HOT!! Florida U.S. House Rep. says he has evidence of hacked voting.

[Carl Brennan]

going back two years!!! He calls in FBI.

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/1106-30.htm

Published on Saturday, November 6, 2004 by CommonDreams.org
Evidence Mounts That The Vote Was Hacked
by Thom Hartmann


When I spoke with Jeff Fisher this morning (Saturday, November 06, 2004), the Democratic candidate for the U.S. House of Representatives from Florida's 16th District said he was waiting for the FBI to show up. Fisher has evidence, he says, not only that the Florida election was hacked, but of who hacked it and how. And not just this year, he said, but that these same people had previously hacked the Democratic primary race in 2002 so that Jeb Bush would not have to run against Janet Reno, who presented a real threat to Jeb, but instead against Bill McBride, who Jeb beat.
"It was practice for a national effort," Fisher told me.


I tell you I've got a case of "secessionitis" that seems to be getting worse daily, but this gives me hope that maybe we can take the fascists to task on this voter fraud. This really looks promising when a politician is so definitive. I want to follow this and offer help in any way we can.
I want to get to Bev Harris and let her know about this very important development so she may be able to lend her expertise if she hasn't already.

Anybody have a pipeline to her? I'm sure she is flooded with e-mails etc. and may miss it.



((((Plus we should all pitch in and buy Mr. Fisher a set of full body armor. )))))


Let's talk about the process from here. Fisher has called in the FBI and will now be faced with all kinds of obstructions by the fascists, let's brainstorm on what those obstructions might be and how to overcome them.

This has got me psyched. :bounce:

[BillZBubb]

1. Who controls the FBI?

I for one am very confident that they will fully investigate! OK, not really.

[shraby]

3. Send this to everybody you can think of

as well as the media. The more the word is out, the more apt they will have to deal with it.

[Carl Brennan]

8. Damn good question and thanks.

I don't think the FBI is as monolithic as we might assume. The Intelligence Community has some real rogue warriors in it fighting the good fight as we have seen with this flood of people blowing the whistle on the Bush crimes.

If we keep a focus on this we may be able to force a credible investigation.

[tinrobot]

36. There are still liberals in government

I know a few very liberal lawyers in govt positions.

[indigolady]

55. Liberals, heck...

anybody with intelligence, and love of America. We want the truth.
The Bush people are not even good conservatives.

[Carl Brennan]

87. kick

[Hello_Kitty]

40. Many in the FBI are pissed at this administration

With their bungling of 9-11, ignoring warnings, and then blaming agents for it. I'm sure some of them would looooove to see BushCo go down in flames.

[s-cubed]

109. FBI hates *'s guts

The FBI hates his guts, & he hasn't yet "housecleaned" there.

[Cathi]

2. The people need to follow up on this....

and not waste time about it. The election will not be certified until December 13th when the delegates go to Washington. We need to press on for Democracy!

[sabbat hunter]

77. actually

its not certified till january 6th when the joint session of congress meets (remember the scene from fahrenheit 9/11 ?)

if we can get one senator (kerry?) to sign a document presented by the house, unlike what happened in 2000, the election cannot be made official.

david

[althecat]

4. This chap better stay out of small planes

[Carl Brennan]

12. Jeez I hope Fisher knows the kind of people he's dealing with.

:scared:

[Clovis Sangrail]

5. don't keep it secret

If this Jeff Fisher really has evidence, I really hope he starts to flood the net and everybody he can with copies of it.
Otherwise the men in the black cars are gonna show up and the evidence will be gone (possibly him as well).

Get as many copies of it out as possible.
Immediately.

If there's any digital information he should sign it with a certificate and blast it out.
Throw it out to the net and it'll get mirrored on a few hundred sites in pretty short order.

[yellowdawgdem]

47. yup

he should make sure he's given all the information to trustworthy people, just in case they go after him. I hope he's already thought of that, but ya never know. He should send copies, plus a video of himself giving testimony.

[splat]

6. But he's not the Rep; he lost 2-1 n/t

[Carl Brennan]

9. Got a source for that? If true it doesn't bode well

for the "non-partisan" element.

[splat]

15. source on fisher

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/palmbeach/sfl-pus16nov03,0,5374224.story?coll=sfla-news-palm

In Palm Beach County with 100 percent of the voting in, Republican Foley drew 30,136 votes, or 67.49 percent, vs. Fisher's 14,514 votes, or 32.5 percent. Republicans outnumber Democrats by about 32,000 in District 16, which stretches from the Wellington area north to Fort Pierce and west to Port Charlotte.

Fisher, 43, offered himself as a "liberal progressive constitutional Democrat," if one with a limited political résumé and even more limited funds. A Palm Beach County Democratic Executive Committee member who ran for the Wellington Village Council in 2002, Fisher said he raised no money for his congressional campaign, paying candidate fees by selling his own stocks.

[Carl Brennan]

18. Thanks for that.

Anything anybody has is good. I wanted some corroboration for the common dreams article.

