New allegations against Armstrong

[stop the bleeding]

Latest Cycling News for June 23, 2006

Edited by Jeff Jones, with assistance from Susan Westemeyer

New allegations against Armstrong

Barely three weeks after the Vrijman report dismissed L'Equipe's allegations that Lance Armstrong used EPO in 1999, the now retired seven-time Tour champion has come under fire from another angle. French newspaper Le Monde is reporting in its Friday edition that Armstrong admitted to using performance enhancing drugs prior to contracting testicular cancer in 1996.

The allegations were made during the SCA Promotions vs. Armstrong trial that is in progress in Lance's home state of Texas. SCA Promotions is an insurance company that paid Armstrong millions of dollars for his Tour wins after the team took out a $420,000 insurance policy in 2001. But following the publication of David Walsh and Pierre Ballester's book, LA Confidentiel, les secrets de Lance Armstrong, which alleged that Armstrong had used illegal drugs, SCA disputed the $5 million payment for the 2004 Tour, saying that it wanted evidence (Armstrong's medical records, for example) that the allegations were untrue.

In court statements obtained by Le Monde, Betsy Andreu, the partner of Armstrong's ex-teammate and friend Frankie Andreu, related her version of events that took place in an Indiana hospital on October 28, 1996, while he was being treated for cancer. " started to ask him banal questions, I don't remember," Le Monde quoted an excerpt of Betsy Andreu's testimony. "And all of a sudden, bang, have you ever taken doping products? He replied, yes. asked which ones. And Lance replied: EPO, growth hormones, cortisone, steroids, testosterone."



Read full article here:
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2006/jun06/...

[atomic-fly]

1. Frankies wife...this should be interesting.

I wonder if Frankie will stand by her. I am thinking that this is more
widespread than reported.
I think they develop the attitude that it's ok because
everyone who wins does it.
I always hope that none of this is true, but when people
like Tyler Hamilton get busted it really makes you aware
how widespread it is.
I'm still a Jan Ullrich fan and hope he rides clean.

[Lerkfish]

2. well, that's hearsay at best.

not that I doubt its true, but how could it possibly be used as evidence?

[Scairp]

36. Yeah, he would confess in front of her?

IF, and I do mean if, he did admit this, is would only have been to his treating physicians, the ones trying to save his life. And that my friends falls under doctor/patient privilege. I highly doubt they would have asked him about this in front of some guy's wife. Of course, she may have had her ear to the door or something, but that doesn't mean he wasn't answering their questions and saying no to each named substance. I don't understand why people are continuing to try and bring him down. It just really pisses me off. And IF he used those drugs prior to 1996, what the name of Hades does that have to do with 1999 and beyond? He didn't win any Tours until '99 so it would be completely irrelevant. This is almost as bad as those who said Lance had an advantage due to the cancer drugs used to save his life. Yeah, what a great advantage, having testicular cancer spread to your lungs and brain and a 15% chance of survival. The big cheat.

[xchrom]

3. oh brother.

[shrike]

4. They sure got it in for Lance, don't they?

Well, success draws enemies. I hope he's innocent of all charges and that this trask talk eventually goes away.

[LostinVA]

5. Good grief, GIVE IT UP n/t

[Exultant Democracy]

6. It's great that DU is here to support Lance

I guess the reason that DU tears apart Barry Bonds is because everyone is biased against baseball players.

You will never hear lets put an asterisk next to Lance's name and he admits taking riods on purpose.

I am sure it isn't racism The problem is Bonds attitued, if he didn't act so "uppity" maybe people wouldn't mind him so much.

[hughee99]

17. You're right

Barry Bonds has admitted using products such as "the cream" and "the clear" but claims he didn't know they were steroids. Lance Armstrong has continued to deny all accusations of taking performance enhancing drugs, and despite many attempts, no one has come close to proving anything yet.

Yes, these 2 scenarios are EXACTLY the same, the only difference is race. Shame on Duers!

[brentspeak]

42. Uh, yeah, "shame"...

You might want to get a new pack of race cards -- your post turned up a losing hand.

[hughee99]

43. You did see the :sarcasm: at the end, didn't you? n/t

[brentspeak]

44. I did, but I misunderstood its meaning. Apologies -- I barked up

the wrong tree.

[hughee99]

46. No problem ;)

More than once I've typed something that I intended to read one way, but because of my wording it was taken a completely different way. When I saw you're response, I went back over my own post a few times to see if this happened again. No problem at all.

[toopers]

18. A few things you forgot to mention . . .

1) Armstrong vehemently denies ever taking steroids -- Bonds denies "knowingly" taking steroids.

2) Armstrong didn't double in size in 1 year

3) So far, no one has come forth and said they injected/gave Armstrong steroids

4) Armstrong's abilities did not drastically increase as he got older

5) During Armstrong's reign, he was the most tested human on earth -- I do not even remember mention of Bonds taking a test.

