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Liberals (Canada) announce Keynote speaker, theme of Convention. Howard Dean

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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 01:39 PM
Original message
Liberals (Canada) announce Keynote speaker, theme of Convention. Howard Dean
http://www.liberal.ca/news_e.aspx?type=news&id=12037

"Montréal –The Liberal Party of Canada today is pleased to announce that the Chairman of the Democratic National Committee, Governor Howard Dean, will give the keynote address at the Party’s upcoming Leadership and Biennial Convention. Governor Dean will be speaking to delegates, alternates, observers, and the attendees on the evening of November 29, 2006, at approximately 8:20 pm (EST).

Governor Dean was elected Chairman of the Democratic Party in early 2005. Since that time, he has worked to strengthen the grassroots of his Party. His leadership has been centered around a “50 state strategy” that focuses on building his Party in every state in the country. Under his leadership, the Democratic Party has rebuilt its infrastructure and shifted its fundraising strategy towards small donations from engaged supporters. Just this week, he led his Party to a clean sweep of the U.S. House of Representatives, the Senate, the majority of Governorships and state legislatures.

“We are proud to have Gov. Dean address our Party. Aside from our obvious affinity with the Democratic Party, Liberals are excited to hear the Chairman’s views on a modern democracy and the role of the Democratic Party in the new U.S. political environment. And the timing couldn’t be better,” said Steven MacKinnon, General Secretary of the Convention."

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rockymountaindem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 01:42 PM
Response to Original message
1. Wow, suddenly I'm jealous of all of my friends here at U of T who are going
to attend the convention... even though the Grits don't have a chance in hell for probably 3 years.
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achtung_circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. here at U of T


Class of '78
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rockymountaindem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Oh yeah? Cool!
What program were you in?
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achtung_circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 05:41 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. Geography, with a minor in History. nt
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Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 07:52 PM
Response to Reply #6
26. Two years at U of T
Scarborough College - Languages, German Literature.
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Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 07:43 PM
Response to Reply #1
25. The Liberals may well be the government again early next year
We currently have a minority government so it can fall at any time. The likely time will be early spring, imo, after the Libs have a new leader. Even WITHOUT a leader right now, they are tied with the faux cons in the polls.
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Upfront Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 01:43 PM
Response to Original message
2. Outstanding choice.
Way to go Canada.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 01:16 AM
Response to Reply #2
46. Hey, upfront.
Haven't heard from you in a long while. Have you been getting my emails? Let me know.
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Upfront Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #46
53. Hi Mad.
Sent you an e-mail.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 11:34 PM
Response to Reply #53
60. Got it.
I can not figure how you got off my list. Most puzzling. Glad I ran into you.
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Kagemusha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 01:46 PM
Response to Original message
3. The hell. That's a bold choice.
Usually you'd think they wouldn't touch any American for a political convention like this. I'm not arguing - I think Dean's great. I'm just saying, that's highly unusual... and I dare say, a bold move...
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Telly Savalas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:34 AM
Response to Reply #3
32. The supposed front-runner is practically an American
Edited on Sat Nov-11-06 12:39 AM by Telly Savalas
Hopefully Dean will remind the Liberals that the invasion of Iraq was a stupid fucking idea and that perhaps they should pick a leader who opposes it.
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Ladydawnelle Donating Member (122 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #3
42. a wolf?
Love Dean

Used to know a Kagemusha (isn't that a wolf?) from an old Science Chat room years back in Talk City. I think he was from Calif. Kage is that you? Hola either way. I was ladyfishy back then.
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Harper_is_Bush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 01:54 PM
Response to Original message
4. Recommended!!! I can't WAIT to hear what Dean has to say!
Harper better leave town that day. :)
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Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 02:00 PM
Response to Original message
5. This is the sort of "bipartisianship" I approve of.
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Starlight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 02:53 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. I'm picturing a worldwide progressive movement...
:pals: :pals:
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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 05:50 PM
Response to Reply #9
16. dream on

This notion that the Liberal Party of Canada is "progressive" (at least by any meaning of the word that those of us who were progressive sometime before this millennium would understand) is a strange one. I just can never figure out where it comes from.

The fact that Dean has accepted this invitation actually doesn't speak very well of him, in fact. But then I'm not under any illusion that the Democratic Party is any more progressive than the Liberal Party.

You have a two-party system in which your choices are limited. We don't, and while progressives may sometimes vote Liberal for strategic reasons (I've done it once in over 30 years of voting, myself, the same number of times as I have voted Tory), progressives are not Liberals and Liberals are not progressives

We in Canada do not have the same tiny political spectrum that exists in the US and we do have a choice. The spectrum here may be relatively narrow as well, and the choice not what some might like it to be, but none of that makes the Liberal Party anything but what it is: economically neoliberal in government (that isn't a good thing) and an opportunistic, corrupt election-winning machine.



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Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 11:12 PM
Response to Reply #16
30. I'm sorry to hear that about the Liberal party.
I agree with you about the Democrats. In the very week of our victory, they've already begun to sell out the progressives, as they have with the unions in the past.
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w4rma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #30
36. DLCers have been acting like opportunists since the victory and they are very often
Edited on Sat Nov-11-06 01:44 PM by w4rma
(compared to progressives) asked to come on big media which gives the DLCers lots of air time.
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Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 01:56 PM
Response to Reply #36
37. I've seen too much of it at DU also, despite DLC being a swear word here.
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Muddy75 Donating Member (35 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #16
49. Very good take on our system.
Edited on Wed Nov-29-06 11:19 AM by Muddy75
This is a good little summary of the Liberal party.

I like this line:

"Liberals campaign on the left, and govern on the right".

Why can't most die-hard Liberals figure this out?

PS - It always annoys me when Americans can only equate or compare their ridiculous 2 party system to our system, as if the corrupt 2 party system in the US is the benchmark for democracy or something.

Edited to add: People need to start realizing that the US Democratic party would be to the RIGHT of our Conservative party...It's ridiculous to try and equate our Conservatives with your Republicans - not even the same ballpark.
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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #49
66. "Liberals campaign on the left, and govern on the right".
Exactly.

