Mandela still alive after embarassing Bush remark

[Robbien]

Source: Reuters

OHANNESBURG, Sept 21 (Reuters) - Nelson Mandela is still very much alive despite an embarrassing gaffe by U.S. President George W. Bush, who alluded to the former South African leader's death in an attempt to explain sectarian violence in Iraq.

"It's out there. All we can do is reassure people, especially South Africans, that President Mandela is alive," Achmat Dangor, chief executive officer of the Nelson Mandela Foundation, said as Bush's comments received worldwide coverage.

In a speech defending his administration's Iraq policy, Bush said former Iraqi President Saddam Hussein's brutality had made it impossible for a unifying leader to emerge and stop the sectarian violence that has engulfed the Middle Eastern nation. "I heard somebody say, Where's Mandela?' Well, Mandela's dead because Saddam Hussein killed all the Mandelas," Bush, who has a reputation for verbal faux pas, said in a press conference in Washington on Thursday.

. . .

References to his death -- Mandela is now 89 and increasingly frail -- are seen as insensitive in South Africa.

Read more: http://africa.reuters.com/wire/news/usnL21784994.html

[woodsprite]

1. Chimpy is REALLY good at pissing off countries. It's second nature to him. n/t

[JohnnyLib2]

2. How embarrassing for all Americans (but one).

Jaysus, I said that just last week about some other * statement.

[ck4829]

3. Didn't Cheney vote against demanding that South Africa release Mandela in the 80's?

When he was a Representative.

[Botany]

5. yes. n/t

[Submariner]

8. Yes, Cheney is a racist pig POS

Cheney bristled in response to questions about his voting record, revealing a mindset that never understood what was at stake in South Africa -- or perhaps understood all too well. Challenged last Sunday to defend his 1985 vote against a House resolution urging the release of Nelson Mandela from 23 years of imprisonment, he first denounced such inquiries as "trivia." Does he really think that the oppression inflicted on millions of black citizens during more than five decades was a trivial matter?

http://atheism.about.com/b/a/119230.htm

[mogster]

4. Mandela, easily the coolest guy around in politics

I hope he (and mr. Tutu) will live forever.

[Virginia Dare]

9. I had the privilege and honor of being in the same room with him one time..

and to hear him speak. What a thrill that was!

[mogster]

13. He's so distinguished and calm

Amazing attitude for a person who spent a large part of his life in prison. Because of injustice.
It's sad he's so old now.
I've never experienced him live, but he's been to Norway many times and always get good news coverage.
Good on Mandela!

[Zodiak]

6. Wow.

That's not a gaffe, but a steaming pile of shit of international diplomacy.

[The Backlash Cometh]

35. Considering how Bush dehumanizes people, it's no surprise that

in his mind they're good as dead.

[Olney Blue]

7. Mr. Mandela, you are a hero.

Please disregard the chimp- he has footinmouth disease.

[Virginia Dare]

10. I seriously doubt he had any idea who he was talking about...n/t

[Buzz Clik]

11. He didn't say Nelson Mandela was dead.

He was saying there were no "Mandelas" in Iraq because Saddam killed them all.

It was retarded, but not for the reason implied in the OP.

[Stuckinthebush]

14. The beginning of Bush's statement

"I heard somebody say, Where's Mandela?' Well, Mandela's dead ..."

[Kagemusha]

15. The quote, slightly less bastardized, is in the latest Bush bio too.

So Bush mangled his own pet line ever so slightly with the delivery. He's obviously used it MANY times before.

[Arkansas Granny]

21. His words from a transcript:

"I thought an interesting comment was made when somebody said to me, I heard somebody say, where's Mandela? Well, Mandela is dead, because Saddam Hussein killed all the Mandelas. He was a brutal tyrant that divided people up and split families, and people are recovering from this."

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2007/09/2007092...

As usual, his apologists have been trying to convince people that "the President meant to say" . . .

[Buzz Clik]

23. As I said, the statement was retarded, but he did not say that Nelson Mandela was dead.

[Robbien]

25. Big deal. Nitpick the words all you like, but the meaning spread over the world

was that Bush said Mandela was dead. Thus this article where the leader of South Africa has to go around his country assuring everyone that Bush is a stupid idiot and their beloved Mandela is alive and kicking.

