Hollywood out of step with American morals: poll

[onehandle]

Source: Reuters

LOS ANGELES (Hollywood Reporter) – A majority of Americans say Hollywood doesn't share their moral values, according to a poll commissioned by the Anti-Defamation League, a group that fights anti-Semitism.

Sixty-one percent of those surveyed said that religious values in America are "under attack," and 59% agreed that "the people who run the TV networks and the major movie studios do not share the religious and moral values of most Americans."

The poll, titled "American Attitudes on Religion, Moral Values and Hollywood," was conducted by the Marttila Communications Group, which surveyed 1,000 adults nationwide. It was released Friday at the ADL's annual meeting in Los Angeles.

"These findings point to the challenges that we face in dealing with issues of religion in society," said Abraham H. Foxman, ADL national director. "The belief that religion is under attack underlies the drive to incorporate more religion into American public life. Disturbingly, 43% of Americans believe there is an organized campaign by Hollywood and the national media to weaken the influence of religious values in this country."

Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20081117/us_nm/us_poll

[WillParkinson]

1. And, of course, you can't refute it....

Because they're religious and say it's true.

[shadowknows69]

22. So, the people on a soap box over Hollywood are going to stop watching

TV, going to movies, renting DVD's listening to their right wing radio gods? Where do they think Rush Limbaugh is produced? Kansas?

[BlueJazz]

2. Oh Brother ..Here we go again with the "Poor Me..I'm Religion and I'm Sooo abused"

Seems to me there is a church on every 3th corner in America...The clergy gets to harass and comment on just about any damn subject whether it has to do with politics or not...the churches make Billions and then there's George's comments >>>>

Think about it. Religion has actually convinced people that there’s an invisible man, living in the sky, who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever ’til the end of time!

But He loves you.

He loves you, and He needs money! He always needs money! He’s all-powerful, all-perfect, all-knowing, and all-wise, somehow just can’t handle money! Religion takes in billions of dollars, they pay no taxes, and they always need a little more. Now, you talk about a good bullshit story. Holy Shit!

[ixion]

3. amazing, isn't it?

this society (and so many others) are built up around a fairytale.

The mind boggles.

[customerserviceguy]

12. The result of agriculture

Religion was needed to keep people in line as societies grew. We're stuck with a lot of the legacy of that time, but by moving to an industrialized society, with a significant service component, we can leave the old ways behind with each passing generation.

[shrike]

27. Not exactly

There's plenty of evidence that hunter-gatherer societies/nomads/what-have-you had spiritual beliefs, totems, rituals, burial traditions, etc.

[customerserviceguy]

29. Hunter-gatherer societies did have belief systems

but they sure never did the damage that post-agricultural societies' religions did. The idea that you had to die for an ideal or for your country (or tribe) was noticeably non-existent in those societies. That's one of the several reasons the Spanish conquistidors were able to take over native American populations five hundred years ago.

Agriculture inspired religions that saw nature as an enemy ("be fruitful and multiply"), fostered sexism, and propped up kleptocracies. Tribal belief systems were more at harmony with natural processes, and did not legitimize many of the things that "leaders" have done in the name of religion to either their own people, or others.

[shrike]

31. Okay. Let's start with the war question

Hunter-gatherer societies fought ALL the time. Just not for the reasons we associate with organized planned, wars and invasions, etc.

They fought over land, they fought over women, they fought over food, they fought over resources; they fought over ancient grudges that went back generations.

Here are some examples of how these folks lived: the Asmat, of Papua, had such an entrenched warrior culture that they built watchtowers to keep a look out for their enemies. The Batak erected natural forts by planting thorn bushes in clumps, which would then grow up into a fence.

Nomadic tribes may not have had ideals and national identities in the way we define them, but they did have something else: clan and tribal identity. This, more than anything else, was responsible for intra-peoples violence that occurred in Africa, North America, South America and Asia long before outsiders showed up. One thing these peoples did have going for them was that their populations were small; life was hard, mortality rates were outrageous, and the territories were VAST. The key to peace seems to have been distance; if your group could keep to itself, have enough to eat and make enough babies to replenish the population, you'd live in relative peace.