I was thinking maybe you'd quoted that from my post and I was going to hasten to add that if I'd said it, I hadn't made it up. ;)

liberals "campaign from the left" courtesy of google.



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judaspriestess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 02:48 PM
Response to Original message
8. good job Howard
I wish I could be there.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 05:05 PM
Response to Original message
10. Kick.
At least Canada appreciates that we won.
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Justitia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 05:07 PM
Response to Original message
11. Sweet. Smart Canadians. -eom
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NastyRiffraff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 05:24 PM
Response to Original message
12. Excellent choice!
Canadian Liberals, you won't regret it. I've seen Howard Dean speak in person. He's not only a very smart man, he's a powerful speaker.
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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 05:32 PM
Response to Original message
13. toadying and coat-tail riding
Edited on Fri Nov-10-06 05:33 PM by iverglas
I'm disgusted with the Liberal Party's choice, but then I'm disgusted with most everything the Liberal Party does.

What USAmerican political party would invite a foreign political personality to give the keynote address at its presidential nomination convention, for the love of mike? What progressive party in any country in the world would invite a USAmerican political figure to give the keynote address at an event which it hoped to use to attract the voters who will hand it the next election?? What can Liberals possibly think of Canadians that they would make this choice???

Is Howard going to announce that the US will now be returning the billions it owes Canada for violating NAFTA? Now that would be a coup ...

Aside from our obvious affinity with the Democratic Party

Pfft. Stuff and nonsense, and offensive stuff and nonsense at that. If Canadians found themselves being governed by the Democratic Party, they would have guns littering the streets and people dying for want of health care, and women's reproductive rights under attack, and gay and lesbian couples finding themselves un-married ... and wouldn't they just be surprised.

The Democratic Party is obviously the best the US can do for progressive politics, and as such I wish it well. We don't need it up here, and I sure as hell don't want it up here. But I never object to the Liberal Party putting itself on display for what it is.


edited to insert omitted word ...


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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 05:50 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Maybe they want to commend him for bringing a halt to what appeared to be
a runaway truck in Washington.

Whatever it was he was able to accomplish against the deadly right-wing machine was more difficult than you may understand.

Maybe he'll prove himself to you in time, iverglas. We're not all alike, you know.
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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. "We're not all alike, you know."
Gee, I wonder whether that was my point.

Maybe he'll prove himself to you in time, iverglas.

I don't recall saying anything at all about Howard Dean. My disgust is with the Liberal Party, and the idea that the party that will likely form my next government thinks it appropriate to invite a foreign politician, or any USAmerican at all, to give the keynote address at its national leadership convention. No other serious country in the world would even think of debasing itself that way, or imagine that attaching itself to some aspect of the US government would gain it an advantage in the voters' hearts. I'm embarrassed as well as disgusted.

I don't give a crap about Howard Dean, thank you very much, when it comes to the politics and government of my country. He has nothing to "prove" to me, because he is 100% irrelevant. And I don't think that the Liberal Party gives a crap about much of anything, including the antics of your sorry excuse for a head of government/state or whether or how they are stopped. What the Liberal Party cares about is power, in Canada, and the uses to which it can be put for the benefit of its friends.

Have you and everyone here failed to notice that the front-runner in the Liberal leadership race is a yankified expat Canadian right-winger who supported the US invasion of Iraq and thought Canada should join in?

There are just all sorts of reasons why the Liberal Party might want to bask in the warm glow of the Democratic victory south of the border ...



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rockymountaindem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 05:51 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. Let me guess, you vote for the NDP?
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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 06:05 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. what, like this would be something I'd not want to admit?

Of course I vote NDP. It would be odd not to vote for the party I've run as a candidate for ... I mean, unless I had been a Conservative or Liberal and seen the light ...

I'd like a better NDP, but it's what I've got for now. Kinda like you folks have the Democratic Party.

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ozone_man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 07:03 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. In my perfect world
Edited on Fri Nov-10-06 07:04 PM by ozone_man
he would be addressing Parti Quebecois in Montreal, after we secede and join Quebec (our largest trading partner), but us Vermonters can't always have it our way, as much as we tried to make Dean the president. But that was before the election. We have some new hope now. He's a moderate, a compromise candidate for progressives. I agree, we really need a revolution down here, to dismantle the two party system, but we elected Bernie Sanders (our own favorite socialist) to the Senate.
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whirlygigspin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 08:59 PM
Response to Reply #19
28. the NDP has it's uses
take a listen to the late great Tommy Douglas
The Greatest Canadian
http://archives.cbc.ca/IDC-1-74-851-4968/people/tommy_douglas/clip7

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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 07:01 PM
Response to Reply #13
21. LOL
Canadians voted for Harper. Not much better than bush, from what I've seen. Canada's a wonderful place, but paradise it ain't. And I've spent a fair amount of time there, and live no more than 20 minutes from the border. Oh, and my state of Vermont is as liberal as any place I've ever been in Canada.
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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 01:33 PM
Response to Reply #21
34. loloolololol

Canadians voted for Harper. Not much better than bush, from what I've seen.

I guess you don't see a lot. I guess you also don't know that very slightly over one third of Canadians who voted voted for a Conservative Party candidate.

Canada's a wonderful place, but paradise it ain't.

Fascinating. I don't recall anyone, very much least of all myself, saying it was. Certainly my distaste for the Liberal Party of Canada, and its broken promises about the problems we do have (I named child poverty and Kyoto), would suggest that I don't rergard Canada as a paradise. What your comment has to do with my objection to the Liberal Party of Canada offering a USAmerican politician as the keynote speaker at its national leadership convention, I wouldn't know.

Oh, and my state of Vermont is as liberal as any place I've ever been in Canada.

Bully for the state of Vermont. Does this mean that the Democratic Party in Vermont will be inviting the president of the New Democratic Party of Ontario (not that the NDP is "liberal") to deliver the keynote address at its next gubernatorial nominating convention?

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Telly Savalas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:36 AM
Response to Reply #13
33. At least Dean was against the Iraq invasion and is against torture
Can all of the major candidates of the Liberal leadership race make that claim?
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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 01:35 PM
Response to Reply #33
35. and yet a-bleeding-gain

What does that have to do with anything I said, or with the Liberal Party of Canada having a USAmerican politician as the keynote speaker at its national CANADIAN leadership convention?

