Boy Charged With Terrorism (14 Years Old)

[RamboLiberal]

Source: ABC

A middle school student who allegedly confronted a girl with a knife has become one of the youngest Americans ever charged with terrorism.

Late Monday, Maricopa County attorney Andrew Thomas officially charged the 14-year-old boy from Mesa, Ariz., with terrorism, aggravated assault with a deadly weapon, kidnapping and carrying weapons on a school campus.

The alleged crimes took place two weeks ago when police say the boy, who is an eighth grader at Powell Junior High School, approached a girl with a knife as she walked home from school. The girl escaped and called police. When the boy failed to show up at school the next day, police visited his home.

They found a backpack full of weapons including a handgun and ammo, chains, and rope. Police said they want the boy to be tried as an adult.



Read more: http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=3003977&page=1

[superconnected]

1. Be afraid everyone. Terrorists are everywhere.

that nice looking boy next door... that 4 year old with the sqinty eyes, the pizza delivery man. Now go out and vote for the patriot act and donate to the bushys.

[aquart]

2. Didn't they say us average citizens wouldn't be affected by these laws?

[Lone_Star_Dem]

7. Yes, but this boy isn't average

Didn't you read? He substantially interrupted a public facility with a deadly weapon. Thus he's a terrorist. The rest of the "average" people can just go on about their business.

Honestly, it sounds to me as if the boy is disturbed and could use some serious help.

"County officials said the boy had plotted a "Columbine-like" scenario

If that is true, he has some problems going on that should be addressed. I don't know how likely it is that they will be now that he's a terrorist poster child, but it's better to deal with young people such as this before they go off rather than clean up the mess after they do.

[Clintonista2]

60. I'm going to assume he was of middle-eastern descent. nt.

[Lilith Velkor]

66. People often assume that about Mexicans.

Hey there, welcome to tha DU. :toast:

[ThomCat]

3. We all knew it was just a matter of time

before charges of Terrorism became common for every assault or threat of violence. This is just crazy. Prosecutors seem to be competing to see who can get Terrorism convictions under their belts. I'll bet it helps their careers.
x(

[merwin]

4. WTF! The kidnapping & terrorism charges are bogus.

[THUNDER HANDS]

5. maybe conspiracy to commit kidnapping and terrorism.

but i didn't read anything that said there was an actual kidnapping.

[John Q. Citizen]

9. Who did he conspire with? It takes a co-conspirator for a conspiracy?

[John Q. Citizen]

10. Self delete, wrong location.

[merwin]

16. I don't see how anything related to terrorism could hold up in the slightest.

If it did, then everyone who robs a store or pulls a knife or gun on someone, or even yells in a threatening manner to a person is a terrorist.

[rinsd]

21. From the story, it appears he tried to take the girl against her will

That is kidnapping.

[renate]

6. he sounds hella scary

Mesa Police say the youth admitted to planning to take his class hostage. The boy told police that he intended to kill the girl, whom he singled out at random, police spokeswoman Holly Hosac said.

There must be a reason they chose to charge him with treason instead of intimidation or stalking or something... and I'm glad. I'm sick and tired of people with a grievance who are so selfish they convince themselves that they have some kind of justification, just because they're pissed off about something, for taking innocent people out.

[ProudDad]

36. HE'S 14 FUCKING YEARS OLD

And yes, I AM yelling at your STUPID statement:

"people with a grievance who are so selfish they convince themselves that they have some kind of justification, just because they're pissed off about something, for taking innocent people out"

He's a goddamn sick child!!!! He needs HELP not the torture that passes for punishment in this fucked up country...

[renate]

52. so was his intended victim, who according to HIM was innocent

At least, as a schoolmate, she would have been roughly his age. And the classmates he intended to take hostage were also presumably 14 fucking, as you say, years old.

Of course he needs help--has anyone here suggested he doesn't? Odds are that he's either mentally ill or the child of a severely dysfunctional home. However, as a parent of a teenager I do NOT hold 14-year-olds blameless for their actions. Several people whom I know personally had hellish childhoods. They did not take a gun to school. They did not consider it okay to act out their fantasies of violence.

I really do respect and even agree with your position, that he's sick and damaged. But the child (chosen, by his own account, at random) or children in his class whom he was apparently willing to kidnap or take hostage were not responsible for his pain. I don't think adulthood or the completion of neurological maturity should be the only point at which we say "Now it's not okay for you to kill other people."

