Pro Clinton Bloggers boycott Daily Kos

[kitty1]

Source: Ny Times

On Friday, it got to be too much for Alegre, a diarist on the flagship liberal blog DailyKos, who frequently writes in support of Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton.

“I’ve put up with the abuse and anger because I’ve always believed in what our online community has tried to accomplish in this world,” Alegre wrote Friday evening. “No more.”

Objecting to the tone of attacks against Mrs. Clinton and her supporters on the blog, the diarist called for a “writers strike.”

“This is a strike - a walkout over unfair writing conditions at DailyKos. It does not mean that if conditions get better I won’t ‘work’’ at DailyKos again,” Alegre wrote, promising to come back only “if we ever get to the point where we’re engaging each other in discussion rather than facing off in shouting matches.”

There seems to be some common angst from both Kos and DU on the Clinton Front for some reason.
The GOP must be licking their chops over this.

Read more: http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/03/15/blogtalk-... /

[Duke Newcombe]

1. Good luck in their new locations...

...or, as I heard from a fellow DUer...

oh tough ass!!!

Duke

[mdmc]

2. McCain avoids kos too

too bad DU can't make the HRC avoid list

[aquart]

25. Really? Are you DEMOCRATIC souls trying to drive us off?

More than one opinion too much for you to take? Cults never like that sort of thing.

Rhinoceros.

[mdmc]

58. I really don't mind the true Clinton supporters

While that ain't my bag, I do see her as the most electable and least likable. I am sure she can win against McCain.

[Xenotime]

67. What the FUCK is that supposed to mean?!?

The last time I checked this was the DEMOCRATIC Underground. Not the Obama Underground. Go start your own blog.

[choie]

72. if only...

[Nitrogenica]

3. They're watching FOX news instead.

[msongs]

4. only obama worshippers are welcome there now. but it's a private site so

big deal.

Msongs

[buff2]

7. I'm glad I never hung out there

[Gore Edwards]

54. contempt

It's good that we've (progessives) have caught up to the right-wing on the internet. It may be that we have become them as a result. When Free Republic peppered a poll in 2000 that said Americans just wanted a resolution to the 2000 election results, it tilted on cnn.com an enormous amount of influence in the general population. That's a good thing that we've learned. But the left leaning web sites don't seem to have learned that. BuzzMax or Newsflash, or Dcause don"t seem to understand that we don't want to be told who to vote for. Just give us the facts. Don't editorialize directly or by proxy. This is the most important election of our lives. DU(I'm proud of you) Does it right. Talk chat whatever But don"t have front pages that propagandize in and against your favorite candidate and against your less favorite candidate. Put your choice on top of your page. We'll know where you stand. Stop the busht. I am a Gore Edwards supporter but I am also a Gore anyone supporter and also an Edwards/anyone supporter.

[monmouth]

5. Buh-bye now, take care...n/t

[mod mom]

6. Too bad I dislike their set-up, as it would be a lovely sanctuary compared to dealing with

corporate loving Clinton folks here. I bet the KOS folks think they went to heaven.

If any Clinton folks fell like doing a full internet boycott-I think you could really make a point!

[buff2]

8. It's really weird

You obama supporters hate Hillary more than you do McLame. Guess who will win in Nov. against Obama?

[FrenchieCat]

9. Not Hillary?

and Not McCain?

That would leave Obama as the winner....which is what we want.

Thanks for the encouragement. It is always welcomed!

[mod mom]

Real Democrats wouldn't use smear tactics against other Dems. I prefer the positive issue based

of Senator Obama.

We've has enough of a president who puts his corporate cronies first, and is easily persuaded to go war w/o merit.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

19. Sums up how I feel.

[Tarheel_Dem]

41. mod mom, you're exactly right....

these are the same bloggers we all cheered on when they took on joe lieberman. Have the clintonites considered that the real netroots haven't forgiven Sen. clinton for her IWR vote, and her triangulation since? True progressives were appalled by the invasion of iraq, and they are equally appalled by the DLC, so I don't know why the sudden outrage that they aren't thrilled with the candidacy of Hillary.

I remember early on her refusal to denounce this disaster of a war, her only problem seemed to be with the "prosecution" of the war by Rumsfeld...I knew then, that I could never support her.

[fascisthunter]

42. Real Democrats Wouldn't Go as Low As Hillary Has

nor would they embrace the DLC either.