[berry]

33. Thom Hartmann is a reliable source.

I'm not saying you have to trust me on this, but he's written a lot of articles and books, and has his own talk radio show. You can check him out easily. And, if you have doubts, just e-mail him or call in to his show (M-F 12n to 3pm, the link is up on the main page here at DU).

[Carl Brennan]

51. Kick

[Freddie Stubbs]

63. Lost by a landslide

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004//pages/results/states/FL/index.html

[grasswire]

7. he'd better send his evidence...

...overseas, somehow.

[Carl Brennan]

11. I've already sent this to my national representatives who know me and

who I trust.

I'm going to pump a copy to the Guardian.

[mountainvue]

10. This article is incredible.

Where are all of our god damn lawyers that are supposed to be helping this guy out?
I'm sending this story to the whores. It's worth a shot.

[Jo March]

102. I'll send it to the "whores" as well

Can't hurt. Might help. Especially the Guardian.

[lizzieforkerry]

13. kick

[pa28]

14. This is what we need.

If our elected leaders have the courage to compile evidence and talk publicly the media may not be able to sweep this under the rug. Anecdotal evidence from normal people will continue to be ignored.

[rodeodance]

16. i really have not heard anything of the media (tv)--has anyone???

[seemslikeadream]

17. Here's his website

http://www.jefffisherforcongress.com/

look at the voting problems at the bottom


Candidate Detail


Jeff Fisher
Candidate for U.S. House District 16
Democratic

Address:
12977 Meadowbreeze Dr Meadowbreeze Dr Wellington, Fl 33414
Campaign Phone:
561-889-2165 561-792-3521 561-333-0890 561-818-4431
Web Site:
www.JeffFisherforCongress.com
Email:
jefffisherforcongress@walkingwi...
Age:
43
Religion:
Jewish
Family:
Wife, Amy 39 married 18 yrs Daughter, Jamie 10 Son David 6
City/Town:
Wellington,Florida
Birthplace:
Endicott, New York
Education/Degrees:
A.S. Accountancy
Occupation:
Political Activist
Experience:
Worked on various political grass root campaigns, various mayoral races, U.S. and multi-state Senatorial races, several Gubernatorial races and seven (7) Presidential campaigns ranging in date from 1975 -2000. Political Activism Animal Rights (Feline, Canine, Bovine & Equine) Abused Women (Homeless & Domestic Abuse) Public Education ( New York,Massachusetts & Florida) ( National Education Program that will eliminate the FCAT) Epilepsy Foundation ( Boston) Civil Liberties (Election Protection) Peace Activist against the Iraq War 2002-03 Peace Activist against the Vietnam War 1969-72 President of Homeowner Association Haverhill, MA 1994-1996 First Wellington Code Compliance Board Wellington, Florida 1998-2000 Entered a three person non partisan Village Council race in Wellington two months prior to the Election in 2002 and received 12 % of the votes.
Endorsements:
Children's Rights Council (Washington D.C.) Bill McBride David Nelson Pending-Sen.Bob Graham,Congressman John Conyers and Howard Dean

more
http://www5.vgt2004.org/a-heraldtribune-public/candidate-detail.go?id=1283966

[Carl Brennan]

19. *** Dr. Blass is a whistlblower in the making***!

Rense.com has some credibility issues, but maybe somebody like Mike Malloy could look into this. I just e-mailed him and gave him the link to my topic here.

Here is what Fisher said:

This is unacceptable and, in my opinion, borders on treason," said Fisher, who was visibly upset that someone might help cover-up more election fraud in Florida. "Over the last few days I have been in direct contact with progressive investigative journalist Greg Palast of Gregpalast.com, with the information that was supposed to be delivered to Greg Palast," he added. "But the sender was told by Dr. Blass not to send it. I then informed Greg's senior researcher, Mr. Oliver, about this critical development. I have had partial information in my possession for the past three months. Unfortunately, Dr. Blass has prevented me from releasing it to the general public."

Fisher stated that Dr. Blass claimed his ex-wife had their son falsely imprisoned in a facility called Growing Together, located in Lake Worth, Florida. "Dr. Blass implored me for help to get his son released, which I was able to do without any thoughts of compensation whatsoever," Fisher said. "Then, during the next few months, Dr. Blass began telling me of this vital vote tampering information. Together, we developed a plan to get this information to John Kerry, and Dr. Blass asked me to contact Mr. Kerry through Charles Figley, a campaign liaison."

According to Fisher, those failed efforts influenced Dr. Blass to seek assistance from Klock.

"Dr. Blass is obstructing justice by withholding vital vote tampering information. I would greatly appreciate the help of the American Civil Liberty Union or a competent vote fraud investigator to address a serious and potentially ongoing voting problem in Florida..

Mr. Fisher can be contacted at [email protected].

[Carl Brennan]

20. Fisher has been onto this for some time. We need to

get this out into the public slipstream fast.

[Carolab]

25. Wait! He's a DEAN candidate

Dean endorsed him--does that mean that DFA is (possibly) involved in helping with this?

[Carl Brennan]

39. Do you have a source on this? I'd like to know

more.

Thanks

[madfloridian]

48. He's not listed at DFA Dean Dozen.

He does sound like crazy Deaniac....crazy like a fox.