[NormanYorkstein]

53. yeah sound like he needs "help"

when boys start to develop this sort of violent behavior early on, and they progress to a technical level that can efficiently kill people, society has to protect itself one way or another.

Perhaps we should send him to a medical facility and make him take drugs?

[IsItJustMe]

67. Do you think they should send him to Gitmo? LOL

[northofdenali]

8. Sick. Just plain fuckin' sick.

Just, jeez, can't we at LEAST go back to, say, Eisenhauer?? Or Nixon?? Hell, anything would be better.

:puke::puke:

[Megahurtz]

25. ROFL!!!

:rofl: That's funny! I know exactly what you mean! :thumbsup:

[ProudDad]

37. It wasn't all that much better

just fewer guns in circulation.

The crazy kids displayed their craziness with fists, 2 by 4s and occasionally in rare urban conflict with chains and rocks.

No guns though so most lived through the experience.

[brentspeak]

11. Obviously, if this is true, the kid is a danger to society.

But I don't see the justification for a "terrorism" charge.

[John Q. Citizen]

12. It's not terrorism unless he had a political motive.

[GoddessOfGuinness]

47. Thank you.

Whoever decided to charge him with terrorism is an idiot.

[aquart]

50. Well, they're probably under pressure from Rove to find some terrorists.

The pickin's have been mighty slim.

[sam sarrha]

13. sounds like Anti Social Personality Disorder, we had one in Juvenile parole, they commit their first

sex crime about 8, first sexual assault by 11 and and by about 14 first armed violent sexual assault/rape. if he is properly diagnosed, ASPD was what they called it then, don't know what they call it now..anyway if he has the said disorder the public will be safer with him convicted as an adult.. this is the sort sick puppy a blood test can identify.. from what i have read of it, they usually end up in jail by choice, life is easier for them in prison.. and there is always a fresh supply of young victims

our sick puppy raped a 4 year old girl, a 9 and 11 year old girl, he got out of juvenile lock up at 18 and was last reported heading back to the home town of the last girl he raped, that was about the time they closed our office

[rebel with a cause]

22. We had several of these in the children's home I worked at.

The reason was that Illinois at that time did not allow juveniles to be locked up, so the dangerous ones were sent to children's homes where the only thing we could do was watch them while we tried to treat/train/re-socialize them. Of course, people with ASPD do not get cured, they only learn to hide their symptoms so they will not be detected the next time. It is scary as heck to work with children that you know will always be a danger to everyone. It is scary as heck to always have to watch your back so as not to leave an opening where they can hurt you or someone else. It is scary as heck knowing that those little boys are now adults and know my name and can come find me it they want to. I was good to them, but remember this is a place where you had to control these youths, so they could still have some resentment/anger toward any one of us who worked there. We also know the secrets that they would not want others to know. Yep, if I think about it, it is still scary as heck.

[ProudDad]

38. I guess you went to the Bill Frist school of diagnosis

You've got this kid all pegged even though his only ACT was to pull a knife on someone. I feel for both of the victims of this story. Note in the below diagnostic the factors must occur AFTER AGE 15!!!!

--------------------

ASPD:

Diagnostic criteria (DSM-IV-TR)

The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders DSM-IV, a widely used manual for diagnosing mental and behavioral disorders, defines antisocial personality disorder as a pervasive pattern of disregard for and violation of the rights of others occurring since age 15, as indicated by three (or more) of the following:

1. failure to conform to social norms with respect to lawful behaviors as indicated by repeatedly performing acts that are grounds for arrest
2. deceitfulness, as indicated by repeated lying, use of aliases, or conning others for personal profit or pleasure
3. impulsivity or failure to plan ahead
4. irritability and aggressiveness, as indicated by repeated physical fights or assaults
5. reckless disregard for safety of self or others
6. consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to sustain steady work or honor financial obligations
7. lack of remorse, as indicated by being indifferent to or rationalizing having hurt, mistreated, or stolen from another

The manual lists the following additional necessary criteria:

* The individual is at least 18 years of age.
* There is evidence of conduct disorder with onset before age 15 years.
* The occurrence of antisocial behavior is not exclusively during the course of Schizophrenia or a Manic Episode.


---------------------

Shit, sound like every one of those yahoos in the minutement on the Ariz border and most bar patrons...

