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lovuian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 11:29 PM
Original message
Obesity a global epidemic, says new report
http://feeds.bignewsnetwork.com/?sid=e53bc25134e8eb61

There's a global epidemic going on and we're not paying it much effective attention.

By 2010 almost half the children of North and South America will be overweight. So will one in five in China and 38 percent of all children in the European Union.

Nor are children in the Middle East, Southeast Asia, Mexico, Chile, Brazil and Egypt exempt. Obesity rates in those countries are comparable to those of fully industrialized nations.
more...
Something has to be responsible for this!!!
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Lone_Star_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 11:39 PM
Response to Original message
1. High fructose corn syrup
It's in almost everything now days and our bodies don't react to it the same way they did to regular sugars that used to be used.

It's bad stuff. That's my theory anyway.
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lovuian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 11:44 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. I agree it something in the food and soda is a major culprit
and I'm wondering about milk too...
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Lone_Star_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 11:59 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. I found the article in Prevention from a couple years ago
My doctor told me if HFCS is in the top five ingredients not to eat the product. He seems to think there's some relation also.

Sweet Story, Sad Ending
Not satisfied with the natural sweetness of food, Americans sought out--and manufacturers willingly supplied--sweeteners. The "added sugar" category of our diet has grown exponentially since the early 1900s--by more than 2,100 percent. And of all the sugars shoveled into processed food, high fructose corn syrup (HFCS) takes the proverbial cake.
Relatively cheap and easy to use (thanks to its syrup form), HFCS now accounts for more than 40 percent of all caloric sweeteners added to foods and beverages.

Researchers are beginning to sound the alarm on HFCS. "There's no question that the rise in HFCS consumption has paralleled a rise in both obesity and diabetes," says physician Gross, who authored the study linking HFCS to diabetes. "A relatively new body of evidence points to the potential negative health consequences of consuming HFCS." One possible link between HFCS, obesity, and diabetes is the way our bodies process fructose. Normally, eating sweet foods stimulates insulin, a hormone that converts sugar to glucose (the form of sugar that cells burn for energy).

As your body's energy needs are met, insulin triggers cells to produce leptin, a hormone that signals fullness. The problem with fructose is that it doesn't stimulate insulin to the same degree that other sugars do, which means that the body doesn't release leptin.

"Leptin controls our sensitivity to fullness," says Peter J. Havel, PhD, a researcher at the University of California, Davis, who has done crucial work in examining fructose's relationship to weight gain. "The more fructose in a meal, the less insulin you'll secrete," he adds.
<snip>
http://www.prevention.com/article/0,5778,s1-3-58-135-48...
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shanti Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:40 AM
Response to Reply #6
17. can we extrapolate that last statement?
"The more fructose in a meal, the less insulin you'll secrete," he adds.

doesn't that mean will need MORE insulin, as in diabetic?? this man is onto something!
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Lone_Star_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:54 AM
Response to Reply #17
20. What it means is
Edited on Fri Mar-10-06 12:54 AM by Lone_Star_Dem
When a person consumes fructose, the effect on metabolic-regulating hormones doesn't increase insulin production the way regular sugar does. Which is good for a diabetic but bad for people who aren't.

Fructose causes the liver to send extra fat into the bloodstream and it doesn't stop us from being hungry. So the tendency is there to eat more that you would otherwise.

For the life of me can't find my source for this right now. If I can I'll post you a link.
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 10:16 AM
Response to Reply #17
43. it also means you should not be eating fruit
Edited on Fri Mar-10-06 10:17 AM by pitohui
fructose is a natural sugar found in sweet fruits

i am sorry to say this but my husband's glycemic index tests are showing he can tolerate ZERO fruit in the diet, who knew you shouldn't be eating fruit? they don't bother to tell you that until you're already symptomatic

almost all fruit is intended by nature to be consumed and distributed by BIRDS
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shanti Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 10:55 AM
Response to Reply #43
52. ???
fruit is natural, hfcs is not. i am not diabetic, but don't have a problem with fruit, just hfcs.

btw, many girl scout cookies don't have hfcs as one of the top five ingredients - i checked :)
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #52
56. fruit is a natural food for BIRDS
Edited on Fri Mar-10-06 11:24 AM by pitohui
we divurged from our common ancestor at the beginning of the triassic some umpty hundreds of millions of years ago :-)

i'm as sorry as you are, esp. as one of my hobbies is my fruit trees, alas, the glucose meter does not lie, and he cannot tolerate fruit

reading an ingredients label is meaningless, what you have to do is actually do the stick, get the readings, and see how YOUR body reacts to carbohydrate


but in the specific case of fruit, it is a treat and should be a rare one, back in the days when an orange was something found in the xmas stocking once a year, fine, no one had a problem w. fruit, the problem is that we are being encouraged to eat fruit every day and even to drink fruit juice, might as well put a gun to your head and play russian roulette as drink fruit juice

in nature fruit appears at specific limited times of the year and mostly to appeal to the birds to encourage them to spread the seed, relatively few fruits have the large seeds clearly meant for spreading by a mammal's hand (avocado and mango spring to mind but many people allergic to the mango family)

we've been sold a bill of goods with fruit and fructose

and like it or not fructose is perfectly natural, research it for yourself, if you cannot tolerate fructose, you are doing yourself no good and potentially some harm by switching from soda to orange juice

it's frustrating but distilled tap water may be the way to go for many of us

hell cyanide is natural, so is arsenic, the argument that natural is good is only heard from the urban community that has no contact with nature and so can make up any fairy tale they like abt it without being challenged
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Shakespeare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 01:56 PM
Response to Reply #56
71. What about bears? Chimps? They eat fruit, too.
Sorry, I'm not buying that only birds are supposed to eat fruit. Other omnivores on our level of the food chain eat fruit, too--and it's an important part of their diet (and ours--scurvy's not a pretty thing).

And as far as I understand, naturally occurring fructose and high fructose corn syrup are two VERY different things (one is very highly processed, and reacts VERY differently with the body). So yes, you ARE much better off drinking fresh OJ than you are drinking a coke.
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Emillereid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #71
76. Lots and lots of animals eat fruit - but the fruit that we grow has been
bred to much sweeter than that ever found in the wild -- or even 50 years ago.
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Shakespeare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #76
79. That's true for some fruits, but not all.
Edited on Fri Mar-10-06 04:09 PM by Shakespeare
Some fruits are just naturally very sweet--one of the sweetest things I've ever tasted was a wild alpine strawberry, for example. In fact, it's likely that many fruits have evolved to be sweet specifically to attract critters like us to eat them (and then scatter the seeds, thereby doing the procreating for them). It's apparently in our nature to love sweet things, and nature catered to that long before we figured out how to do the same through hybridization.

However, I still think it's silly to suggest that fruit is bad for us.

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Emillereid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #79
81. Perhaps I shouldn't have used the word 'sweeter' -- sweet taste doesn't
always correlate that well with simple sugar or carbohydrate content or glycemic index -- and the fruits as well as many of the root vegetable have been bred for greater and greater carbohydrate content. The original apple for example was a small, sour thing; the original potato was the size of a kumquat, etc. Most wild fruits tend to the sour side in comparison to our agricultural products.

I didn't suggest that fruit is bad for everyone -- especially if they are eaten whole. People who have glycemic control issues often can't tolerate them though. I don't do well with most fruits -- too many carbos for me.

I don't think whole fruit is the reason for our obesity problem.
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #79
91. the glucose meter doesn't lie
i am sorry but, yes, fruit is very bad for many people

if you don't react to fruit, fine, to assume that anyone can therefore eat fruit is what is silly actually

wild alpine strawberry did not evolve with you in mind like it or not
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Shakespeare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-13-06 10:41 AM
Response to Reply #91
124. ROFL....I never suggested it did.
I never thought I'd see somebody get so worked up about a post about fruit.
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #71
92. well, you are just wrong
Edited on Sat Mar-11-06 02:00 PM by pitohui
the glucose meter says fresh orange juice is just as bad as coke

i admit to a little overstatement to get your attention and the bears and chimpanzees have my permission to keep eating as they wish, but they live significantly shorter lives than humans have the potential to live, the truth is, if you have metabolic syndrome or diabetes, do the stick, get the reading, and you are going to be sadly disillusioned abt the lies we are told abt fruit

kids sucking down juice all day are causing their disappointed parents some HORRENDOUS dental bills
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Shakespeare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-13-06 10:40 AM
Response to Reply #92
123. That's quite a different matter altogether.
For somebody for whom glucose levels are important to monitor--not a majority of the population by any means--then that has some significance. But generally speaking, the health benefits of OJ are quite good.