In the New World, the English and French realized immediately that they could divide and conquer. They exploited ancient grudges and long-time tribal rivalries, and longtime enemies invariably fought on opposing sides in the various wars. There is an amazing speech given by a victorious chief, at a surrender agreement following a conflict between the British and Americans. His speech was directed at a chief who belonged to a tribe which was a traditional enemy of his people. He said, to put it in modern-day terms, "You're my bitch."

Please understand, I'm not excusing the actions of the Spanish, French, English or anyone else (Quite frankly, one of the worst things they brought to the New World may have disease. Indigenous probably died of bugs their bodies couldn't fight as anything else) but I do think we do a disservice to these peoples by romanticizing them, by assuming that all they did was frolic happily through the meadows until the big, bad invaders showed up. It robs them of their humanity, IMO. They were people, they WERE our brothers, in more ways than one. They were HUMAN, with all tha baggage and the frailties that entails.

[customerserviceguy]

34. No question that hunter-gatherer societies fought

and I didn't mean to imply that they were all peaceful. But they didn't have fake patriotism that inspired them to go off and conquer resources and peoples that were outside of their hunting-gathering grounds.

Indeed, humans have all conflicted with each other througout history, I did not mean to minimize that. It's just that the population densities that agriculture supports have given rise to chiefdoms and especially states that were able to develop more sophisticated weapons, and the philosophies necessary to use them. A nomad whacking another nomad from across the river to take his limited belongings is a far cry from being able to climb into a fighter plane and drop bombs on hundreds or thousands of people below, that the warrior never sees. It takes religion and patriotism to really get people to do that.

As agriculture turned the stone tool into the bronze tool and into the steel tool, it also turned the idea of a "common defense" into something much more than looking out for one's feeding grounds. And it provided the means for rulers to consolidate power over people to fight someone who was not a natural enemy.

[shrike]

35. Please don't discount the importance of ethnicity and clans, even today

A former U.N. peacekeeper, an atheist, wrote an item on Dawkins' site, of all places, saying that outsiders have the Balkan conflict all wrong: it's not religious, but ethnic. The former Yugoslavia was a communist nation for years, and fully 50 percent of the population self-identify as atheist; the truly religious are considered a curiousity. Even the terms "Christian and Muslim" don't mean what we think they do; they're more like nametags for which side you're on.

I always feel a bit alarmed when people indicate that all we need to do is remove outside influences (religion and nationalism are the usual culprits), and all will be well. We are who we are -- and in fact, I believe we DO require some controls, lest we descend into anarchy and chaos.

I also think science has already provided an important clue to why we do what we do: We share 98 percent of our DNA with the chimpanzee. I'd done some reading on chimp culture (and it is a culture) and it sounds pretty damned familiar.

[customerserviceguy]

41. Again, agreed, culture is as least as important as religion

in determining the propensity of people to fight.

I was just trying to make the point that a lot of the baggage of religion that we currently suffer from (the sub-post I was responding to referred to this society (and so many others) being built upon a fairytale) came as a result of humanity's transition to agriculture. It allowed us to be sedentary enough to erect temples, and write books, and use the interpretations of those writings to enslave people for the benefit of the rulers at the top. Hopefully, we will continue to make the transition from the 5,000 years of agricultural mindset to the freedoms of thought that were wrought by the Industrial Revolution.

But we will still have to get people over the old hates of the past. A reasonable prosperity for all with a cessation of hostilities for a few generations will go a long way to healing those divisions. I see the international missions in the Balkans as being an extension of the peace that was forged in Western Europe after WWII. Hopefully, this will be the answer for the Israelis and Palestinians, as well.

[shrike]

42. You're more hopeful than I

Mankind has almost unlimited capacity for hate. And an almost unlimited capacity to do harm: Corporations buying up public water supplies, international drug cartels, the human trafficking business, etc., etc., all fueled by mankind's only true god: money. And t'was ever thus: the end result of any war was land and resources.

And, as I've said, we can't run away from who we are. Changing outside forces is not going to change our basic nature, which is violent, tribal, aggressive. We are who we are.

