Turkish Women Blast Karen Hughes With Iraq War Criticism

[IChing]

ISTANBUL, Sept. 28 -- A group of Turkish female activists confronted Undersecretary of State Karen Hughes Wednesday with heated complaints about the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq, turning a session designed to highlight the empowering of women into a raw display of the anger at U.S. policy in the region.

"This war is really, really bringing your positive efforts to the level of zero," said Hidayet Sefkatli Tuksal, an activist with the Capital City Women's Forum. She said it was difficult to talk about cooperation between women in the United States and Turkey as long as Iraq was under occupation.

Hughes, a longtime confidant of President Bush tasked with burnishing the U.S. image overseas, has generally met with polite audiences -- many of whom received U.S. funding or consisted of former exchange students -- during a tour of Egypt, Saudi Arabia and Turkey this week.

In this case the U.S. Embassy asked Kader, an umbrella group that supports woman candidates, to assemble the guest list. None of the activists currently receive U.S. funds and the guests apparently had little desire to mince words. Six of the eight women who spoke at the session, held in Ankara, the capital, focused on the Iraq war.

"War makes the rights of women completely erased and poverty comes after war -- and women pay the price," said Fatma Nevin Vargun, a Kurdish women's rights activist. Vargun denounced the arrest of Cindy Sheehan, the activist mother of a soldier killed in Iraq, in front of the White House Monday at an antiwar protest.

Hughes, looking increasingly pained, defended the decision to invade Iraq as a difficult and wrenching moment for President Bush, but necessary to protect America.

>>>>>snip

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/20...

[IChing]

1. More of the dialogue

Hughes: "You're concerned about war, and no one likes war," she said. But, she said, "to preserve the peace sometimes my country believes war is necessary." She also asserted that women are faring much better in Iraq than under the rule of deposed president Saddam Hussein.

"War is not necessary for peace," shot back Feray Salman, a human rights advocate. She said countries should not try to impose democracy through war, adding that "we can never, ever export democracy and freedom from one country to another."

Tuksal said she was "feeling myself wounded, feeling myself insulted here" by Hughes' response. "In every photograph that comes from Iraq there is that look of fear in the eyes of women and children. . . . This needs to be resolved as soon as possible."

[rodeodance]

4. "and women pay the price,"--said a Kurish women!!--these women are the

smart ones, ----not our diplomatic Ms. Hughes!!

"War makes the rights of women completely erased and poverty comes after war -- and women pay the price," said Fatma Nevin Vargun, a Kurdish women's rights activist. Vargun denounced the arrest of Cindy Sheehan, the activist mother of a soldier killed in Iraq, in front of the White House Monday at an antiwar protest......

[saigon68]

67. Ms. Hughes= "FEMALE ASS CLOWN"

[never cry wolf]

35. Her reply reminds me a little of:

Why of course the people don't want war. Why should some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece? Naturally the common people don't want war.... That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.

Herman Goering, during the Neurenberg trials.

[Cha]

45. Yes, hughes went to the same

school as goering and the fascist bushwa.

It must really Chapped their collective butt that a lot of us are giving them the Bronx Cheer when it comes to their idea of "patriotism".

Fuck 'em if they don't what is Patriotic!

[niallmac]

60. I am copying that. n/t

[PsychoDad]

64. They do have their heads up their @ss

"She also asserted that women are faring much better in Iraq than under the rule of deposed president Saddam Hussein."

Iraq was quite secularized and westernized under Sadam. The best women in Iraq now can hope for is to be given the same rights they had under the Sadam regime. Hopefuly their voice will be loud enough to insure that.

[FizzFuzz]

65. "She also asserted

that women are faring much better in Iraq than under the rule of deposed president Saddam Hussein."--- LIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

god I am so SICK of these damned LIARS!!!!!! The blatant fact twisting, it just drives me up a wall. I just can't stand it. Arrgh!

[rodeodance]

2. "War is not necessary for peace," this was told to Hughes!! grand!

......"You're concerned about war, and no one likes war," she said. But, she said, "to preserve the peace sometimes my country believes war is necessary." She also asserted that women are faring much better in Iraq than under the rule of deposed president Saddam Hussein.

"War is not necessary for peace," shot back Feray Salman, a human rights advocate. She said countries should not try to impose democracy through war, adding that "we can never, ever export democracy and freedom from one country to another."

Tuksal said she was "feeling myself wounded, feeling myself insulted here" by Hughes' response. "In every photograph that comes from Iraq there is that look of fear in the eyes of women and children. . . . This needs to be resolved as soon as possible."