And I never said kids should be "sucking down juice all day." They need to be drinking WATER, and supplementing with a piece of fruit or two (or an occasional glass of non-HFCS fruit juice) is certainly healthy.
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Lance_Boyle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 04:00 PM
Response to Reply #56
78. no, no, no! NOT distilled!
distilled and de-ionized water are NOT good for you - they cause minerals to be leached from your bloodstream and excreted. Minerals that your body needs. Minerals that your body gets from water. Plain old water. Distillation is wonderful for liquor. Bad bad bad for water.

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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #78
93. sorry but plain old water is contaminated w. medicine metabolites
read further down the thread

weight gain epidemic worldwide is caused by metabolite products of estrogens and other common drugs that cause weight gain being found in the public water supply

that is worldwide

our localized support of the corn farmer is a usa thing

but the obesity epidemic is WORLDWIDE

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Nikia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 07:59 PM
Response to Reply #78
105. Distilled water is safe under normal circumstances
It is always safe if consumed with food or in normal amounts between regular meals under most circumstances. It might cause some problems if one has lost a lot of fluids through excessive sweating, vommitting, or diarrhea. There may be some problems if you are fasting with only water for multiple days.
You can get minerals from your food or supplements.
Soda is bad for your minerals though as it can leach calcium from your bones.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #43
108. The "cs" part of HFCS that does the damage..
corn syrup is not a "natural" part of fruits or veggies (except for corn)..

HFCS is added to stuff that doesn;t even NEED sugar..

I have a theory that during the corn glut we had back in the 70s & 80's led to "innovative" ways to USE the stuff, since it cost more to sell it than to use it.. This was about the same time that the agri-businesses started buyiong up all the farms and setting up feed lots all over the place..
Combine govt subsidies to the agri-business "farms", the growing of the easiest crop.(corn), feeing the corn-waste to the feedlot animals and turning everything else into HFCS, which was used by the agri-business food production companies....No waste left to dispose of, except for the tons of animal shit from the feedlots...( a lot of which leaches into the water systems)

Diabetes & obesity probably follows the same graph of the use of HFCS..

A fat kid was RARE in the 60's & 70's.. Look around today..
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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:49 AM
Response to Reply #6
19. Dude!! HE is NOT NOT NOT kidding!!
Edited on Fri Mar-10-06 12:52 AM by kgfnally
I just started- and I mean, in the past three weeks or so- having a snack at work now and then. I'll have to check the ingredients, but these are the types of snacks that would probably have already had it in the top five.

Edited to add: I just found some Skittles I had in my coat pocket from tonight. Let's go check... be right back.... oh, SNAP: the first two ingredients are sugar and corn syrup. Bully for me.

We have a floor scale at work- a nice, big, digital scale for carts and such. I get up on it every day- not that I'm concerned about my weight; I'm only around 135-140 pounds soaking wet.

I now weigh 145. Ten more than I did a month ago, and all I did differently was to start eating those snacks.

I'll stop eating junk entirely and watch what happens. With the physical nature of my job, I bet I'll drop ten inside a month.

(For the record, prior to working in my own personal hell I was in Dilbert's personal hell, and sitting on my butt all day eating snacks for two years or so had me tipping the scales at 160. There is definitely something going on, and I, too, tend to think HFCS consumption has something to do with it.
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GoddessOfGuinness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. I noticed it was even in a low-calorie salad dressing
Why? :shrug:
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NMDemDist2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 11:48 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. it's cheap n/t
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Lone_Star_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:02 AM
Response to Reply #3
8. Guess the had to sweeten it a bit with something
But really, is cane sugar really that much more expensive?
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Skink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:07 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. No but we'd have to buy it from castro.
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Lone_Star_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:37 AM
Response to Reply #10
14. Of course, silly me
What was I thinking? We can't have that happening, no sir!

Well, in a small way Cuba is getting even.
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 10:18 AM
Response to Reply #10
44. really why can't we buy it from louisiana?
Edited on Fri Mar-10-06 10:19 AM by pitohui
we raise the sugarcane and refine it too, what's wrong w. supporting our farmers here at home for a change?
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GoddessOfGuinness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:18 AM
Response to Reply #8
13. It was a vinagrette...
Very silly of them...
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Lone_Star_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:39 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. They really are slipping it into everything
Even where it's not needed it appears.

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laundry_queen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 11:11 AM
Response to Reply #16
55. Absolutely it's in things where it's not even needed.
My dh and I lived in a very remote area for a few years at didn't eat any fast food, just homemade stuff. We then went on vacation and ate at a McDonalds and EWWW! The burgers and fries were CLOYINGLY sweet, it was disgusting! I wonder how much HFCS are in those?
And now that we live closer to fast food and are busy parents, we eat out more often and find ourselves getting used to it. bad bad bad. We still for the most part try to make everything from scratch, but even things that are used in recipes, like canned soup, have HFCS in it. It's EVERYWHERE!
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Massacure Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-12-06 10:54 AM
Response to Reply #55
121. Fruit syrup in burgers? I don't think so...
The thing with fast food is hydrogenated oil ad trans-fat, plus salt in some things.
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 10:21 AM
Original message
oh so you've never made viniagrette dressing yourself
yes, you put in a tiny pinch of sugar as well as a garlic clove, of course you do, hello?

a tiny bit of sugar makes the flavor "pop" a little better, nothing wrong w. that

if you make your own, it takes only moments and you then understand the ingredients needed plus you can make changes to suit your own taste altho i doubt you would choose to delete the pinch of sugar entirely after you experimented, since salad dressing has to be stored in fridge anyway after opening really no effort or space is saved by buying it pre-made in my humble opinion
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GoddessOfGuinness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:47 PM
Response to Original message
61. I've never put sugar in mine...
I guess I don't know what I'm missing...and that's ok by me. :-)
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mikeytherat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #8
82. No. But corn syrup is easier to transport and store than granulated sugar
mikey_the_rat
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NYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 03:08 AM
Response to Reply #3
26. Re salad dressing:
Edited on Fri Mar-10-06 03:09 AM by NYC
Ranch dressing, 3 types:
Regular fat content has corn syrup.
Fat free has corn syrup.
Light ranch dressing has NO corn syrup.

I forget the brand. You have to read all bottles until you find the kind that does not have corn syrup.

Ice cream:

Breyers seems to be the only one, and you have to read the various flavors. Vanilla, chocolate, and at least one other have no corn syrup.

Just read everything.
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GoddessOfGuinness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:49 PM
Response to Reply #26
62. Wow...Even Ben & Jerry's?
:(
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NYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #62
64. I don't know. You'll have to read.
Ben & Jerry's changed their vanilla to something I didn't like as much, so I stopped buying it. I can't remember if the new one had corn syrup.

Regardless of the brand, you have to read each flavor to be certain.

I think anything called "butterscotch" or "caramel" unavoidably contains corn syrup. So, the only way to be certain is to read. (Even Breyer's caramel contains corn syrup.)

Read the ingredients of Breyer's vanilla and French vanilla. It's a very short list. Compare the length of the list to an ice cream like Edy's. It makes you wonder why those other companies add so many "strange" and unnecessary things.
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GoddessOfGuinness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #64
66. I have a lot of recipes that use "corn syrup"
Is the stuff like Karo the same thing as "high fructose corn syrup"?
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NYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 01:30 PM
Response to Reply #66
69. I don't know if Karo is high fructose.
Edited on Fri Mar-10-06 01:33 PM by NYC
When I was a kid, we knew a family that put Karo corn syrup on pancakes instead of maple syrup. We all thought it was disgusting. They liked it just fine.

I would suppose that Karo must say on the label if it is high fructose. I avoid corn syrup whether high fructose or not.

Someone mentioned that bread has corn syrup, and many of them do, but there are some that don't. Same with cookies. I buy some Canadian ginger cookies that don't have corn syrup, but they do have hydrogenated something or other. The hydrogenated stuff is to increase shelf life, so I imagine most cookies have it.

