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Reply #88: No one said anything about surrendering. [View All]

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du_da Donating Member (239 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #77
88. No one said anything about surrendering.
It does however obligate us to come to reality about our situation. We simply don't have the numbers and if we can't convince others either the centrists or the right to help us then we can't get anything done. That means we have to be careful about how we deal with these people. We can't be approaching them with insults and accusations unless we want to not be taken seriously. We also have to realize where the limitations of what we can get done are because of the current situation and work within those confines and push our efforts to educating the people in preparation to better prepare the environment in the future. However, that education again means we have to be aware of the methods we use to communicate.

If we focus on the idealists at the expense of the centrists we loose, there aren't enough of them yet. We have to build up the idealists ranks first. It worked in 2008 purely because of the disgust toward Bush. Sorry to use the term again, but we don't get that luxury again. So what are we going to rely upon the economy improving? We can only rely on that if the private sector starts creating jobs because the republicans aren't going to let the government do it, and we have been entirely incapable of convincing the private sector to start hiring because we have managed to convince them we are out to get them. Now they are too scared of what might happen down the road if they start hiring again. Method is important in politics because people have memories.

You say those programs are sacred well how sacred do you think they are going to be if we loose control of the Senate and the White House again? There are no sacred cows in politics. We don't have to like it but we have to accept the reality of the situation and work within its confines to improve our own position. Now if you think there is a way to press to the left without loosing even more ground then we are all listening, but I don't see that path available until we get out there and build up the ranks. We have to start convincing others to join us. Until then we are in full stop the leaking ship mode. Which wouldn't be so bad but we are our own worst enemy when it comes to convincing others of anything because our methods tend to turn them off before we even get started. If we can't fix that then all the leaning left in the world isn't going to save those who need us most.
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  -If Obama DOES cut Head Start and community block grant funding Ken Burch  Feb-11-11 04:30 AM   #0 
  - don't kid yourself; he'll still call himself a democrat  cali   Feb-11-11 04:35 AM   #1 
  - Didn't intended to minimize the LIHEAP cuts.  Ken Burch   Feb-11-11 04:38 AM   #2 
  - In today's political climate  du_da   Feb-11-11 04:48 AM   #3 
  - the people have spoken? Really? Got any polls that show that the majority  cali   Feb-11-11 04:55 AM   #4 
  - We don't have the luxury  du_da   Feb-11-11 05:12 AM   #5 
  - garbage. doing the wrong thing is never right, no matter how  cali   Feb-11-11 06:28 AM   #6 
  - Fair enough  du_da   Feb-11-11 09:12 AM   #8 
  - The people were most certainly sold on no tax cuts for the rich w/ tax cuts  stillwaiting   Feb-11-11 06:38 AM   #7 
  - Not during the last election cycle they weren't.  du_da   Feb-11-11 09:25 AM   #10 
     - Political reality is not all that popular on this board - nt  badtoworse   Feb-11-11 02:05 PM   #80 
  - How easily you throw around the word "luxury: when you KNOW this equates to DEATH.  bobbolink   Feb-11-11 12:46 PM   #51 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Feb-11-11 01:32 PM   #72 
  - While I completely agree with you, can you iimagine how painful it is for someone like me  bobbolink   Feb-11-11 01:37 PM   #73 
     - I know it is, and I'm sorry if I added to your pain.  Ken Burch   Feb-11-11 01:44 PM   #75 
  - Do you think  du_da   Feb-11-11 01:48 PM   #76 
     - The 2010 election doesn't OBLIGATE us to surrender  Ken Burch   Feb-11-11 01:54 PM   #77 
     - No one said anything about surrendering.  du_da   Feb-11-11 04:40 PM   #88 
        - That last part MIGHt be a valid analysis  Ken Burch   Feb-11-11 09:47 PM   #105 
     - So, you insist that throwing poor people under the bus is going to get you the results you want.  bobbolink   Feb-11-11 04:28 PM   #87 
        - No one said  du_da   Feb-11-11 04:43 PM   #89 
           - How delightful that you can be so calm about the deaths of human beings.  bobbolink   Feb-11-11 08:56 PM   #104 
           - Accepting cuts CAN'T improve our situation.  Ken Burch   Feb-11-11 09:48 PM   #106 
              - That depends  du_da   Feb-12-11 12:11 AM   #111 
                 - Being "effective" in cutting makes you a Republican.  Ken Burch   Feb-12-11 12:24 AM   #112 