[TahitiNut]

35. Ages 8 through 11, he was a "Peace Activist against the Vietnam War"

That's more than a bit strange for a candidate's resume. :eyes:

[mzmolly]

21. BLAST THIS SHIT!

:hi:

[Carl Brennan]

22. Oh hell.....

For some of you who have been at DU awhile you may have seen the topics on the child abuse and the links to the Repugs.

Please see the link below. It looks like Fisher is onto his opponents sick shit

This needs to be reported to local authorities where that house for kids is. :mad: :mad:



http://www.walkingwithfisher.com/indexpage1page1.htm>

If you value children, then sign the Petition above. David Lopez Blass spent his birthday on Monday where twenty-four children are being abused verbally, physically, mentally and sexually. Growing Together has been doing this under the protection of HRS and now DCF over the past 15 years. DCF and Steve Walsh are now conducting a thorough investigation and compiling facts that will lead to their license being revoked.

David's birthday was this week. Why should any child in America be forced to spend their birthday in bondage? That is a national concern. Mark Foley says its not. Maybe when Mark Foley adopts a family he will understand. Yes Mark I believe anyone can adopt a child and love them, including you. HAPPY BIRTHDAY DAVID!
To all the Davids in this nation, I will fight and defend your rights. My opponent, Congressman Mark Foley claims he is a champion of children. It took him 121 days to call Dr. Blass and offer his help.
Mark Foley is a Champion of Children NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mark Foley has the Sun-Sentinel supporting his lies regarding children.

I am asking everyone to call and email the Sun-Sentinel and tell them that Mark Foley is no champion of Children's Rights.

Email Kingley Guy who decided Foley is better than Fisher and lodge your complaint. Here is the email link. Foley is no Champion of Children's Rights <mailto:[email protected]>

Would you want your child, grandchild, niece, nephew or just one of your neighbors children who might live in the West Palm Beach area to be subjected to this kind of inhumane activity?

The Blass family wants the American people to know that there are people in political positions that do help children. Congressman Shaw (R) of Florida has been helping. Congressman Kucinich (D) of Ohio and his staff have helped. Maxwell Reade (Father of Affirmative Action) of the University of Michigan and Congressman Conyers (D) of Michigan have helped. Ken Eggleston (D) and State Representative Mary Brandenburg (D) of Palm Beach County has helped. Thank you.

David Blass's father, brothers and family are asking again the people who claim they are champions of children to help. Each of the following people have been asked for assistance and each has turned down helping an innocent child in a direct manner or through a staff member. They are:
Congressman Mark Foley , Mayor Lois Frankel, Mayor Rodney Romano, County Commissioner Burt Aaronson,State Senator Dave Aronberg. Thank you Congressman Robert Wexler for having some of your staff members help in freeing my son.

The Blass family is asking each of them to distance themselves from Rick Bradshaw who had the audacity of not protecting Palm Beach County's children by trying to have Jeff Fisher stop the legal proceedings against Growing Together. Mr Bradshaw has discriminated against African Americans, Arab Americans and has given support to Anti-Semetic organizations (Palm Beach Atlantic). The Blass family will forgive each of you if you help free David and dissociate yourselves from Mel Sembler, Growing Together and Rick Bradshaw. As the first step in that direction please sign our petition to Governor Bush immediately.

The Blass family and the people of Poland and Polish Americans want to thank Mr. Fisher for being the champion of children. Many people have taken notice of his heroic and humanitarian efforts for our David and the other children who are in bondage in Growing Together. Elseware on Mr. Fishers web site you will find correspondence with Dr. Michal Kleiber <Blass/blasspoland.htm>, Minister-Chairman of the State Committee for Scientific Research of Poland who is working with us and the U.S. Ambassador to Poland to free David who is also entitled to his full rights as a Polish American.

This gruesome story is being ignored by the Palm Beach Post. On October 12, 2004, George Bennett contacted Dr. Blass and was more concerned about polling numbers than the fact that child abuse was happening only few miles from the Palm Beach Post West Palm Beach office.

[Carolab]

31. Mel Semler (Straight)

http://thestraights.com/news/#gt-rape

Growing Togetehr is a "faith-based" program owned by the Semlers. For those who don't already know: Mel and Betty Semler ran the myriad Straight foundations, in multiple states, and have been sued over/involved in multiple child abuse cases for over a decade.

[seemslikeadream]

34. theStraights at a glance:

Protesters picket Florida Holocaust Museum Awards Banquet

http://thestraights.com/pickets/fl-holo-011704/fl-holo-report.htm

David Lopez Blass released from Straight-descendent Growing Together, Oct 29 Heat from John Kerry and Florida Democrat candiate Jeff Fisher helped secure the release of David Blass. link aA new site shed's light on Growing Together. link There is a petition out to grant full Constitutional rights to David Blass and to all clients at Growing Together. petition
http://thestraights.com/index.htm

It is worth the pain giving a glance to its new friend, Sembler ambassador. His Excellency Melvin Floyd Sembler, beyond to being "extraordinary and plenipotentiary Ambassador in Italy", is also a "distinguished citizen" of the Scout, has had a medal from the National Conference of the Christians and of the Hebrew, it has had the Humanitarian Prize of the center Hebrew Golda Meir/Kent, but above all he is ex-president of the International Council of the Centers Trades them.