Turkey, a member of NATO, has long been a close ally of the United States, but relations have soured during the Bush administration, especially after the Turkish parliament blocked a request to allow U.S. troops to stage an invasion of northern Iraq via Turkey. National Security Adviser Stephen J. Hadley visited Ankara last week as part of a new effort by the White House to mend ties.......

[0007]

3. The women Turks let Karen have it;

Hughes, looking increasingly pained, defended the decision to invade Iraq as a difficult and wrenching moment for President Bush, but necessary to protect America.

"You're concerned about war, and no one likes war," she said. But, she said, "to preserve the peace sometimes my country believes war is necessary." She also asserted that women are faring much better in Iraq than under the rule of deposed president Saddam Hussein.

"War is not necessary for peace," shot back Feray Salman, a human rights advocate. She said countries should not try to impose democracy through war, adding that "we can never, ever export democracy and freedom from one country to another."

Tuksal said she was "feeling myself wounded, feeling myself insulted here" by Hughes' response. "In every photograph that comes from Iraq there is that look of fear in the eyes of women and children. . . . This needs to be resolved as soon as possible."

[rodeodance]

5. it is emabarrassing to me that Hughes is suposed to be the "diplomat"

[0007]

24. And we wonder why counties don't have a healthy view of America!

Our administration doesn't have a clue.

Rice will be coming out next week, and then Rumsfeld again and around & around & we go.........

[hraka]

40. Definition of "diplomat"

"One, such as an ambassador, who has been appointed to represent a government in its relations with other governments."
from dictionary.com

She represented our government quite well. That's the problem.

[Kikosexy2]

6. First the Saudi...

women and now the Turks...Karen "Mama" Hughes is getting bitch-slapped left and right--just love it ladies.

[Pachamama]

12. LOVE IT! 1st she tells Saudi's how women should be more "liberated", then

she goes to a country where islam prevails as the predominant religion and where women are more equal and liberated and then those "liberated" women tell Karen Hughes where she can shove it....

[Kikosexy2]

18. Karen must ...

cursing Georgy boy right now...damn this mission, I'm going home.

[tanyev]

7. Oopsie.

Who pre-screened this audience? Time for them to go spend more time with their family.

[IChing]

8. That's the thing, when you live in a bubble and ask for dialogue

Reality tends to leak in.

[tanyev]

11. Sounds like the Rainbow Tour isn't going so well.

[AlCzervik]

9. Karen Hughes "Muslim outreach" will now only be done with American

repoublican audiences.

[Hardrada]

17. Ones in uniform too

Ordered to be there and ordered to like it. The Shrub regime tries to order the rest of us to like them and it doesn't work.

[wellstone_democrat]

10. Idiotic *gendered* approach

I *love* the fact that Hughes attempt to speak to women on an "emotional" basis going to war a "wrenching moment for President Bush*" doesn't fly with these women---they aren't buying the infantile emotional argument. She underestimates the level of education and sophistication (and secular nature) of most Turkish women. They aren't the audience for the soap opera approach and aren't as addled by consumerism and marketing as many women in western nations. I went to grad school with several Turkish women and they were sharp and cosmopolitan in outlook.

I love seeing this ass get her head handed to her over and over on this trip. love it.

[Kikosexy2]

13. Looks like...

she needs to take her tour back to the "soccer moms" for Bush! (Sigh).

[grannylib]

51. "Wrenching moment" my ass...his biggest problem was waiting for 9/11

to happen so he'd have an excuse to try to portray himself as a 'war president.'
What a fucking little monkey turd.
No offense meant towards monkey turds; I have no doubt that monkey turds are better looking, better smelling and far more intelligent than the unelected moron jetting about the country (so much for conservation, eh, Incurious Georgie??) looking for his next photo op.

[Raster]

55. As he pumped his fist and yelled "feels good"... yeah, wrenching moment

Liar, liar

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

14. And the hits just keep on comin'

Hughes is just another Bush bully. I love hearing about others slapping her around. She deserves nothing but the back of the hand.

Nominated.

[necso]

15. "Hughes, a longtime confidant of President Bush

tasked with burnishing the U.S. image overseas, has generally met with polite audiences -- many of whom received U.S. funding or consisted of former exchange students -- during a tour of Egypt, Saudi Arabia and Turkey this week."

"In this case the U.S. Embassy asked Kader, an umbrella group that supports woman candidates, to assemble the guest list. None of the activists currently receive U.S. funds and the guests apparently had little desire to mince words."

Gee, useful (and important) context.