[RichKay]

75. Oh No???

I believe you already have.

[marshall]

79. People hate a turncoat far more than a sworn enemy

Benedict Arnold is one of the better known names out of the Revolutionary War--far better known than any of the British generals and Crown loyalists.

[stillcool]

21. yeah...me too...

I used to like Hillary, before the Primary. Now I think she must have always been a Jekyll & Hyde. I feel the same way about some posters. I had no idea.

[bowens43]

10. they sound more like bushes 19 percenters ecery day.

[Umbram]

11. "unfair writing conditions" oh please...

Are we suppose to equate this with unfair living conditions or unfair working conditions?

[Alexander]

12. Translation: "We're outnumbered whiny babies, so we're taking our ball and going home."

You'd think these Clinton supporters would be able to argue for good reasons to vote for Hillary, rather than leaving websites in a huff.

Maybe they just can't think of any.

[jaybeat]

29. No, it's "We can't argue rationally against a cult of personality."

Can't say I blame them.

Something tells me people will be awfully contrite when McBlame wins in November.

I mean, I hope he doesn't, and I'll work like hell to elect the Dem, but it really feels sometimes like Obama's supporters think the United Corporations of America are just going to hand over the keys without a fight.

I fear we are all in for a very nasty surprise around just how low they will go to keep what they've got.



And while I remain undecided, I can't shake the feeling that the Obama world just really doesn't have a clue. The Clintons, at least, know what we're up against.

[gtar100]

35. I don't see that. I think Obama is going to be more than ready.

I don't know where you got that "Obama's supporters think the United Corporations of America are just going to hand over the keys without a fight". You couldn't be more wrong about that with me and many others on this board. The Clintons aren't the only one's who know what the right wing is capable of. And just because they've been through the wringer with them doesn't mean they're the best ones to handle it. They haven't exactly done anything extraordinary to combat the right-wing attack machine. In fact, the right wing became a very dominant force in the US *during* Bill Clinton's presidency.

So maybe the Clintons know what we're up against. But I have yet to see from them that they are really the ones who can beat it. If Hillary wins, I hope you're right. But whoever does, it's not going to be just them doing the fighting, we've got to do a lot of the work too. There are still a lot of Republicans out there salivating over Social Security, Medicaid and any other social program they think could put more money in their pocket if it were destroyed.

Listen to more of Obama's speeches and interviews. I think you'll find he has no illusions about it either. Just a different tact.

[jaybeat]

55. I hope you're right

What worries me is how bent out of shape pro-Obama people get when the RW attacks bubble up. "Hillary is so MEAN! She's going to destroy the party!" You think McBlame is going to try and do anything BUT destroy the party? You think he and Rove aren't following the Buchanan 1972 playbood RIGHT NOW? (I don't mean you, personally.)

I agree that the Clinton's have compromised and triangulated with the Repukes far too much. But at least they've taken the worst the creeps could throw at them and are still standing. I worry that the Obama campaign's response to the right-wing smears is too much like Kerry's. I hope I'm wrong. I really do. But I worry that I have to hope, and that there isn't more of a record there for me to KNOW.

[Alexander]

48. You would be 100% correct if you stopped at "we can't argue rationally".

You really can't.

[jaybeat]

56. Thanks for proving my point

One Obama supporter replied to my post intelligently. (Hint, it wasn't you.)

THAT'S exactly what I'm worried about. If YOU can't respond with substance, what does that say about the overall Obama "movement."

My very unscientific sample shows we have a 50-50 chance of getting our heads handed to us in the fall. But if we surveyed the overall level of discourse on GD-P, the odds would get a hell of a lot worse.

[nolabels]

59. Only people who are against Obama have intelligence

Some inane comments need not be replied to. Also the results of attrition often has the losing side retreating. You and your fellow types of posters here are a movement (or a cult). A five to one preference has your camp in the minority here. I was also here long before you got here and will probably still be here when you leave. I was originally never a Obama supporter but just lately became lukewarm to the Obama campaign (thanks in part to the Hilary supporters).

I don't prefer to debate about the personalities here at DU, but since you chose to call them out what have you really got say

[jaybeat]

60. Huh?

Some inane comments need not be replied to.

Yours certainly qualifies, but here I am, against my better judgment...

You and your fellow types of posters here are a movement (or a cult).