In fact, Sembler is not sure a diplomats of profession. For the precision, he is a former-vendor of feminine underwear, become one of the main constructors of centers trades them of the United States.
http://thestraights.com/articles/sembler-italian-kelebekler.htm


They run very close to really performing psychic murder. Marge Robertson, executive director of the Cincinnati Chapter of the ACLU, speaking of Straight, Inc., from Cincinnati Post

http://thestraights.com/articles/melsembler-bio.htm

[Carl Brennan]

38. Ohh,, sheeeeet, its Sunday fackin mornin' for Hayzooz sakes!!!

All I wanted was an easy cup of coffee and something less traumatic. :bounce:

But not really. great post :hi:

[seemslikeadream]

41. Can I warm up that coffee for ya Carl?

[Carl Brennan]

59. What's so weird is there are alot of Repug gays

Google "Jeff+Christie" aka Rush Limbaugh

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=807561


Then there are the numerous accounts of conservatives, clergy etc. who abuse children.

Here is a story about Tony Blair covering up a sex ring:


Blair defending paedophile ring http://www.propagandamatrix.com/blair_protection.html
The controversy is certain to topple the Blair government, which has already issued a D-Notice to gag the press from revealing the names of known paedophiles within the British executive, including at least two senior ministers; and the case highlights the government's antipathy toward the Sunday Herald and its brand of independent journalism that has, among other things, exposed the role played by the domestic security agency, MI5, in helping the IRA to carry out terrorist atrocities.

[Carl Brennan]

103. Semler may be linked to the recent CyberNET bust.

[Carl Brennan]

105. HOTTTT!!!! Sembler and Blass linked to FBI's Cybernet bust.

Sounds like Fisher is the real deal!!


That little difference in spelling for Semler/Sembler does frustrate a google search.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=61397&mesg_id=61397


I was at first looking at PMing this for private use, but I think its time the public see this.
Interestingly enough, Dr. Piotr Blass is not only significant and real, he has alot of resume background in Michigan state, and otherwise, is connected to a very interesting corporation known as CyberNET Venturs Inc.(which manages all of Cybernets divisions...)
In the allegations report, a certain vendor described that such a network company was financing the operation through Mel Sembler and a few other bad eggs connected to the head of the game map. Another company was described as giving source to certain code.....Turns out CyberN is indeed an open source code distributor to several organizations, ultimately not even limited to voting companies. Also turns out an employee named Guitterez works(or had worked) there and created actual databases for elections across the USA and easily the globe, that are certainly not MS Access.
<http://engrm.com/personnel/gutierrez-alan/experiential.html>

[BQueen]

23. Possible whistleblower in Ohio

http://www.theeveningleader.com/articles/2004/11/06/news/news.01.txt
Saturday, November 6, 2004
Board awaits state followup
By ERIN MILLER

WAPAKONETA -- Auglaize County Board of Election members say they have not heard any more from the state regarding a possible investigation after receiving notice of being placed on administrative oversight last week.

***

In a letter dated Oct. 21, Ken Nuss, former deputy director of the Auglaize County Board of Elections, claimed that Joe McGinnis, a former employee of Election Systems and Software (ES&S), the company that provides the voting system in Auglaize County, was on the main computer that is used to create the ballot and compile election results, which would go against election protocol. Nuss claimed in the letter that McGinnis was allowed to use the computer the weekend of Oct. 16.

Nuss, who resigned from his job Oct. 21 after being suspended for a day, was responsible for overseeing the computerized programming of election software, according to his job description. His resignation is effective Nov. 11.
(more)

Some details of other Auglaize Co. oddities in this thread. Local focus was on DELAY OF INVESTIGATION by Blackwell to "count" the votes.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=1333866&mesg_id=1336042

[cthrumatrix]

52. the media has a "gag rule in effect".... it's obvious

[Carl Brennan]

53. Thanks for this. This is exactly what I wanted to do with this topic.

As the fraud story unfolds these people will be important as witnesses. Now Bev Harris is reporting that her contacts in the TV media are being told to zip their lips on voter fraud.

[Chelsea Patriot]

24. KICK!!!!!!

[Copperred]

26. EOS

If he has REAL HARD EVIDENCE this is not a ego moment.. RELEASE IT ONLINE>>>>AND LET THE AMERICAN PEOPLE GO TO WORK.


EOS

[GoblinToe]

27. KICK!!

KICK THIS INTO HIGH GEAR!!

[George_S]

28. Why are most pushing this new members?

Just curious.

[seemslikeadream]

29. Why would you say that? It's not true.

[Democat]

37. Here we go again?

Anything is possible, but some things are more possible than others.

[BernieBear]

30. This Means Dems Have Been Waiting Two Years to Catch

them in the act.

