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Reply #42: I wasn't saying that a party cannot be "replaced." [View All]

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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-26-11 02:39 PM
Response to Reply #22
42. I wasn't saying that a party cannot be "replaced."
I was saying that we will always have a 2 party system.

The Constitution enshrines this through the electoral college absolute majority requirement (and the selection process if no one gets an absolute majority), the electoral college itself, the lack of proportional representation, and other properties.
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  -Bill Moyers: Change can't come from within the two parties. They are frozen, paralyzed, purchased. Better Believe It  Nov-26-11 10:21 AM   #0 
  - Cue the anti-Naderites in . . . 3 . . . 2 . . .. 1 - n/t  coalition_unwilling   Nov-26-11 10:24 AM   #1 
  - Uh-Oh... Here comes a flock of Waaa-Waaas.  bvar22   Nov-26-11 11:31 AM   #12 
  - I was going to post a follow up with that link  Enthusiast   Nov-26-11 03:38 PM   #58 
  - If Nader said it no one would listen to him  FreakinDJ   Nov-26-11 04:23 PM   #65 
     - Yes, because, like Howard Zinn, a hero of history, and all other humans  Xtraneous   Nov-26-11 10:58 PM   #104 
        - +1  Scuba   Nov-27-11 06:39 AM   #120 
        - "Oh air, pride, plume, here BUCKLE and the fire that breaks from thee then . . .  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:53 AM   #159 
        - + another  rtassi   Nov-27-11 12:37 PM   #174 
  - Yes - Moyer's Speaks The Truth - Is It Time For DU To Become 99% Underground?  cantbeserious   Nov-26-11 10:25 AM   #2 
  - No. Keep it DU. But Moyers views are certainly worthy of thoughtful discussion on this board.  Better Believe It   Nov-26-11 10:30 AM   #5 
  - Sadly to me, so many of my progressive views have been flamed on this  indepat   Nov-26-11 02:40 PM   #44 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Nov-27-11 02:10 AM   #116 
  - 99% Underground better than DU which suggests alliance with "Democratic" party ... !!  defendandprotect   Nov-26-11 03:07 PM   #50 
  - This isn't Democatic Party Underground (DPU)although many here vote for Democratic Party candidates.  Better Believe It   Nov-26-11 04:19 PM   #63 
  - Are you sure?  defendandprotect   Nov-26-11 10:33 PM   #93 
     - Nonsence!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1  Auntie Bush   Nov-27-11 12:24 PM   #172 
        - Evidently you've read nothing here re the Third Way and Democratic Party?  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 02:58 AM   #197 
  - Why don't you set up 99% Underground...  SidDithers   Nov-27-11 10:33 AM   #150 
  - "thoughtful discussion"  Bobbie Jo   Nov-27-11 06:37 PM   #190 
  - Agree DU needs a name change -- 99% Underground -- Great idea -- !!  defendandprotect   Nov-26-11 03:04 PM   #48 
  - Of course there is a connection, it's in the rules, isn't it?  cui bono   Nov-26-11 08:50 PM   #87 
  - However, also somewhere Skinner says clearly ... 'NO CONNECTION' between DU and Democratic Party ...  defendandprotect   Nov-26-11 10:36 PM   #94 
  - Maybe change the logo to a lower-case d.  Atman   Nov-27-11 06:11 AM   #119 
  - I'm not sure what the difference is between  Le Taz Hot   Nov-27-11 08:39 AM   #127 
     - k/r --- "wearisome" --- yep -- !!  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 03:10 AM   #199 
  - Start your own friggin' site...nt  SidDithers   Nov-27-11 10:38 AM   #153 
  - No, it's the current party that needs a shit-load of mind change.  gkhouston   Nov-27-11 12:08 PM   #169 
     - Agree -- but the idea being that a name change might change the mentality .... ????  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 02:35 AM   #192 
  - That works for me - since the party doesn't.  polichick   Nov-27-11 08:39 AM   #128 
  - .....  blindpig   Nov-26-11 10:26 AM   #3 
  - K & R !!!  WillyT   Nov-26-11 10:29 AM   #4 
  - Bill Moyers is Correct  pmorlan1   Nov-26-11 10:37 AM   #6 
  - Zinn's history flaws? pls post here a five line or so summary for overbusy guy. thanks!  sam11111   Nov-26-11 10:44 AM   #7 
     - Zinn was a generally bad historian who outright distorted facts to fit his version of events  Spider Jerusalem   Nov-26-11 12:20 PM   #20 
        - Facts? Polemic? If one can't win on facts, smear the character?  jtuck004   Nov-26-11 03:10 PM   #53 
