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DoYouEverWonder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 03:29 AM
Original message
PM attacked on Iraq 'God' remarks
4 March 2006

Anti-war campaigners have criticised Tony Blair after he suggested his decision to go to war in Iraq would ultimately be judged by God.

The prime minister told ITV1's Parkinson chat show: "If you believe in God (the judgement) is made by God."

Reg Keys, whose son was killed in Iraq, said Mr Blair was "using God as a get-out for total strategic failure" and his comments were "abhorrent".

But Labour MP Stephen Pound praised Mr Blair for being "painfully honest".

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/4773124.stm


Blair needs to give it up. No amount of praying is going to save his wretched soul or justify what has been done to the Iraqi people.

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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 03:36 AM
Response to Original message
1. Maybe he doesn't know that
he was elected by women and men.
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Greeby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 03:41 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. "elected" is a stretch
When 24,000 decide for the rest of us :(
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 04:39 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. Valid point n/t
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Benbow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 03:55 AM
Response to Original message
3. Amazing distancing himself from being judged in this life
Will that be his defence for his impunity at The Hague - that only history and God can sit in judgement on his decisions? The British people, to whom the PM has a duty in this life and now, and everyone for whom travel and life has been made more dangerous as a direct result of his aligning the UK with the US in the illegal invasion of Iraq - are entitled to judge, too. And the thousands upon thousands of civilian Iraqis who have died because of the PM's disastrous sucking-up to the Bush administration.
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saigon68 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 04:39 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. SUCKING UP


HE IS WAITING TO BE PATTED ON THE HEAD
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Greeby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 05:04 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. Pah, not a patch on Steve Bell


:evilgrin:
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saigon68 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 07:04 AM
Response to Reply #6
10. LOL I love Steve Bell


STEVE'S TAKE ON THE CHIMP'S TRIP TO INDIA
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flordehinojos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 05:13 AM
Response to Original message
7. tony blair ought to fall down on his knees and sweat blood, cry tears and
ask for God's and humanity's forgivenness and maybe then he won't seem to be just such a plastic made up figure.

and isn't it interesting how politicians never accept responsibility, or blame? FIDEL CASTRO'S SAYING WAS AND IS, 'HISTORY WILL ABSOLVE ME"!

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EuroObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 05:48 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. "History will absolve me": different context:
But Fidel Castro pronounced those words in the context of corrupt legal proceedings manipulated by Batista's dictatorship. His struggle at the time was precisely to uphold the legitimacy of the law in the face of its usurpation.

Rather than a speech, it was an address he prepared for delivery at the show-trial to which he and some of his comrades were subjected, following the Moncada Barracks affair (cf. wikipedia).

The full text in English is here and is, imho, required reading for any political philosopher (or even a mere observer or humble participant in political processes).

It commences:


HONORABLE JUDGES:

Never has a lawyer had to practice his profession under such difficult conditions; never has such a number of overwhelming irregularities been committed against an accused man. In this case, counsel and defendant are one and the same. As attorney he has not even been able to take a look at the indictment. As accused, for the past seventy-six days he has been locked away in solitary confinement, held totally and absolutely incommunicado, in violation of every human and legal right...


and concludes (emphasis added):

...I come to the close of my defense plea but I will not end it as lawyers usually do, asking that the accused be freed. I cannot ask freedom for myself while my comrades are already suffering in the ignominious prison of the Isle of Pines. Send me there to join them and to share their fate. It is understandable that honest men should be dead or in prison in a Republic where the President is a criminal and a thief.

To you, Honorable Judges, my sincere gratitude for having allowed me to express myself free from contemptible restrictions. I hold no bitterness towards you, I recognize that in certain aspects you have been humane, and I know that the Chief Judge of this Court, a man of impeccable private life, cannot disguise his repugnance at the current state of affairs that compels him to dictate unjust decisions. Still, a more serious problem remains for the Court of Appeals: the indictments arising from the murders of seventy men, that is to say, the greatest massacre we have ever known. The guilty continue at liberty and with weapons in their hands - weapons which continually threaten the lives of all citizens. If all the weight of the law does not fall upon the guilty because of cowardice or because of domination of the courts, and if then all the judges do not resign, I pity your honor. And I regret the unprecedented shame that will fall upon the Judicial Power.

I know that imprisonment will be harder for me than it has ever been for anyone, filled with cowardly threats and hideous cruelty. But I do not fear prison, as I do not fear the fury of the miserable tyrant who took the lives of 70 of my comrades. Condemn me. It does not matter. History will absolve me.