Gold's, the horseradish company, makes a ketchup that does not contain corn syrup. Same with their cocktail sauce.

It pays to read labels. I've been avoiding corn syrup for a while. It isn't easy, but you can find decent products that don't have it.

Karo nutritional facts:
http://www.karosyrup.com/nutrition.asp

Light corn syrup:
Ingredients: Light corn syrup, high fructose corn syrup, salt, vanilla.

Dark corn syrup:
Ingredients: Dark corn syrup, refiners syrup, caramel flavor, salt, sodium benzoate (used to protect quality), caramel color.

I see they now make a pancake syrup:
Ingredients: Corn syrup, high fructose corn syrup, salt, artificial maple flavor, sodium benzoate (used to protect quality), caramel color.




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GoddessOfGuinness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 01:50 PM
Response to Reply #69
70. Thanks for the info!
My grandma's pecan pie recipe calls for dark corn syrup, as does our family pepparkakor recipe.

I prefer to avoid the HFCS, except for the occasional treat... :evilgrin:
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Critters2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 03:29 PM
Response to Reply #69
73. My grandparents always used Karo on pancakes
My grandfather, and damn near everyone he knew, raised corn. He thought they ought to eat it, too.

In fact, corn and soybeans have paid my salary most of my career, albeit secondhand. I eat HFCS in moderation. It's not an evil in and of itself.
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 09:01 AM
Response to Reply #3
35. It's subsidized. That's why soda is often cheaper than bottled water
the government pays large corporations to add corn products to their product lines. Ever go to a theme park and wonder why a 20 oz bottle of water cost a buck more than a 20 oz bottle of Coke or Pepsi? the soda's production was subsidized, the water's production was not.
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 10:21 AM
Response to Reply #3
45. Here's something gross
It's also in fast-food burgers! They put it everywhere they can to get people hooked.
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GoddessOfGuinness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #45
63. You think it's addictive?
Perhaps so...
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 01:16 PM
Response to Reply #63
68. Not like cocaine or anything
But yeah, I think it is to a certain extent. Fast-food companies are smart, they know what keeps people coming back for more. They market-test everything they sell. So I'm sure if they're including HFCS, it's because people liked those products more & wanted more. We're attuned to like sweet things - & companies cater to that w/the fake sweetness of corn syrup & other additives. There's a really good book called "Fast Food Nation" that really goes into how this stuff is created - after you read it, you'll never want to eat fast food again!
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AllieB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 10:45 AM
Response to Reply #3
51. Low-cal and low-fat products often have hidden sugars
to make up for the lack of flavor. I stay away from anything that says low-fat or low-cal, and go for the full-fat version.
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GoddessOfGuinness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #51
65. Usually I do too...
I rarely even use salad dressing...I usually prefer a little lemon juice and some pepper. But my kids like ranch; and I thought I'd pick some up. Then I read the label on the regular variety, and nearly fainted! 180 calories to dress your salad!

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wickerwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 10:22 PM
Response to Reply #3
107. It's in dog and cat food too..
All the cheap stuff- Whiskas, Purina, etc. are swimming in HFCS. The government pays pet food companies to dump it in their products.

Why? Who votes first in the primaries in the US? Iowa. And what's the major product of said mid-Western state?

No politician will touch Iowa corn subsidies. We make tons more of it than we can ever consume. HFCS is a useless byproduct that the government bribes food companies into dumping into *everything*.
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shanti Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:38 AM
Response to Reply #1
15. that's it!
i will continually trumpet the evils of this substance, HFCS. :grr:
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Lone_Star_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:41 AM
Response to Reply #15
18. The introduction of HFCS in our food products parallels weight gain
statistics in the US.

I right with you in trumpeting the evils of this stuff.
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Psephos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 01:27 AM
Response to Reply #1
24. Hooboy. Correlation is not causation.
I am *not* saying there isn't a link, but a lot of other things could be at the root of this. We don't know yet - but the answers will come when some controlled studies are done. It is a disservice to politicize this. It brings nonscientific pressure to bear upon investigations into what's happening, and ridicules those in the general population who look to other causes. Almost certainly the real answer is more complex than the knee-jerk response.

Correlation is the weakest form of science evidence establishing causation. Here's a link to Carl Sagan's Baloney Detector for anyone who wants to avoid junk science.

http://www.carlsagan.com/revamp/carlsagan/baloney.html

I saw a few posts seeing a link to the appearance of fast-food corporations into the third world. WOW! Does anyone know what percentage of meals in, say, China are served in Western fast-food restaurants? They have 700 million people who don't even have a telephone. Prolly not stuffin' down burgers and cokes four times a week, just a thought.

Meanwhile, I avoid HFCS whenever possible. Want a delicious, inexpensive, and healthful drink to take the place of soda? Brew up a pitcher full of iced tea and keep it in the fridge. Use a mixture of loose green tea with jasmine and black tea with passion flower (I buy them at Costco in bulk). Chill, and drink as much as you want. Lightly sweeten the entire pitcher with a teaspoon of honey - or not; it's good either way. Lots of flavonoids and antioxidants, but best of all, it totally hits the spot.

Peace.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 09:37 AM
Response to Reply #24
39. Who is going to do the "controlled studies"? The junk food industry?
Edited on Fri Mar-10-06 09:49 AM by cryingshame
Science, it practise and its conclusions, is heavily influence by who is paying for it. Always has and always will be.

You are right, about correlation and casuation... except direct casaulity is almost impossible to determine when it comes to organic systems (since we are NOT machines despite Science's desire to regard us as such).

Example, does smoking REALLY cause cancer? Or does it lead to a situtation where cancer can occur.

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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 10:33 AM
Response to Reply #24
49. Yeah..
But people in China aren't the ones getting sick, because most probably can't afford it. It's more prosperous countries like Japan that are wolfing down the fast-food & suddenly facing diabetes & heart disease problems. I like your recipe for iced tea - I drink Diet Coke constantly but am pretty sure it's bad for you.
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TygrBright Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 01:56 AM
Response to Reply #1
25. You may be right about that...
...although I tend to think that HFCS is only one of a whole raft of culprits.

I have no idea WHICH one, I can only go by my recent experience, which is kind of spooky.

I've never dieted much, but in my thirties I went through a cycle of depression that left me VERY overweight, so I did diet then, and tracked fat & carbs & calories scrupulously, etc.

Lost about fifty pounds and got back to my "normal" weight balance, which is still pretty stocky-- runs in the family. A few years ago my weight started oh-so-slowly creeping up again (perimenopausal? normal aging? less active, maybe... anyway...) but it wasn't enough to worry me.

About four or five months ago I decided we were going to stop eating processed foods almost entirely, and not eat out more than 2-3 meals a week. That is, our meals were going to be made from ingredients, including sugar, butter, cream, and other emphatically NON-diet stuff, but just the basic ingredients. Some things organic, some not, I'm not too obsessive about that. Plenty of wine in the cookery, unsweetened chocolate, whole-milk yogurt, and so on. Also 'healthy' stuff like fresh fruits & veggies, tofu, etc., but not as a conscious effort to eat 'healthy.' Just the required ingredients for (as an example) hot & sour soup, or veggie lasagne (with fresh whole-milk ricotta, etc.) Let's just say that our total calorie count has definitely NOT gone down.

But we have LOST weight. Not much, just a few pounds each over about 4-5 months, but it's for sure not what I expected.