[sam sarrha]

58. it was a Manual.. my reference was 20 years ago. i qualified my comment as an assumption..yours is

is an accusation.. sounds like you went to the Google school of diagnosis..

:sarcasm: sorry, couldn't help myself.

what i was referring to 'Is' a psychotic disorder, it has been a while, and they didn't probably have the condition adequately researched at the time.

BUT the FACTs are.. there is a psychotic condition, i don't have the proper name, where children at about 8 years old commit sex crimes and about every 2 years it escalates, eventually into forced rape with a weapon, they can be charming and win your heart, poor babys, so abused, just want to hug em and shed a tear. that is how they work. they are devious and users of other emotions.

i don't care if you are a world renowned shrink.. i have worked with these sick puppy's in the Prisons and i dont think all are broken,..just built that way.. they are a statistical percentage of every culture

check out the book..'the Psychopath next door'

[Catshrink]

14. This is very close to home...

it's one of our HS's feeder schools and our students are pretty upset about it. This is the real effect of terrorism.

[Xenotime]

15. Sounds liek a bunch of * wannabes acting out their fantacies.

[okasha]

17. I wonder if someone has misunderstood

the charge, and it's actually "terroristic threats," which, despite the name, has nothing to do with terrorism.

[rodeodance]

19. in any case-----I find it terrible that terrorist is being used. The kid has

servere problems, but Terrorism sure does not fit.

[rodeodance]

18. my god, Terrorism laws were never meant to apply to this type situation!

[sam sarrha]

59. terrorism is a tactic to achieve a goal by killing other than your enemy

saddam's first crime was where a teacher beat his brother and Saddam killed the teachers brothers wife...!! that is terrorism

[w4rma]

20. What's his political motive? Without one he's no terrorist. (nt)

[Miss Chybil]

23. You think this is crazy, you should see how they apply "torture" laws in California.

There should be a law against the "throwing it against the wall to see if it will stick" method of prosecution. This boy's actual crimes are bad enough. There is no need to pretend they are terrorism, as well. This makes it seem like aggravated assault with a deadly weapon isn't a horrible enough crime and it dilutes the whole process. Now, the only thing anyone will focus on is how the prosecutor charged the kid with terrorism, not on how the kid attacked a girl on her way home from school. This type of thing will also dilute the crime of terrorism. Absolute travesty.

[ProudDad]

39. All criminal prosocuters are SHITS n/t

[Miss Chybil]

49. I wouldn't go that far. We need them to enforce the law, but their

methods leave a lot to be desired, sometimes.

[ProudDad]

55. Quote from a DA in Alemeda County, CA

"The only difference between the innocent and the guilty is that the innocent are a little harder to convict."

Almost without exception, DA's are mindless, bloodthirsty fucks who overcharge like crazy so they can fulfill their prime function. That is to get the most years in prison with the least amount of time spent. That's how they're graded and promoted.

At best they are lawyers, which means, they are entirely AMORAL. They will do anything and say anything in order to WIN!

I don't blame them 100%. I blame a corrupt system that give them WAY TOO MUCH power. I blame a corrupt, incompetent system that includes the cops and prisons/jails that can't even crack the 50% recidivism barrier. If the airlines and their executives had their success rate in "keeping us safe" they'd all be sent to jail.

Their methods are draconian and any resemblance between DAs activities and justice is purely accidental!

And, yes, I do have a good deal of direct experience in this area.

[Robb]

65. In my little county

...when the sheriff was running for re-election, the newspaper's letters to the editor page was filled with missives against him -- the signatories of which were a who's who of the frequent fliers on the court page.

[Megahurtz]

24. Well, It Sounds Like

he did "Terrorize" her but it sounds like the use of that law is taken way out of context.

What should be a Stalking charge they turned into "Terrorism".

And no. I firmly do not believe he should be charged as an Adult.

[pitohui]

26. wow!

i don't care what he's charged with, but get that kid off the street and out of the school system, that's one sick puppy!

i hate to think what he intended to do with the young lady once he had her chained up and at the mercy of his knife

[MadMaddie]

27. You have to keep in mind the language that is used

In Texas when I was involved in Law Enforcement, there was a law about "Terroristic Threats", had something to do with making threats against another persons well being, keep in mind this was before 9/11.

I suspect that the law that they are talking about was probably on the books way before 9/11.

