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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-26-04 03:31 PM
Original message
Carlyle (Group) on course for historic China deal
http://business.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,13132-1375...

CARLYLE GROUP is close to completing the first leveraged buyout in mainland China by a foreign firm after emerging as front-runner in the race to buy the countrys biggest construction equipment maker.

<snip>

XCMG, Chinas biggest maker of construction equipment for roads, mines, buildings and utilities, is on course to make sales of nearly $3 billion this year.

Although Carlyle has made a handful of small joint investments in China, this would be the first time it takes control of a Chinese company.

Carlyle, which opened its first Chinese office in Shanghai in April, has earmarked about $1 billion of investment capital for Asia. Because about two thirds of a typical leveraged buyout is funded with debt, this gives Carlyle about $3 billion of buying power, most of which will target companies in China.

China is an increasingly attractive market for private equity firms because of its rapid growth. Its GDP has grown by about 9 per cent a year over the past 25 years and now stands at about $1.5 trillion.

...more...

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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-26-04 03:43 PM
Response to Original message
1. I wonder how the Chinese will take to that...
:shrug: (I really don't know. But how would Americans like it if a gigantic German conglomerate waltzed in and started buying out our big manufacturing companies.)
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Just Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-26-04 03:45 PM
Response to Original message
2. Fascinating. I hope some DUer is tracking the dollar trail.
It would be so, SO, "democratic" if any one person tracked this company.
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Eloriel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-26-04 03:45 PM
Response to Original message
3. You know, of all the things we've got to worry about
the Carlyle Group is, to me, a huge, under-appreciated threat.

I think they fucking want to own the world, and I think they just might be able to do it.

The thing that bothers (worries) me the worst, is that it's a PRIVATE company, plenty secretive except if they want info released, and it's answerable to NO ONE. Our SEC can't lay a hand n them -- their books are simply no one's business but the other investors. We don't even get to knwo what they own, unless they want to reveal it.

Something else that was underappreciated about Carlyle is the Enronesque scheme they pulled just before the war.

They'd bought United Defense, producers of the bulky and maybe anachronistic tank, and secured a nice big contract with the U.S. DoD (Army probably) for a gob of them. Carlyle's purchase of United was rather well-publicized -- it was around the time the Iraq War Resolution passed with all the war fever. Carlyle then took United public in December after the IWR, and of course, it was a VERY successful IPO. Great timing, right? Right.

But then Carlyle sold United -- and I don't remember exactly when (not all tht much later), but I am somehow totally persuaded that they knew what they were doing with their timing. Because ALSO around this time, Rumsfeld and Secty Army White (at the time) fought openly about this very tank which the Army seemed to love but Rumsfeld did not -- and White lost. He not only lost the contract (it was canceled), he lost his job.

I would LOVE to see who owned big amounts of that stock and what if any stock dumps happened before that contract was so publicly canceled. I'd also love to know just how much of a killing Poppy Bush's Carlyle Group (and its "private investors") made on the IPO and the subsequent war-fevered sale of United Defense.

Wouldn't you?
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-26-04 04:06 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Fascists-R-Us? Head of us-China Chamber of Commerce - Uncle Prescott Bush
Not very surprised here.

The Carlyle Group is a who's who of international fascists that have surrounded the Bush family doings for decades.
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Just Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-26-04 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Blood covers both the top and bottom of the human "chain",...
,...every time.

Greed and survival seem to be akin to the snake eating its tail symbolism.

The middle survives the longest *grin*.

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Thoth Donating Member (256 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-26-04 04:24 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. Now Carlyle is invested in China's economic growth...
Edited on Fri Nov-26-04 04:27 PM by Thoth
to keep that construction equipment hummin'. Hmm... so Bush Jr.'s China friendly policies will help Bush Sr. and co-conspirators with this deal. No wonder 'W' isn't concerned about out-sourcing and losing US jobs to other countries like China.

But when we eventually (the US) compete with China for oil in the mideast, I wonder which side Carlyle will back then? Probably both sides. If you believe in a "New World Order" a la Alex Jones, Carlyle certainly fits the bill of those aiming to profit from de-stablization around the world and they invest in both sides. Nasty bastards.
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Just Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-26-04 05:41 PM
Response to Reply #6
12. "Blowback", "karma", "divine justice",...
,...are delivered in the most interesting ways.

The "all powerful" always believe themselves in power of their destiny,...then, reality hammers them.