And no offense, but I find it strange terms to hear someone talking about the industrial revolution in positive terms. There have been reams of books written by people who feel quite differently. And who see agricultural man in quite a different light. You're more than entitled to your POV, and I understand where you're coming from; it's just that usually I hear quite the opposite.

[xxqqqzme]

32. sort of like wearing the same underwear

when you're on a winning streak?

[shrike]

33. Maybe

Though I doubt they wore underwear.

[defendandprotect]

9. George Carlin was "godly" in his real concerns -- to me, anyway --!!

[customerserviceguy]

13. I got to see him live

a month before he passed on, it was a privilege! I remember hearing "Hippy Dippy Weatherman" when they first played it on the radio back in the mid 1960's!

[notadmblnd]

4. Well if they'd take their religion back to church where it belongs

then no one would attack them. When they bring it into my everyday life in an attempt to impose it on me, you're damn right I'm going to attack it.

[Mugweed]

5. Amen...

When you push your religious beliefs into my public schools, into my workplace, into the workings of my local/state/federal legislatures, then you can rest assured I'm going to attack them. Keep your primitive superstitions to yourself.

All organized religion is a scam.

[LanternWaste]

30. As is politics, philosophy and other human constructs...

"All organized religion is a scam."

As is politics, philosophy and other human constructs that exist no where but in our own faith...

[santamargarita]

6. Now that "Jesus George" Bush is finally out, these Christian Fascists...

...are back to the same shit as before!

[ClusterFreak]

7. If anyone is looking to Hollywood for moral guidance....

...they need their head examined.

:eyes:

[Dogtown]

8. How I wish

it *were* under attack.

[defendandprotect]

10. I don't think these are religious "values" -- more like distortions, hatred, intolerance --

[tanyev]

11. I'm guessing this was not a completely random sample.

Question number one: What church do you attend? None? OK, thank you for your time, godless heathen.

[customerserviceguy]

14. The entertainment media are always on the cutting edge

of changing societal mores. We made a fairly big leap about thirty years ago with the VCR, it used to be that if you wanted to hear a "dirty" word uttered from a star's mouth, you had to be close enough to the big city to find a movie theater. The VCR brought "R" rated movies to the boondocks long before satellite technology was affordable.

I expect the Internet is doing the very same thing. The old moralists are losing control of the younger generations faster than ever before, and they're mighty alarmed about it. Certainly, the youth vote for Obama must really scare them silly.

[Marrah_G]

15. Hollywood makes what sells

So I call Bullshit on the morality police. If people were so at odds with Hollywood values then why would they still be purchasing what Hollywood is selling.

[Brazenly Liberal]

16. This, of course, is a huge lie.

It's an old, oft-told lie, but a lie nonetheless and Reuters should be ashamed of themselves for doing their bit to perpetuate it. (I'd love to see the actual poll - this reeks of push, neh?)

There is, of course, the 21st century martyrdom craze. Every conservative (and, let's face it, some liberals) with an ounce of religion in them can't wait to tell you how persecuted they are.

But there is also the sad little unrequited crush they have on Hollywood.

The truth is conservatives love Hollywood to death. Television, films and "the national media" are businesses. They offer products they expect to make money. When something is successful, they imitate it right into the ground. If the "religious and moral values" of most Americans did not allow for packing as much sex and violence as possible into a film or TV show, they wouldn't shell out the dough to see it and Hollywood would stop making it. It's as simple as that.

Beyond the obvious fact that they buy what's being made out there is the other salient bit of info: While Rush and his ditto-butts sneer at any show biz person offering an opinion or taking a stand on political issues and scoff at Al Franken, they very carefully don't mention which party actually puts the entertainers in office every chance they get. Ahnold, Ronnie Reagan, Sonny Bono, even that guy that played Gopher- these guys aren't Democrats.

When I had a huge crush on Kent Kelly and he ignored me, I went around claiming I never liked him to begin with. A little pathetic, but it was 6th grade, after all. If I was still pretending to despise people who had rejected me, I'd be really pathetic. And Republican.

