New 'Iraq massacre' tape emerges

[Henny Penny]

"The BBC has uncovered new video evidence that US forces may have been responsible for the deliberate killing of 11 innocent Iraqi civilians.

The video appears to challenge the US military's account of events that took place in the town of Ishaqi in March. "

*************

"The video tape obtained by the BBC shows a number of dead adults and children at the site with what our world affairs editor John Simpson says were clearly gunshot wounds.

The pictures came from a hardline Sunni group opposed to coalition forces.

It has been cross-checked with other images taken at the time of events and is believed to be genuine, the BBC's Ian Pannell in Baghdad says."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/5039420.stm

[villager]

1. "apres moi, le deluge"

In this case, "apres" Haditha, the expected deluge of "other" massacres, coming to light...

[redwitch]

9. great billboard!

Bush Cabal portraits with "apres moi, le deluge" underneath.

[villager]

12. DU photoshoppers, you heard redwitch!

Now get busy! :D

[coalition_unwilling]

54. As * might say, "L'etat, c'est moi" . . .

(with apologies to Louix XIV)

[villager]

59. hell, he can't even speak English

How'd he say that in French? Though I'm sure he believes it...

[coalition_unwilling]

60. I'm sure he would pronounce the final 'T' in "L'etat" and "c'est" . . .

which would make for massive hilarity among us francophiles. Come to think of it, he would probably also pronounce the 's' in "apres." :)

[villager]

62. he'd definitely pronounce the last one in "c'est!"

n/t

[truthisfreedom]

2. in the age of technology, it's very difficult to cover up the truth.

i'd say 28% is next. perhaps 26%.

[Toucano]

66. Yet technology cannot force people to see the truth.

Even when it's uncovered and in front of them, too many refuse to see.

[Roland99]

3. Wonder why this tape wasn't spread about by the Sunni forces earlier?

[EFerrari]

44. They tried but remember, at first the "native" reports were

discredited by the Pentagram.

Rumsfeld must have known is was only a matter of time because they didn't try very hard. They only managed to delay the inevitable.

[hatrack]

4. Why are the words "Iraq Massacre" in quotation marks?

It was unquestionably in Iraq, and though the circumstances and responsibility for the evening's events have yet to be established, it certainly was a massacre.

So, why the quotation marks?

[Henny Penny]

8. You should address that very good question to the bbc. n/t

[MGKrebs]

18. I sometimes wonder why "War on Terror" is capitalized.

As if it's a trademark or something.

[frylock]

33. i wonder when they're going to address that typo in the "war of terror"

[nodehopper]

45. I just refer to it as TWAT

[SlavesandBulldozers]

42. because it's a product

a marketing tool.

[coalition_unwilling]

55. It's part of the dot-com emphasis on "branding," I think . . .

Seriously, don't you get a feeling that some of the same money changers who brought us the dot-com boom\bust cycle are involved in creating "Brand Iraq" and associated marketing tie-ins. Andy Card actually explained why they waited until Sept. 2002 to start promoting the Iraq bullshit with the line that "You don't introduce a new product line in August" (or words to that effect).

[heartofthesiskiyou]

48. the " "'s were not like a ? mark would be

my guess is they are quoting someone

[muriel_volestrangler]

5. I just saw it on the BBC

and I'm a bit surprised they broadcast it - it include the body of a dead child (perhaps 5 years old?) with part of its skull blown away. Horrifying.

[Phoonzang]

6. Surprise!

Not....

[AlCzervik]

7. you know the reports that come out about "X # of bodies discovered"

in iraq, is anyone starting to wonder now about who killed them? I always assume it's sectarian violence, i'm starting to doubt that in some cases.

[Roland99]

10. Negroponte

Left his mark before he became top spook.

[Henny Penny]

11. yep. Mr Negroponte has quite a cv.

you should check it out chimpsr.



"Last year he was given the difficult task of being the US ambassador to Iraq, which made him the head of the biggest diplomatic staff in the world, some 900 people.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,3604,1417055,00.html

They sure do a lot wine-ing and dining in Baghdad!

:sarcasm:

[blonndee]

61. Yes, I've begun to wonder about that too. n/t

[Minstrel Boy]

13. the report from the Iraqi police

At 230 of 15/3/2006, according to the telegram (report) of the Ishaqi police directorate, American forces used helicopters to drop troops on the house of Faiz Harat Khalaf situated in the Abu Sifa village of the Ishaqi district. The American forces gathered the family members in one room and executed 11 people, including 5 children, 4 women and 2 men, then they bombed the house, burned three vehicles and killed their animals (map coordinates 098702).