All I can say is,...even those of us at the "bottom of the power chain",...can watch and enjoy the arrogant fall, stumble and out and out PAY.
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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-27-04 01:52 AM
Response to Reply #12
17. Don't the little people usually benefit in spades after that?
I'm just asking. We get to pick up pieces, which amount to quite a bit for everyone.

Unless nukes are involved. :scared:
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genieroze Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-27-04 01:46 AM
Response to Reply #6
16. Alex Jones always warns about the Carlyle Group. eom
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Ima Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-26-04 05:27 PM
Response to Reply #3
9. Eloriel
"I would LOVE to see who owned big amounts of that stock and what if any stock dumps happened before that contract was so publicly canceled. I'd also love to know just how much of a killing Poppy Bush's Carlyle Group (and its "private investors") made on the IPO and the subsequent war-fevered sale of United Defense.

Wouldn't you?"



Why don't you start a thread in GD about Carlyle? We have some excellent 'diggers'.
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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-26-04 05:38 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. info on Carlyle/United Defense
general corporate info

just a snippet:

The Carlyle Group owns 49.5% of United Defense, whose directors include former government heavyweights Frank Carlucci (Defense) and John M. Shalikashvili (Joint Chiefs).

http://www.hoovers.com/united-defense-industries,-inc./...

info on ipo and profit to Carlyle

http://www.bailoutwatch.org/crusader.htm

excerpt:

One of the biggest projects that United Defense Industries (UDI) is counting on is the Crusader Artillery System. The system is a self-propelled 155mm howitzer with a resupply vehicle and was intended to be the fastest firing and most accurate field artillery piece ever, but has run into serious problems concerning its weight that seemed certain to lead to its demise. UDI also built the Bradley Fighting Vehicle and the two programs combined for 41 percent of UDI's sales in 2001.

<snip>

On Sept. 26 UDI signed a $665 million contract with the Army through April 2003 to complete the development phase of the Crusader. In the fiscal year 2002 defense appropriations bill that passed Congress Dec. 13 and the president signed in January, the Crusader received more than $487 million.

Now Carlyle and the Crusader face their toughest challenge. Recently, Secretary Rumsfeld announced that the program would be canceled. In a show of how difficult it can be to kill a defense project, the full House approved the $475 million proposed by the president for the Crusader for FY2003. The Senate Armed Services Committee also left the Crusader money in their authorization bill saying it would wait to hear from Secretary Rumsfeld before making a final decision.

Some defense analysts feel that even though the Crusader does not fit into plans for transforming the military, it placates some Pentagon officials who are resistant to change. Even if the project is canceled, UDI has already received $2 billion from the program and would receive more to shut it down.

<snip>

In late October Carlyle Group filed an initial public offering (IPO) for UDI. The IPO conveniently took place one day after Congress approved the defense appropriations bill and raised $237 million. Carlyle officials said they were looking for an exit strategy from ownership of UDI and some analysts said that the IPO was part of that strategy. In its Securities and Exchange Commission filing, UDI said 16 percent of its revenue in 2000 was from the Crusader.

...much more info at link...
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Mandate My Ass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-26-04 05:36 PM
Response to Reply #3
10. I remember that deal
I'll see if I can find my links but I do believe that was a giant pump and dump stock scheme. Rumsfeld went around initially saying they were going forward with the Crusader tank and when billions in investments came in, he suddenly reversed his position and cancelled it. Everybody who invested based on his public support of the project lost their shirts but someone in the know walked away with it all.
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cassiepriam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-26-04 04:28 PM
Response to Original message
7. The Carlyle Group just met its match.......
Should be fun.
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cosmicdot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-26-04 04:35 PM
Response to Original message
8. kick
I conjecture that Poppy and Greaseman Baker and associates set up the infrastructure for TCG, as well as its mirror group, The Blackstone Group, on government time ...

We need more transparency into private equity investment entities.

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Robert Oak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-26-04 08:49 PM
Response to Original message
13. I once was blind but now I see, sold down river for thee n/t
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bhikkhu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-27-04 12:30 AM
Response to Original message
14. Think Armored Bulldozers
and the market is looking bullish.

I remember Carlysle as a significant asset in the Bin Laden portfolio, quietly divested after 9/11.
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VegasWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-27-04 01:35 AM
Response to Original message
15. This will be really interesting to see how a communist country
fits into the Caryle Group's plans for world domination.
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