Oh baby.... Kerry and Company know exactly what is going down... They haven't floated off down the river at all. They are on Mission Control ready to pop this Fascist puppy. They have known about the how, why, where of the hacking and they were WAITING for it to happen again.

People are going to jail on this one...... Wheeeeee Eeeee

BushCo may be going down.....

BB

[BernieBear]

32. I got a little excited before reading entire thread! Sorry [:-(]

[sadiesworld]

42. .

[goclark]

43. Kick kick kick

[Kellis]

44. Kick

:hi:

:kick:

[savetheuniverse]

91. NEWS FLASH MSNBC

reporting on internet battle right now
saying conservatives won but there is a "liberal elite" contesting

[savetheuniverse]

92. diversion? or st else

guy just set himself on fire in front of the WH

for real

ss proceding w caution bf allowing cameras back on wh lawn

msnbc

[marlakay]

45. They need to be caught!

One of my new bosses is from India and a genius guy in computers. I went to his home to meet his wife the other day at lunch and we started talking about the election. Since he is new here he couldn't vote but when I asked about hacking into the programs he said it could be done. He set up all the programs for our company.

It started me thinking but I was worried they would get away with it. I just wonder with the animals in charge who will there be to stand for our side???

[harpo]

46. SWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEET!!!

[fizzana]

49. I have a major problem with the Hartman article

The four Florida counties he mentions in the article (Baker, Dixie, Holmes and Franklin) are all northern, rural, largely white conservative counties. The only reason the majority of voters are registered Democrats is because of the remnants of the old Dixiecrat days.

These four counties have all voted Republican by a considerable majority for the past 20 years with no exceptions.

Hartman did not do his homework on this. All he had to do was check back on previous elections and he would have seen roughly the same percentages going back at least to 1988 if not earlier.

If this election was hacked so were the last 5 or 6 Presidential elections in these four counties.

If this is the major premise of the article then it has little credibility. I'm not saying conclusively that there was no fraud in Florida but it wasn't in those 4 counties.

Flame me if you have to but presenting flimsy evidence like this only makes it almost impossible to make the case for real fraud if there was fraud.

[kerry2win]

50. bush did better in those counties

of the 52 op/scan counties in 2004 he won by a total of 504,000 but hats 250,000 or so better than he did in those same counties in 2000 . just read a post from batchdem that amy have explained the difference

[seemslikeadream]

54. KICK

[On the Road]

56. Here's a Chart Based on Fisher Actual vs Expected Data

Sorry for the size -- I'm new to this and can't seem to reduce it. But seeing it visually is more striking.

[darthdemocrat]

88. just curious

What is "expected" turnout?

Is it based on 2000 turnout by party? Is it comparative as a proportion of the electorate?

By my math there has been an amazing turnout (in terms of counted votes vs. registered voters) for the GOP compared to 2000. Like an increase from 66% to about 80%. Democrats increased turnout from 63% to 66%. Curiously, Independent turnout actually decreased.

My calculations are unfortunately dependent on the exit polls. If their percentages of party affiliation and presidential vote (by party aff.) are actually representative then the only valid explanation is that Democrats got blown away on turnout and/or voted but did not have their votes counted.

This is also based on the "midnight special" exit polls that may have been doctored. Using earlier ones, the Repugs still just flat out got way more votes tabulated per registered voter.

[Greylyn58]

57. Big Kick

:kick:

[Chelsea Patriot]

58. Keep KICKING!!!!!!!!!

[cthrumatrix]

60. message to the media.... we won't forget... so do your damn jobs

[nodehopper]

61. that's awesome...except he is a candidate, not a rep. but still.

[bearfan454]

62. kick

for our Democracy !

[Nicholas_J]

64. Well as he was talking about impeaching Bush

Representatives John Conyers as wellas Jerrold Nadler and Robert Wexler are calling for a General Accounting Office investigation of the electronic voting machines in the 2004 elections

Blackboxvoting.org--"--has filed Freedom of Information Act requests to obtain internal computer logs and other documents from 3,000 counties and localities, in an attempt to audit the election.

I think that in the next two years we may see many demands for investigations, and it may be that the Kerry campaign is co-ordinating some of this behind the scene, but cannot afford the attacks that will be made if this is made a public issue. There is considerable momentum building for an investigation into the numerous, and growing revelations of widespread voting error, most of which seems to have favored Bush.

[Soth]

65. Boot to the head!!!

er...I mean...kick.

Hope this guy does have evidence, though. This could finally reveal some of those bastardly vote-hackers.

[seemslikeadream]

66. Randi Rhodes is talking about Fisher now

about how Jeb didn't want to run against Reno so the vote was hacked.
She's sticking up for Fisher, she knows him.

[BamaBecky]

67. What did Randi say?

About Jeff Fisher in Florida - any more revalations about that?

[Carl Brennan]

68. I heard the tail end of that. Man I hope this

this gets into the media slipstream, but Fisher may have been given "an offer he couldn'e refuse". He has a wife and kids.

Just some thoughts. I'm not claiming he was threatened, but that could be why his lying low right now.

He does say that he has evidence of hacking in 2002 as well.