They were:

Turkiya Muhammed Ali, 75 years
Faiza Harat Khalaf, 30 years
Faiz Harat Khalaf, 28 years
Um Ahmad, 23 years
Sumaya Abdulrazak, 22 years
Aziz Khalil Jarmoot, 22 years
Hawra Harat Khalaf, 5 years
Asma Yousef Maruf, 5 years
Osama Yousef Maruf, 3 years
Aisha Harat Khalaf, 3 years
Husam Harat Khalaf, 6 months

(Signed)

Staff Colonel Fadhil Muhammed Khalaf
Assistant Chief of the Joint Coordination Center

3/16/2006

from here

[Critters2]

14. They've got some pretty dangerous 3 year olds over there

apparently. :sarcasm:

:grr:

[Minstrel Boy]

15. It's the six month old ones you really gotta look out for n/t

[Critters2]

17. Oh God!!!

A six month old!!! I missed that! What kind of bastard shoots a 6 month old?!

[leftchick]

40. the photos were on Yahoo and I posted them here!

babies dead in the pick up truck with gunshots! :cry:

[Stella_Artois]

16. Another lie shot down

Murdering children wasn't an isolated act at Haditha if this is true. Its part of an emerging pattern, should these allegations be proven.

These US troops are baby killers. Literally. I don't support these troops.

[Critters2]

20. I don't either

and I'm tired of feeling pressured to say I do. People who shoot children are not worthy of my support. The military needs to take responsibility!!

Btw, love the username...and your beer!

[Stella_Artois]

25. Thanks !

There are things worse in life than a cool Stella !

I'm tired of the "must support the troops" mantra also.

Its like being told we must support the residents of a city, when we know for a fact that some of these residents are murderers. Sure i'll support the ones within the law, but the ones outside it no. And if i find that the leaders of this city tried to cover things up, then i don't support the whole city until it cleans up its act.

Why are soliders sacred ? Because the left got a bad name in the 1970's for attacking the troops ?

Hey, i wasn't alive then, and these ones are volunteers.

[coalition_unwilling]

56. It was probably inevitable that Iraqi children would pay a high price

for this invasion\occupation bullshit. I remember reading that 50% of the population of pre-war Baghdad were younger than 18. I've read similar statistics about the population of Iran.

[jpak]

19. From the beginning there were persistent reports of civilian deaths

US checkpoints (cars that did not obey commands to stop).

War supporters and the MSM were not concerned with these deaths - yet they happened all the time.

There are probably more Hadithas (and Fallujahs) in the closet than anyone suspects...

[dipsydoodle]

21. Would very unusual for the BBC

to report anything at all like this unless they knew for certain they were on safe ground. It's already the top news item on their TV teletext service and I'm guessing as this was reported mid evening GMT it will be headline news in most of our newpapers tomorrow.

[Stella_Artois]

23. True enough

I trust that they have had the tapes verified though, by subject matter experts.

As much as i respect John Simpson, a correspondent he is, not a firearms, ballistics or truama expert.

This video came from a "hardline Sunni group" not an independant source. I'd really want to be as certain as i can before going public with this. Its going to huge and the BBC will be damaged if its later proven untrue.

[IndianaGreen]

27. Hint: The US military always lies, and the burden of proof s/b on them

and it takes days of denials before the truth begins to come out, such as in the recent "accident" in Kabul in which US troops "fired in the air." Now we know that they purposely fired on the angry crowd, and I expect that in a little while we will find out that the convoy deliberately ram the cars in the traffic jam to make a path.

But a report filed by Iraqi police accused US troops of rounding up and deliberately shooting 11 people in the house, including five children and four women, before blowing up the building.

The video tape obtained by the BBC shows a number of dead adults and children at the site with what our world affairs editor John Simpson says were clearly gunshot wounds.

The pictures came from a hardline Sunni group opposed to coalition forces.

It has been cross-checked with other images taken at the time of events and is believed to be genuine, the BBC's Ian Pannell in Baghdad says.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/5039420.stm

[bennywhale]

51. I watched on the report and they were stressing that they did

recieve it from a hardline group and had 'experts' study it for tampering, timing, area it was in etc before showing it. And they continued to stress alledged.

They also ran the American alledged version of the incident with graphics and then the new alledged version. So i think they've covered their arses just in case.

[dipsydoodle]

22. Video link has been cross posted by Redacted

See here : http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x1330769

[IndianaGreen]

24. You have troops that believe they are crusading for Jesus

and that the Iraqis are infidels, what do you expect the outcome to be? The troops get their cues from their evangelical proselytizing chaplains, and from members of the brass such as General Boykin:

Rumsfeld defends general who commented on war and Satan

Friday, October 17, 2003 Posted: 10:22 PM EDT (0222 GMT)

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld and the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff are defending a new deputy undersecretary of defense "who has reportedly cast the war on terror" in religious terms.