Item 5 could be easily contested, I just don't remember. The point is that Armstrong has dealt with a level of testing that Bonds would have feared a few years ago.

[thinkingwoman]

25. Armstrong didn't double in size in 1 year

Yep, that pretty much does it for me even without the other 4 points you make.

There is just no comparison of the two athletes and skin color certainly has nothing to do with it.

[LostinVA]

30. Armstrong actually DECREASED in size n/t

[Owsley]

34. EPO...

...doesn't make you bigger. It increases the oxygen carrying capacity of your blood. Please don't interpret this as an accusation of Lance Armstrong. I'm still not sure where I stand on the issue. On the one hand I really want to believe that Lance was really that amazing on a bike. On the other hand I'm supposed to believe that a guy who absolutely dominates a sport when most of the riders are doped isn't doping himself?

The comparisons with Bonds are weak at best. As previous posters have mentioned, Lance has been tested more rigorously than most athletes on the planet (though for a time they didn't test for EPO...kind of like MLB not testing for HGH). There is far more circumstantial evidence to implicate Bonds than Lance.

Owsley

[LostinVA]

35. I know about EPO -- but some of the other stuff he's been accused of takin

would have made him BIG... instead, he looks like the ultrarunners I know: nothing but skin, muscle, and sinew.

[Owsley]

38. Cancer treatment...

...was probably one of the biggest reasons he lost so much body weight. As far as cyclists go, pre-cancer he was a pretty big guy.

Owsley

[LostinVA]

39. No, that's what I meant

In his book, he mentions how bulky he was before the cancer, and how when he rebuild his body afterward, he was smaller -- Built more like an ultra running (except for the MASSIVE quads), with less bulk... and how this made him a better cyclist.

So, IF he took stuff before his cancer, the irony is that his cancer made him stop taking such possible drugs and thus he became a better athlete without the drugs. IF he took stuff before.

[rinsd]

22. What a shameful defense of Barry Bonds.

Bonds doesn't act "uppity", he acts like a prima donna asshole.

The only time Barry Bonds has taken a social stand for anything is invoking racism as a shield against his roid allegations.

Yeah one guy took roids under a doctor supervison while fighting cancer then has come out clean in the most tested sport on earth.

The other guy took roids because of his ego.

Just like Harry Reid's boxing tickets and Dukester's yacht are the same thing, I guess the above is.

[tabasco]

45. Yep, you're right. It is Bonds' attitude.

Barry Bonds is a first-class asshole and you look ridiculous playing the race card to defend him.

I remember what a jerk Bonds was in Pittsburgh to the fans and press.

Nothing changed after he left either.

[Moderator]

7. kick

[Flagg]

8. New doping allegations against Lance Armstrong

Paris - Seven-time Tour de France winner Lance Armstrong allegedly told doctors treating him for cancer that he had doped, the French daily Le Monde reported on Friday.

Citing sworn testimony given in Texas by the wife of Armstrong's former best friend, cyclist Frankie Andreu, the retired Tour champion told doctors at Indian Hospital in 1996 that he had taken 'EPO, growth hormones, cortisone, steroids and testosterone.'

Le Monde said it had obtained a copy of Betsy Andreu's testimony, which she gave on January 17 in Dallas during an arbitration session in the lawsuit pitting Armstrong against the insurance company SCA Promotions.

The daily also said that her husband had given the same testimony on October 25.

However, in a deposition to the Dallas court, given November 30, 2005, Armstrong denied that any doctor at Indiana Hospital had asked him if he had used illegal substances.

He also said that Betsy Andreu's testimony was based on her dislike for him.

Armstrong is suing SCA Promotions, which specializes in insuring risks linked to sporting feats, because the company has refused to pay 5 million dollars (4 million euros) for his 2004 Tour de France victory after the Texas native was accused of using illegal substances in the book L.A. Confidential.

Armstrong retired from professional racing after winning his record seventh consecutive Tour de France last year.

© 2006 dpa - Deutsche Presse-Agentur

http://sport.monstersandcritics.com/othersport/article_...

[Rich Hunt]

9. do you have a local source for this?

I don't see how this is more relevant to the front page, than, say, a thwarted terrorist plot.

[Renew Deal]

10. This shit never ends.

These French losers can't handle that an American is the greatest champion in their races history. He won 7 times. Get over it.

[Flagg]

11. Newsflash: they're all doped

**

No need for that kind of language "French losers "

[Sequoia]

13. I agree.

Bash the French on the Freeper site, not here. Lance is a prissy Bush-lovin' clown anyway. It's only the Black basepall players who do drugs, right?

[Room101]

14. "Lance is a prissy Bush-lovin' clown" ??

According to whom? Lance is on record telling Bush that Iraq was NOT a good idea.

[Renew Deal]

16. And bash the americans on DU?

[stop the bleeding]

20. even though he spent election night 2004 with the Kerry headquarters,

yeah Lance went on a bike ride with *, but that was to promote research on his Cancer work.