  - you this a fucking luxury???? Let me guess, you aren't poor?!  fascisthunter   Feb-11-11 12:51 PM   #55 
     - Maybe you should reread the statement  du_da   Feb-11-11 04:44 PM   #90 
        - Deleted message  Name removed   Feb-11-11 07:15 PM   #99 
           - Please  du_da   Feb-11-11 08:18 PM   #101 
              - You CAN'T defend cuts in programs for the poor and STILL claim to care about the poor.  Ken Burch   Feb-11-11 09:50 PM   #107 
                 - There is no absolute  du_da   Feb-13-11 04:20 AM   #121 
                    - You're assuming we HAVE to cut just to survive.  Ken Burch   Feb-13-11 01:44 PM   #122 
                       - In today's political climate yes, I make that assumption.  du_da   Feb-13-11 04:17 PM   #124 
  - +a very, very, very large number!  Ken Burch   Feb-11-11 10:38 AM   #18 
  - what the polls have shown was the the majority of people  chowhound   Feb-11-11 11:37 AM   #31 
     - Why are you even here? nt  sudopod   Feb-11-11 11:51 AM   #40 
     - because im angry about the way the election went  chowhound   Feb-11-11 12:12 PM   #46 
        - You want the votes? Then make sure people are heard! Make sure poor people are cared for!  bobbolink   Feb-11-11 01:20 PM   #67 
           - and staying home aint gonna get you there either  chowhound   Feb-11-11 01:39 PM   #74 
           - Your response, devoid of any compassion, is what is getting the results you don't want.  bobbolink   Feb-11-11 04:27 PM   #86 
           - More importantly  du_da   Feb-11-11 04:52 PM   #93 
           - Isn't kicking people and spitting at them  du_da   Feb-11-11 04:49 PM   #92 
     - The problem wasn't dems staying home  du_da   Feb-11-11 04:46 PM   #91 
  - Gotta look at the long-term...  Bigmack   Feb-11-11 09:38 AM   #12 
  - In another political climate  du_da   Feb-11-11 09:51 AM   #15 
  - Every single independent evaluation of Head Start shows that it's a successful program  Gormy Cuss   Feb-11-11 01:10 PM   #62 
     - It doesn't matter if the program does what it is suppose to do.  du_da   Feb-11-11 04:56 PM   #94 
        - "It doesn't MATTER if the program does what it is suppose to do"?.  Ken Burch   Feb-12-11 12:27 AM   #113 
        - For a program  du_da   Feb-13-11 03:13 AM   #118 
        - No, it's time to call a fool a fool with FACTS.  Gormy Cuss   Feb-12-11 11:49 AM   #117 
           - I don't disagree that it is a worthy project  du_da   Feb-13-11 03:16 AM   #119 
              - Actually, no. The people aren't forcing us to do any such thing.  Ken Burch   Feb-13-11 01:45 PM   #123 
  - Sacrifice for so many of you is going to one less movie, having one less bottle of wine.  bobbolink   Feb-11-11 12:45 PM   #50 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Feb-11-11 01:12 PM   #63 
  - The President does not control the gov't pocketbook. nt  PBS Poll-435   Feb-11-11 09:18 AM   #9 
  - No but he does submit an annual Budget  Bandit   Feb-11-11 09:45 AM   #14 
  - OMB is a guideline, CBO is a guideline  PBS Poll-435   Feb-11-11 09:59 AM   #16 
  - Where does it say that? Congress can do whatever it wants with the President's budget proposal...  badtoworse   Feb-11-11 02:11 PM   #85 
  - The President has the ear or the nation and the last say on legislation  sudopod   Feb-11-11 10:50 AM   #20 
     - Probably the stupidest thing I have seen in a while  PBS Poll-435   Feb-11-11 11:01 AM   #21 
        - "Stupidest thing I have seen in a while"  sudopod   Feb-11-11 11:24 AM   #23 
        - I wished they were still so enthusiastic about teaching civics  PBS Poll-435   Feb-11-11 11:28 AM   #25 
           - How's that  sudopod   Feb-11-11 11:33 AM   #28 
              - Sad that so few know so little  PBS Poll-435   Feb-11-11 11:34 AM   #29 
                 - *eyeroll*  sudopod   Feb-11-11 11:38 AM   #32 
                    - Go to Congress and testify  PBS Poll-435   Feb-11-11 11:41 AM   #34 
                       - So during his 30 minute interview with O'Reilly  sudopod   Feb-11-11 11:44 AM   #36 
                          - LOL  PBS Poll-435   Feb-11-11 11:44 AM   #37 
                             - Why?  sudopod   Feb-11-11 11:49 AM   #39 
                             - Because you know the story is a lie, yet you project the future of Egypt with a lie  PBS Poll-435   Feb-11-11 11:53 AM   #42 
                             - What story is a lie?  sudopod   Feb-11-11 11:54 AM   #43 
                                - Again, just let it go  PBS Poll-435   Feb-11-11 12:26 PM   #47 
                                   - I guess I'll just have to make do  sudopod   Feb-11-11 12:41 PM   #48 
                                      - He does not write the budget. We are 7 months from the next budget  PBS Poll-435   Feb-11-11 12:43 PM   #49 
                                         - What would stop him from SAYING anything?  sudopod   Feb-11-11 12:49 PM   #52 
                                            - Because it doesn't matter  PBS Poll-435   Feb-11-11 12:50 PM   #54 
                                            - You, apparently. And everyone else in the dozens of threads discussing the issue.  sudopod   Feb-11-11 12:52 PM   #56 