Is there anyway to get him and his loved ones into a witness protection program?

[ftlaudguy]

70. Well, the witness protection

program stops at the FBI. Anyone above that, could get the info, if they wanted (Bush, Rove, et al) so that really wouldn't help them out too much.

This is an incredible story that Fisher presents. Juveniles in FL detention centers being taught programming and hacking (it's also incredible, in and of itself, that juveniles in FL detention centers are learning period, rather than raping other inmates, being raped/beaten by gaurds, etc...but I digress).

I hope there is some real concrete proof of this because it will otherwise relegate him to the "tin foil" crowd and the media will mock and drop this but quick...

[Carl Brennan]

71. Thanks and welcome to DU

:toast:

My understanding is that anyone who has hard evidence of a crime as Fisher claims he has then they are eligible for the program. But I may be wrong. I'm not to sure what you mean by "The witness protection progam stops at the FBI". Did you mean getting information on it?

[ftlaudguy]

72. To Clarify

Thanks for the welcome. No, just that the idea of witness protection keeping he and family safe from the repukes is wildly optimistic....they can find out anything they want from a government program. It's hard enough to protect folks from the "illegal" mob....with the WASP mob in the WH me thinks it would be impossible.

[Carl Brennan]

74. Yea, I was thinking the same thing, but if he is "officially" in a witness

protection program it makes him a little safer IMHO.

Good thinking on this.

[Carl Brennan]

89. Kick for recent interest

[Carolab]

69. This has been posted for days now

There has been nothing new reported on it yet.

[genieroze]

73. we made the news, say we are nuts

To bad abc said we are nuts

WASHINGTON, Nov. 9, 2004 -- There were minor voting irregularities on Election Day — long lines, voting machine breakdowns, shortages of provisional ballots — but some people are now leveling charges of voter fraud.

Doug Chapin, a nonpartisan election analyst, finds the claims to be baseless. "There were no problems that would lead me to believe that there were stolen elections or widespread fraud," he said.

"There was no overwhelming reason to cast doubt on the outcome of this election," seconded Democratic strategist Donna Brazile, the campaign manager for Al Gore's 2000 campaign. "George Bush got more votes this time."

Nevertheless, many people have devised various theories, including stories of voters in largely Democratic counties in Florida whose votes were changed for Bush, phantom voters in Ohio and exit polls showing John Kerry in the lead that were truer than the final tally. Off the record, many Democratic strategists dismiss such allegations, but they also know such resentment can be channeled for political use in the future.

Those Florida Democrats Who Mysteriously Voted for Bush

Based at least in part on these conspiracy theories, three Democratic congressmen have written a letter to the U.S. Government Accountability Office.

"We are requesting an investigation into all the allegations, of irregularities with respect to the electronic and other voting machines so that people can have confidence in the result of this election, and so that any weaknesses are changed before the next election," said Rep. Jerrold Nadler, D-N.Y.


http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/story?id=239735&page=1

[Carl Brennan]

75. Just look how they use "conpiracy theory"

Based at least in part on these conspiracy theories, three Democratic congressmen have written a letter to the U.S. Government Accountability Office.

But heck, I'd call this a positive in that it is a mainstream source.

[seemslikeadream]

76. There's six congressmen now Carl

John Conyers
Jerald Nadler
Robert Wexler
Robert Scott
Melvin Watt
Rush Holt

http://www.house.gov/judiciary_democrats/gaoinvestvote2004ltr11804.pdf

:hi:

[Carl Brennan]

79. Wexler and Conyers are mentioned in Fisher authored piece above.

They must know something hard.

[savetheuniverse]

93. diversifying use of conspiracy

they're also now using "conspiracy" w re other things, not just the F story
saw it about 15 minutes ago ...

[ChiciB1]

78. THIS IS TRUE!!

I've had updates at my Fl-Dem Groups at Yahoo for some time now! He IS keeping the pressure on about this!!

I live in Florida and Jeff Fisher has been very outspoken about this. We need to keep on fighting. I'm a little upset with what Clinton has been saying because he wants us to quit denying the Truth about our Party. That we need to be more "centrist!" But I'm a Democrat who still wants to show the REPUKES, they don't own US!

Hold your head high, and SCREAM at the top of your lungs!

[seemslikeadream]

80. Hi ChiciB1

do you know about this Mel Semler guy? I used to live near Sarasota, quite the place.

[ChiciB1]

81. NO I DON'T... BUT

I know about "Cruella!" Katherine Harris. I actually only live in Sarasota COUNTY, but my town is Nokomis... further south, basically Venice!

I campaigned my heart out for the Dems and it was widely speculated that SHE was going DOWN. But it didn't happen. It's not much fun living in a County that is TOTALLY controlled by REPUKES!! We were getting such GOOD response as Democrats and I felt so optimistic for the first time in a very long time.

The Jeff Fisher thing is BIG around here, but it's on Yahoo at lot too! Just finished watching Keith again, talking to J. Alter. He thinks MORE news people will be picking up on the story in the coming days. But for me, I'm totally fed up with the REPUKES, especially given the fact that I'm surrounded by them! I still have my bumper stickers on my car and won't replace them until I get my new ones, that are sort of "in your face!"