Funny, because I could easily say the same about you. In fact, many in the Obama "movement" choose to use that word. But, what I have yet to hear anyone rationally discuss is, if yours is in fact a "movement," what does that movement stand for? Vague words about a "new kind of politics," or the concrete policy proposals that are, in fact, 99% the same as his opponent?

That's why I remain undecided. And why you're full of shit when you talk about my "camp."

I was also here long before you got here and will probably still be here when you leave.

Don't be so sure and so righteous! I'm honestly not sure how long I've been reading or posting, but it started way before the '04 elections. And, unlike so many Obama folks who declare how they'd rather draw and quarter Hillary than vote for her in the fall, I will support the Democratic nominee, period.

I was originally never a Obama supporter but just lately became lukewarm to the Obama campaign...

Me, too!

But it is posts like yours that keep holding me back.

[nolabels]

65. Yea, it was a pretty stupid post on my part, thanks for pointing that out

Kind of just woke this morning on the wrong side of the bed or something. After reading a few of your previous posts i can see you are just in the same kind of boat as me. Really angry about the whole thing and seeing how on a lot levels it is very pointless and unnecessary. Really though this place was once a place people would ponder issues and not personalities.

btw, thanks the help making me seem self-righteous, it's usually not my shtick but if it gets things fired up (even if i am nonfactual somewhat or a whole lot)....well you know

[kitty1]

37. Huff Post has some interesting comments on this blog story..n/t

[RichKay]

76. I cant think of any good reason . . .

NOT to vote for Hilary Clinton. Ive not read a single piece of persuasive evidence from all the vast amount of DU editorialization on Hilary that would pursuade me otherwise. Im bored by the "she voted for the Iraq war argument." If you had ever bothered to read the speach Hilary gave on the authorization to use force amendment you would see that her vote did not extend to preemptive war. Lets put the blame for the war on where it belongs. The true facts of Hilary's political career and accomplishments are well recorded and they hardly need to be defended by arguments which are opinion based and factually incorrect.

[mtnester]

80. Her name is spelled Hillary

so you might want to watch that tell

[BlueJac]

13. Repubicons must move on.........

the are the cancer that has infiltrated the the political discussion.

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

14. maybe they can blog for Faux News

Geraldine Ferraro is a news analyst there

[fightthegoodfightnow]

15. Oh That's Sure to Win Over Supporters of Either When This Ends

Good grief.

And Alegre isn't SCREAMING by threatening to walk out? GIve me a break. She's screaming like a child.

[NashVegas]

16. It's That Damn Civility Gap Again

[onehandle]

17. The Kos community was mostly behind Edwards, but now they have to settle for a second choice.

Oh, well.

[cap]

18. guys, we will want to have the Hillary supporters with us in November

let's let handle them gently, allow them some time to mourn and then transition them back in November.

Obama is not running as a third party candidate. He will need their support come November. We are running on a platform of high mindness. Let's try and cultivate the grace and style of our candidate.

If there's a split in the party in November, we will all rue harsh words.

[TML]

20. They're Gone

If you keep track of Taylor Marsh's blog, they're already talking about voting for John McCain to spite Obama. That's right. They're calling themselves McCain Democrats.

With Democrats like these, who needs Republicans?

[cap]

24. not all of them by far...

and they can return easily if we allow them to transition back.

[TML]

46. Here's an idea

We can make them take one of those loyalty oaths that are popular with the Bush administration. They're probably used to the idea already.

[JerseygirlCT]

63. I think there's truth here. And no one should be made to return to the party

with tails between their legs. No one likes having to belittle themselves. So yes, make room for us all to be one party again. Frankly, the sooner we get that focus back, the better.

[Ramsey]

70. That's a pretty sweeping generalization

That may apply to a handful of people, but I'd be very very surprised if the majority of Clinton supporters actually planned to support McCain.

[aquart]

26. How nice of you to consider us.

Be sure we consider you, too.

[AX10]

34. I have made it very clear that I will not be supporting Obama...

in the fall.

[neverforget]

44. 4 more wars! 4 more wars! 4 more wars! that'll show Obama to have the gall

to win the nomination. SCOTUS? Who cares? I wanted Hillary but I can't so I will punish the US with more right wing judges and more war! That'll show'em!

Ah! I don't like Hillary but I will vote for her if she is the nominee.

