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Mark E. Smith Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 02:54 PM
Original message
Evolution Vs Creation Row Ends In Stabbing
Source: The Australian

By Adam Bennett / December 14, 2007

A FRUIT-picking trip to southern New South Wales ended in the death of a Scottish backpacker who had become embroiled in a bizarre row about creationism and evolution.

English backpacker Alexander Christian York, 33, was today sentenced to a maximum of five years in jail for the manslaughter of Scotsman Rudi Boa in January last year.

Mr Boa, 28, died on January 27 after being stabbed by York at the Blowering Holiday Park, near Tumut.

Mr Boa and his girlfriend Gillian Brown arrived in Australia from Scotland at the end of 2005 and went to Tumut to pick fruit as their first port of call on a round the world holiday.

The Scottish couple and York, neighbours at the caravan park, were becoming friends and spent the night of January 27 drinking at the Star Hotel in Tumut.

However, towards the end of the night, an argument broke out between York and the pair about creationism versus evolution escalated into a shouting match at the pub.

The couple, both biomedical scientists, had been arguing the case of evolution, while York had taken a more Biblical view of history.

Read more: http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,2292...
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AX10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 02:56 PM
Response to Original message
1. Of course the creationist is the murderer!
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TechBear_Seattle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #1
8. Why would anyone expect otherwise? n/t
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:34 PM
Response to Reply #1
17. No surprise there.
It's irrational to murder someone over a verbal argument, especially when you're flat-out WRONG like York - of course he flew off the handle and killed, he's not rational in the first place.

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truthisfreedom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #1
24. Totally predictable. Knuckle-dragging neanderthals, all of them.
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ThomCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 02:56 PM
Response to Original message
2. Why is it no fucking surprise
that the one taking the creationist point of view was the violent one?

x(
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tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #2
38. WWJS?
Who Would Jesus Stab?
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derby378 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
3. Should evolutionists start packing heat?
Good Lord, this is getting ridiculous...
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appal_jack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. 'Nature is red in tooth & claw...'
... & creationists' knives, apparently. Evolutionists need to take that survival of the fittest thing more to heart. Nature doesn't care who is 'right,' only who is left standing and able to raise young successfully.

Joking aside, this is awful, and I am genuinely surprised that it occurred somewhere besides Texas.

-app
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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #3
32. Not in NSW
It's pretty much a hangun free society- and all the BETTER for it.
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derby378 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-15-07 10:33 AM
Response to Reply #32
45. Or so you thought...
...although you could make the argument that evolutionists in NSW should carry Kershaw blades (provided they're lgal down under) to protect themselves against these yahoos.
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silverojo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-15-07 06:01 PM
Response to Reply #32
48. Have you actually LIVED there?
If not, STFU.
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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-15-07 10:09 PM
Response to Reply #48
53. I'm in Newcastle, NSW right now
With my Aussie partner- so it could be I know a little about the place....

and about Americans, who've doomed themselves to an increasing violent society (and the worlds largest prison system) through their pathological obsession with firearms.
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silverojo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-15-07 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #3
47. YES!
Reason #4675 why we need our Second Amendment rights:
To defend ourselves against fanatic right-wingers.
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AlinPA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:03 PM
Response to Original message
4. Don't mess with knuckle dragging bible-thumping flat-earthers.
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Jackpine Radical Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:05 PM
Response to Original message
5. Since the creationist is the one who survived,
should we conclude that he was more biologically fit than the evolutionist?
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mikelgb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #5
12. ...
:hide:
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dmallind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #5
14. Well technically natural selection..
...isn't individual-specific, but in the spirit of the post yes you could definitely say he had a distinct survival advantage.
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Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 07:18 PM
Response to Reply #5
37. In this particular case,
Edited on Fri Dec-14-07 07:26 PM by Gman
yes. The irony is that by being the survivor, the creationist proved the case of the evolutionist.
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jhrobbins Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 08:14 PM
Response to Reply #37
39. That's only if you subscribe that muscle is the superior biological
evolutionary end.
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Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 08:50 PM
Response to Reply #39
40. Again
"in this particular case".
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jhrobbins Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 09:22 PM
Response to Reply #40
41. Said (in my best Emily Latella voice), 'Nevermind'
:o
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JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 09:23 PM
Response to Reply #39
42. nah, it's the "living is the superior biological evolutionary end"
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Jackpine Radical Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-15-07 08:59 AM
Response to Reply #42
44. Exactly.
Or, to be more pedantic about it, living to produce viable offspring is the superior biological outcome.
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silverojo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-15-07 06:03 PM
Response to Reply #39
49. It is in nature. n/t
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Nikki Stone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:06 PM
Response to Original message
6. The Bible thumper kills the scientist: there is a metaphor for our times
Who wants to tell me again that atheists commit all the murders in history? Where are you Pope Ratburger? Tell me again, God damn you.
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struggle4progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 10:37 PM
Response to Reply #6
43. A scientific education makes a more inventive murderer!

Scientist convicted of killing husband with stun gun and acid
December 12, 2007
ASSOCIATED PRESS

LOS ANGELES ... A Superior Court jury found Larissa Schuster, 47, of Clovis, Calif., guilty of murdering Timothy Schuster with the special circumstance that the murder was committed for financial gain. His half-dissolved body was found a few days after his 2003 death in a barrel that was inside a storage unit that his wife had rented ...

Prosecutors said Larissa Schuster and her former lab assistant kidnapped her 45-year-old husband on July 10, 2003, knocked him out with a stun gun and chloroform-soaked rag, then dumped his bound body head-first into a barrel while he was still breathing.

The assistant, James Fagone, told authorities that Larissa Schuster then poured hydrochloric acid into the 55-gallon container ...