Lt. Gen. William G. Boykin, whose promotion and appointment was confirmed by the Senate in June, has said publicly that he sees the war on terrorism as a clash between Judeo-Christian values and Satan, the Los Angeles Times reported Thursday.

Appearing in dress uniform before a religious group in Oregon in June, Boykin said Islamic extremists hate the United States "because we're a Christian nation, because our foundation and our roots are Judeo-Christians. ... And the enemy is a guy named Satan."

http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/10/16/rumsfeld.boykin.ap/

Published on Sunday, November 23, 2003 by the Los Angeles Times

Bush's Inaction Over General's Islam Remarks Riles Two Faiths

Muslims call for rebuke of Boykin, but such a move could isolate key Christian supporters.

by Johanna Neuman

WASHINGTON — More than a month has passed since the disclosure that a fundamentalist Christian policymaker at the Pentagon had disparaged Muslims for worshipping idols.

<snip>

Arab leaders are furious at the lack of action and believe it is evidence of a double standard in which Bush rebuked the president of Malaysia for anti-Semitic remarks but said little about Boykin's.

And fundamentalist Christians are angry that Boykin is not being applauded.

Many military officers who served with the oft-decorated Boykin in Bosnia and other hot spots are also rallying to his defense.

"Anything that looks like punishment or reprimand will turn off, disappoint and demoralize a certain percentage of the president's base that he is going to desperately need a year from now," said Gary L. Bauer, chairman of the Campaign for Working Families, a conservative political action committee.

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines03/1123-06.htm

[Julius Civitatus]

26. Dupe

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=1330769&mesg_id=1330769

[IndianaGreen]

28. That's in GD forum

not in LBN.

[Henny Penny]

31. Always check the forum and the time of posting before

using the "dupe" word... :-)

[Julius Civitatus]

37. Cool

My bad

[flyarm]

29. LOOK.....OVER THERE....

WHITE GIRL MISSING IN ARUBA...


fly

[Critters2]

46. God, thanks!

I'd almost forgotten what really matters.

Must...watch...Van Susteren

[alarcojon]

30. And it goes on

and Bush goes on not giving a shit, except when he has to lie to try to cover something up.

[IndyOp]

32. "Children of Abraham" a flash presentation of events at Ishaqi (Abu Sifa)

WARNING! Photos that the BBC said were too graphic to show are IN this Flash presentation:
Ishaqi - Abu Sifa - Children of Abraham - Death in the Desert

Here is a description of several of the photos:

We know from photographic evidence that the corpses of two men, four shrouded figures (women, according to the villagers), and five children - all of them apparently under the age of five, one as young as seven months, were pulled from the rubble of the house and laid out for burial beneath the bright, blank desert sky.

We know that the U.S.-backed Iraqi police said that an autopsy performed on the bodies found that "all the victims had gunshot wounds to the head." We know that the U.S.-backed Iraqi police said they found "spent American-issue cartridges in the rubble."

We know that two Iraqi police officials, Major Ali Ahmed and Colonel Farouq Hussein - both employed by the U.S.-backed Iraqi government - told Reuteres that the 11 occupants of the house, including the five children, had been bound and shot in the head before the house was blown up.

We know from the photographs that one child, the youngest, the baby, has a graping wound in his forehead. We can see that one other child, a girl with a pink ribbon in her hair, is lying on her side and has blood oozing from the back of her head. The faces of the other children are turned upwards toward the sun; if they were shot, they were shot in the back of the head and their wounds are not evident. But we can see that their bodies, though covered with dust from the rubble are otherwise whole; they were evidently not crushed in the collapse of the house. They died in some other fashion.

We know from the photographs that two of the children - two girls, still in their pajamas - are lying with their dead eyes open. We can see that the light and tenderness that animate the eyes of every young child have vanished; nothing remains but the brute start of nothingness into nothingness. We can see that the other three children have their eyes closed; two are limp, but the baby has one stiffened arm raised to his cheek, as if trying to ward off the blow that gashed and pulped his face so terribly.

May God have mercy on our souls.

Please people. The problem isn't Haditha. The problem isn't Abu Sifa. The problem isn't Abu Ghraib. The problem isn't Iraq.

THE PROBLEM IS ONGOING USE of the US Military for control of markets and resources.

Real Shock & Awe: After 15 Years War, Sanctions 1,000,000 Iraqis Dead
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/IndyOp/4

Killing Hope: Over 250 Military & CIA Interventions Since World War II
http://www.killinghope.org/

Google Video:
What I've Learned About US Foreign Policy - The War Against the Third World
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3453261789658676035&pl=true

[IndianaGreen]

34. Great post IndyOP

Thanks for the info. We need to get the word out that Haditha is not an aberration by a handful of Marines but, as the Ishaqi massacre shows, is part of a policy of extermination of civilians in order to "drain the swamp" of insurgents by removing a supportive population.