It's irresponsible of the Media to not distinguish the specic law that is being used to charge him with. Is it county, state or even national
law that they are abiding by.

The media is intentionaly misusing the term Terrorism.

The child needs to be helped obviously, no doubt about it.

[happyslug]

34. The Term "Terroristic Threats" is in the Model Penal Code.

The Model Penal Code has been adopted in one form or another (Often with heavy rewrites including increase sentences) in also every state, so the Term is known in almost all states.

But I should note, in the article the definition used for "Terrorism" is NOT the definition of "Terroristic Threats", thus I suspect the Charge is "Terrorism" as that is defined under Arizona law.

[Ilsa]

28. What the hell is wrong with the local DA? I thought they

were supposed to be smarter than to abuse laws and children. A fourteen year old is a still a child, physically, emotionally, mentally, every which way.

[pitohui]

30. sorry but a "child" with a knife who plans to chain up my daughter needs to go away

someone who doesn't know that's wrong at age 14 will still not know it's wrong at age 24 or age 54, how many girls and women does he have to threaten with the knife i wonder?

you knew when you were 5 or 6 years old that you don't pull knives on people and you don't chain them up, this is pretty kindergarten stuff

if they're 14 and they're like this, they never go anywhere but down

i don't mind seeing teen-agers who commit VIOLENT crimes tried as adults because they're a lost cause anyway, i don't mean smacking someone, but using a weapon...come on, that is not poor impulse control, that is something far more, they had to go out, obtain these weapons, make these plans...they are not just merely having a late temper tantrum, they are dangerous and most of them by age 14 are bigger than i am, they don't need to be walking around on the outside

[Ilsa]

33. Not tried as an adult. The system needs to be able to deal with

children who do violent things, not throw them in prison with adults.

I don't consider a 14 year old a lost cause.

[pitohui]

46. but the system doesn't deal with them, it puts them out to prey on us again

these "children" that the system refuses to deal with are shooting each other every damn day while we pretend that saying "oh how cute, they're just kids" is helping anyone

if they can't be helped, and apparently they can't, then at least their victims can be helped by getting them out of the juvenile pretense of a system and into a jail where they can be held for a longer period of time

i'm not seeing where a person who doesn't know, at age 14, that you don't act like this will EVER know you don't act like this -- stupid violent people don't change that much in my experience

[Ilsa]

61. So sacrifice a 14 year old versus working to get the system

fixed so they get the help they need to change? And having them finish maturing in a system guaranteed to warp their psyches?

A 14 year old's brain isn't fully developed. They can still learn if worked with by professionals. Yeah, the system needs fixing. But it is much more complicated than throwing them away and never giving them a chance again. They'll absolutely be worthless for the remainder of their lives if they are treated as such by the govt and system, not just their families, when they are this young.

[ProudDad]

40. Time for you to get the facts

The judgment centers of the human brain are not fully formed until age 25...

Until then, they are NOT adults no matter how you want to believe they are in order to "get rid of them".


"In light of what has been learned, it seems almost arbitrary that our society has decided that a young American is ready to drive a car at 16, to vote and serve in the Army at 18 and to drink alcohol at 21. Giedd says the best estimate for when the brain is truly mature is 25, the age at which you can rent a car. "Avis must have some pretty sophisticated neuroscientists," he jokes. Now that we have scientific evidence that the adolescent brain is not quite up to scratch, some legal scholars and child advocates argue that minors should never be tried as adults and should be spared the death penalty."

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?scid=27&did=977

original article:
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1101040510-631970,00.html

[pitohui]

43. pardon my french, that is complete and utter bullshit

you know damn good and well that decent people already know by age 6 or so that it is not OK to pull knives on people or to kidnap girls and chain them up

this "judgment center of the brain" bullshit is a complete red herring, i am not asking the kid to be socrates, i am asking him not to take a knife to the other schoolkids and kidnap them and put them in chains and cut them up

if he did it to a dog, you'd be saying, watch him, future serial killer, we all know that teens who do this to dogs end up being serial killers and torturers

but since it was a live human girl that was threatened, it's OK and he just needs some treatment and hand-holding, because it isn't like girls have feelings or anything when they're threatened with knives and they don't have the same value as DOGS

come on, this kid is a waste of oxygen

if he was four, you'd have an argument, he's four fucking TEEN!

this concept that kids should be able to cut up, shoot, rob, and do pretty much whatever they like and get away with it, and not be tried as adults until AGE FUCKING 25, is a disgrace to decent people who would like to live in peace anywhere

sorry, but allowing predators to prey on young girls is not a liberal or progressive cause

let him get therapy in prison, away from young girls

let me guess, you are not the "proud dad" of a DAUGHTER!!!