        - I didn't actually say any of that, so I'll kindly thank you not to put words into my mouth.  Spider Jerusalem   Nov-26-11 03:43 PM   #59 
        - Ok. I do think  jtuck004   Nov-27-11 12:33 AM   #114 
        - Applause and a few cheers for your post -- k/r -- !!  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 02:37 AM   #193 
        - It's all about class and class warfare .... something you apparently don't recognize.  Better Believe It   Nov-28-11 10:07 PM   #223 
        - +1000% -- fantastic post--!!  defendandprotect   Nov-26-11 10:40 PM   #99 
        - +1  rtassi   Nov-27-11 12:41 PM   #175 
        - History is written with bias. Maybe Zinn's bias is against your grain. nm  rhett o rick   Nov-27-11 10:41 AM   #156 
        - While I agree that Howard Zinn did "cherry pick" a lot of  dotymed   Nov-27-11 01:54 PM   #181 
           - Think Howard Zinn came up with about as fair a look at our history as possible ---  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 03:08 AM   #198 
  - How's Marc Rich doin' these days?  Octafish   Nov-26-11 10:54 AM   #8 
  - The two parties aren't going away. It is possible though perhaps  libinnyandia   Nov-26-11 10:56 AM   #9 
  - OWS is a message that BOTH parties are finished -- and the movment is to the LEFT ....  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 02:41 AM   #194 
  - Recommended.  H2O Man   Nov-26-11 11:03 AM   #10 
  - yes they are owned by corporations and rich Both parties  lovuian   Nov-26-11 11:03 AM   #11 
  - I stand with Bill Moyers.  bvar22   Nov-26-11 11:32 AM   #13 
  - I hate to be the bearer of bad nows, but it isn't coming in any way OTHER than the two party system.  BzaDem   Nov-26-11 11:35 AM   #14 
  - The parties themselves are not even an afterthought, they have no mention, so either or both  TheKentuckian   Nov-26-11 12:26 PM   #22 
  - I wasn't saying that a party cannot be "replaced."  BzaDem   Nov-26-11 02:39 PM   #42 
  - Every nation that has single payer universal HC also has  truedelphi   Nov-26-11 07:34 PM   #77 
  - Great point -- !! But you can't undo the corporate 2-party lock by voting for it, can you ...???  defendandprotect   Nov-26-11 10:44 PM   #100 
  - There are more than 2 behavioral options. Why do people pretend otherwise?  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:02 AM   #137 
  - No one is pretending. There are not more than 2 actual options.  BzaDem   Nov-27-11 12:21 PM   #171 
  - Doesn't it rather obviously depend upon what YOU DO after voting?  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:35 AM   #151 
     - Yes and no. What really matters is who you are.  truedelphi   Nov-27-11 02:42 PM   #186 
        - +1000% --- k/r  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 02:46 AM   #195 
  - So, you've never even heard of the Libertarian party, the Green party, or the Constitution party?  Major Hogwash   Nov-27-11 09:25 AM   #131 
     - They are precisely as relevant as the number of seats and Presidencies they have won. n/t  BzaDem   Nov-27-11 11:55 AM   #167 
     - Side by side go the other parties' candidates, except  truedelphi   Nov-27-11 01:21 PM   #179 
     - it's about funds not whackjob or loser leaders  TorchTheWitch   Nov-27-11 01:43 PM   #180 
     - Hogwash -- Computers were already with us in late 1960's delivering unverifiable results -- !!  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 02:50 AM   #196 
        - You don't a clue as to what the hell is going on in this country.  Major Hogwash   Nov-28-11 04:56 AM   #209 
           - Are you saying voting computers didn't come in during late 1960's????  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 03:33 PM   #216 
              - Are you saying that computers can vote?  Major Hogwash   Nov-28-11 08:53 PM   #219 
                 - Are you saying none of our elections have been stolen by computer voting?  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 08:56 PM   #220 
                    - How old are you?  Major Hogwash   Nov-28-11 09:09 PM   #222 
                       - Hogwash -- straight up ... Voting computers are hackable or not -- ???  defendandprotect   Nov-29-11 12:52 AM   #224 
                          - I knew you wouldn't answer that question!!! There's a tea party out there somewhere . .  Major Hogwash   Nov-29-11 01:48 AM   #227 