[Carl Brennan]

82. Thanks for this. It's good to have someone on the ground in the area.

We've got two things going on: the boys school and Fishers' claims on vote hacking. Child abuse can be reported to the police and or Child Protective Services. You would remain anonymous if you wanted to.

We could bust this thing wide open.

[Lucypher]

83. We should be contacting...

the print media, which is a good place to start. The basic liberal ones are better. The New York Times, The Washington Post, The Chicago Tribune. They have outstanding investigative reporters.

[Norquist Nemesis]

84. Here's who I would contact first...FITZGERALD

U. S. Department of Justice
United States Attorney
Northern District of Illinois
Patrick J. Fitzgerald Federal Building
United States Attorney
219 South Dearborn Street, Fifth Floor
Chicago, Illinois 60604
[phone]

He's running the Plame investigation.

[Carl Brennan]

85. Thanks. I'm working on that, but I think Fisher is in contact with

the 6 Congressional members. I might get an e-mail to Fitzgerald.

[bullimiami]

86. damn this is getting older by the minute

thom hartmann said yesterday on democracy now that he has been following this and nothing so far. no fbi. nada.

[Carl Brennan]

90. Jeff Fisher's letter to Ralph Nader.

Letter to Nader from Fisher:
http://www.jefffisherforcongress.com/Campaign2006/indexletterRalphNader.htm

Ralph Nader and Al Sharpton came to me and offered their selfless assistance in protecting every American's right to have a fair election. Mr. Nader is the patriot who has decided that partisan loyalty is unacceptable in situations such as rigged election. Rev. Al Sharpton was the man who contacted Mr. Nader and asked him to join forces with the Democrats, Greens and Independents to ensure that Democracy is restored in our nation before the Electoral College meets.

I voted for and supported John Kerry, however he is surrounded by people who have kept him from receiving the message that he, as well as every voter in America, was cheated. I have been in contact with the Democratic National Committee's legal staff since November 12th. Why are they delaying to contact Senator Kerry regarding the information that would change the outcome of the November 2, 2004 election?

Americans are SCREAMING for John Kerry to report to duty!

To John Kerry: the nation and the Constitution are sinking fast! Save the ship (United States), its crew (American citizens) and its manifest (the U.S. Constitution) before its to late!!

To Ralph Nader,
Re: xxxxxx – (the Sender) see rense.com article
“Cover-Up of 2000 and 2004 Florida Vote Continues”
(Press release VoteFraud.org, and Blackboxvoting.org) 11-1-04
For more statistical info, visit http://www.jefffisherforcongress.com and click on the link labeled “Surprising Florida Presidential Election Results”. The data reveals that the election results are inverted/cross-party voting.
On July 27, 2004 xxxxxx showed me an email dating from 1999 which stated that a successful run of posting felons’ names to electronic voting went without any problem and leaving no audit trail. Mr. xxxxx also showed me information that it was done during the 2002 Florida Gubernatorial Democratic Primary as well. (Visit http://www.jefffisherforcongress.com and click on link labeled “Thank you Michael Moore from Jeff Fisher and Thom Hartmann”). He then told me that due to this success and the improvement of programming that it would probably be used in the General Election on November 2, 2004. This was relayed to me on July 27, 2004 in the mid afternoon in a parking lot leading from a McDonald’s to the local county library in the Kendall area of Dade County. He also mentioned to me that he was living in fear. He believed his family might be killed if they found out that he gave this information to anyone. I tried to get this information to John Kerry on many occasions through Charles Figley. All attempts were fruitless.
Additional information:
Regarding conversation with xxxxxxx

[ElementaryPenguin]

99. Wow!

Lots of things about this "crazy" starting to sound very plausible to me! You could even have adult GOP operatives actually doing the hacking - then blame these no-good delinquents if the operation was ever uncovered!

[imenja]

94. I find the Janet Reno allegation absurd.

The idea that Janet Reno lost the Democratic primary for governor because of hacking is absurd. Everyone I know voted for McBride. Janet Reno was the most hated member of the Clinton administration, and no more so that in South Florida. That she thought she could win the governor's house was absurd. All the good democrats backed out because she was in the race. I'm still angry at her about it. It struck me as tremendously selfish and short-sighted on her part to run, because it cleared out the field of contenders, was one factor in Jeb's winning re-election. Of course, McBride turned out to be a very poor candidate. During the debates he was so bad I had to turn off the television set. If I had kept watching I might not have been able to bring myself to vote for him.

[bullimiami]

104. I dont know where in FL you live but

Everyone I know voted for Reno. I live in Dade, We all thought McBride was a dullard, bumbler. He never even put up a decent fight.

I thought at the time that both the repub and the dem leadership in florida didnt want Reno because she was too independent.

I dont find the allegation all that absurd.

[savetheuniverse]

95. kick

[savetheuniverse]

96. kick but the URL IS GONE FROM THE ORIGINAL POST>>>>>

[savetheuniverse]

97. Kick was the URL deleted accidentally? or inentionally

[Carl Brennan]

100. The commondreams link still works for me. Is that what

your question was about?

