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OhioChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 06:03 AM
Original message
Voter ID rules change a third time in four days (OH)
Monday, October 30, 2006
Mark Rollenhagen
Plain Dealer Columbus Bureau

A federal appeals court Sunday jumped into the fray over Ohio's new voter-identification law, changing the rules for absentee voters for the third time since Thursday morning.

A three-judge panel of the 6th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Cincinnati blocked an emergency order issued by a federal judge in Columbus Thursday night that had set aside ID requirements for absentee voters after determining that they were vague, confusing and unevenly applied by county election boards.

The ruling left unclear what would happen to absentee ballots mailed since Friday.

http://www.cleveland.com/open/plaindealer/index.ssf?/ba...

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lizziegrace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 06:06 AM
Response to Original message
1. I'm on my way to work
and I don't have time to read the article. My daughter (away at college) has her absentee ballot to mail. Can someone tell me what she should do with it? Mail it, don't mail?

Thanks!
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INdemo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 07:40 AM
Response to Reply #1
11. Call your local county clerk
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catmandu57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 09:29 AM
Response to Reply #1
14. I'd make a copy of her id
get it notarized and send it back with the ballot.
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lizziegrace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 06:31 PM
Response to Reply #1
24. Too late
She mailed it this morning. It's going to Delaware County and she was asked to either provide her DL # or the last 4 of her social.

I hope they count it.

:(
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Eurobabe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 06:08 AM
Response to Original message
2. CONS still trying to steal OH, I see...my overseas ballot better be counted!!
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liberal N proud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 06:09 AM
Response to Original message
3. Confusion - They want it to be a state of confusion
When everyone is confused, they can tamper with things much easier.
1. Keep the poll workers very confused
2. Keep the voter very confused and maybe keep some of them away from the polls
3. Keep the media confused, thus sending mixed messages to the voter adding to their confusion.

This could be a bigger mess than 04 when they fought to the 12th hour about voter protection something the republicans like to call challengers.

As far as the absentee, they are looking for any means possible to negate those ballots and not have to count them.
This is Blackwell's game and he isn't finished until every voter is disenfranchised.
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jimshoes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 06:19 AM
Response to Original message
4. This is going to cause a lot of
Edited on Mon Oct-30-06 06:21 AM by jimshoes
extra work and confusion. Some absentee ballot packs have been sent out already with a special instruction sheet declaring: (Pursuant to Federal Court Order, You are not required to provide any of the following information or documentation in filling out this application). Then it listed the different forms of ID that were previously needed. This was in my absentee ballot pack which I recieved on Saturday. My wife , who got her ballot pack on Friday didn't receive the special instructions.
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katinmn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 06:23 AM
Response to Original message
5. Here we go again. Votes flipping in Florida. Mass chaos in Ohio.
Even George Will saying something is fishy.

We're in for a looooooooooong election season. Courts will decide.
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DoYouEverWonder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 06:34 AM
Response to Original message
6. You can't change the rules during an election
even if the rules turn out to be crappy.

Once Ohio started sending out ballots, all ballots are supposed to be treated the same.

Looks like another mess in the making. Of course, Ken Blackwell is still in charge, isn't he?

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Igel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 07:20 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. Unless Blackwell now inhabits
5 bodies--that posing as the Elections guy, one functioning as a federal judge, and another functioning as three appeals court judges ...

The current muddiness is because of judges. Perhaps accurately, perhaps unimportantly, Blackwell apparently was content enough with the previous ruling and didn't want this appeal (the article says).

They shouldn't change the rules mid-stream. I agree. Even if "they" are federal judges.
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shirlden Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 07:03 AM
Response to Original message
7. The latest instructions I rec'd
from the Franklin County Board of Elections is that I do not need a current address on my drivers license. I do not have my current address on my license, due to the fact that they are issued for 4 years and I moved 3 years ago and have voted in every election at the same place I will be going to next Tuesday.
My solution.....I am anal about keeping records, so I plan to take a grocery bag full of bills, pay stubs, passport, etc with me. I will dump it all on the counter and say take whatever you need from this, but I intend to vote and not on a provisional.
In 2004 when the repigs threatened to "challenge voters" I took my strongest, custom made, wood walking stick (I am 70)to the polls with me, with the intent that if any repig challenged my right to vote, I wanted to make sure he was never able to walk up to another voter for the rest of his life. They need to understand that protecting our freedoms can be very painful for anyone who gets in the way.

May Blackheart roast in hell along with the rest of the repig pond scum in my beautiful Ohio.

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DoYouEverWonder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 07:25 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. Why don't you just update your driver's license?
I don't know about OH, but in most states it's the law that you have to notify the Motor Vehicles Dept if you move.

In FL, you can do it through the mail and they send a sticker to put on the back of your old license.