                                            - I'm sure pointing out that the fiscal year is different than the calendar year  sudopod   Feb-11-11 12:55 PM   #57 
                                            - There will be no reduction in funding until fall of this year in the worst possible scenario  PBS Poll-435   Feb-11-11 01:02 PM   #59 
                                            - oooh, that's reassuring. no reduction until fall, just in time for winter.  Hannah Bell   Feb-11-11 01:05 PM   #60 
                                            - This thread is so full of derp that it hurts, isn't it? nt  sudopod   Feb-11-11 01:09 PM   #61 
                                            - It's full of something, alright  PBS Poll-435   Feb-11-11 05:23 PM   #96 
                                            - Ignorance of what? nt  sudopod   Feb-11-11 05:51 PM   #97 
                                            - The budgetary process  PBS Poll-435   Feb-11-11 07:29 PM   #100 
                                            - wat?  sudopod   Feb-11-11 10:06 PM   #108 
                                            - wat?  sudopod   Feb-11-11 10:06 PM   #109 
                                            - I guess not  PBS Poll-435   Feb-12-11 01:06 AM   #115 
                                            - Just so we're clear that this is being proposed by the Administration  sudopod   Feb-11-11 01:19 PM   #66 
                                            - Either a budget passes or a CR does  PBS Poll-435   Feb-12-11 01:08 AM   #116 
                             - And when the people  du_da   Feb-11-11 05:08 PM   #95 
                                - Well damn it what should we fight for?  sudopod   Feb-11-11 06:30 PM   #98 
                             - He had plenty of time to talk to a guy  sudopod   Feb-11-11 11:52 AM   #41 
                             - We let it go, poor people like our own bobbolink DIE. Is that okay with you?  Zhade   Feb-11-11 01:18 PM   #65 
        - it follows that if we're doing these things to permanently "balance the budget"  sudopod   Feb-11-11 11:28 AM   #24 
           - Maybe  PBS Poll-435   Feb-11-11 11:29 AM   #26 
  - A certain contingent will vote for him no matter what he does,  TBF   Feb-11-11 09:30 AM   #11 
  - if, if, if, if, if,if, if, if, if, if,if, if, if, if, if,if, if, if, if, if,if, if, if, if, if,  spanone   Feb-11-11 09:41 AM   #13 
  - OK...you're imititating the "green bells of Cardiff"...what is your actual point?  Ken Burch   Feb-11-11 11:17 AM   #22 
     - La, La, La I can't hear you?  neverforget   Feb-11-11 08:40 PM   #103 
  - I'm not familiar with the debate over head-start.  JVS   Feb-11-11 10:29 AM   #17 
  - you can start here  xchrom   Feb-11-11 02:04 PM   #79 
  - True, if he DOES.  Rex   Feb-11-11 10:40 AM   #19 
  - Yeah, just like he announced huge cuts to Social Security in the SOTU!  Arkana   Feb-11-11 01:12 PM   #64 
  - this is what happens when dems sit home....nt.  chowhound   Feb-11-11 11:31 AM   #27 
  - No, this is what happened when all Dems went out full force and voted for Obama  MzNov   Feb-11-11 12:50 PM   #53 
  - News blast... he doesn't give a shit what you call him.  bobbolink   Feb-11-11 11:35 AM   #30 
  - You're right, of course.  Ken Burch   Feb-11-11 11:40 AM   #33 
     - I understand there are steps;..... but I am also going to push those of you who hate what he is  bobbolink   Feb-11-11 11:42 AM   #35 
        - OK. And you SHOULD do that.  Ken Burch   Feb-11-11 11:47 AM   #38 
           - You're great, Ken. I'm very appreciative.  bobbolink   Feb-11-11 11:55 AM   #44 
  - When you smell dog shit, you don't pretend it's Valentine's Day perfume  somone   Feb-11-11 11:59 AM   #45 
  - I ususally check my shoes when that happens  badtoworse   Feb-11-11 02:07 PM   #84 
  - kick  emilyg   Feb-11-11 12:57 PM   #58 
  - Would he still be able to call himself a Democrat is he only froze funding rather than cut it?  Freddie Stubbs   Feb-11-11 01:21 PM   #68 
  - He'd have somewhat more right to.  Ken Burch   Feb-11-11 01:29 PM   #70 
  - If he does cut those things he'll have to increase prison spending. People turn to crime when they  craigmatic   Feb-11-11 01:22 PM   #69 
  - Exactly  Ken Burch   Feb-11-11 01:31 PM   #71 
  - Most criminals are are in STATE prisons, not FEDERAL prisons  Freddie Stubbs   Feb-11-11 02:00 PM   #78 
  - Yeah and state prisons are either privately owned or get federal money one way or another.  craigmatic   Feb-11-11 02:05 PM   #81 
  - I don't see that as being a problem  BobbyBoring   Feb-11-11 02:05 PM   #82 
     - Sad but true.  craigmatic   Feb-11-11 02:06 PM   #83 
  - "IF" is such a large word when you are making unfounded assumptions.  bluestate10   Feb-11-11 08:27 PM   #102 
  - Implying liberals don't  sudopod   Feb-11-11 10:07 PM   #110 
  - You have identified perhaps the cheapest tactic used to deflect from these betrayals,  woo me with science   Feb-12-11 12:40 AM   #114 
  - Stand up to big business  Rock The Debt   Feb-13-11 03:56 AM   #120 
 

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