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Telly Savalas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #35
38. You were suggesting that the Democratic party is far to the right
of the Liberal Party. Iggy's "frontrunner" status in the leadership race calls this into question.

As far as having an American speak at the convention, Howard Dean has probably spent more of the last couple decades in Canada than Iggy, so why not have him speak?
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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 07:14 PM
Response to Reply #38
43. I was suggesting absolutely no such fucking thing
I said what Canadians might expect if they were being governed by the US Democratic Party: no health care, a gun free-for-all, etc. etc. Have you noticed any federal or state Democratic govts in the state making any serious effort in the last few decades to bring about any of the sort of social safety and support measures we have in Canada? I haven't.

You seem to have read this as my saying that the Democratic Party is to the right of the Liberal Party. I did not say that. The DP may indeed be to the right of the LP on the sorts of things that seem to matter in the US but aren't serious issues in Canada: women's reproductive rights, the rights of lesbians and gay men and various other equality issues. But the LP is not actually any more interested in equality than it is in health care or child poverty. The Liberal Party is a right-wing party. The Democratic Party is a party without policies, as far as I can tell, but what policies it has would hardly be regarded as on the left in Canada.

As far as having an American speak at the convention, Howard Dean has probably spent more of the last couple decades in Canada than Iggy, so why not have him speak?

I completely fail to take your point. Did I nominate Ignatieff for the Liberal leadership? Am I voting for Ignatieff for the Liberal leadership? Do I want to see Ignatieff leading the Liberal Party? (Well, okay, I might not mind it; as I've said: let the Liberals fly their colours high; they look good on them and I prefer that they be well visible.)

Conversely, is Howard Dean running for the leadership of the Liberal Party? Does Howard Dean vote in Canada? Is it remotely appropriate for ANY U.S. politician to be involved IN ANY WAY in the party politics of a foreign country? Should Canadians be glad to see any U.S. politician so blatantly associating him/herself with a political party in this country?

I also have to ask: is it honourable for Howard Dean to place his stamp of approval on the Liberal Party of Canada in this way? He is interfering in the political process in Canada. There simply is not any other way to perceive what he is doing. And I wonder what everyone would be saying if some darling of the Republican Party were giving the keynote speech at a Conservative leadership convention.

I think the Liberals are engaged in one more in their history of cheap political tricks for quick political profit, trying to polish up their extremely tarnished image by sucking a little second-hand glitter from a politician/party currently enjoying its 15 minutes of uncritical approval, and sucking up to Canadians who widely despise the Republican administration in the US by rubbing elbows with the guy who slew the dragon.

Let's see Howard Dean announce that a Democratic Congress will be insisting that everything owed to Canada for the softwood lumber scam be returned. But let's see him do it back home in Washington DC, not from the platform of a Canadian political party convention.

Ignatieff is speaking because he is a Canadian citizen who is a candidate for the leadership of the Liberal Party of Canada. If the Liberal Party wants a yankified expat for its leader, that's up to them. If they want to act like colonial serfs of empire and bow down to the latest American idol, that's up to them too.

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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 06:42 PM
Response to Original message
20. A little more about it from CTV
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20061110/howard_dean_061110/20061110?hub=Politics

MONTREAL -- "The Liberal party will turn to a Democratic heavyweight from south of the border to inspire the troops during their convention.

Liberals hope to learn from former presidential contender Howard Dean who changed the way U.S. parties finance campaigns in the run-up to the 2004 election with his grassroots, Internet-based appeal.

As chair of the Democratic National Committee, Dean was a leader in this week's mid-term elections that gave his party control of the U.S. Congress.

Liberal national director Steven MacKinnon says Dean's campaign helped reinvent the way democracy and political parties work."

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Raine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 07:09 PM
Response to Original message
23. TERRIFIC
Dean is THE MAN! :thumbsup:
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Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 07:41 PM
Response to Original message
24. Wow! VERY cool!
I am so glad to see Dean get the respect he is due for his 50 State Strategy! The Liberals could learn a great deal from him as they, too, need to rebuild their party on a national level, imo.

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Olney Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 08:51 PM
Response to Original message
27. This is quite an honor!
:yourock: Dr. Dean, you are amazing.
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whirlygigspin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 09:05 PM
Response to Reply #27
29. an amazing honor
It is in fact stunning, if you truly appreciate the history of the Canadian Liberal Party and what this means in that context.

wow!

:hug:
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Oreegone Donating Member (726 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-10-06 11:40 PM
Response to Original message
31. You Go Howard,,,,Yahoo!!
Shows there are some smart people in Canada. They didn't invite an American, they invited a brilliant and decent human being.

My favorite quote from the story that explains why they invited him follows:

"Just this week, he led his Party to a clean sweep of the U.S. House of Representatives, the Senate, the majority of Governorships and state legislatures."

Howard, you are my Hero !!!!!
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stepnw1f Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 02:11 PM
Response to Original message
39. Very Smart Move!
They know a winning strategy when they see it.
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THX1138 Donating Member (276 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 04:54 PM
Response to Original message
40. Pretty sad
that Dean is more appreciated for his success in Canada than he is by the American press and the DC elites in his own party. In all these post-mortem elections articles I am reading in the press, his name is conspicuously missing from a lot of them, or he's mentioned as an afterthought. He's being dissed, and it's really starting to piss me off. What's the deal?
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CHIMO Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 05:24 PM
Response to Original message
41. Doesn't Seem To Add Up Yet
Edited on Sat Nov-11-06 05:28 PM by CHIMO
From the same propaganda.
Liberals announce Keynote speaker, theme of Convention

The theme of the Liberal Party of Canada Leadership and Biennial Convention will be ‘Choices that Count’. The theme reflects the wishes of delegates who will be making the important decisions over the course of the week regarding Party policy, leadership, and structural renewal.

http://www.liberal.ca/news_e.aspx?type=news&id=12037

Howard Dean to give keynote address at Liberal convention
Dean's grassroots, internet-based fundraising appeal in 2004 changed the way U.S. political parties finance campaigns.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2006/11/10/dean-liberals.html

Conservatives continue to dominate political fundraising in Q3 of 2006

To date this year, the Conservatives have raised $13.3 million, according to the publicly posted figures. That compares with $4.1 million for the Liberals and $2.8 million for New Democrats.

http://www.cbc.ca/cp/national/061102/n110270.html

So the theme requires an American to provide the choices that count? Confusing.