Why are you so insistent that Bush did not say Mandela is dead? What's the deal?

[Kagemusha]

28. Because it's the truth?

Like I said elsewhere in the thread, Bush mangled his own line, a line he's used before in private. But as for why one would point out that Bush said one thing and the world heard something else (because of the mangling), well, that's because it's true. And somewhere along the line the truth should matter to us somewhat.

[Buzz Clik]

30. And on a scale of 1 to 10, ...this doesn't even register.

[Buzz Clik]

29. Nitpick words. Interesting. Please don't let me interfere with your fun.

[yardwork]

38. He said, "Well, Mandela is dead." Seems clear to me.

[Buzz Clik]

51. No, what's clear is you don't mind intentionally pushing the wrong impression.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

54. I think that's clear of you.

Bush is talking jibberish. That's quite clear.

It's like some crazy bum talking about how UFOs stole his I-pod.

I don't know why you're trying to interpret it any other way.

[Buzz Clik]

60. Uh... because I speak English, and I can interpret even poorly spoken English?

Because I don't have a hard-on for hating Bush, even for things he didn't say.

That's a start...

[yardwork]

58. Your post is insulting.

[Buzz Clik]

61. Ok.

[Name removed]

68. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[IronLionZion]

27. You're right, but it's fun to laugh at *'s expense anyway.

The sad part is that he is right too. Anyone who could possibly have been a unifying leader for all the Iraqis has been killed off. There is no civil disobedience, there are no hunger strikes or marches or free speech of any kind, just violence and death. Bloody hell.

[Buzz Clik]

31. And I agree.

[martymar64]

69. Iraq's past is America's future

When people realize that marches and hunger strikes don't work against monsters like Bush and Cheney.

[vlas]

33. But he did say it. It's right there. "Mandela's dead"

By saying "Mandela's dead" He may not have MEANT to say "Mandela's dead" but he said the words. I don't know how one can say he didn't say it. It's there in black and white and in quotations. He said it.

In context you could read it as a verbal stumble, paticularly given the history of the speaker - But he said it. That is reality.

[Buzz Clik]

36. And Al Gore said he discovered Love Canal -- out of context.

In context, Gore meant something totally different.

If you want to play games to make a fool look more foolish, go right ahead. However, you run the risk of becoming embroiled in an argument over a meaningless phrase while ignoring substantive issues.

[yardwork]

39. Did Gore actually use the words, "I discovered Love Canal?"

[Name removed]

40. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[yardwork]

57. You're comparing apples to oranges.

When the president of the United States, during a press conference, states that a very well-known leader of another nation is dead, it is going to get a lot of attention. The president has a responsibility not to go around saying that people are dead when they're not.

Some off-the-cuff comment that a U.S. senator made at some point - having nothing to do with a person or a leader of another nation - is not comparable.

[Name removed]

59. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[yellowcanine]

37. No he didn't but it was a stupid thing to say anyway. One should not imply that a living person is

dead even to make a point. And it is time for reporters to start calling Bush out when he says inappropriate stuff like that. The next person called on should have asked, "Do you really think it is appropriate to suggest that a respected South African leader like Nelson Mandela is dead?"

[Buzz Clik]

42. He said the Iraqi equivalents of Mandela were dead. And it was a retarded comment.

[frankf]

62. he said "mandela is dead"

[yellowcanine]

45. The other thing is he would have us think that he supports what Mandela stands for. He doesn't and

never has. Mandela is a warrior for human rights. Bush believes in holding power its own sake. He has no principles other than self interest.

[Gormy Cuss]

55. That is the reason I'm enjoying the outcry over this.

He has no business invoking the name of Mandela in this context.

[stanwyck]

48. Watch the clip

He very clearly says "Mandela is dead". Then he went on to clarify. Actually, if you watch the video, it's much more embarrassing than the OP.

[Buzz Clik]

50. I watched it -- first on The Daily Show, then on Countdown.

Stewart stopped the clip after "Mandela is dead", made a big (funny!) production of being shocked at Nelson's death, and calls him on the phone.

Olbermann -- as usual -- played roughly 60 seconds to give complete context. Keith acknowledged that "if you weren't paying close attention" you would have gotten the impression that Bush was saying that Mandela was dead.

