideology which in turn is driven in large part by our own foreign policy. Like it or not, it's not our freedom they hate (more mythology), but rather it's our behavior in the Middle East and elsewhere. When we start to address the issue of American hegemony and its effects around the world, then we'll see the beginning of the end of groups like al Qaeda.

[maxrandb]

27. C'mon DU! Don't fall for this crap

Again, this is what our "assholious" media does now. This is a dumbass, misleading headline, written by a dumbass, misleading reporter. Within seconds, I bet this headline and story was linked to Drudge, and Hannity will be jerking-off to it all afternoon.

To me, it seems like a pretty long stretch from:

"My preference obviously would be to capture or kill him," he said. "But if we have so tightened the noose that he's in a cave somewhere and can't even communicate with his operatives then we will meet our goal of protecting America."

To: Barack Obama: it is no longer essential to kill Osama bin Laden

Notice that nowhere in the story does Obama say the words "it is no longer essential to kill Osama bin Laden". Notice too that, although the statement "it is no longer essential to kill Osama bin Laden", comes immediately after Barack Obama (colon)...as if this is a direct quote from Obama the, it is no longer essential to kill Osama bin Laden text in the headline is not encased with quotation marks.

This is a bit more subtle, but this headline and story is nothing more than...

Q: Answer yes or no, have you stopped beating your wife?

A: I've never beaten my wife

Headline: Man can't confirm that he's stopped beating his wife.

[mcg]

30. Yes, it is a very misleading headline, thank you for pointing that out.

Even worse is "The Washington Times".

I saw the right-wing Moonie cult rag last night at a store.
They are blasting away with both barrels at all things Democratic.
How can anyone consider that trash a newspaper?

[jackpan1260]

59. Agreed. Unfortunately, many duers and non-duers only read headlines before they react. nt

[.... callchet ....]

71. " your wife "

" I've never beaten my wife" It's your wife ! " I've never beaten your wife " That's how my wife tells jokes.

[Dover]

28. Bin Laden was the poster child and excuse for the "War On Terror" as was 9/11.

But as we've been reading lately, they are backing away from the whole "war on terror"
policy propaganda. It's become a liability...or perhaps more accurately, a "LIEability".

Now it seems they will return to the age old recruitment technique...an impoverished country
in search of a 'secure' military job that promises an education and a future. More lies...
If they cannot create a hunger for revenge against an enemy then perhaps they can simply rely on hunger.

[HopeHoops]

29. Bush went from "Dead or Alive" to "Like, Ya know, whatever, man"

How do you "water down" THAT?

[BattyDem]

31. He's removing the "boogie man"

That's a good idea. Make him irrelevant and those "conveniently-timed" audio tapes won't ever have an impact again.

Obama's making it clear that he's going to protect our country from the real threats it faces and he's not going to waste his time chasing ghosts. If we get Bin Laden, fine ... but he recognizes that doing so isn't really going to make us any safer at this point.

It's going to be nice having a "grown up" in charge.

[Connie_Corleone]

33. Here we go again. Yet another misleading headline from the media.

[Dover]

35. Re-packaging - The "War On Terror" model is so last year...

UK foreign minister urges "war on terror" rethink

...The idea of a "war on terror" gave the impression of a unified, transnational enemy, embodied in al Qaeda and its leader Osama bin Laden, Miliband said, when in fact militant groups were diverse and had wide-ranging motivations.

..snip..

While a "war on terror" was a call to arms and an attempt to build solidarity by taking on a single shared enemy, the foundation for solidarity between nations must be based not on "who we are against ... but who we are and the values we share."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090115/wl_nm/us_britain_te...

-------


No more "War On Terror", House committee decrees

By Rick Maze - Staff writer
Posted : Wednesday Apr 4, 2007 16:11:56 EDT

The House Armed Services Committee is banishing the global war on terror from the 2008 defense budget.

This is not because the war has been won, lost or even called off, but because the committee’s Democratic leadership doesn’t like the phrase.

A memo for the committee staff, circulated March 27, says the 2008 bill and its accompanying explanatory report that will set defense policy should be specific about military operations and “avoid using colloquialisms.”

The “global war on terror,” a phrase first used by President Bush shortly after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks on the U.S., should not be used, according to the memo. Also banned is the phrase the “long war,” which military officials began using last year as a way of acknowledging that military operations against terrorist states and organizations would not be wrapped up in a few years.