But it may be that they are hoping to obtain the secrets on funding? Again unclear.

Or perhaps they are pulling a red herring across the, Quebec is a nation, bit?

Who knows.

Maybe it is just the Liberals way of initiating reciprocity.

Or perhaps they don't want to be left behind.

Labour drafts in US election architect for 'our midterms'
Labour has enlisted one of the engineers of this week's Democratic victory in the US midterm elections in an attempt to boost its flagging fortunes before the local elections in May.
Howard Dean, the former presidential candidate and one of the men credited with masterminding the trouncing of the Republicans, will visit the UK next month to brief party officials about his pioneering campaigning techniques.

http://politics.guardian.co.uk/labour/story/0,,1945410,00.html

Always something interesting going on.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-28-06 11:00 PM
Response to Original message
44. I wish Governor Dean the best of luck tomorrow night.
Hope all goes well.

I notice Segolene Royal won her primary, and it reminded me I had seen this in September. She's a beautiful lady and I hear really cares about the people.

It was a press release from some group, and I did not save the link.

"Howard Dean, Segolene Royal to attend Spanish Socialist congress
Mon Sep 4, 6:14 PM ET

US Democratic Party chief Howard Dean and possible French Socialist
presidential candidate Segolene Royal will attend a conference organised by
Spain's ruling Socialists in mid-September.

It will be the first time that the head of the Democrats will attend such a
conference, Jose Blanco of the Socialist (PSOE) party said.

Royal is expected in Madrid on September 15 and 16 and will take part in a
debate together with Spanish Vice-President Maria Teresa Fernandez de la
Vega, according to a programme published on Monday.

Royal said in a television interview on Monday that she was also due to meet
Spanish Prime Minister Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero during the visit, who
will close the conference on September 17.

Dean, a vocal opponent of the US invasion of Iraq, serves as chairman of the
Democratic National Committee and ran to be the party's presidential nominee
in 2004, losing the candidacy to John Kerry."

I understand she ran a similar internet-based campaign.


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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-28-06 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #44
45. I found one article in English about her from several months ago.
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Mother Jones Donating Member (427 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 10:26 AM
Response to Original message
47. This shocked me too, when I first heard it

I think Dean is a GREAT man, especially after all the criticism he has had to take. I recall right wingers saying the Dems are finished if they elect him Chairman, and look at what he accomplished.

We all love to criticize our idiot PM as being George-Bush-like, and the Liberals make a habit of pointing it out. Toadying up to an American politican, even a democrat, makes no sense to me at all.


If Dean is coming up, in the spirit of uniting "progressives" together, and with a strategy for winning, then I would understand that. However, if that were the case, the Liberals would need to choose a leader other than Ignatieff - a man who is more American than Harper and more right-wing than Howard Dean.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 11:06 AM
Response to Reply #47
48. Do Canadians really lump Dean and Bush together?
Edited on Wed Nov-29-06 11:11 AM by madfloridian
I have tried to understand the posts in this thread that are trying to figure out why Dean would be asked there.

It appears he is lumped as an "American" along with George W. Bush.

I can not pretend to understand the Liberal party in your country, but our Democratic party here has been pulled sharply to the right in recent years...shutting out the people in the party. Deam is trying to change that situation by rebuilding the party on smaller donors.

I hope I am wrong, that Canadians don't equate Dean and Bush.

I may be misunderstanding it all, as I don't know the parties in Canada. See posts 44, 45...as it may explain more.
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Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #48
51. The Liberal party has recognized they need to go back and
rebuild their party and, imo, they recognized how Dean was pivotal in that area with the success of his 50 State plan so have asked him to speak to the party.

I don't think Canadians equate Dean with bush at all, quite the opposite, imo. They see Dean as being pivotal in the defeat of the bush/repub party defeat in Congress.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 01:03 PM
Response to Reply #51
52. Thanks.
I am very ignorant of the various parties there, and I am thinking they don't see the nuances and outright fights going on within our parties.

I think it is interesting his trip to Spain to speak in Sept. got no attention at all. Maybe it wasn't meant to. Also interesting is the woman from France who is using the internet style campaign won her primary.

She looks like a neat person...see post 45.

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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #48
65. are they not both United States politicians?
I'll ask again -- can you imagine the Democratic Party inviting a foreign politician to be the keynote speaker at its presidential nominating convention?

Do you folks really not get it?

The US is really not the leader of the free and democratic world, and its celebrities really are not relevant to the domestic politics of other countries.

And the Democratic Party may be a big tent, but its flaps do not extend beyond US borders. The Democratic Party is a USAmerican political entity, Howard Dean is a US politician -- and this here is Canada and the Liberal Party is a Canadian political entity.

If a non-US politician in a position equivalent to Dean's were to associate him/herself with a political party in the US in this way, methinks I'd be hearing some squawking about sovereignty from south of the border.

The Democratic Party in the US should not be associating itself with any political party in Canada. And political parties in Canada should very certainly not be associating themselves with political parties in the US, even for such a cheap and desperate trick as this obviously is.

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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 05:04 PM
Response to Reply #65
67. Don't kid youself...Clinton and Carville go there a lot.
Others also. I really don't see it, I really don't. In fact I think it would be great for our party to have someone from Canada or England speak at our convention.
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PassingFair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 09:17 AM
Response to Reply #47
63. Hi Mother Jones!
:hi:

The video is posted down thread!

I hope Howard inspires average liberals in Canada,
as he has inspired average liberals here in the US,
to get up and get going! Luckily, you Canadians have
a head start in that you are already SMARTER AND MORE
REALITY BASED than most of US! :)

When the "silent majority" remains silent, we get
situations like we created here. The bushies were
able to drive their bullshit mobiles straight to
the centers of power because the slumbering majority
here LET THEM.