[ProudDad]

54. Your attitude is

unsupported by science (nor, thank Dog, by most of the legal system).

Most of your post isn't worth responding to since it was filled with bullshit that I neither said nor believe nor anything this kid ACTUALLY DID!!!

...but...

This kid needs help. He needs appropriate therapy. He is probably salvageable if he gets it.

He doesn't need nor deserve to be in a FUCKING CAGE BEING FUCKED IN THE ASS BY A PRISON PREDATOR!!!!

Appropriate humane treatment IS a LIBERAL/PROGRESSIVE cause. Your mindless call for revenge belongs on www.freerepublic.com NOT HERE!

And yes, I AM the Proud Dad of a Daughter. As a result, I know a LOT about the judgment capabilities of 14 year olds...probably (obviously) a hell of a lot more than you do!

[treestar]

63. It's still not terrorism

[IsItJustMe]

68. So in other words, no such thing as redemption, hang him high. I hear ya!

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

29. I'm guessing the kid's a minority.

[pitohui]

31. why? isn't it white kids who usually pull that columbine shit?

why would a minority even think that's cool?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

32. A white kid would have gotten suspension and a talking to.

They throw the book at the minority kids.

[pitohui]

44. a suspension and a talking to for trying to kidnap a girl at knifepoint?

maybe back in 1974, but this is 2007

look at the demographics of serial killers/rapists, of which the kid is studying to become one, lots of white males in that demographic and everybody from the fbi on down knows it this time of century

[renate]

51. maybe it's just me, but I totally assumed he's white

Have any of the school shootings except the one in Minnesota by a Native American kid been by anybody other than white kids?

I'm pretty sure that white kids get the benefit of the doubt more than kids of any other race for run of the mill infractions, but when it comes to school shootings or mass violence, I suspect that I'm not alone in assuming the perpetrator is white.

[ProudDad]

35. I haven't read the article yet

How much you wanna' bet the kid is Black or Brown?



Anyhoo, tried as an ADULT!!! WHAT TOTAL BULLSHIT!!!

What kind of FUCKED UP COUNTRY IS THIS!!!!!!!!!!!


This is a SICK kid. He's been fucked up by the authoritarian, consumerist bullshit society that we live in... He needs therapy NOT PRISON!!!

[Lydia Leftcoast]

41. TERRORISM??? TERRORISM?

This country has gone insane in a way that is far more dangerous than anything a terrorist could do.

It sounds like this was a depressed kid who was hoping to commit "suicide by cop," like Kip Kinkle, of Springfield, Oregon, who begged the student who finally subdued him to kill him.

I could see charging him with assault, which would be serious enough and would put him in a detention facility for a while, but TERRORISM??? Is he going to get remanded to Gitmo to join the other teenagers there? :grr:

[Odin2005]

42. Are district attorneys elected in Arizona?

Because it's shit like this that makes me against DAs and judges being elected. An elected judiciary cares more about looking "tough on crime" in order to win elections then actual justice.

[ProudDad]

56. Most DA's are appointed

by the shithead who gets elected DA for the county.

A lot of them are padding their resumes so they can cut the cord and make the big bucks defending corporate pigs...

[muryan]

45. terrorism is a bit much

but they shouldnt spare the rad for this nutcase

[HuffleClaw]

48. a stunt to get national attention methinks

and it worked too

[ProudDad]

57. More information

"Police said they were alerted by a girl who said the boy confronted her with a knife.

Holly Hosac, another Mesa police spokeswoman, said the teen was a good student but apparently had trouble with another boy at school."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uslatest/story/0,,-6530911,00.html


Oh, right, let's make sure he gets the death penalty :sarcasm:


He's already kind of fucked -- Maricopa County is the home of that dip-shit of a sheriff who likes to dress up inmates in pink suits and brought back the chain gang -- in the Phoenix, AZ sun...

[treestar]

62. How ridiculous. It is a crime, not terrorism.

[Naipes]

64. UNBELIEVABLE!

It amazes me that so many people have an opinion about this story without even reading the article.