So, if you know what Bush's intent was and since Bush actually clarified his classic Bushian Language Obliteration to state his real meaning, how dishonest is it to insist on taking the single sentence out of context and pretend that he meant something that he clearly did not? In my opinion, real dishonest.

Bush gives us plenty of real material. Focus on that.

[stanwyck]

63. You shouldn't have

stated that Bush never said "Mandela is dead" . That's where you undercut your point, which we all get. You did yourself no favors by making such a blatant error. Why start your valid argument with such a glaring mistake?

[Buzz Clik]

64. Read. My. Words. Carefully.

Read. Then respond.

I said, "He didn't say NELSON Mandela was dead."

Exact quote.

What is your motherfucking problem?

[stanwyck]

71. Oh, right. It was some OTHER Mandela

he was referring to...so, technically, your saying he didn't say NELSON Mandela was dead is not an intentionally provocative lie. Get a job with the Bush administration. They need your skills. So does Larry Craig.

[DesertRat]

12. "Mandela's dead because Saddam Hussein killed all the Mandelas"

What could * have possibly meant by that comment?

[Kagemusha]

16. As explained in the new Bush biography...

It means that Saddam killed all of Iraq's would-be Nelson Mandelas and there aren't any credible national leaders left who are interested in reconciliation and national unity rather than carving the place up to favor a particular ethnic/ religious constituency.

That's what he meant to say.

[Arkansas Granny]

22. Won't it be nice to have a President again who doesn't need

someone to come along behind him when he speaks in public to explain to us all what he meant to say? Maybe our next President won't need "explainers" and "apoligizers".

[Kagemusha]

26. All presidents need some of that.

The gaffes just tend to be of a different nature.

[tekisui]

17. It makes NO sense.

[Buzz Clik]

24. True.

[Jackpine Radical]

18. Bush will have to rder Mandela killed now

to pacify the reality-based crowd.

[CurtEastPoint]

19. Maybe he meant 'mandala'...you know, those circle thingies..maybe Saddam killed them

[JerseygirlCT]

20. Oh, so his fictitious death is now SH's fault, too? nt

[EFerrari]

44. I don't think Bush knows that South Africa isn't in Iraq.

lol

[JerseygirlCT]

46. All those countries .... over there...

You know, not Texas or sumthin.

[Gen. Jack D. Ripper]

49. Yet another thing he and Miss Teen South Carolina have in common. n/t

[Mend]

32. shit-for-brains should have said "President Mandela"...

...how dare he leave off his title?

[Ian David]

34. Maybe Bush actually knows something we do not?

Maybe there's a commando team, sent by Bush, that was supposed to have killed Nelson Mandella by yesterday morning.

Anyway, today Bush appologized, "I mis-spoke when I said that Stephen Biko was dead. He is still very much alive."

[Amerigo Vespucci]

41. "I heard somebody say, Where's Abe Vigoda? Saddam killed all the Vigodas..."

Abe Vigoda is alive



Page loaded Friday September 21 2007 9:07:10 AM PT

http://www.abevigoda.com/ffb.php

[Buzz Clik]

43. I distinclty recall seeing footage of Vigoda being shot by mobsters.

Or was that Salvatore "Sal" Tessio. They look a lot alike.

[martymar64]

70. They never show Tessio getting whacked in the movie

He just gets into the car, the whacking is implied.

Abe Vigoda lives!!!!

[truthisfreedom]

47. He's a freaking boneheaded laughingstock. We are living a national nightmare and we just refuse to

WAKE UP!

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

52. Oh my god, I thought this was a joke

...when I saw this yesterday at DU.

[damntexdem]

53. And it turns out that all of the Iraqi Mandelas survived Hussein ...

but have tragically been killed by Blackwater since the U.S. Invasion.

[ProudDad]

56. If bush really wants to find the Iraqi Mandela

there's a place where racist, fascist governments like cheney/bush's put their Mandela's...

If you want to find the Iraqi Mandela -- check out Abu Graib...


The "coalition of the witless" has doubtless thrown him and his kind of humanitarian patriot in there...

[goforit]

65. RETARDED!

[pitohui]

66. "insensitive" is a nice word for it

sorry our resident is a moron, mr. mandela, we didn't vote for him!

[goodgd_yall]

67. Why would anyone believe what Bush said about Mandela?

Since when is he a purveyor of truth?