Millions of us protested, but millions more bought
the propaganda and disinformation and mis-information
of the lying PRESS and DID NOTHING.

Howard Dean helped change that for me just by speaking
the truth LOUD and CLEAR and making it PLAIN that it is
a DUTY that we all have to SPEAK UP. EVERY DAY. (Ask Elizabeth!)

We have to ASK for votes. We have to MAKE THE CASE.
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Swede Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 11:15 AM
Response to Original message
50. What a brilliant idea!
I just love it.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 09:30 PM
Response to Original message
54. Link to the video, live feed.
http://www.cpac.ca/forms/index.asp?dsp=template&act=view3&template_id=46&lang=e

Upper right hand corner.

Said to be running late per a Kos diary.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #54
55. Dean coming up now.
Edited on Wed Nov-29-06 09:53 PM by madfloridian
Getting a good reception. There must have been a video presentation before he spoke. They all sound so enthusiastic.
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lovuian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 09:54 PM
Response to Original message
56. He is Awesome
:woohoo:
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goforit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 09:55 PM
Response to Original message
57. Hats off to Dean!!
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 10:08 PM
Response to Original message
58. He graciously gave credit for the win to everyone....
I hope our other politicians take note. It was great to see appreciation, because he damn well deserved some.

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JudyM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-29-06 10:47 PM
Response to Original message
59. Well at least his value is being recognized by *some* liberal leaders. n/t
:eyes:
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 12:34 AM
Response to Original message
61. Video up now. Definitely worth it.
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Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 09:02 AM
Response to Reply #61
62. Thanks for the link! I missed the speech so it was great to
see the video. Howard was very impressive, I loved it when he began to speak French and received applause for showing the respect to Canada's two languages. His comment "Fox will hate this" made me laugh out loud.

I think the Liberals made a smart move inviting him.
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ianwood Donating Member (34 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 11:09 AM
Response to Original message
64. I hate harper
bush wannabe
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 05:05 PM
Response to Original message
68. Full speech from You Tube in two parts.
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CHIMO Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 05:22 PM
Response to Original message
69. Democrat invokes the values of Trudeau
OTTAWA—Invoking Pierre Trudeau's "Just Society," American political heavyweight Howard Dean told Liberals gathered for their leadership convention that to regain power they must stick to their traditional values of fairness and social generosity and above all put their trust in the wisdom of the people.

Like their Democratic cousins in the United States, the Liberals will rebuild their strength by driving home the stark differences between a progressive, inclusive party and a right-wing government that "feeds on fear, depends on differences and ultimately, conquers by dividing," Dean told the conference.

"The other strategy is about hope and promise," said Dean, who as chair of the Democratic National Committee won widespread praise for captaining his party's stunning effort in the recent United States mid-term elections, when the Democrats wrested control of both houses of Congress from U.S. President George W. Bush's Republicans.

"We trust people and we bring them together. We appreciate our differences and we focus on our similarities. We say our diversity does not divide us, it defines us.

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1164840611400&call_pageid=968332188774&col=968350116467

Hmm...

Wonder if the Green party will be doing something similar for a political party in the US after the next election?
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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #69
70. fucking appalling
Edited on Thu Nov-30-06 07:33 PM by iverglas
Like their Democratic cousins in the United States, the Liberals will rebuild their strength by driving home the stark differences between a progressive, inclusive party and a right-wing government that "feeds on fear, depends on differences and ultimately, conquers by dividing," Dean told the conference.

I'm afraid that "Yankee go home" is about all I can think of to say.

Anybody remember Carolyn Parrish and Francie Ducros? At least they weren't engaging in PARTISAN politics by butting into the political processes of a foreign country.

Fucking appalling.

Oh, wait ... maybe Dean was saying that the Liberals need to drive home the stark differences between the NDP and the Conservatives, or the Bloc and the Conservatives, or the Greens and the Conservatives ... I mean, "progressive, inclusive party"? ... Maybe nobody'd told him where he was.



typo fixed
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MaineDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 07:36 PM
Response to Original message
71. Transcript of his speech
Embargoed Until 8:30pm EST
November 29, 2006


Governor Howard Dean Delivers Keynote Address At The Liberal Party of Canada's Leadership and Biennial Convention

Montreal, Quebec - November 29, 2006

AS PREPARED FOR DELIVERY

Good evening, and thank you.

Frank McKenna, you are a great leader and a great friend. You've been a principled caretaker of the relationship between our two countries. I thank you for that.

And I thank you all for sitting through that video.

That was something. My father would have enjoyed it. My mother - she would have believed it.

Of course the truth is, in this business, success like we had earlier this month in our midterm elections, takes a lot of people working together.

Our 50 state strategy was about people coming together, fighting for what we believe in, and working as hard as they possibly could.

It had to do with partnership.

And that's one of the things I want to speak about tonight.

Parce que je crois, à la lumière des résultats de cette élection, que nous pouvons à nouveau bénéficier d'un partenariat entre les Etats-Unis et le Canada...D'un véritable partenariat...D'un partenariat fondé sur la coopération et la vérité, le respect mutuel et l'égalité.

English Translation: Because I believe, as a result of that election... and as far as the United States and Canada are concerned... Once again, we can have a partnership. A real partnership. A partnership based on cooperation and truth, mutual respect and equality.

That is the kind of relationship that people in border communities - like my home state of Vermont - know so well.

And that is why tonight, I say to my friends, my neighbors, and the delegates of the Liberal Party of Canada...

Je me sens privilégié et suis hautement honoré d'être ici parmi vous ce soir. En fait, j'en suis si crier que je pourrais hurler. Mais, rassurez-vous.

Je ne le ferai pas. Mais je le pourrais..

English Translation: It is a great privilege and honor for me to be here tonight. In fact, I’m so happy I could scream. I will not. But I could.

Let's just say I learned my lesson the hard way.

It's an honor to be here because we all know that the relationship between Canada and the United States - is as important in principle and promise as it is close in proximity.

I'm sure you all remember the Ice Storm of 1998. At its worst, here in Canada, there were well over a million people without power.... and many, many more without power in the northeastern United States.