Oh, and somebody screwed up by not carefully choosing (or at least screening) the audience -- this is the expected GOP-S(L)OP* these days -- and it is required behavior from flunkies.

S(L)OP*: Standard (Lying) Operating Procedure. "Lying" is used here in the broad sense of anything that can be (and is) used to mislead, misinform, misdirect, create false impressions (a favorite), etc.

[scarletlib]

32. Hmm. Maybe the person who selected this audience "screwed

up' on purpose.

[MADem]

54. You are likely on to something

And who knows, there may have been some coordination between nations ahead of these dog and pony shows. All politics is local...

And monkeyboy, as usual, is the last to figure it out.

[gratuitous]

16. And, far from being a difficult and wrenching moment for Bush

Before going on the air to announce the shock and awe invasion of Iraq, prelude to showers of flowers, Bush was being made up, pumping his greedy little fist, and saying "Feels good. Feels good."

http://www.unknownnews.net/insanity032003.html

[elehhhhna]

19. Yelling "Bring 'em on" was hard work.

[elehhhhna]

20. So, who hasn't she pissed off? Oops. SHE FORGOT POLAND!

[JNelson6563]

21. Boy the women of SA and now Turkey

Karen's not being so warmly welcomed with her master's message. That's what happens when you try to defend the indefensible.

Julie

[elehhhhna]

22. Will this come back to haunt Iraqi Kurds in the ass I wonder?

Nevermind. Of course it will.

Karen's petty, venal master will probably gas them for this.

[elehhhhna]

23. Where can I get a tee shirt that says "We Hated Her FIRST!" ?

[Brother Buzz]

57. Not bad!

[Solly Mack]

25. I live around many Turks and they all said she would be eaten alive

once she got to Turkey.

I was in my local Kaffe shop and talking with the regulars - mostly Turks who are now German citizens.

[IChing]

26. well, they certainly chewed on her ..that' why I love the headline

Anytime she get's bitch slapped you gotta love it...
why only 3 nominations?

[Solly Mack]

27. 4 now :o)

I detest Hughes.

[scarletwoman]

28. I am happy to add the 5th vote.

It's great to hear about these women speaking out!

sw

[cascadiance]

58. Maybe she could go to Germany...

And more Turkish women can tell her how Doner Kebab (Turkish version of Gyros) is more popular than American fast food (hamburgers, etc.) there! I'm sure that would be an eye opener to her about how the world lives outside her sheltered little RW life!

[Solly Mack]

66. Doner Kebabs rule! She can try some Turkish pizza too

though I'm not so sure she'd enjoy what people here had to say at all.

Would be worth watching though. lol

[onager]

29. Mr. ROFL Smilie sure comes in handy here...

wellstone_democrat wrote: ...I went to grad school with several Turkish women and they were sharp and cosmopolitan in outlook.

I agree. We used to socialize with some Turkish women in Saudi Arabia. They tended to be well-educated, knowledgable on current affairs, and extremely outspoken.

Whenever talk turned to their own government, you only had about a 10-nanosecond delay before words like "Fascist" and "neanderthal" started flying around.

These women aren't about to be intimidated by the likes of Hughes.

[DIKB]

30. My word.

She lives in a bubble.

She also asserted that women are faring much better in Iraq than under the rule of deposed president Saddam Hussein.

We took the one country in the middle east where women had the MOST rights, women could hold jobs, go to school, wear what they wished, etc. And we have pushed it towards a theocracy where some women have had their heads shaved for wearing jeans. THIS is "much better" ?

[bobbieinok]

33. I wish everyone in the US knew this.....M$M silent again

[MisterP]

44. bubble? more like lobotomy

[ninkasi]

61. If you read Riverbend

She does not think that women are faring much better than they were under Saddam Hussein. She thinks conditions are worse. Of course, she's an Iraqi citizen, and a woman, so I'm sure she doesn't know as much as the Chimp and Karen Huge...to give her name the Bob Boudelang spelling.

[spooky3]

31. The listening tour is giving her an earful!

[Mountainman]

34. She is going around the world selling the same old lies the world rejected

back in 2003.

Their spin machine doesn't work in other countries.

[Quakerfriend]

38. It's really so embarrassing.

She is the ultimate UN-diplomat!

Somehow, I can only picture her at home in her bathrobe making brownies.

[never cry wolf]

36. Kicked and recommended.......n/t

[cascadiance]

37. Damn, Turkish women are doing a fine job these days!

First it's Sibel Edmonds, now these ladies too!

Lived in Turkey for a number of years as a kid. Always knew Turks as having a lot of pride and being strong willed. As women have become more liberated there than in other Muslim countries, they're becoming a strong force to deal with! Proud of their telling it like it is!