[ima_sinnic]

49. aw, isn't that special? well, I made it clear long ago I would never support the war-loving HRC

excuse me, the corporate ass-kissing, status quo-loving, negative campaigning, John McCain endorsing, riding-on-her-husband's-coattails, wink-&-a-nod payola-grubbing HRC.

[madrchsod]

52. then why are you here?

[americaheldhostile]

43. Re: How nice of you to consider us

aquart wrote: Be sure we consider you, too.

Amen! Just as Hillary can't win the GE without Obama's supporters, Obama can't win without Hillary's supporters. So, I appeal to those who want to trash and alienate others' supporters on DU and elsewhere: PLEASE stop and think about what you're doing to the Democratic Party and our chances in the fall with such tactics. Best regards.

[JerseygirlCT]

62. Oh I agree. But I have to wonder at the degree

of vitriol there. Is it even possible that they could rally around the Democratic party nominee if that nominee isn't their chosen one?

I know I'm less than happy with Clinton. I really dislike the way she's run this campaign- a huge disappointment to me, and it makes me think much less of her.

But damn if she isn't my candidate if she wins this nomination. I'm a Democrat; I'll vote for our choice in November.

[2peaches2]

22. Daily Kos posters have gotten hostile

to almost everyone who doesn't bow down and kiss Obama's feet. The postings are so angry and unconstructive that I have had to stop reading most of them. It matters not whether you supported Edwards, Clinton or anyone else as the attacks were consistantly angry to all. If we, the Democratic base, can't get along now how the hell are we going to fight McCain? The anger and abuse is so high that I can see many walking away and not supporting the candidate in November. For years I have ignored the Repubs saying that we were "fractured" but now it is so evident that I am afraid that it can't be repaired in time.
I for one, will not be going back to Daily Kos until things settle down and people are all treated with a minimum of respect.

[IndependentDem]

23. This is horrible

we as a party and as americans need to step back and remember who the real "enemy" is. we cannot rejoice over a large portion of our party breaking off, we need to stop ridiculing and bashing each other. we need to remember that our differences are very insignificant when compared to the differences we have with the republicans that are benefiting from all of our internal bleeding. I ask for each of you to go over to freerepublic.com and remember why WE ALL cannot allow the right wing to control our country for another 4 years. So please, the next time that you disagree with an obama supporter or a clinton supporter and want to bash a fellow democrat please take a step back and go read a ridiculous posts like this http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1985711/posts or something like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qNi7tPanUA then start a thread bashing the fucks that deserve it.

[PSPS]

30. You're baying at the moon, I'm afraid

The same environment exists here at DU as well. Why do you think they had to take special steps to permit people to "ignore" GD-P?

Obama fanatics are still furious over that and regularly circumvent the rules to keep the childish shouting matches alive by posting "editorials," "political videos" and, apparently, "LBN" (like this thread) which quickly degenerate into cultish derision of anyone who states any opinion that doesn't fit with the "come to Obama" mentality (again, like this thread.)

I still can't understand it, though I have some ideas regarding what might be behind it. And it's up to the candidates to do something about it. The republicans are the real enemy here, and it's breathtaking to see so many people forgetting or, perhaps more accurately, dismissing that fact.

It's would have been hard to imagine any scenario that would result in a republican victory in November, but this is handing it to them on a platter.

(By the way, I've never heard any Clinton supporter say they would vote for McCain if their candidate wasn't nominated. But almost to a person, that's what I've heard Obama supporters say. That's something worth remembering when reading some of the replies upthread, as it parallels republican behavior over the last seven years.)

[IndependentDem]

32. thats why i have refrained from posting

although tonight was my first time posting here at DU, i have been here for a while and have watched this place deteriorate. it all seems to have started when edwards bailed... possibly because the obama/clinton supporters felt they had to win over the edwards people. i dont know, but i know that i dont want to be involved in demeaning fellow democrats because of who they support. recently i had decided to not post here until this primary was over.. but today i decided that if enough of us that care more about the party than we do the nominee start reminding people who we should be mad at, then maybe we can pull this place back together.

[gatlingforme]

27. I can understand why this came about, I would not want to

write at Kos if they are being beligerent towards my opinions, as we all have them, I guess if you can't go along with the majority you are not welcome, sounds like a little REPUBLICAN to me.....

[AX10]

33. Kos, Huffpost, TPM, are militant in their opposition to HRC.

I do not read any of those sites.