Riddle me that. I'm not ascribing it to any one thing we're not eating anymore, but I think there's definitely a link between the lack of processed foodstuffs, incl. HFCS, and our ability to absorb a generous calorie count without piling on weight.

speculatively,
Bright
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 10:27 AM
Response to Reply #25
48. I speculatively agree
It's really striking when you compare what Americans eat to people in other countries. Almost everything we eat is pre-processed or pre-packaged & stuffed w/chemicals. In Europe, people shop at local farmer's markets & often make dinners from scratch. And they're mostly thin, healthy & don't have America's epidemic of diabetes & heart disease. Correlation doesn't equal causation, but I have to think our pre-packaged eating habits have something to do with it.
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AllieB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #25
54. We eat like that too, and my husband's blood sugar dropped as a result
We follow a modified Atkins plan, and Dr. Eades' Protein Power plan. We eat no refined food, try to buy organic produce and free-range meat and hormone-free dairy products, and limit white sugar and white flour to special occasions. My husband dropped 50 lbs, and was on the verge of diabetes, but his blood sugar is now normal. His cholesterol dropped 30 points also. I lost my last stubborn 10 lbs that I had gained eating low-fat and high-carb. We feel great!
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 10:11 AM
Response to Reply #1
42. HFCS not used in all nations' soda formulas actually
Edited on Fri Mar-10-06 10:14 AM by pitohui
it isn't HFCS because believe it or not the distribution of this problem is truly worldwide, i can be in a tour group with people from the former red china and i'm the smallest in the bunch, i have a picture of myself w. middle schoolers from japan and again i'm the short one, it's everywhere

my strong suspicion is that it's the metabolites of various modern medicines in the water supply, drugs that cause many people to gain weight include female hormones (birth control, uterine fibroid control, HRT, gender re-assignment, irregular cycle, and more are all reasons female hormones in some form are prescribed), SSRIs to treat people w. clinical depression, some schizoaffective disorters etc also cause weight gain sometimes spectacular weight gain, friend of mine gained 100-plus pounds on prozac but can't opt out because he is unable to function without it, and there are many more drugs w. the side affect of weight gain

the new drugs, esp. female hormones which are cheap and were actually first discovered in mexico, are worldwide in distribution and tests show that their metabolites contaminate water supplies all over the world, indeed, they may already be affecting the reproductive health of fish, reptiles, and amphibians as well as humans

can't say the same for HFCS which may be cheap in usa where we need to subsidize our corn farmer but which are too costly in some other nations where cane or another source of sugar is used, many travelers follow which sugars are used where in which sodas in various countries and make a point of sampling their favorites, as i'm not a soda fan can't tell you the details but i'm confident you can easily find them, pepsi here is not the same as pepsi there, fanta here not the same as fanta there
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KansDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 10:26 AM
Response to Reply #1
47. My theory too...
For 26 years now, I've tried to avoid HFCS. Very hard to do.
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AndyTiedye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #1
53. HFCS is Mostly a US Thing. Why is Everybody Else Getting Fat?
They use real sugar in soda in Mexico and most tropical areas.
I think they use beet sugar in Europe.

Only the US grows so much corn that we want to use it for everything
(even heating and motor fuel).

Most other countries don't use "High-Fructose Corn Syrup".
So why are they putting on weight?
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #53
58. read my other posts
people who never leave the usa are happy to blame the home grown usa product and assume it's the same everywhere

as i said in my other posts the cause is metabolites of female hormones and other medicines now used worldwide which are now found worldwide in the drinking water, these medicines carry the risk of weight gain for a large proportion of the population

i'll bet my hat on it when it shakes out we'll find out this is the cause

nothing to be done abt it, the many pills w. side effect of weight gain are too necessary to quality of life in too many cases, SSRIs can cause weight gain as can the simple birth control pill



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wickerwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #53
109. The weight gain doesn't have the same reason in every county.
And I think you can't really compare the levels. If you sit in an airport in Ohio and watch people walking by every single person is morbidly obese. Every single person. Ride the subway in China and people twenty or thirty pounds overweight still stick out like sore thumbs.

They are putting on weight. Why? Because there's literally a KFC on every single block. I walk past four... FOUR... KFCs on my ten minute walk to work. Chinese food is extremely greasy. They used to be able to get away with it because they ate such small portions and worked like fiends. Now that more people have cars, escalators, etc. there is a serious reduction in the amount of exercise they get.

I would attribute it first to the reduction of exercise that comes from Westernized lifestyle and greater affluence. But the U.S. certainly has the most serious epidemic and I think a large part of it is HFCS. Even when people from other countries get obese, it's nowhere near the extent that U.S. people do. In three years, I have never seen a Chinese person over 230-240 pounds. Try finding an adult weighing less than that in many places- especially in the mid-West.
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Nikia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #109
111. I don't think things are that bad in Ohio
I am in Wisconsin. I left Ohio 10 years ago, but get back occaisionally. I'd say the size profile is similiar. I'd say that the average person is around 10-20 pounds overweight. There are about equal numbers of really huge people and skinny people. Not everyone is obese.
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AndyTiedye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #109
113. It Varies Quite a Bit Within this Country as Well
If you sit in an airport in Ohio and watch people walking by every single person is morbidly obese. Every single person.


It seems to vary a lot by region. The majority of the people one sees around here (San Francisco area) are not obese. New Englanders tend to be a bit heavier, but not that much,
I haven't spent enough time in Ohio to say one way or the other. There may be some correlation with climate, as people tend to be fatter in cold climates almost everywhere in the world.
It provides more insulation, and it may also be a byproduct of the tendency not to exercise when the weather is horrible. Likewise people tend not to exercise much where the weather is un pleasantly hot and humid most of the time. Houston has that kind of climate as well as severe pollution, so it is no surprise that it is the obesity capital of the US.

Ride the subway in China and people twenty or thirty pounds overweight still stick out like sore thumbs.

They are putting on weight.


It isn't totally clear, but I assume you are refering to Chinese people here, rather than Ohioans.

Why? Because there's literally a KFC on every single block. I walk past four... FOUR... KFCs on my ten minute walk to work.

That's a lot of KFCs. I can't think of any place in the US that has them that close together.

Chinese food is extremely greasy. They used to be able to get away with it because they ate such small portions and worked like fiends. Now that more people have cars, escalators, etc. there is a serious reduction in the amount of exercise they get.


I don't think you can blame us for making your people fat. ;-)

I would attribute it first to the reduction of exercise that comes from Westernized lifestyle and greater affluence.


Well, maybe you can, in that we are paying for it, but then you are propping up our currency, so it's all circular anyway.

But the U.S. certainly has the most serious epidemic and I think a large part of it is HFCS. Even when people from other countries get obese, it's nowhere near the extent that U.S. people do. In three years, I have never seen a Chinese person over 230-240 pounds. Try finding an adult weighing less than that in many places- especially in the mid-West.


Chinese people are usually quite a bit shorter than Americans, so weights are not directly comparable.

Most of the people I see around here who weigh that much are tall enough to carry it. I suppose most of us still weigh a bit more than we should, but not to the extent you describe.
It may be different in the Midwest.

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R Hickey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #1
57. High Fructose Corn Syrup is better for you than regular sugar
Actually I think HFCS is good for you. The other sugar "sucrose" rots your teeth and is much worse for diabetics.
I think this fructose scapegoating is all a plot by the producers of more expensive foods, such as meats. People are getting fat because they don't get any exercise. The more people drive, and the less they walk to public transportation, the fatter the population will get.
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zelda7743 Donating Member (256 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #57
89. I'm a dietitian
Sucrose is comprised of a glucose molecule and a fructose molecule hooked together. You can't say that fructose is better than sucrose because sucrose is half fructose and half glucose, aka "blood sugar." High fructose corn syrup is a lab-created monster that we have no business eating in the amounts that we do.
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Emillereid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 03:59 PM
Response to Reply #1
77. Also think about all the products made of our excess corn and flour.
Up and down the aisles of a modern grocery store one finds corn, flour, hydrogenated fat, salt, artificial flavored monstrosities -- a veritable nutrition wasteland -- and the stuff short circuits all satiety controls.

I wouldn't be surprised too if we discover some microbe at work either.
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mitchum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 04:08 PM
Response to Reply #1
80. And your theory is correct n/t
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Megahurtz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 04:34 PM
Response to Reply #1
84. That High Fructose Corn Syrup is disgusting!
Why do they have to put it in everything? :grr:
The only time I like a sweet taste is when I'm eating dessert,
I would rather have a non-dessert item taste salty.

That stuff is nasty!
I also think that it's responsible for sending people's blood sugar through the roof,
and creating the diabetes epidemic.
Maybe it's another version of their genocide. :tinfoilhat:
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winston61 Donating Member (642 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-13-06 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #1
125. soda pop and candy
loaded with high fructose corn syrup.
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GrumpyGreg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Mar-09-06 11:50 PM
Response to Original message
5. God,I thought this was primarily a USA thing. We certainly don't
Edited on Thu Mar-09-06 11:50 PM by GrumpyGreg
eat the way they do in China and obesity is a problem there too?
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Jamison Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:01 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. Well since their markets have opened up.
The Chinese have been invaded by McDonalds, Pizza Hut, Coca-Cola, KFC, etc. So there you go.
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lovuian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:03 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. Bingo!!! Corporations have globally taken it with them
Who'd ever think China would have obesity???
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Skink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:08 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. Think I'll was this buger down with a 64 ounce soda.
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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:56 AM
Response to Reply #11
22. Which is why everyone eating there should order tea.
Or water.