[JewishAmerican]

98. What shall you expect?

Actually few pools and electoralvotes.com showed that Kerry had a lead in Florida by as much as 4%. Republicans can't win fair! They will cheat! Unless the system is fixed, Republicans will probably steal 2008!

[Carl Brennan]

101. Jeb Bush linked to Straight school as advisor.

As many of you know a Congressman from Florida has alleged that kids in a drug rehab program in Florida "hacked the vote."

Turns out that Jeb Bush is an advisor at said school.



As of October 11, 2001 Jeb Bush, the governor of Florida and brother to the President of the United States, is on the Advisory Board for Straight which now calls itself the DFAF (Drug Free America Foundation, Inc.) And so is his wife Columba! James W. Holton, Commissioner of the Florida Transportation Commission, is on the board of directors of the DFAF. It should come as no surprise to see Jeb Bush tied to DFAF, after all Betty Sembler was his finance cochairman. And then there is SAFE. Straight-Orlando closed on August 14, 1992. On that very day Michael Scaletta Straight - Orlando's executive director (taking Loretta Parish, Straight - Orlando's marketing director, with him) opened SAFE, Inc. out of the same facility Straight had used. In the morning the kids had been in Straight; after lunch they were in SAFE. In late 2000 TV station WAMI from Miami, Florida did a two-day exposition on SAFE. Because Governor Jeb Bush had previously visited SAFE he had been contacted while the segment was being produced to get his thoughts of SAFE. Even though he had been told that the segment was going to be controversial, Jeb Bush sent the station this letter of endorsement of SAFE! Even without Jeb and Columba, the list of names on Straight's Advisory Board is nothing short of extraordinary!. Here they are:


http://www.thestraights.com/news/index.htm#jeb-dfaf


http://www.thesmokinggun.com/mugshots/nbushmug1.html
http://www.rotten.com/library/bio/black-sheep/noelle-bu... /

[New Earth]

106. i think that should be a thread in itself

unless i'm understanding wrong, that sounds pretty damn important, i think it should be given it's own thread so it doesn't get lost in this one.

[Carl Brennan]

107. PLease look at posts 31 and 22 and 105 above. Fisher is the real deal

We have a link between Blass and Sembler/Semler and the FBI's Cybernet bust yesterday.

Now how is the Straight School (such irony) working with Cybernet? Any ideas.




http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=61397&mesg_id=61397


I was at first looking at PMing this for private use, but I think its time the public see this.
Interestingly enough, Dr. Piotr Blass is not only significant and real, he has alot of resume background in Michigan state, and otherwise, is connected to a very interesting corporation known as CyberNET Venturs Inc.(which manages all of Cybernets divisions...)
In the allegations report, a certain vendor described that such a network company was financing the operation through Mel Sembler and a few other bad eggs connected to the head of the game map. Another company was described as giving source to certain code.....Turns out CyberN is indeed an open source code distributor to several organizations, ultimately not even limited to voting companies. Also turns out an employee named Guitterez works(or had worked) there and created actual databases for elections across the USA and easily the globe, that are certainly not MS Access.
<http://engrm.com/personnel/gutierrez-alan/experiential.html>



Reply #22
<http://www.walkingwithfisher.com/indexpage1page1.htm> >

If you value children, then sign the Petition above. David Lopez Blass spent his birthday on Monday where twenty-four children are being abused verbally, physically, mentally and sexually. Growing Together has been doing this under the protection of HRS and now DCF over the past 15 years. DCF and Steve Walsh are now conducting a thorough investigation and compiling facts that will lead to their license being revoked.

Then Carolab's response #31:
http://thestraights.com/news/#gt-rape <http://thestraights.com/news/> Growing Together is a "faith-based" program owned by the Semlers. For those who don't already know: Mel and Betty Semler ran the myriad Straight foundations, in multiple states, and have been sued over/involved in multiple child abuse cases for over a decade.

[seemslikeadream]

108. Cybernet is missing all those computers

they supposedly bought with the money they borrowed.

I believe there is a Cybernet connection to Boeing.


Should check to see if they got Homeland Security money.

Is there a possible connection to Comcast? I have my reasons

[dmac]

110. This is a great link BUT

Keith Olbermann has all but discredited Fisher as legit. Unfortunately, he (Fisher) boasts a connection to Nadar, that has been denied by Nadar, et. al, and therefore K.O. questions the authenticity of anything he says - plus he said, "he whispers a lot" but implies that the whispers do not add up to much.

I am very interested in what anyone else thinks about this because when I first read about this last week, I was stunned and bought in, hook, line, and sinker - and was very disturbed by what I had read. After Olbermann's comment though, the jury is out.

[Carl Brennan]

111. Question for sure, but don't discount. There could be some

serious manipulation going on here. fterall you can bet that anybody with hard evidence of fraud is going to be a serious threat to the BFEE. I'm leaving this line to Fisher open. But then I also know alot about the child abuse/sex rings that Repugs are involved in and the Straight School info is totally believable.