And cities like St Jean sur Richelieu, in the area that became known as the triangle noir, were particularly hard hit. Forced to go without power for weeks on end.

But there was a flicker of hope. A line was put up - literally an extension cord of good will and cooperation - connected to a power source in Vermont.

Utility companies didn't complain. It wasn't about what regulators said we could or couldn't do. People didn't waste time looking for excuses.

It was about people saying they could help out... and then doing it. Because it was right. It's what you do for your neighbor.

Same thing when wildfires swept through Montana this past summer. Fire fighters from Alberta were on the ground battling 25 different fires. They were offering their help; they were risking their lives.

And it was Canadian emergency responders who were among the first on the ground in New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina. Just one of many reasons why Canada is so often thought of as the conscience of the world.

There are other instances that illustrate our nations' relationship.

In Washington DC, there is only one embassy that sits between our two institutions of federal government - the White House and the Capitol.

It is the Canadian Embassy. And I think it is more than symbolic.

The point is: we are connected by more than an occasional power line. More than the extremely important commercial interests and agreements. More than a border - even one that stretches all the way from New Brunswick to British Columbia, Maine to Washington State.

We are connected by shared values. We share ideals.

And chief among them is our belief in democracy.

Our political systems are different, but the principles are the same. Regardless of party, we are fortunate to live in societies where we regularly exercise our democratic rights in peace and prosperity. And we are lucky to have talented and selfless individuals, like those running for the leadership of the Liberal Party, willing to offer themselves for public service.

The point is, we have choices.

But make no mistake - those choices and their consequences matter. They matter greatly.

I believe there will be many changes now that the Democratic Party has finally regained control of the Senate and the House of Representatives. And just one of these will be renewing our relationship around the world.

As I said at the onset, once again, we can have a partnership. A real partnership. A partnership based on cooperation and truth, mutual respect and equality.

But first there is work to do.

The Democratic Party had a great day a few weeks ago. But it was the start of our rebuilding, not the end.

Still, I believe there are two main lessons from our success. Lessons for progressive parties everywhere.

Simply put, they have to do with the place of power and how it's practiced.

By the place of power, I mean where it resides.

And that is with the people.

It does not work its way from the top down.

It grows from the grassroots up.

It grows not just in the areas that have traditionally supported you. Whether it is the Liberal Party or the Democratic Party, we should never cede a single region or province, never cede a single state or city. Nor should we ever cede a single voter. Not a single one. It is a mark of respect for the voters that we ask each one for their vote regardless of the likelihood of getting it. This is what we call the 50-state strategy.

We shouldn't just court big donors; we must include small contributors.

We have had to transform ourselves into a Party that could communicate with its supporters and with all of our citizens... in the traditional ways... but also in new ways. By using the power and potential of technology as part of an aggressive outreach to meet and include voters and to get our message out.

But at the end of the day -- whether we're talking 50-states or a 13 provinces and territories -- it's pretty simple.

It's just this: Show up everywhere. And work hard everywhere.

Knock on doors everywhere. Make the calls everywhere. Shake hands everywhere. Do the hard work everywhere.

And keep doing it... because that's what running a permanent campaign takes.

So for us, that work won't stop. But I think on November 7th, the American voters demonstrated that if Democrats do these things...

If we show up, work hard and ask people for their votes...we can win in any part of our country.

My party took a major step in this election towards our goal of being a national party again. We won in places that some thought we couldn't. And we earned the votes of people who not have voted for a Democrat in a very long time.

We even earned some votes from people who hadn't even seen a Democrat in quite some time.

We did it by investing early. We did it by investing at the state level, laying the foundation that our outstanding candidates needed to be successful.

But most of all, we did it by showing up in every state in the country and reaching out to all of our citizens, regardless of party or religious affiliation. We did it by talking about our values, and the beliefs we share.

We went to where power resides. And we proved... if we competed in the most conservative parts of the country, we could win ... at any level, anywhere.

Believe it or not, I'm not much of a zen person.

But I've found that the path to power, oddly enough, is to trust others with it. That means remembering the power is where the voters are.

That's the first step to rebuilding a party.

The second step has to do with how we put the power into practice. First, remember it's on loan. Next, fight for what you believe in.

When my party was wandering in the wilderness, there were those who said we should change direction... that we should become more like the Republican Party whose policies and priorities we disagreed with.

When you say that, in essence you are arguing that our basic and guiding principles can be altered or modified.

More than that, you're conceding that those principles may be wrong.

They are not. Our basic principles remain as true as ever. We - Democrats in the United States and Liberals in Canada - share a belief in the same thing -- fiscally responsible, socially progressive values.

And in fact, most Americans -- and I'm quite certain, most Canadians -- support that way of governing.

After all it was our parties - under Bill Clinton and under Jean Chrétien and Paul Martin - who balanced the budgets and ushered in prosperity.

And it was our parties who created and believe in the social safety net.

We're the ones who believe that a bright future goes through our schools and that college should be available for all.

We believe that everyone deserves health care. Thanks to the Liberal Party, Canada has been delivering it for some time. And in the United States, we can learn from you as we work to provide our citizens access to affordable health care.

We believe in embracing innovation and the search for new cures. People here in Montreal know that. My wife, who did a fellowship for McGill for a year knows that, and as a doctor myself, I can tell you: access and innovation lead to health and hope.

We believe that a truly "just society," to use Pierre Trudeau's words... recognizes the fairness of human and civil rights... another area where we would do well copying Canada's conscience... and learning from the people in this room and those who came before you.

Our parties believe that a good job is the foundation of a strong family, a strong community, and a strong country; and we believe that a lifetime of work earns you a retirement with dignity.

Our parties believe to be good citizens of the world community... we have to be good stewards of the environment.

We believe in an honest, open government.

And - yes - we agree on the importance of a smart and strong national security policy, one that includes a change of course in Iraq.

I think President Clinton may have said it best: we shouldn't stay the course. We should "stop and think."

That's what the American people said loudly and clearly during our mid-term elections.