I almost never drink soda. Makes my mouth and my throat all gummy-feeling. Yuk.
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0007 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 07:40 AM
Response to Reply #11
32. Ever watch someone eat in less than three minutes?
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melm00se Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 06:51 AM
Response to Reply #7
30. While that is
part of the problem, the bigger issue is work.

with advances in technology and the efficiencies they provide, the amount of purely physical labor has begun to ebb...you have more and more sedentary folks and less activity = less calories burned (along with no corresponding drop in caloric intake) = increase in body weight.

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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 09:51 AM
Response to Reply #7
40. Chinese metabolism handles corn syrup even worse then Americans
NYTimes find a HUGE spike in diabetes in Asian community here in America.

Traditional chinese diet uses almost no sugar... or sugar from grains like barley malt or rice syrup.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 10:40 PM
Response to Reply #40
110. Rice/fish/veggies.....that WAS the normal asian diet
salty..not sweet..was their palate...
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snooper2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 08:56 AM
Response to Reply #5
34. I used to as well..
But, watching different photos from Iraq over the years, and I see very few (skinny) people there as well. Most all of the men I ever see on tv at protests, after a bombing, whatever, always have some pudge in the face and a belly going on.

The whole damn World is going super-size...
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 10:23 AM
Response to Reply #5
46. the day when you could pick the american out of crowd by weight is over
it's a huge problem in china

you'll have trouble convincing me that it isn't metabolites of female hormones and other drugs in the drinking water supply, that's what you find worldwide, not HFCS
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greenman3610 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:13 AM
Response to Original message
12. how many bottles of coke sold per day?
worldwide?
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 09:15 AM
Response to Reply #12
37. See post #35
possibly the reason people reach for a Coke before they reach for bottled water...
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amitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 12:56 AM
Response to Original message
21. It doesn't hurt to move a muscle once in awhile, too. Food isn't
the only problem. I can eat as much as I want and not gain weight, because I exercise daily. And I eat a lot of candy!
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formactv Donating Member (247 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 04:41 AM
Response to Reply #21
27. I agree!
Exercise makes the difference. I am 52, and am in the same shape I was at 19, because I have always gotten a lot of exercise. Not working out, just light physical work,walking, and sometimes heavy physical work. Children do not run around as much as when I was young. I live in rural Vermont, and my neighbors get around on 4 wheelers. I saw a 5 year old driving one!
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #27
59. so people do not exercise in china and japan?
my friend you are just wrong

the japanese schoolgirl walks and rides her bike, there is no place to park her car even if she had one, the japanese think nothing of walking up and down the side of a mountain on a nice day just for a lark, go puffing and panting up the mountain and at the top what do you find? entire classes from the schools, the old people out for a holiday, and half the rest of the town

i exercise to tone my muscles but i am not thin because i exercise, everybody in the younger generation is bigger than me even tho exercise is a natural part of their life!

i think most sports doctors will also tell you that exercise is for conditioning and toning and stamina but that exercise alone doesn't do much for weight

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Psephos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 01:24 AM
Response to Original message
23. self-delete; posted to wrong subthread
Edited on Fri Mar-10-06 01:25 AM by Psephos

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Demit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 06:01 AM
Response to Original message
28. High Fructose Corn Syrup is evil. And almost impossible to avoid--
It's not only in soda & sweet snacks. It's in barbecue sauce and ketchup. It's in bread. It's in three-bean salad. It's in fat-free/low-fat foods: diet cookies and crackers, ice cream, frozen cakes and pies (Fat holds food together. When it's removed something must take its place--an emulsifier made from sugar). It's even added to honey by some manufacturers (it increases bulk and lower production costs).


This is from an article I have on my hard drive, so, no active link : All Hail the Corn! Or Should We? (New York Times 7/19/02)

"Corn is the world's most widely planted cereal crop. In North America, corn is treated like a king not only in the food system, but also in Washington, D.C.

Last month <6/02>, President Bush signed a bill requiring taxpayers to pay farmers $4 billion a year, over a ten-year period, to grow more corn. More corn when the U.S. is desperately trying to find ways to get rid of the current surplus corn produced here. More corn when farmers are currently selling it for over a dollar less per bushel than it cost them to produce it. A $190 billion bill to grow more corn when planting less corn would increase the price farmers receive for it, and eliminate the extreme surplus. If farmers don't benefit from this bill, then who does? The Archer Daniels Midlands, Tysons and Coca-Colas of the world.

The United States, possibly without realizing it, is a nation saturated in corn. The animals we eat are fed a diet of corn, even if it is not good for them. The natural diet of beef cattle, for instance, is grass, but they are fed the cheaper corn, which disrupts their digestive systems making it necessary to give them antibiotics to stave off illness and infection. 10 billion bushels of corn are devoted to feeding livestock annually; companies like A.D.M., Cargill and ConAgra have figured ingenious new ways to dispose of the leftoversand there are a lot of leftoversturning it into everything from ethanol, Vitamin C, biodegradable plasticsand high-fructose corn syrup (HFCS) .

HFCS has done wonders for keeping corn in business. Soft drink and snack manufacturers have largely abandoned sugar for corn syrup, and nearly 10% of Americans' calories come directly from corn sweeteners. Along with the corn-based animal protein and corn products such as breads and chips that we consume, we are saturated in corn.

This great corn excess is doing excessive harm to our bodies and our environment. It is probably not by chance that the surge in obesity and Type 2 diabetes in the U.S. coincides with the surge in use of corn sweeteners in soft drinks and snacks, corn sweeteners whose relative bargain price enabled manufactures and retailers to create ever-larger portion sizes. ..."


I was researching HFCS in 2002. There may be more, and more illuminating, info out there by now. It may only be a part of the answer to obesity/diabetes, but it's definitely a part.
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Locrian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 06:42 AM
Response to Reply #28
29. stress too
In addition to stress making people want to eat more - stress triggers your adrenal glands to make more cortisol. Cortisol is involved in the conversion of sugar as is insulin.

Of course if you get TOO stressed out for too long your adrenal glands shut down and you wind up with adrenal fatigue. Ive been there and thats NOT the kind of thing you want to happen to your body.
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 09:14 AM
Response to Reply #28
36. And now they can slip it into anything without your knowledge:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

I grew up eating a lot of products with HFCS in them because my family was on a very tight budget.I'm borderline diabetic, suffered from chronic fatigue and depression for most of my life, have fibromyalgia and ADD. I cut HFCS out of my diet about a year ago, and have recently cut ALL sweeteners out-artificial and otherwise. The symptoms of all my lifelong health issues have lessened considerably-particularly the ADD and depression (though the depression was also eased with the use of a device called an Alpha-stim, but that's another post). Naturally, I'm also losing weight.

The government MUST know how this stuff effects health-and it mostly effects the health of the poor, given that foods with HFCS are subsidized and therefore cheaper than those without it (why coke is cheaper than bottled water). Health care is pretty much un-affordable for the poor too. If I were into tinfoil hats, I would almost wonder if there's a little thought to population control here....but it's probably just greed.
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megatherium Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 09:54 AM
Response to Reply #28
41. It's hard work avoiding HFCS. If you go to Whole Foods,
you'll find certain brands of ketchup that do not have it. Oddly enough, said ketchup tastes much better than the usual crap at Kroger.
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Mnemosyne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 07:10 AM
Response to Original message
31. People are forgetting that the industrial nations have spread
toxic chemicals and pesticides from one end of the world to the other, including additives in food.

These things affect the body in many ways, yet most people would rather blame eating too much and laziness as the basic cause of obesity.

I call bullshit. I suffer from heavy metal poisoning and chemical/pesticide toxicity. I know what it has done to me. Mine may be extreme, but chronic low-level exposure can and will cause repercussions to the body over time. The young are especially sensitive to the effects of these poisons.