I doubt that Lance is a Bushlover - just MHO

[LostinVA]

31. THis has nothing to do with Bush or racism

Good grief... no, it's not only black baseball players, it's a big chunk of baseball players. Good grief, what strawmen.

[Renew Deal]

15. There is absolute need for that

and worse. They are petty, whiney, america hating losers. They can't stand that an American is their greatest champion.

[Flagg]

21. "whiney, america hating losers"

"They can't stand that an American is their greatest champion."


Take it easy. This isn't fuckfrance.com.
Nobody here is bashing America.
And French people don't own the Tour de France. It's always been an international race.
Next year it will start in London.

Yeah, French cyclists are losers but there's a good reason for that but you'll probably call me an america hating loser if I tell you...

[Scairp]

37. Yes they have

Le Monde has had a hate-fest going against Armstrong for a number of years and you cannot believe anything they print about him.

[LostinVA]

40. That I agree with -- Lance reminds me of Hillary in a a way

It doesn't matter what he does, or how many times he proves that things aren't true, there's a certain group that cannot let go their obsessive dislike (and even hate of him). Like HRC and the Freepers.

[spag68]

12. Lance Armstrong

In this insane world we live in how can it be that this gets more notice then important things like anything to do with bushcorp.

[MadHound]

19. Well, first off, this is hearsay evidence

Not allowed in a court of law, for good reasons. Secondly, it originates with somebody you disliked Lance, hmm makes me kind of suspicious right there.

And finally, even if this was all true, it apparently all took place years before Lance's Tour victories, in fact took place before he contracted cancer. Now I don't know about you, but if I had just lost one of my nuts to testicular cancer I would put an immediate halt to whatever I was taking that could put my other nut in danger, be it 'roids, EPO, or fucking Krispy Kreme Doughnuts.

He came out the other side of his cancer treatments clean, he always tested clean for his rides, he has withstood extreme scrutiny on this subject, so now his critics are resorting to hearsay evidence from admitted detrators.

Weak, very weak.

[slackmaster]

23. France should surrender to itself

Pathetic.

[Flagg]

24. keep your French-bashing to yourself

It's not the the evil america hating cheese-eating surrender monkeys against saint Lance.

They all do it.
Including Lance Armstrong.
You're being naive if you think any of those guys can ride their bikes and climb mountains at 30 miles per hour for 3 weeks without taking anything.

[thinkingwoman]

26. So all of the testing is BS then?

That sport is overtested, frankly...and yet year after year a whole bunch of "those guys" do actually "ride their bikes and climb mountains at 30 miles per hour for 3 weeks" and come up clean on the tests. How does that happen do you think?

[slackmaster]

27. I couldn't ride like that no matter what drugs I took

But I do believe there are a few people who can. Lance Armstrong is one of them.

[stop the bleeding]

28. Being a Bike Racer that has raced with and against the

"pros" I have seen both sides of this, yes there are people who ride their bike just as fast with or without drugs, just like I have seen riders who shoot up before a race get dropped in the first 20 miles. It is on both sides of racing.

Just for the record people, they go up those mountains more like 12-16mph tops with an occasional burst of speed, most mortals like myself average around 6-9mph going up the same gradients.

On edit: until some REAL proof comes forth, preferably not from a newspaper that shows that Lance is a doper then I am on the side that believes he is clean, call me naive or just call me a reasonable person that is looking for solid proof.

[Squatch]

29. Lance Armstrong, himself, admits to EPO use

in his book "It's Not About the Bike: My Journey Back to Life" as PART OF HIS CANCER TREATMENT!"

[LostinVA]

32. Bingo n/t

[alfredo]

33. People just cannot accept the fact that Lance and his team found

the way to win the tour year after year. It meant sacrificing the rest of the season, but for their sponsors that was fine because the tour is all that matters to the US audience.
Everything the team did was designed for one goal: win the tour. Lance got to France months early to ride the course over and over again. He also worked on the sections where he felt he needed more work.

Everything about Lance was studied by his trainers. Every detail of his training, down to weighing everything he ate and drank, was monitored. When on the bike they knew his vital signs in real time. Position on his bike was optimized. His pedal stroke was adjusted, and so was the gearing to optimize performance.

His manager was the best in the business. During the tour he knew the vital signs for all racers. He knew their strengths and when to use them. Lances team controlled the race from day one. Not much happened without their consent. They were that dominant.

Doping cannot make up for poor conditioning, poor planning, poor strategy, and sub par team mates. Lance, barring any accidents or illness, had the tour won as soon as he rode off the ramp in the prologue.

His team (Discovery) has returned this year. Lance won't be there, but the same intelligent team manager is running the show. Look for them to do well. George Hincapie will be the team leader. he is the meanest Mother fucker on the road. Look for him to be a favorite.

[brentspeak]

41. Another French newspaper allegation against Lance Armstrong?

Then you know the allegation is 100% B.S.