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MrPrax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 12:37 PM
Response to Reply #8
19. One of the Great Speeches...
Def should be required reading for many and especially folks who wouldn't mind a peek into PRE-revoluntary Cuba and Castro's own radicalization--a reluctant hero to be sure.

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EuroObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Little subtle kick here in the name of Justice. n/t, but also:
nada, hombre, yo todava relativamente equilibrado, dentro de lo que cabe... y ustedes? :hippie:

:hi:
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MrPrax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 06:07 PM
Response to Reply #20
24. Nope...don't understand
got the geist...dumb Gringo--took really kewl stuff like 4 years of Latin in high school with a smattering of French.

Spanish? Who speaks that??? ;-)
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 05:56 AM
Response to Original message
9. might be interesting if i thought tony believed what he says.
but like all other neoliberals and neoconservatives -- he is an utterly cynical, depraved man -- and that's it.
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salin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 07:04 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. Were it ever to come to it...
"God made me do it" wouldn't work as a defense at the Hague.
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 07:16 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. fingers crossed, salin, fingers crossed really, really hard.
Edited on Sat Mar-04-06 07:16 AM by xchrom
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salin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 08:26 AM
Response to Reply #12
15. Things have changed in the past couple of years
haven't they. I am going to guess that unless things get worse (eg we pursue another war) - that powers to be would prevent such war crimes trials for fear of the potential distabilizing of major countries and their govts. That is the realist speaking. However, several years ago we could "scream" about the Hague per bushco/blair - but beyond our own echo chambers there would be no consideration. There are indications now that this has been a fear for some high up in each govt for a number of years now... contexts change and who knows. I would venture to guess if we do pursue another full out action - that war crimes would become more and more likely as the destabilizing nature of such actions would have already occured wiping out the fear of what said crimes might bring (in terms of instability).
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 09:13 AM
Response to Reply #15
18. sadly, i agree, there will be no trial. the major corporations here and in
europe would never, ever agree to it.

and whether we like it or not -- at this time in our history they have all the political power that counts.

but at least saying so -- and hear i'm with you in spades -- gets heard and even in small amounts talked about.

it is a change.
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boobooday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 07:57 AM
Response to Original message
13. Proof that he is a non-believer
Cause if he really believed, he would tremble in fear as he said that.
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badgervan Donating Member (745 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 08:57 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. Avoiding Responsibility
This is how blair and bush, in their own small minds, avoid responsibility for thousands of needless deaths. God is responsible, see? They aren't the first, they certainly won't be the last - but they are moral cowards when and where it counts. Irresponsible, cowardly - and very small, small men. History will not be kind to them.
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Cronus Protagonist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-05-06 06:17 AM
Response to Reply #16
26. Hey, that's the essence of Christianity you're talking about
Asserting one's works as God's work is a "get out of hell free" card for entry into Heaven. It's the main vein of Christian Dominionism AND Islamic Totalitarianism. One can do ANYTHING here on earth if it's done in God's name - war, suicide, murder, torture, genocide, etc.... all AOK as long as it's for God.

:scared:
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muriel_volestrangler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 08:19 AM
Response to Original message
14. Courtesy of Bloggerheads
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Monkey see Monkey Do Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 09:10 AM
Response to Reply #14
17. Fantastic!
(I'm reminded of last night's My Name Is Earl:

Randy: Was it my fault we got caught?
Earl: Of course it was your fault. I was half way down the block with the basket of money and you tripped over your damn dress. I told ya to go as a priest, but no, you thought it would be funny to dress as a nun. If you'd just listen to me instead of worrying so much about trying...
(Both start laughing.)
Randy: It's funny, isn't it? Is it funny?
Earl: Yeah, it's funny.
Randy: I told you. It's because I'm a man, but I'm dressed like a woman.
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goforit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 04:55 PM
Response to Reply #14
22. The perfect perverted couple.
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goforit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 04:54 PM
Response to Original message
21. ...and total blasphemy!!!
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antonialee839 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 05:03 PM
Response to Original message
23. Bush and Blair are confusing God with Dog.
Dog told them to kill all those people in Iraq.
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mom cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-04-06 08:24 PM
Response to Original message
25. I didn't mean to bomb them ... God made me do it!
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Disturbed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-05-06 06:28 AM
Response to Reply #25
27. Shrub and Blair are pathetic weasels.
The UK belongs to the World Court so Blair should be charged with War Crimes. Shrub has to be Impeached.
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