Anyone that denies that toxic heavy metals/chemicals and pesticides have no effect on the human body has their head up their ass.

HFCS is also another major contributor, though I would not consider it the main factor, but one in the culmination of many.

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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 09:18 AM
Response to Reply #31
38. CFS and fibromyalgia
I was diagnosed with it in the mid-eighties, when it was considered a rare condition. Now it appears to be an epidemic-and we can guess the culprits.

What are you doing for treatment, if I may ask?
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Mnemosyne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #38
85. The mercury poisoning happened
from 1965 - 1975 and intermittently until the early 1980's due to my father's occupation, bulk milk hauler. My environmental doc believes it caused me to become hypersensitive to chemicals/pesticides. Thank you US government! :nuke:

I am being diagnosed with new things all the time. It is terrifying. CFIDS, fibro, hypothyroid, weird allergies, adrenal exhaustion, the list goes on and on and seems to grow with each visit to the doc. Now I am going to be tested for possible chronic renal failure, yah. He calls me his mystery woman. It's rare to find anyone they can trace mercury poisoning back 40 years and see the current effects. I fascinate him! :)

We tried chelation therapy, some homeopathic type (he won't even attempt regular), and it nearly killed me as my system had deteriorated so much by the time I found my environmental doctor. He saved me from imminent death. Even with the strangest blood work my PCP had ever seen, she still claimed my illnesses were "in my head" because she knew I had a bi-polar disorder diagnosis. Of course that came from the mercury, but it took the enviro. doc to know it!

All those years wasted, all the medications that would never work and poisoned my system further, no wonder. Mercury attacks the CNS, heart and kidneys mainly, along with the endocrine glands and whatever the hell else it comes in contact as it wrecks havoc in the body. And only the universe knows what damage the chem/pesticides added in living between two farms growing up and being so sensitive all my life.

I am on a very expensive supplement regime (thanks Mom!). Vitamins, minerals, thyroid and some stuff for my adrenal and pituitary glands. I try to buy and eat as much organic as possible, but it's very hard/nearly impossible at times in this small town and on disability with FS. I have eaten almost no meat at all in 2 years, and still have high cholesterol! Not fair! I have to use a cane (I'm 48, wheee!) due to the mercury causing neuro. damage to my balance. It's better than knocking things over when in public and being accused of being drunk! I rarely ever drink, but boy could people get rude! :rofl:

I also laugh, a lot. It helps with pain quite a bit. Laughter really can be a great relief, if it can't heal. A bit of herbal therapy helps with pain more than any of the crap pills my PCP tried to shove down my throat before I found a new one. I dance in my kitchen for some exercise when I have enough energy. And of course the kitties help also! :)

My doc says he doesn't think it will kill me, says I will only feel as if I am dying (sure do many days), but he says he just doesn't know for sure with everything going wrong. I just hope for the best and treasure each day, each moment. What else is there anyway?! :) I could get hit by a car tomorrow!lol

I keep going for two reasons:

my sweet little grandson age 4, almost 5. :loveya:

And to see * and co. taken away and tried for crimes against humanity. :grr:

Those two things make life very worthwhile!

What do you do for CFS and fibro? Is there something else I can do to make it hurt less? Is there anything to ease the horrible fatigue? Don't you hate feeling more tired when you wake up than when you went to bed? Isn't it awful to get more tired from exercise rather than energized by it? Am I really nosy?!

How did you ever manage to get a diagnosis? My daughter was diagnosed with CEBV in 1986, age 7. I studied about it and CFS then and it seemed many doctors were claiming it was all "in your head" back then also. I felt they just were too lazy to take time to listen and hear what their patients were telling them.

You know when you are not well, when something is very wrong. Sure there are people that are hypochondriacs, but they are few. It saddens me at the suffering that many have had to endure because our illnesses weren't easy to diagnose. Shame on every doctor that ever sent someone away with an "it's all in your head"!

Please excuse me for going on. I'm sure I answered your question with way more info than you wanted! This is just such an important subject. People are still being treated like morons by their doctors, and others, because they don't fit in neat little cubbyholes that make it easy for the assembly line medicine today.

This = that = pharmaceuticals. If you don't fit they throw you away and suggest a shrink! Then more pharmaceuticals to shut you up! :nuke:

The poisons they have added to our food supply are deadly, slow and insidious. People just haven't made the connection. Some of us have and are screaming bloody hell, but I'm afraid our voices just aren't loud enough to drown out the powerful money of the corporations. :grr:

Okay, end of rant.

Please, tell me what you are doing for yourself to help and how you managed to find out what was wrong. I'm interested. You must have had a great doctor back then. :hi:

In hope of peace,
v


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megatherium Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 08:53 PM
Response to Reply #38
87. My mom has fibromyalgia.
Is there a linkage to diet/obesity?

All I've heard is that it's linked to Lyme disease. Supposedly, 20% of Lyme patients who are not treated in time (not until certain neurological symptoms manifest) end up being diagnosed with fibromyalgia. Lyme can be difficult to diagnose. If this theory is correct, it would explain the epidemic of fibromyalgia, since there's been an epidemic of Lyme. (Lyme is of course spread by deer ticks; there are a hell of a lot of deer out there nowadays, as rose farmers might testify.)

My mom also thinks that an auto accident she had may have triggered it. (She rolled her station wagon in 1973; something failed in the vehicle and she suddenly had no steering. She was bruised badly, banged up, but fortunately no serious injuries -- but she always felt different; perhaps she had some neurological damage due to the trauma.)
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AngryAmish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 08:52 AM
Response to Original message
33. I guess it is better than having kids starve
I think there will be more tall people in the future.
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Abathar Donating Member (56 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 03:34 PM
Response to Reply #33
74. This makes me feel old,
but I remember when all the headlines were covered with people dying of starvation and malnutrition, now I see this.

One of my all time old cartoons was "The Wizard of Id" A reporter was interviewing the king on his thrown and asks him "Your majesty, what do you think of the obesity problem facing your subjects?" and his reply was "I like it a lot better than the famine problem we use to have."

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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 10:45 AM
Response to Original message
50. ... limited to the wealthy nations,
while millions upon millions are malnourished or downright starving to death.

If there's a global epidemic it is one of poverty and hunger.


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nomo Donating Member (84 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 11:59 AM
Response to Original message
60. It's not our fault!

A cold-like virus may cause obesity, new experiments suggest.

Researchers at the University of Wisconsin in Madison have found that mice and chickens infected with a common human virus put on much more fat than uninfected animals. They have also discovered that the same virus is more prevalent among overweight people, a strong indication that it may also cause obesity in humans.


http://archives.cnn.com/2000/HEALTH/07/28/fat.virus.ap /

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Megahurtz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #60
83. That's Weird.
You would think that a virus would cause people to lose weight.
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goforit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 01:07 PM
Response to Original message
67. This is unfortunate. Technological advancements create sedentary
life styles.

In addition all those hormones and preservatives pumped into
all our foods certainly doesn't help.
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Lilith Velkor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 03:23 PM
Response to Original message
72. Gosh, we better make sure third world children don't get too much food!
:grr:
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Critters2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 03:43 PM
Response to Original message
75. Here's a funny little notion
How's about we try eating less? I know it's radical. I know "they" are putting something in food that makes it addictive. I know it's easier to blame fat, or HFCS, or all simple carbs, or fast food restaurants. Taking personal responsibility is hard work.

I lost 20 pounds in 6 weeks. How did I do it?! Did I give up all carbs and gorge myself on eggs, butter and red meat? Did I avoid HFCS like it was powdered anthrax? Did I eat only foods labeled "Fat-free"?

No, I took the radical step of limiting quantities. I ate 1350 calories a day, and not a calorie more, unless I was SURE I had participated in some physical activity that burned off more than usual. And even then, I NEVER ate more tha 1450. EVER.

It wasn't easy. A full meal at almost any restaurant was WAY more than the 400 calories I allowed myself at any single meal. But I learned that it is actually possible to eat a sandwich without french fries. I drank tea instead of pop (or do you say "soda"?). I got my "five a day" of fruits and veggies. I stopped eating when I was full, regardless of what was still on my plate.

People get fat because they eat too much--of anything. Stop looking for some culprit that can be blamed besides gluttony. If you take away HCFS, people who are gorging on that will find something else to eat too much of.