Committee staff members are told in the memo to use specific references to specific operations instead of the Bush administration’s catch phrases. The memo, written by Staff Director Erin Conaton, provides examples of acceptable phrases, such as “the war in Iraq,” the “war in Afghanistan, “operations in the Horn of Africa” or “ongoing military operations throughout the world.”

“There was no political intent in doing this...cont'd

http://www.armytimes.com/news/2007/04/military_gwot_dem... /

------

U.S. Deployments Expected To Rise
http://www.stripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=...

[Oregone]

36. I hate the superiority comlex and "cave" language we use.

Do we honestly think someone with as many connections as OBL and as much money would be living in a primitive cave? Absurd nonsense. I was hoping some of that arrogance would be shed with Bush.

[ro1942]

38. the American people

like harold pinter said, it's always the American people. that translates to keeping big business safe.

[AngryAmish]

37. Mayb Osama is a Judas Goat.

[Dover]

42. Well, since there was never any proof of bin Laden's participation in 9/11

and continuing to pursue him no longer serves a purpose other than to keep the whole
9/11 issue alive and the questions coming....best to put that ghost or "goat" to rest.

[xchrom]

45. recommend -- that it speaks for itself. nt

[MADem]

48. Why kill the Boogieman?

Gotta have something to scare the kiddies with....to keep them in line? He does turn up at the oddest times, doesn't he?

OTOH, kill him, and he's a martyr. Far better for him to die of some pedestrian ailment.

"Bin Ladin Dies From Infected Ass Boil" is not as dramatic a headline as "Modern Prophet Martyred By Evil Empire."

[Pastiche423]

58. He did die of an untreated lung complication on

December, 26 2001.

[MADem]

84. Well, I won't take THAT to the bank, either. nt

[jillan]

54. Biden just came back from there - maybe he knows something?

[Aristus]

61. Lowering expectations. It's not the PR disaster that "Git him dead or alive!" is

n/t

[smitty]

67. Especially since he's already dead.

[No Elephants]

72. Bush said "Wanted: Dead or Alive" right after 911. He never pursued the policy, though. As

soon as he said it, his peeps told him the statement had been foolhardy, in his typical "all hat" style. And he took it back. By the 2004 debate, he was saying it did not matter. On this, timesonline is ignorant or deceitful, or both. Obama is changing nothing.

[customerserviceguy]

75. Obama knows the only way to kill bin Laden

is to carpet bomb western Pakistan. He's not willing to do this.

I figure there's a reasonable chance that our intelligence services are already intercepting bin Laden's messages to AQ, and killing him keeps us from being able to snoop on what's up with them.

In any case, PE Obama has changed his mind about killing bin Laden after he's been receiving the same top level security briefings that Chimpy and Darth have been getting.

[tomp]

76. he means to tell us there was a time when it was essential to kill bin laden?

that's just silly. like it was essential to kill sadaam hussein? this is our foreign policy? america is sick.

still waiting for change (read: sanity).

[ProgressIn2008]

77. Why keep this fairy tale alive? Will anyone ever dare to speak some truth? nt

[bemildred]

79. Seems pretty clear that it never was essential to kill Osama Bin Laden.

Propaganda tools are better left alive anyway, I suppose.

[Zorra]

81. I'd prefer that he share a cell with Bu*h or Cheney.

Or Rove.

[LynnTheDem]

83. Maybe we could go for the legal thang; capture & trial.

Maybe we could stop advocating for murder.

It's wrong when they do it.

It's wrong when we do it.

[Hannah Bell]

86. benazir bhutto said he was dead. before she was assassinated.

[Belial]

87. Let Obama make his own explanations for his change in policy

Obama said it the first time.. then changed his position.. happens all the time. I wouldn't even say changed his position so far as to clarify it even more.

[meow2u3]

88. We don't need to KILL bin Laden--just take him alive

Just capture him alive, arrest him, charge him, try him, convict him, and let him rot in prison for the rest of his misbegotten life. Killing a fanatical terrorist like OBL amounts to rewarding him for the terror he has wreaked on this world; it will only make a martyr out of him in the eyes of his equally blind followers.

[Imagevision]

89. geeze I hope we're not going to start hearing these change of plans for the next 4 years from Barack

[timtom]

90. So, he's pretending to buy into the myth of Osama bin Laden, eh?

Hmmm...