[LiberalFighter]

17. How many actors and actresses have grown up outside of California?

I'm sure quite a few.

[Gman2]

18. Poorly worded.

People think that Hollywood is bankrupt morally. Not necessarily religious. We have contestants killing themselves outside of judges homes for Amer. idol. We have 24/7 hookup shows for teens. Insult and holler cable politics. They feed us innane drivel, that is cheap. We have little real entertainment anymore. Movies are just an excuse to blow shit up. No human dialogue. If there is any, it hits you over the head, with political correctness. We need an INDY renaissance.

[WCGreen]

19. And the biggest perpetrators of attacking traditional values is...

The Christian Broadcasting Compnay, all those hate filled preachers tho take to the Air, Trinity Broadcasting network...

Look, these people can't raise the money they need to live in the lifestyle they have grown accustomed to unless they scare the beejeedees out of the flock to send them as much money as they can...

[lelgt60]

20. I think the single most important ideal that needs to be taught in schools is...

Well, #1 is the Golden Rule, but after that:

In the USA, the word democracy DOES NOT MEAN simply "majority rules".

I can't tell you the number of times people have told me this to justify nasty positions...often "religious" positions.

Kids need to be taught that the thing that really makes the USA system good isn't just democracy, but the COMBINATION of democracy with the requirement to respect human rights as defined in the Constitution and interpreted by the courts. It needs to be emphasized that you can't pass laws that tread on the rights of minorities.

[Edith Ann]

21. Hollywood Morals

Somebody is buying those movie tickets and watching those horrible TV shows. Somebody is making the movie and TV industry rich. Most of them probably answered that poll. BTW, if we do away with sex on tv all we will have left is violence. The conservative right don't mind watching people getting blown up.

[Bragi]

23. Go Hollywood!! /NT

[CBHagman]

24. Context, dear DUers.

First of all, this is a survey we're talking about, a sampling of attitudes, not a platform statement. We'd have to know more about the survey and the methods employed.

Secondly, the group in question is the Anti-Defamation League of B'nai B'rith we're talking about, not the Catholic League of Decency (Google it if you're under a certain age). Please note the stances the ADL takes on certain key issues:

http://www.adl.org/PresRele/CvlRt_32/5322_32.htm

ADL urges the committees to reaffirm a commitment to the separation of church and state:

Faith-Based Initiatives: The Faith-Based Initiative raises serious questions of both law and policy and has distorted the appropriate role of government in the provision of social services. Every component of the initiative should maintain essential constitutional safeguards for protecting religious organizations, beneficiaries and the government (more).


School Vouchers: Vouchers pose a serious threat to the values that are vital to the health of American democracy. These programs subvert the constitutional principle of separation of church and state and threaten to undermine our system of public education (more).


Creationism and "Intelligent Design:" Creationism, creation science and "intelligent design" theory are all religious theories of creation offered to explain the origins of the universe and are based on varying interpretations of the Bible. ADL has consistently opposed these troubling initiatives and advocates the right of students to learn science independent of religious doctrine (more).


Religion in the Military: ADL is concerned that religious harassment and unwelcome proselytizing are an ongoing problem in the military and the nation's service academies. The League calls for Congressional oversight and hearings toward the adoption of consistent guidelines to address reports of religious intolerance and proselytizing in the armed forces (more).

There's a good deal more at the ADL website, including such issues as civil marriage for same-sex couples (The ADL is for it) and so forth.

Finally, as some have mentioned elsewhere on this thread, the survey doesn't answer the question of how we reconcile evidence of the popular appetite, such as it is, for what the entertainment industry churns out -- torture porn, reality TV, and all -- with the report from this survey. A lot of people buy tickets to the latest family-oriented animated fare, but there's no shortage of viewers for slasher flicks either.

Oh, and as for the notion that Hollywood is generally ahead of the curve, think again. Think of how African-Americans were portrayed back in the day. Think of the Production Code. Think of blacklisting. Granted, there is the proud tradition of Hollywood liberalism, but there's also the more shameful legacy of racism, sexism, etc., that afflicted the entertainment industry. It is, after all, a business, and prone to all the bad behavior we see in other fields.