[bennywhale]

52. The Nazis used very similar tactics to what you are suggesting in

your post. Rounding up and killing innocent villagers on mass for 'crimes' by resistance fighters in or near their village. this collective punishment was meant to discourage the resistance (as they knew the consequenceas) and turn the innocent or passive population against them. It didn't, it just increased fanaticised everyone.

[dipsydoodle]

35. That is even more horrifying

than the BBC video. I can unerstand why the Beeb edited what they broadcast. Thanks for that link although maybe thanks is not an appropriate word given the circumstances.

[uppityperson]

36. Thank you, excellent video, very very very sad, puts blame directly bush

I remember seeing pictures of these little kids in the back of a truck. This is all too much. All this is directly caused by Mr.bush. Blood on his hands.

[leftchick]

41. Thank You Chris Floyd!

and thank you for reposting this! Damn, this went down the memory hole for most folks months ago.

[IndianaGreen]

38. Keith Olbermann just mentioned Ishaqi massacre

as the first item on his show tonight. The word is getting out!

[IndianaGreen]

39. Here is March article by Common Dreams about Ishaqi massacre

I believe that at the time the MSM was consumed by news from Aruba and American Idol contest.

Published on Monday, March 20, 2006 by Knight Ridder

Iraqi Police Report Details Civilians' Deaths at Hands of U.S. Troops

by Matthew Schofield

BAGHDAD, Iraq - Iraqi police have accused American troops of executing 11 people, including a 75-year-old woman and a 6-month-old infant, in the aftermath of a raid last Wednesday on a house about 60 miles north of Baghdad.

The villagers were killed after American troops herded them into a single room of the house, according to a police document obtained by Knight Ridder Newspapers. The soldiers also burned three vehicles, killed the villagers' animals and blew up the house, the document said.

A U.S. military spokesman, Major Tim Keefe, said that the U.S. military has no information to support the allegations and that he had not heard of them before a reporter brought them to his attention Sunday.

"We're concerned to hear accusations like that, but it's also highly unlikely that they're true," he said. He added that U.S. forces "take every precaution to keep civilians out of harms' way. The loss of innocent life, especially children, is regrettable."

Accusations that U.S. troops have killed civilians are commonplace in Iraq, though most are judged later to be unfounded or exaggerated. Navy investigators announced last week that they were looking into whether Marines intentionally killed 15 Iraqi civilians - four of them women and five of them children - during fighting last November.

But the report of the killings in the Abu Sifa area of Ishaqi, eight miles north of the city of Balad, is unusual because it originated with Iraqi police and because Iraqi police were willing to attach their names to it.

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines06/0320-01.htm

[tinfoil tiaras]

43. And they always say that we're the "baby killers"

"We'z gots to saves tha fetusses, Jebediah!!!"

Harumph. :mad:

[Blue_Tires]

47. ttt n/t

[CHICKEN CAPITOL USA]

49. ok- they've had their chance- THE AREN'T QUALIFIED- Time to go---home

and train them better in how to invade and occupy "morally"--

now THAt's something to think about!
Moral invasion is like compassionate Rape.

[regnaD kciN]

50. The most darkly amusing line in the story...

The US army has also announced that coalition troops in Iraq are to have ethical training following the alleged incident in Haditha.

That's right...you need ethical training to know that executing unarmed civilians, including women and children who never did anything to you, is not a good idea. :sarcasm:

[coalition_unwilling]

57. I wonder if that so-called "ethical training" will include a module

on the legitimate uses of civil disobedience? Somehow, I doubt it.

[Name removed]

53. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Briar]

58. According to BBC radio news this evening

(no link yet) the US will exonerate the troops involved in this. "No evidence of an intention to kill" apparently. No mention of the cover-up element.

[bdamomma]

63. what a lie and a cover up

I saw that interview of that little girl whose parents and family got killed when those American troops came in and killed their family, she said she hates the American soldiers, it was terrible, to just committ a massacre like this. This incident goes to the top officials.

[Rex]

64. Another massacre? Repuke lurkers are already showing their

collective guilt by posting 'yeah well what about Clinton and Yugoslavia'. Well, last time I checked US troops didn't massacre anyone in Bosnia or Serbia. To the lurkers - what's the matter, can't handle the fact that Bush really is the Giggling Murderer? Touch shit, suck it up you dogs!

[bamacrat]

65. I hope B*sh is held accountable.

When is the rest of the country going to wake up and look at what is happening. Death squads in Iraq, phone tapping in the US, hes gone too far. Impeach this douche.