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mtnester Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 07:57 AM
Response to Reply #9
12. For those that have the jack, that is fine
how many folks that are just squeaking by have a spare $19.50 to fork out just to guarantee their RIGHT to vote? Ohio does NOT require you to update your DL if you change addresses until your renewal time. Changes in the meantime are $19.50.

This is part of the problem in Ohio...all of Blackwell's "acceptible" forms of ID require you to spend money.

This will be presented to the Ohio Supreme Court today...absolutely

http://www.dispatch.com/?story=dispatch/2006/10/30/2006...
But Subodh Chandra, a Cleveland lawyer representing one of the groups that sued to challenge the ID requirement, has said he plans to appeal the 6 th Circuit ruling to the U.S. Supreme Court.

Chandra, representing Service Employees International Union 1199, said last nights court action guarantees more confusion among voters and poll workers and puts votes at risk of not being counted.

"We hope that the 6 th Circuit is not taking the position that one must permit an election to be a train wreck before one tries to stop the wreck," Chandra said. "Thats what appears to be happening."

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AndyTiedye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 01:06 PM
Response to Reply #12
22. They Call That a POLL TAX. It is Illegal
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shirlden Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:38 AM
Response to Reply #9
13. I did notify
the DMV, but they do not send you out a new license and it does cost time and money to get one. My point is I should not have to go thru this bullcrap. I left here for New Orleans right after Katrina and just got back to Ohio a couple of weeks ago. This is my home, I went down there to do whatever I could to help.
Now I find that while I was gone, Blackheart has been busy stealing my right to vote.

May he rot in hell !!!
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LittleWoman Donating Member (217 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 03:15 AM
Response to Reply #7
27. You do not need to bring all that stuff
Edited on Tue Oct-31-06 03:16 AM by LittleWoman
I am a poll worker in Franklin County and I just went to training last week. If you have your driver's license and it has an address different from your voting address you will still be able to vote a regular ballot. The poll worker should ask you for your current address and then will look at your id. If the address is different and the address in the poll book is your current address all the poll worker has to do is note your driver's license number in the book. You will sign the book and vote as usual. If you like you can take a current utility bill in your name or other official government letter addressed to you at your voting address. Do not bother to take your passport --it is not allowed as id because it does not show your address.

If for some reason the address on your driver's license is your current address and the address in the poll book is incorrect you will still be able to vote a regular ballot if your current address is in that precinct. You will just have to fill out a change of address form. If your current address is not in that precinct the poll worker should be able to tell where to vote. When you go there you will have to fill out a change of address and vote on a provisional ballot on the voting machine. It is very important that you vote in the precinct where you currently live.

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texpatriot2004 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 07:27 AM
Response to Original message
10. Voting in America went so much better before the "help
America vote act"
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Kolesar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 09:51 AM
Response to Original message
15. Voter ID rules change a third time in four days (Fed court reinstates Ohio ID req)
Voter ID rules change a third time in four days

Monday, October 30, 2006--Plain Dealer Columbus Bureau

A federal appeals court Sunday jumped into the fray over Ohio's new voter-identification law, changing the rules for absentee voters for the third time since Thursday morning. A three-judge panel of the 6th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Cincinnati blocked an emergency order issued by a federal judge in Columbus Thursday night that had set aside ID requirements for absentee voters after determining that they were vague, confusing and unevenly applied by county election boards. The ruling left unclear what would happen to absentee ballots mailed since Friday.

"These are details that can be ironed out, but we're interested in all ballots being counted," said Mark Anthony, a spokesman for Ohio Attorney General Jim Petro. Petro appealed U.S. District Judge Algenon Marbley's Thursday order even though the office of Secretary of State Ken Blackwell had said it did not want to appeal.

In an order issued Sunday evening, the appeals court panel shelved Marbley's order and allowed Petro to intervene in the case on behalf of the Ohio General Assembly, which earlier this year approved legislation establishing the new ID rules.

The panel also ordered that all absentee ballots be held for safekeeping.

Subodh Chandra, one of the lawyers for a Cleveland homeless advocacy group and a Columbus-based labor union that challenged the law, said it was unclear what would happen to votes cast over the weekend - or in person at boards of elections on Friday - in light of the intervention by the appeals court. "They're at risk of not being counted," Chandra said. "That's the situation: more chaos and confusion."

...snip...

http://www.cleveland.com/election/plaindealer/index.ssf...