Just stop eating too much. Really, that's the only answer.
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Scout Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-10-06 07:41 PM
Response to Reply #75
86. Just stop eating too much. Really, that's the only answer.
you really don't know much, do you?

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davsand Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 11:06 AM
Response to Reply #86
88. To a certain extent I agree with her.
I DO think we have a very real issue with portion control here in the US. It is pretty common to go out to anyplace to eat and the portion served will far exceed what you really need to eat. In some ways, we bring it on ourselves with the common attitude that a full plate is a GOOD thing, however, most people do not really know what constitutes a "portion" of anything.

When you get a big old slab of beef on a plate, it probably is too much meat. If you get an entire chicken breast it probably is too much meat.

If you see a package that says "Only 60 calories!!" that looks great to you if you are trying to control weight or even just eat sensibly. What they DON'T put under that "60 Calories" header is the info that it is maybe half of what looks like a single serve package or maybe only a tablespoon of something.

If you look at the actual requirements we have nutritionally, we do eat WAY too much as a society. I seriously think that has been encouraged by the food industry to a certain extent. "Super Size it" has become a way of life for us, and I think we are hurt by it.

Something else that I think contributes to being overweight is the use of pre-packaged or convenience foods. The farther it is from the way it was grown (the more processed it is) the worse it is gonna be for you.

Nine times out of ten, the instant version will have lower fiber content and a lot more additives in it. (Look at rice and oatmeal if you really want to see an example of that...) The lower the fiber content the more available the carbs, and the greater the available carbs, the more impact it has on blood sugar.

I will not claim to be a nutritional guru, or even terribly educated on the subject, but I will say that I think we generally are over caloried yet malnourished at the same time.

Just my two cents.



Laura
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Critters2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 06:12 PM
Response to Reply #88
101. I think you're right about eating more natural foods
I joined a CSA last summer, and had a ton of veggies to eat every week!! I even had to learn what to do with some of 'em (what is Russian kale?!). I ate lots of fresh veggies, and I think it helped. My CSA is in transition to organic, so no chemicals, either. I'm sure it helped!

I find I'm not very understanding of obesity. I have three members who've had "stomach stapling" surgery (what is the official name?), and that seems like a pretty dangerous thing to do to a body. And after the surgery, they were told they HAD TO eat sensibly and exercise, because they could still gain the weight back, and with worse consequences!! I thought "Well, why didn't you do that in the first place?" Really, I don't get it.

The thing that was most amazing to me, when I committed to losing weight (I gained quite a lot in Iowa--I eat when I'm happy snd/or have a constant supply of kringla from great bakers!) was how little food my diet allowed me, compared to what I had been eating. Do you have any idea how little 400 calories are?! There are whole restaurants with NOTHING on the menu but drinks that have that few calories! I just had to change what I think of as a meal. No more "super sizing".




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Critters2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 03:35 PM
Response to Reply #86
94. I know
that I weigh 130 lbs, have a blood pressure of 90/45, and a total cholesterol of 138. And I did it simply by eating less.

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Scout Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 04:56 PM
Response to Reply #94
95. and I know that "just eating less" doesn't make me lose weight...
but gosh, I guess we're all DIFFERENT, no?

So I guess there's more to it than just "eat less, really."

And I know that while I'm overweight, I have excellent blood pressure and very, very low cholesterol. I'm flexible as all hell, much more flexible than many of my skinny friends, and I'm as strong as an ox (for a woman).

So "feh" on the obesity epidemic.
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Critters2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 05:46 PM
Response to Reply #95
98. You will never convince me that anything other than eating too much causes
Have you even tried to cut back on calories? It isn't easy, but it works. Really. The fact that you're overweight and aren't willing to try eating less only supports my theory.

As to "excellent blood pressure and very, very low cholesterol", I'd be curious as to the numbers. These things are hard to keep in a healthy range if you're not eating right. And it's hard to be obese if you are.


400 calories 3x a day and another snack of 100-130 calories, including five servings of fruits and veggies. Do this for a month, and then tell me what's happening with your weight.
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pitohui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 06:08 PM
Response to Reply #98
100. try medical science
you are going to find huge, huge numbers of doctors, pharmacists, and researchers who believe that certain medications do cause weight gain

in fact, the warning information with many medicines does mention weight gain as a side effect

people who think eating too much is the only cause of weight gain are pretty living in a pre-scientific witchcraft-based era, it is fun to believe that everything is under our own control, all we have to do is eat the magical herbs and poof all is well, it just doesn't happen to be reality-based

i know a man who gained 100 pounds on prozac and he is a pain in the ass he's such a picky eater

then keep in mind that metabolites of prozac and many other drugs and chemicals, including estrogen and estrogen-like chemicals are found in the drinking water supply

you will be hard pressed to convince me that "eating too much" is the cause of the obesity epidemic when i cook the same food for me and my husband, my husband is overweight, i eat twice what he does, i'm thin, hmmm, could it be genetic differences and how we respond to trace amounts of chemicals etc. in our water, etc. make a difference?

the discrimination against fat people and the assumption that they are all fat lazy slobs who eat too much has got to go, i have seen it up close, my husband is not a fat lazy slob

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Critters2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 06:16 PM
Response to Reply #100
102. Drugs that have 'weight gain" as a side-effect, and I've been on several,
cause a craving for food. Thus, it is still eating too much that causes the weight gain. In rare instances the problem is water weight gain. But I was once on a tricyclic that caused weight gain--by making me hungry. I asked the doc for something else.

And prozac causes weight loss as often as it causes weight gain.

I still think weight gain comes from eating too many calories.
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phylny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 07:36 PM
Response to Reply #98
103. Do a google search for PCOS and learn. n/t
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eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-12-06 05:39 AM
Response to Reply #98
114. It won't change much
People evolved to face periodic starvation. Just the simple fact of having enough to eat will make a certain percentage of the population fat. Nothing can be done about it, nor should it be. Excercising more and more natural foods will make people healthier, not thinner.
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Danieljay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #75
90. Congrats to you...but there is more to it than that... READ on..
Edited on Sat Mar-11-06 01:23 PM by Danieljay
high cortisol levels due to long term stress resulting in insulin sensitivity, thyroid issues, etc. can all be underlying issues preventing weight loss. I know of people who run 5 times a week, train for marathons, eat low calorie diets, and STILL don't lose weight. Its usually due to long term stress and the depletion of adrenals combined with hight cortisol levels.

Consuming less is a great idea and it works for a lot of people. That being said, there is also something to be said about a non-inflammatory diet, eliminating gluten and wheat for some, eggs, tomatoes, and dairy for others. Any good Naturopath or dietician will tell you that and also be able to treat the underlying conditions.

Childhood weight problems and obesity are almost ALWAYS diet related due to high fructose corn syrup, fast food, and sugars. Children on whole foods diets are rarely overweight.

If you are trying everything and still can't lose weight, find a good Naturopath. If you are in the Portland Oregon area, I know of one personally (my partner) who is a great doctor and who specializes in this sort of thing in addition to bio-identical hormone replacement therapy.
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Scout Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 05:10 PM
Response to Reply #90
97. I just had a screening exam...
to see if I can participate in a study examining blood sugar in those predisposed/at greater risk for Type II diabetes and metabolic syndrome.

On the one hand, if I don't get into the study it's good because it means that even though I weigh 230 pounds, my "numbers" are good with triglycerides and cholesterol, and my blood pressure is good. They are studying the effects of a current medication on people predisposed but not yet diabetic, under age 50 ... to see if they can find a way to prevent Type II from developing.

If I do get into the study, I'll get consults with a dietitian, several other tests of blood sugar and liver function, plus a full-blown body composition analyses. NO ONE, not even medical people and my surgeon, thinks I look like a weigh near what I do ... I'm "visually overweight" yes, but not "morbidly obese" which I am according to my BMI. (A useless measure of health if you ask me.)

For me, cutting calories simply means I'll gain weight slower. The only way I've lost weight is by continueing to eat normally for me, and exercising a LOT ... like weight lifting, swimming, daily walking.

Cutting calories tells my body to go into famine mode, and it becomes more efficient at burning what I take in. Therefore I must eat, but exercise a lot.