[frog92969]

45. Have you looked for the reasons why?

[Pastiche423]

73. Might it be that they are anti-DLC?

As opposed to you that must think the DLC is the way to go? Ya know, the republican wing of the Democratic Party?

[Politicalboi]

28. There seems to be some common angst from both Kos and DU on the Clinton Front for some reason.

For some reason????? Try telling Hillary not to steal an election.

[Purveyor]

31. I never could accept the KOS website format, albeit I tried... eom

[tinrobot]

36. Striking essentially means not supporting your candidate.

Brilliant move.

[Oslo]

38. GBCW diaries often backfire

I feel the folks who do them fantasize about what the blog will be like without them. If your mad, leave...no one's stopping you. No need for pity.

[DBoon]

39. I'm so glad I voted for Edwards

someone who could lose with poise and dignity

[CreekDog]

40. Have they considered DU?

Please?








not really, well, sometimes...

[crimsonblue]

47. Isn't this kind of self defeating?

I mean, if all the Hillary supporters decide to boycott dkos, the most popular liberal blog on the nets, then there won't be anything but negative articles on her. The average guy doesn't spend hours online at blog sites and forums, so they may spend just 10 or 15 min at dkos. Follow my logic: if people go to dkos and read only negative Hil or Pro-Barack articles and diaries, then they will not likely leave as supporters (atleast more so) of Hillary. This ain't Montgomery, people. It's a stupid website so get over your dumb hissy fit and come on back.

[Posteritatis]

51. Keep in mind a couple of diarists is a drop in Kos' bucket

If all the Hillary supporters boycott DKos, we'll be living in a strange and alien dream world. Most people are going to have considerable inertia with sites they've settled into; hell, I still read Slashdot despite the fact that the mindset of the readerbase is pretty close to what I define as evil most of the time.

All of them leaving just ain't gonna happen. Hell, I'd be surprised if more than a few of them did. And short of DK establishing rules to the contrary, any gaps in Clinton's supporters there will probably be filled in short order anyway.

All I'm seeing here is a flounce from a few people. Those never impress - or worry - me.

[ima_sinnic]

50. that sounds fabulous! that's like when the fundies boycott disneyworld

--that's the best time to go to disney -- looks like I'll be spending more time over at Kos, a sanctuary from trolls and DLC fake "democrats" who can't bear the thought of an administration that isn't kissing their corporate asses and waging war all over the world.

[madrchsod]

53. they can start their own site if they don`t like kos

and there are several pro hillary websites they can post on.... kos `s site format sucks..i tried posting there but it`s to complicated for my feeble mind

[suston96]

57. The fact that this is a NY Times story is significant. The Democratic party may be.....

....permanently splintered.

[JerseygirlCT]

61. Kos, the new railing against Olbermann...

why is it that the Clinton folks suddenly have a problem with places and people they'd formerly celebrated? You might think that they'd be given the slightest pause, but instead they just decide that places and people they'd trusted are suddenly awful and must not be trusted.

??

[RichKay]

77. I know why

Because Hilary lives in the real world. Surrounded by duplicity and ponderosity.

[otherlander]

64. This isn't news.

[and-justice-for-all]

66. At this point, I will take HRC or Obama....

I am so sick of rethug rule, I just want them gone.

[Apollo11]

68. Let's try to keep things civil and respectful here on DU

OK - maybe I am being overly hopeful ...

[Ramsey]

69. I've also stopped reading Kos

DailyKos has been my favorite site other than DU for a couple of years. But no more. And its not just that the majority of the front page posts are anti-Clinton. It's that the front page posters are all going out of their way to demonize Hillary, to the point that they have focused on some pretty ridiculous allegations that seem fairly meritless, and to place Obama on a pedestal. Everything Hillary's campaign does or says is nitpicked apart and presented in the most negative light, while the Obama campaign is given the opposite treatment- they are defended to the hilt no matter what.

I'm no huge Hillary booster, I'm a fence sitter who would be happy with either candidate. For me, the front page posters at Kos have always had some integrity, but in this area they have lost all objectivity, and therefore all credibility. I cannot believe what they are writing about, so I've just stopped visiting there.

[mainegreen]

71. 'Meh' is the sum total of my feelings for Kos.

DU for me.

[Orsino]

74. The only way for DailyKos to make the news...

...is to anger the corporatists.

[sudopod]

78. And nothing of value was lost. nt

[ButterflyBlood]

81. GOOD FUCKING RIDDANCE!

nt