Whenever there is a big election, and particularly one where there is a big power shift -- like the one we had a few weeks ago... and like the one your Liberal Party will have soon enough -- there is always, it seems, as much analysis as there is voting.

And in the days before and after our mid-terms, there was a lot of talk about two kinds of prevailing political strategies.

One feeds on fear... depends on our differences... and ultimately, conquers by dividing.

That is not sustainable.

The other strategy is about hope and promise. We trust people and we bring them together. We appreciate our differences and we focus on our similarities...we say our diversity does not divide us, it defines us. We propose we meet our shared challenges with shared solutions.

The Democratic Party and the Liberal Party are the 'we' parties, our opponents too often are the 'me' parties.

This year we trusted people and brought them together. We are at our best when we create and inspire a sense of community.

That is true of our politics. And it is true of the special relationship between our two countries.

If we always remember that...

If we stand up for what we believe in...

If we show up everywhere and work hard everywhere...

And if we remember that power does not belong to us, it is loaned to us...

I have no doubt, in Canada and the United States... our greatest victories.and our nations' greatest days... are still ahead.

###

Paid for and authorized by the Democratic National Committee, www.democrats.org. This communication is not authorized by any candidate or candidate's committee.
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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #71
74. utter, ignorant, offensive bullshit
And it was our parties who created and believe in the social safety net.

We're the ones who believe that a bright future goes through our schools and that college should be available for all.

We believe that everyone deserves health care. Thanks to the Liberal Party, Canada has been delivering it for some time. And in the United States, we can learn from you as we work to provide our citizens access to affordable health care.

There is no social safety net in the US.

And in Canada, the mainstays of the social safety net -- old age security, universal health care, unemployment insurance -- were achieved after they were first implemented (in the case of universal health care, provincially) and fought, for long and hard, by the CCF and the NDP, and ultimately acquiesced in by the Liberal Party.

http://www.canadianencyclopedia.ca/index.cfm?PgNm=TCE&Params=A1ARTA0001902
Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (CCF), founded 1932 in Calgary as a political coalition of progressive, socialist and labour forces ...

... In 1933 the party met in Regina, where it chose J.S. WOODSWORTH as its first president. Woodsworth, an MP since 1921, was the acknowledged leader of the party both inside and outside Parliament. The party also adopted the Regina Manifesto, which set out its goals, including that of creating a mixed economy through the NATIONALIZATION of key industries and that of establishing a WELFARE STATE with universal pensions, health and welfare insurance, children's allowances, unemployment insurance, workers' compensation and similar programs.

What partisan, false baloney Dean spouts. If he believes it, he has been misled. Yet another reason not to have foreign politicians interfering in domestic politics: they don't know what they're talking about.
If you want to hear a *really* great *really* progressive political speaker, find some audio/video of Tommy Douglas.


The Democratic Party and the Liberal Party are the 'we' parties, our opponents too often are the 'me' parties.

Yeah, Howard? Too bad you don't have an actual progressive party in your lame two-party system in the US, but we do. And the NDP, the Bloc and the Greens -- all opponents of the Liberals -- are not the 'me' parties.

I remain disgusted, but unsurprised, by the Liberal Party. I regret being so disgusted by Howard Dean.






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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 10:19 PM
Response to Reply #74
76. Wow, why don't you say what you really mean?
Our country is lacking much right now in every area, but it is not because of Dean. He was just a governor in VT who ran for president to try to change things.

Now, I don't know jack about the parties in Canada, but I sure know a hateful post when I see it. Sounds like your country has parties that have been hijacked just like our parties here have been. The GOP was hijacked by the neocons and right wing religious extremists, and the Democratic party was hijacked by the big money and corporatists.

Dean's speech was one that said give the power back to the people who should rightly have it.

Your rants in this thread seem overwrought. Clinton goes to Canada trying to affect change in the Liberal Party all the time. What do you think of that? Carville was up there with the Liberals in October. How about that? Now there's a really nice guy for your country to pay attention to.

I can not imagine what harm in the world it did to have a speaker from America, unless you really truly honestly think Dean is like Bush.

And if you do, then that is pathetic. Absolutely pathetic.

Oh, and BTW, I was just reading that they are not going the rout of change. They are going with the same old, just like our Democrats here want to do....with the exception of Dean, Kucinich, etc.

So, even though Dean mentioned reaching out to everyone in the party, they did not listen....so he did not "corrupt" them.

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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-01-06 01:07 PM
Response to Reply #76
78. wow, why don't you address what I said?
Our country is lacking much right now in every area, but it is not because of Dean.

Did someone say it was? What has that statement got to do with anything *I* said?

Now, I don't know jack about the parties in Canada

Maybe you should find something out, so you have a chance of understanding the posts you respond to.

Clinton goes to Canada trying to affect change in the Liberal Party all the time.

What????? Where the hell did you get this idea?

Clinton speaks in Canada as a paid speaker, just as he speaks anywhere else. For instance:

http://www.embassymag.ca/html/index.php?display=tp&tp_date=1141794000
Embassy, March 8th, 2006
TALKING POINTS
Clinton in Town
Former U.S. president Bill Clinton was in Ottawa on Monday as part of the "Power Within" speaking tour, along with Tour de France cycling champion Lance Armstrong. 5,000 people, including former prime minister Jean Chrétien, crammed into the Congress Centre to hear the Mr. Clinton speak about leadership.

Clinton spoke as a private individual hired by a profit-making enterprise, and Chrétien, and a lot of other people, attended the event as members of the paying public. (Maybe Chrétien got a freebie, but he was still there as a private individual and not as a head of government or leader of a party.)

Are you actually thinking that it would be even remotely acceptable for any US citizen, let alone a former head of state, to try to effect change in a political party in a foreign country???

I will ask, yet again: in what circumstances would a US citizen think it acceptable for a foreigner to try to effect change in one of the political parties in his/her country?

I can not imagine what harm in the world it did to have a speaker from America, unless you really truly honestly think Dean is like Bush.

Some people just have weak imaginations, I guess. Or like to cover their ears and go wah-wah -- since you have absolutely no need to "imagine" anything in this regard, it having been explained to you over and over.

So, even though Dean mentioned reaching out to everyone in the party, they did not listen....so he did not "corrupt" them.