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/2007121...


And the curious fact, that so many murders are related to reproductive activity, begs for an evolutionary explanation

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sasquatch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:14 PM
Response to Original message
9. What are the odds that the guy will immigrate to the USA after his time is up-
and becomes a minister for a megachurch?
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lynnertic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-16-07 04:48 AM
Response to Reply #9
55. Slim to none:
he wouldn't be able to afford US health care coverage...
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Ezlivin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:16 PM
Response to Original message
10. I don't fear God, I fear his deluded followers
N/T
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HuffleClaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:17 PM
Response to Original message
11. who would jesus stab? nt
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RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #11
29. Mary Magdalene?
:shrug:
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lynnertic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-16-07 05:04 AM
Response to Reply #29
56. Maybe in the biblical sense
I heard that he married her.

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pnorman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:21 PM
Response to Original message
13. "English backpacker Alexander Christian York, 33, was today sentenced to a maximum of five years"
I found that part beyond belief! WHAT could possibly have been "mitigating or extenuating circumstances"??

pnorman
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drm604 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #13
16. Read the article.
Read the article. It's explained.
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yellowcanine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:35 PM
Response to Reply #13
18. Maybe he was drunk and the victim called him a bible thumping fundy?
Who knows? Maybe there was more as well. The point is we don't know - it seems pretty clear it was not premeditated but that is about all we know. We also don't know the norm in Australia for sentencing for these sorts of things. Basically it sounds like a bar room brawl that got out of hand. Not very Christ-like on the part of York, that is for sure.
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:35 PM
Response to Reply #13
19. He's crazy?
I mean, he DID stab a guy in an argument in which he was wrong about mythical beings creating the universe...

Too lenient IMHO, though.

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yellowcanine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:43 PM
Response to Reply #19
26. The judge thought it was accidental according to the article. He did hear the evidence and he is a
Edited on Fri Dec-14-07 03:44 PM by yellowcanine
judge. We did neither. We also do not know what the norm is for sentences is for this kind of crime in Australia. So I think it is a bit presumptious for us to comment on the sentence.
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laconicsax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:31 PM
Response to Original message
15. If anything, this disproves evolution
You'd think that right about the point where the stabbing started would've been a good time for the victim to evolve thick armored skin. He didn't, so evolution is bogus.
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:37 PM
Response to Reply #15
20. LOL!
That's exactly how IDiots/creationists think about the evolutionary process - that it's instantaneous and all adaptations would have to be perfectly useful.

You've captured their stupidity on this issue perfectly! XD

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PATRICK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:37 PM
Response to Reply #15
21. Both were drinking
One dead, one in jail. Gene pool boosted.

Bring back Prohibition!
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yellowcanine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #21
27. Except the dead guy may have already reproduced. He did have a girlfirend
and who knows - maybe he left a bit of himself behind. And the perp certainly will get a chance to reproduce - when he gets out if not before during a conjugal visit. So the gene pool may not be helped much by the whole sorry mess.
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JBoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #15
23. That's a good point!
He would have been better off spending those milliseconds praying! :D
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pegleg Donating Member (788 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-15-07 06:42 PM
Response to Reply #15
50. Then again, didn't a simple argument EVOLVE into murder?
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laconicsax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-15-07 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #50
52. Nope.
It either intelligently designed into murder or it was always a murder that God intended and leave it to secular leftists to try to figure out how one thing led to another when we all know that it was God.
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flyingfysh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:38 PM
Response to Original message
22. this proves nothing about evolution or creationism
What it proves is that drunks can get very stupid.
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theredpen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 03:43 PM
Response to Original message
25. "caravan park"
Nice to hear that other countries have drunken losers living in trailer parks, too.
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pleah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 04:39 PM
Response to Original message
28. Of course, if all else fails,
Edited on Fri Dec-14-07 04:41 PM by Jesuswasntafascist
kill the unbelievers. Why am I not surprised that this happened. Soon this will be common place.

God help us.
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BulletproofLandshark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 05:16 PM
Response to Original message
30. Somehow, I expected the fundie to be the stabber
Not surprised at all
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BadgerKid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 05:26 PM
Response to Original message
31. Unfair fight
Two against one!
:rofl:
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tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 06:27 PM
Response to Original message
33. Naturally it was the Bushie who sucker-stabbed and killed the decent human being.
Nothing lower or more cowardly than a Bushie, even an English Bushie.

Murders, liars and cowards, almost to a person.

The Bushies all aroundthe world, like the Nazis before them, have been self-selecting for this kind of person (and reprogramming anyone with a dull enough mind but not yet a cowardly murdering lying Bushie, to become one) for decades now.
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and-justice-for-all Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 07:02 PM
Response to Original message
34. York was just doing gawd's will,,,nt
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Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 07:05 PM
Response to Original message
35. Fundamentalism Stops A Thinking Mind. n/t
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 07:06 PM
Response to Original message
36. Is this the height of irony, or what? nt
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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-15-07 10:52 AM
Response to Original message
46. You cannot have a rational discussion with a man who prefers shooting you to being convinced by you.
--Sir Karl Popper
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damntexdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-15-07 07:05 PM
Response to Original message
51. Yeah, stabbing the "heretic" is just so biblical.
I guess it's the only way the Creo could see to "win" the argument.
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MilesColtrane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-16-07 12:59 AM
Response to Original message
54. Manslaughter?
Apparently the judge believed York's defense: "I was just holding a knife, and God shoved Boa onto it."
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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-16-07 06:03 PM
Response to Reply #54
57. A drunken fight is classic, common law manslaughter
It doesn't rise to the level of intent required for murder.
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