[Maggie_May]

39. You go spread the Love Karen

[Arkana]

41. Bet she wasn't expecting that.

Karen Hughes is scum--just like her boss.

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

42. It's just an 'image' problem though. All the usual Rove/Hughes methods

should work fine, talking points faxes, smear campaigns, purple band-aids and the like.

[number6]

43. bitch slapped with reality...

he he

[Cha]

46. I am so Grateful to these

Turkish Women who have the brains and heart that karen hughes will NEVER KNOW.

karen is missing valuble cells and genes..poor twisted sister.

[bread_and_roses]

47. This makes me even more ashamed that so many US women support

this murderous regime. The eyes of the Iraqi women and children should haunt every woman in this Country as well. And not just haunt, but move to speak and act.

[bread_and_roses]

48. Given the reports about Furious George's response to "bad" news....

I wonder if she'll go back to the WH and report that she was greeted with flowers strewn at her feet?

[fortyfeetunder]

49. What an ethnocentric speech!

Karen Hughes was pontificating on women's rights to Middle Eastern women---while right here in the good old USA we have women being denied health care and reduced access to safe contraception...

She deserved a butt chewing from her audience....shame on her!

[prof_youngblood]

50. Karen Hughes: Author of the; "the troops died for a noble cause speech"

This broad is running on empty for the monster they created...!

[Miss Chybil]

52. LOL! They didn't vet the audience. It must have killed her to have

to listen to people speak the truth.

[KDLarsen]

53. Let's face it - invading Iraq has put turkey in a VERY tight spot

They've had constant problems with the Kurdish minority, and now that the Kurds in Iraq is getting control of their own zone, it's going to strengthen the cries for Kurdish independence from Turkey.

But nice to see Karen Hughes be told off by the people she probably thought she was going to lecture about how great democracy is. Heavens knows that that tour of hers have presented her with more critiscism that she and/or the administration she represents will ever get back home. I mean, the part that says: ""War is not necessary for peace," shot back Feray Salman, a human rights defender. She said countries should not try to impose democracy through war, adding that "we can never, ever export democracy and freedom from one country to another." - can it get any more truthful than that?

[Raster]

56. karen hughes: longtime wetnurse to the beast.

[AnneD]

71. I think the correct phrase is

Whore of Babalyon.

[Raster]

76. same thing.

[calimary]

59. Truth hurts, 'eh karen? Deal with it, honey. You need to get out more.

Kicked and nominated.

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

62. Hughes makes US look even more condescending and arrogant

The US has the nerve to send W's mommy figure around the world to tell everyone that War is necessary for peace.

Right, that is so easy to say when you are exporting war, and are not importing it.

[Amonester]

74. Yeah. Particularly easy when somebody else has to fight and...

die or lose limbs, or get their face burnt for life in them.

Someone should tell a** clown Karen to tell **: "Send Jenna & Barb."

[AuntiBush]

63. Tuksal's Got That Right!

""This war is really, really bringing your positive efforts to the level of zero..."

Yeah, tell us about it. And, Hughes looking "pained." Bleeding purple for her now

[goodhue]

68. Pained or subdued?

Current version of the story now states:

"Hughes, who became increasingly subdued during the session, defended the decision to invade Iraq as a difficult and wrenching moment for Bush but necessary to protect the United States."

[wicket]

69. interesting- they must've changed it afterwards

Wonder why'd they do that? Weird.

[progressoid]

70. Good - she needs more of this.

I never thought I could hate anyone as much as Rove but she's getting pretty close.

[redqueen]

72. How did invading Iraq protect America?

So glad they failed to insulate Karen from reality... now if only that would happen to bush.

[WinkyDink]

73. PR Campaign

That's all KH wants, a Potemkin Middle East.
Her focus will be the same throughout the ME now as in Iraq: Stifle the free press, (shoot to kill if need be); lie, lie, lie for the home press and our ignorant, childish, fairy-tale-believing citizenry(Conditions are improved....).

Her hubris is astounding. She no doubt expected to be not only respected, but revered as the emissary from The Great Liberator! I.e., Hughes apparently thought/thinks that Turks, Saudis, etc. watch Faux News!!

[truthisfreedom]

75. this UNDERSCORES the bush administrations complete disconnect with reality

they've created their own reality and they repeat their mantras to each other (spread democracy spread democracy war on terror war on terror) and that's created government by nonsense. it's a fucking religious cult. they're uninformed, uneducated, self-righteous thugs who were apparently home-schooled by corporate thieves.