The arrogance of the uninformed US mind never ceases to amaze me. You have no clue what is going on in the Liberal Party of Canada, and you would be very wise to stop proving it in public.

Your rants in this thread seem overwrought.

And when all else fails, a little personal commentary never goes amiss, eh?




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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-01-06 01:16 PM
Response to Reply #78
80. You mixed up two posts in your rants.
I prefer to think that most in Canada are nicer.

As I said, you seem to think all politicians are the same here in the US.

I don't think that way about your country.

You quoted what another poster said and attributed it to me. But I agree with that poster.

This "uninformed US mind" is much more open than yours is. Your hatred of our country is very obvious. I recommend you direct it at the appropriate people.

And if you think Clinton was just there as a paid speaker, you need to research. I don't deal in gossip, so I will mention no names.


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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-01-06 01:54 PM
Response to Reply #80
81. no, I didn't, and you might want to withdraw this silly allegation
You quoted what another poster said and attributed it to me. But I agree with that poster.

Everything in boldface in my previous post was copied and pasted from the post of yours to which I was replying. I have no idea what you are talking about, and it's unfortunate that you didn't bother to leave a clue.

As I said, you seem to think all politicians are the same here in the US.

As I said, you might want to address something I have actually said instead of making up offensive and unfounded bullshit.

Any chance you'd like to answer the question I've asked in just about every post so far? And not with some disingenuous "wow, I'd love it if a foreign politician came and talked at a political convention here!"

This US politician was the keynote speaker at a leadership convention. How would most USAmericans like it if the keynote speaker at a Democratic or Republican presidential nominating convention were the Howard Dean equivalent from another country? The CEO, or board chair, of a political party?

You can't actually imagine an equivalent situation, of course, because there really isn't another country in the world that shoves its nose into other countries' business to the extent that the US does. Maybe you could imagine that Martians have taken to colonizing some of the countries on earth, politically and economically and culturally, and wonder how a USAmerican would like having a Martian give the keynote speech at a presidential nominating convention. Say, a really nice Martian.

I don't give a crap whether Howard Dean is Eugene Debs reincarnated. He should not be interfering in the party politics of another country. His speech was PARTISAN. He praised the Liberal Party for things it is not even responsible for, he openly associated his party with the Liberal Party of Canada, and this is UNACCEPTABLE.

Canadian governments and political parties have never taken openly partisan positions in their dealings with the US government. The Liberal Party of Canada, which stands a good chance of being the governing party in the relatively near future, has now identified itself with the Democratic Party in the US. What if the Republicans do *not* lose the presidency in 2008? How clever is it for the governing Canadian political party to have openly aligned itself with the opposition US political party in this way? Not very. Not that it makes a whole lot of difference, frankly -- I'm waiting for the Democrat-controlled Congress to return the billions of dollars the US owes Canada for softwood lumber duties collected in violation of NAFTA -- but it is simply not clever.

This "uninformed US mind" is much more open than yours is.

What in the bleeding hell does this have to do with the openness of anyone's mind? Are you completely incapable of recognizing a subject of discussion and addressing it -- or do you just not want to?

Your hatred of our country is very obvious.

Well, your statement is false, but your ignorance of Canada is indeed obvious.

And when what one does has such huge effects on other people -- as what the US does has on Canada -- it's hard to distinguish the effects of ignorance from the effects of hatred much of the time.

And if you think Clinton was just there as a paid speaker, you need to research. I don't deal in gossip, so I will mention no names.

And if you think I'm going to play stupid guessing games about unspoken gossip, you're mistaken.

But sigh, I suppose you're still just not getting it. Of course political parties in various countries have relations. The NDP belongs to the Socialist International:
http://www.web.ca/~ondp/links_SI.html
Of course political parties sometimes retain or consult foreign expertise.

And one Canadian political party hires a celebrity US politician to utter effusive undeserved praise about it at its leadership convention, thereby acting like the desperate licker of US boots that it is.

And the celebrity US politician in question has insulted all Canadians who know what the Liberal Party is and know that it is no more the champion of the social safety net, just for starters, than the Democratic Party is in the US (wow, who signed that welfare reform legislation?), and who are disgusted by a US politician lending his shiny image to the party we oppose and vote against.

Your hero has got into bed with our villains. Like I did say: their choice, all round. I like to see the Liberal Party looking like desperate toadies; it's what they are.

But this in no way alters the fact that it was absolutely improper for a US politician to associate himself with a political party in a foreign country in a way so unmistakably calculated to generate support for that party. Imperialism is just ugly, no matter who is engaging in it.

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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-01-06 02:15 PM
Response to Reply #81
82. The Liberal Party are your villains? Desperate Toadies?
Well, I did not have a clue about that. They sounded pretty decent on the parts I watched.

Yes, you did mix up posters' quotes. But it doesn't matter, I agree with them.
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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-01-06 02:27 PM
Response to Reply #82
83. "Well, I did not have a clue about that."
There ya go.

As was quoted in another recent thread here: Liberals campaign from the left and govern from the right. Canadians who pay any attention at all are quite aware of this. The fact that "left" and "right" don't actually mean the same thing in Canada as they mean in the US is irrelevant; there happens to be a left in Canada.

Tommy Douglas was not a Liberal.
http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=-8011314353978191737&q=%22tommy+douglas%22

I am not a Liberal. And never will be.

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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 11:08 PM
Response to Reply #74
77. Your outrage on this thread over this is so over the top
that it actually made me giggle. Do carry on.
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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-01-06 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #77
79. some people just see what they want to see and not what's there

"Outrage"? Disgust. I've said it, and I've expressed it, and I've exhibited it.

But hey, don't let me get in your way.

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CHIMO Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #71
75. Thank You
For posting the keynote speech of a Canadian political party at the convention to elect a new leader.

Couldn't find it anywhere else.
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 07:41 PM
Response to Original message
72. Maybe Smirk will be asked to keynote the Tory convention
:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
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iverglas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-30-06 07:50 PM
Response to Reply #72
73. nah, let's have Ignatieff asked to keynote the Democratic Convention

hahahahahahaha hah.

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