Someday, when world famine comes those skinny bitches will be dropping like flies; the fat will live off our reserves until the beautiful people are dead, then we will rule the world! We will return to a time when a little meat on your bones meant you weren't a starving peasant, but could afford to eat. Bwaaaa haaaa haaaa haaaa! :evilgrin:
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Critters2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 05:51 PM
Response to Reply #97
99. Your body only goes into "famine mode" briefly
After a week or so, you'll start losing weight. It takes discipline to get through that time. I remember when I was hungry, felt like I needed to eat all the time. I felt it, I acknowledged it, I chose not to eat. Now, my body expects to eat regularly, but to eat less. I never feel hungry--or if I do, I eat something healthy, and eat that much less at my next meal.

I do all this with very little exercise. I walk the dog twice or three times a day, and practice yoga as a spiritual discipline. But I never do any aerobics or that crap. Don't have to.

I just eat what I need to, and do the ordinary physical activity the day calls for.

This isn't rocket science.
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wickerwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #99
112. 95% of diets fail.
Does that mean 95% of people are lazy, stupid and completely undisciplined?

If 95% of people failed their driving test or their SATs would we be looking at the people or at the test?

It's bully for you that you've been able to lose weight and keep it off, really it is. But do you honestly think that most people just don't realize they need to eat less and exercise more? Or that they are so lazy and bad, bad, bad that they can't manage to stick to 1350 calories a day?

You're right that people eat portions that are too big and that *some* control is necessary- but how that control is achieved differs from person to person. I work a job where I have to be able to focus my attention very carefully for extended periods of time. If I eat less than I need (somewhere in the 1900-2000 calorie range) I get light headed, foggy, irritable, irrational- I can't put sentences or thoughts together- I look like an asshole and would almost certainly be fired if I did it for more than one or two days at a time.

I've lost 80 pounds and kept it off for three or four years. There is no magic bullet- not even eat less and exercise sensibly. Everyone has to find their own balance. But I do know that nobody will stick to a diet that makes them miserable. And it's absurd to expect them to. And 1350 calorie a day would make me absolutely cease to function.
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eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-12-06 05:41 AM
Response to Reply #99
115. No s/he won't
His/her body will change to need fewer calories, and his/her weight will stay the same.
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Danieljay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-12-06 10:47 AM
Response to Reply #99
120. Remember that your situation is unique... not rocket science for you
but there is another componant that you seem to want to ignore. Your weight loss situation is unique. It works for some and not everyone. Its NOT simply about eating less. Did you not read my previous post regarding stress hormones, insulin insenstivity and thyroid? I'm sitting here next to a physician who deals with this every day in her practice. She has patients all the time that "just eat less" and don't lose weight.

I'm happy for you that you lost the weight you wanted to lose simply by consuming less. Thats a great start and that works for a lot of people. That being said, be gently with those for whom that doesn't work. There's more to weight loss than simply reducing calories.

Consider yourself one of the lucky ones.
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phylny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 07:38 PM
Response to Reply #90
104. I was never very overweight until I started grad school in my late 30's.
Edited on Sat Mar-11-06 07:40 PM by phylny
The stress was enormous (going to school, working, taking care of house, husband and kids) and I gained. Boy, did I gain.

I'm awaiting bloodwork to see if it's hormonally based. I'm on Weight Watchers, doing well, but it's agonizingly slow. Their "Core" program is all about whole grains, vegetables, fruit and protein.

Edited to add my blood pressure and labs are always fantastic.
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Danieljay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-13-06 12:08 PM
Response to Reply #104
126. hi Phylny
If you have a gluten allergy even whole grains can be a problem. Tomatos, dairy, and even soy are common food allergins and can be a source of problems too. If you have access, find a good middle of the road naturopath who can assist you. Ask him or her about a detox using a food supplement such as MediClear while following a whole foods diet, or inquire about what it means to follow a non-inflammatory diet. I've never had an issue with weight, but when I did a three week MediClear detox recently many of my other symptoms just disappeared. As I reintroduced certain types of food I realized what I had allergies to.

I think you are on the right track with the hormone testing. There is a chance your adrenals are shot or/and you might have a thyroid issue. You can take your temperature at 8:00 in the morning and 8:00 in the evening for a while. If its regularly below normal, it could be a indication of a thyroid imbalance.

Best of luck to you! Its not always as simple as eating less.
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phylny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-13-06 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #126
129. Thanks for this info! n/t
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Lydia Leftcoast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 04:59 PM
Response to Original message
96. I put a lot of the blame on sedentary lifestyles
As countries industrialize, they start driving and stop walking. When I was in China 15 years ago, all except the very wealthy went everywhere by bicycle or public transit, even in Beijing and Shanghai. Now, I've heard, Beijing is laced with freeways, the nouveau riche all want cars, and bicycles are actual banned from many main streets.

Japan has had cars for a long time, but it is only in recent years that it began getting American-style car-burbs, where every store is surrounded by a parking lot.

You still see very few obese people in Japan, but those that exist are mostly young.

In all industrialized countries, children increasingly sit inside and watch TV or play with their computers instead of running around outside as we did when I was a child in the 1950s. We certainly had TV, but we weren't encouraged to sit around and watch it all the time unless we were home sick, because our parents believed that it was bad for our eyes.

Certainly quantities of food play a role, more so in the U.S. than in Japan, where restaurant portions look puny to the average overfed American.

I must say, though, that the Chinese seem to eat a lot, and switching to a sedentary lifestyle could easily pack on the pounds.
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eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-12-06 05:43 AM
Response to Reply #96
116. What can be done about that?
Nothing. Most jobs are sedentary, and many people have to work more than one of them to survive.
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Lydia Leftcoast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-12-06 09:40 AM
Response to Reply #116
118. Don't build any more car-burbs
Edited on Sun Mar-12-06 09:40 AM by Lydia Leftcoast
where people are forced to drive.

Make sure that there are non-car alternatives to driving and that they are easily accessible: sidewalks, bike paths, frequent bus runs, commuter trains, light rail.

Change zoning laws so that every new business, shopping area, or office "park" must be accessible to non-automotive transportation.
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eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-12-06 04:24 PM
Response to Reply #118
122. All good suggestions
However, the effect woould only be that people would be healthier, and weigh slightly less on average. There is just no friggin' way that walking to a sedentary job in a society where there is enough to eat for most people can be made equivalent to one where peasants do hard physical labor all day on short rations.
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Nikia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-11-06 08:19 PM
Response to Original message
106. They should look into this
I thought that more American children were heavy because they weren't playing outside activily as much as they did in the past due to increase in sedentary entertainment options and parents paranoid about their children's safety. It would be odd that children who continue to be active would be putting on weight. Perhaps there are things in foods that cause less efficient calorie burning or fat burning. Perhaps it could be a reaction to environmental pollution.
I do know that some people don't seem to burn fat very well. When calorie deficient, not everyone will burn stored fat in relation to how much they theoretically should. The body can respond by lowering metabolism, burning muscle, burning organs, or lowering function. It doesn't have to burn fat. That is why you get heavy people passing out trying to fast. That is why the dead anorexics aren't always the lightest anorexics either.
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eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-12-06 05:48 AM
Response to Original message
117. A skin color analogy
My skin is much lighter when I stay out of the sun, and it gets a lot darker when I spend time outdoors. That proves that black people are really white people who spend too much time in the sun. They may foolishly claim that their skin stays really dark even if they spend all their time indoors, but that just proves they are doing it wrong. They could have light skin if they really wanted it, and should just STFU about racism.
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MissMillie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-12-06 10:22 AM
Response to Original message
119. My guess is that it is more than one "something" that is responsible
Our jobs are less active than they used to be, we eat more processed food than we used to, kids play video games instead of tag and kickball,.... all of it.

There's no one answer, and there is no one solution.
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noonwitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-13-06 02:26 PM
Response to Original message
127. Too much time on videogames and not enough on the bike or in Little League
I don't think the diet would be so much of an issue if all kids were getting enough exercise. When we were kids, we could eat McDonald's every night and not gain weight. We didn't spend all our non-school hours playing videogames, we rode our bikes to our friends' houses after school.
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allisonthegreat Donating Member (586 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-13-06 04:06 PM
Response to Original message
128. It is hard
To stop eating sugar..(like candy, cookies, & cakes) ..There ar sugars hiding in the foods..It is terrible...I have to literally detox off the food...
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