[underpants]

25. This survey is the result AND has the purpose of shaping opinion not reflecting it

people believe this crap because they have had it drilled into their heads

[CBHagman]

37. "Has the purpose"?

Please read the quote from Abraham Foxman.

http://www.adl.org/PresRele/RelChStSep_90/5392_90.htm

"These findings point to the challenges that we face in dealing with issues of religion in society," said Abraham H. Foxman, ADL National Director. "The belief that religion is under attack underlies the drive to incorporate more religion into American public life. Disturbingly, 43% of Americans believe there is an organized campaign by Hollywood and the national media to weaken the influence of religious values in this country."

(SNIP)

"It is troubling that so many Americans feel as if the output of Hollywood is part of an organized campaign to undermine religious values in this country and believe that censorship is acceptable," said Mr. Foxman. "It shows that in this age of pervasive media and the widening availability of the Internet, many Americans still maintain a very parochial view toward the information age, and even believe in censorship to 'protect morality.' If anything, it points to the need for a greater awareness of the fundamental role that the First Amendment has played in helping religious freedom in America to be sustained, and indeed, to flourish."

The reference to the First Amendment is key in that statement.

[...of J.Temperance]

26. Nobody gives a shit what the ADL think

And Abraham Foxman is a Right-Wing idiot anyhow.

[Behind the Aegis]

40. Idiotic ad hominem.

Foxman is "right-wing?" LOL! Prove it!

[noonwitch]

28. If they don't like Hollywood movies, they can make their own movies.

If they can get funding. They kind of cut their own throats on this stuff. They loved Mel Gibson for "The Passion", but then hated him when his company considered producing "Farenheit 911".

Disney makes family-safe movies and television shows, but they hate them for hiring gays and treating them as well as their straight employees, and having "Gay Day" at Disneyworld. They did make "The Lion, The Witch and The Wardrobe", a story with christian themes, into a good movie.

Pat Robertson tried to produce a soap opera in the 80s. It was one of the most unintentionally hilarious things I've ever seen. It was called "Another Life"-maybe it's available on dvd? It's very funny. It lasted a couple of years, and didn't get good enough ratings to stay around.

TD Jakes has made a good, entertaining and deep movie-even if you don't like his message overall or his politics (I don't), "Woman, Thou Art Loosed" is a very good study about compassion, grace and forgiveness. It also has some good insights about sexual abuse and it's effects on multiple generations of women in families.

I also caught "The Gospel" one day on BET, which I think also has a connection to Jakes. It was a good look at what happens behind the scenes in churches, and it had some great music.

[onager]

36. Here's a nice moral song from a recent movie!

Well, fairly recent. And it even mentions Jesus! And praying and stuff! Very moral...

Cox: In my dreams you're blowing me...some kisses.
Darlene: That's one of my favorite things to do.
Cox: You and I could go down...in history.
Darlene: That's what I'm praying to do with you.

(Chorus: Together)
Let's du-et, in ways that make us feel good,
Let's du-et, and make that sacred sound,
Put two and two together,
Perfect harmony we found.
We know it's only natural, lets du-et!

Cox: I'm going to beat off...all my demons.
Darlene: That's what loving Jesus is all about.
Cox: Looking in your eyes, I start believing.
Darlene: Let's bring this whisper to a shout.

Chorus

Cox: Did I hear you sighing?
Darlene: What are you implying?
Cox: Look a little tired.
Darlene: Music's got me wired.
Cox: Pretty good looking
Darlene: Boy we're really cooking
Together: Now!

Cox: I just want to make out...what you're saying.
Darlene: Read my lips, it's what you're looking for.
Cox: Here I am a-sneaking up behind ya.
Darlene: You can always come in my backdoor.

Chorus

"Let's Duet" from Walk Hard: The Dewey Cox Story

[Blue_Tires]

38. well art (and i use the word "art" very loosely with hollywood) is

supposed to push the cultural norm, while at the same time being a mirror of society...

[Skittles]

39. oh what a load of crap

more evidence of what deluded rightwing propaganda has done to the critical thinking skills of so many