So, Petro is carrying the gop's agenda, even though SOS Blackwell claims he did not want this appeal? Ironic is that Blackwell attacked Petro viciously to defeat him in the gubernatorial primary.
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FogerRox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 09:51 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. How do you spell scum bag fascists?
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Greeby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 09:51 AM
Response to Reply #15
17. They really want this bad, don't they?
Wonder why? :sarcasm:
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TrogL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #15
23. Would you like Canada to come down and supervise your elections?
We've got a perfectly good infrasture and it doesn't look like the government's going to fall anytime before Nov. 7th (although you never know in our system).
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w4rma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 02:37 AM
Response to Reply #23
26. Yes. (nt)
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ClintonTyree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 04:39 AM
Response to Reply #23
28. Or have NATO monitor our elections..........
just like they do in banana republics where crooked, petty dictators run the government. Oh........we DO live in a banana republic where a petty dictator runs the government! :grr:

Yes, someone, ANYONE...........please help "the most powerful country on earth" :eyes: succeed in having fair elections!
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muriel_volestrangler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 08:53 AM
Response to Reply #28
30. You do realise that does happen, don't you?
Not in a major way ("no systematic observation of polling station procedures will take place"), but the idea of monitoring screwups like changing the ID rules is there:

Giovanni Kessler from Italy, former Deputy President of the OSCE Parliamentary Assembly, leads the mission of 16 election analysts from 13 OSCE participating States.

Following a briefing in Washington DC, the analysts will be deployed across the United States to meet the relevant State electoral authorities and political parties and candidates participating in the elections.

OSCE/ODIHR election analysts will follow campaign activities, the legislative framework and its implementation, the media, the work of the election administration and relevant government bodies, and the resolution of election disputes. They will be guided by OSCE commitments, international standards and best practices for holding democratic elections, as well as national legislation, including the 2002 Help America Vote Act, which amongst other things introduced reform of voting technologies.

Although the mission may visit some polling stations on election day, no systematic observation of polling station procedures will take place. A final report with findings and recommendations will be issued approximately 8 weeks after the elections.

http://osce.org/item/21858.html
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muriel_volestrangler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 08:47 AM
Response to Reply #23
29. Is Canada's system secure and easier, or just more trusting?
I ask because the UK system is much easier to use, but also easier to abuse. The electoral register is produced by mailing every house a form, on which one person fills out the names of everyone they say lives at the house, and that one person signs it. To vote in person, all you have to do is turn up to the local polling station (covering maybe a couple of thousand voters) with the card they mail you, and you can vote. No ID or address checking at all. If you lose the card, then you can still vote - you tell them your name and address, and they look it up on the register. As far as I know, they don't ask for any ID.
Someone trying to vote twice would only get found out if they try to vote twice at the same polling station, and the staff recognise them; or the real person whose vote they've stolen also tries to vote, so that they end up with a duplication.

The system for postal voting is even less secure. Anyone can apply to vote by post, just by filling in a form and signing it - again, no ID check. You can even ask for the voting form to be sent to a different address than the one you're registered at - so stealing someone else's vote is easy (if they realise they haven't been sent a voting card, and they then complain to the authorities, you might get caught; so you just need an address mail can be sent to that can't be traced back to you later). When filling in the voting form, all you have to do is to get anybody to witness that you sealed the voting envelope - a friend of mine got his 5 year old son to do it, last year. That would be easy to fake too.

So, you can easily give yourself 2 or 3 votes, just by claiming there are more people living at your address than in reality. The only way you're likely to get caught out on that is if one of the made-up people gets called for jury service, which is done off the electoral register (but claim they're over 70, and they won't get called). I think they do get suspicious when many adults are claimed to live at the same address (over, say, 10), but make it look as though your aged parents live with you, and they'll never notice. Horribly insecure.

So does Canada's system make you feel safe? Or is it that not so many people in Canada want to defraud the system as they seem to in the US? That seems to be what the British system relies on.
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Doremus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:16 AM
Response to Original message
18. The neocon mind is a criminal mind.
Sons of bitches exist only to stick it to their fellow human beings.

With all the emphasis on absentee voting, I KNEW they'd come up with some way to disqualify those ballots.

May all the negative energy expended in screwing the rest of us come back to them a thousand fold.
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:33 AM
Response to Original message
19. First off-I'm confused just reading that
Second- suuuuuuure Blackwell doesn't want to appeal it

PuhLEEEEEEEEAZE!
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:55 AM
Response to Original message
20. It sounds like Blackwell doesn't want people to vote
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superconnected Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:07 AM
Response to Original message
21. How fucking scary.
The people who don't trust the voting machines don't get a break there.

Betcha the poorer and interracial communities(dem) get a lot less votes that get counted than the wealthy ones.
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struggle4progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:45 PM
Response to Original message
25. Julia Smith Gibbons was originally appointed by Reagan and was
promoted to the Appeals Court by GW Bush. David William McKeague was originally appointed by GHW Bush and promoted to the Appeals Court by GW Bush.

What a surprise ...
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