                          - Right -- anyone who understands voting computers are hackable is a "Mad Hatter" -- !! ROFL  defendandprotect   Nov-29-11 11:42 AM   #229 
  - +1  rtassi   Nov-27-11 12:44 PM   #176 
  - Our Party needs to elect a majority of progressives.  glinda   Nov-26-11 01:25 PM   #25 
  - Unfortunately, we're only being give pre-selected corporate candidates ...  defendandprotect   Nov-29-11 12:53 AM   #226 
  - Once the Dem Party was basically infiltrated by people  sabrina 1   Nov-26-11 01:40 PM   #29 
  - Not sufficient attention is being paid to Third Way control over Dem Party ... imo ... !!  defendandprotect   Nov-26-11 10:45 PM   #101 
  - Are those your words or are you quoting a Whig?  Bluenorthwest   Nov-26-11 02:19 PM   #34 
  - you are essentially saying that change is hopeless.  provis99   Nov-26-11 03:28 PM   #56 
  - No, I'm not. I'm saying that any change will come through a 2 party system. If you claim that change  BzaDem   Nov-26-11 05:32 PM   #71 
     - Political mobilization through a political party in this country is doomed to failure.  Marr   Nov-26-11 08:01 PM   #84 
     - Why would they vie for its support?  BzaDem   Nov-27-11 12:15 PM   #170 
     - Because it would be a voting block.  Marr   Nov-27-11 05:29 PM   #188 
        - Exactly -- GOP/Christian movement was given start up-funding by GOP ... !!! Most of it funded by RW!  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 03:19 AM   #201 
     - Agree -- k/r --- and not enough discussion of Third Way here ... most don't know ... ???  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 03:13 AM   #200 
     - no, you absolutely said it was hopeless.  provis99   Nov-26-11 09:49 PM   #92 
     - The number of parties is not going to change. The platforms and makeup of the parties can very well  BzaDem   Nov-27-11 12:03 PM   #168 
        - nonsense.  provis99   Nov-28-11 03:20 AM   #202 
     - Bing- frakking -go, you all! Go back and READ Chomsky re COGNITIVE programming/propaganda, or Lakoff  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:09 AM   #141 
  - Yes. The US of A never had more than two parties and never will!  RegieRocker   Nov-27-11 10:08 AM   #140 
  - And Dick Tracy's wrist T.V. will never come about...  SteveM   Nov-27-11 04:23 PM   #187 
  - Unrec...  SidDithers   Nov-26-11 11:37 AM   #15 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Nov-26-11 01:14 PM   #24 
  - Count on it Sid!  whatchamacallit   Nov-26-11 01:39 PM   #28 
  - How's that Harper Government doing up there, Sid?  Bluenorthwest   Nov-26-11 02:21 PM   #35 
  - Recommended....+94  DisgustipatedinCA   Nov-26-11 02:35 PM   #41 
  - Ain't democracy grant...nt  SidDithers   Nov-26-11 03:04 PM   #49 
  - rec'd  mike_c   Nov-26-11 05:09 PM   #70 
  - Bill Moyers speaks my mind....kr nt  ooglymoogly   Nov-26-11 11:41 AM   #16 
  - +1  alittlelark   Nov-26-11 10:37 PM   #95 
  - Please go read the text of the entire interview.  bvar22   Nov-26-11 11:59 AM   #17 
  - Yea Bill! I was so glad to read recently that he's coming back to television. Excellent timing! n/t  Dover   Nov-26-11 12:04 PM   #18 
  - The current dynamic is that $ = election victory. That's what needs to change.  DirkGently   Nov-26-11 12:19 PM   #19 
  - For the most part yeah...  Telly Savalas   Nov-26-11 03:14 PM   #54 
     - Perhaps you were thinking of Meg Whitman vs. Jerry Brown in last year's gubernatorial n/t  catzies   Nov-26-11 05:37 PM   #72 
  - occupy. -eom  Huey P. Long   Nov-26-11 12:21 PM   #21 
  - The 2 capitalist party system provides the illusion of democracy in an oligarchy. K&R  Tierra_y_Libertad   Nov-26-11 12:46 PM   #23 
  - +1000  alittlelark   Nov-26-11 10:38 PM   #97 
  - Thank you. And those trying to claim that people "just don't vote for" third parties  woo me with science   Nov-27-11 11:22 AM   #164 
  - + more  rtassi   Nov-27-11 12:47 PM   #177 
  - +1000% -- We get the privilege of voting for those whom corporations/elites select for us --!! ROFL  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 03:22 AM   #203 
  - Kicked and recommended.  Uncle Joe   Nov-26-11 01:29 PM   #26 
  - This is the truth  whatchamacallit   Nov-26-11 01:33 PM   #27 
  - Yep -- and we've known this for decades ... 2 corporate parties ... doesn't sink in somehow ... !!  defendandprotect   Nov-26-11 01:49 PM   #30 
  - Regulatory capture...  FlyByNight   Nov-26-11 01:57 PM   #31 
  - My question is, how did US politics consolidate in the two-party system  alp227   Nov-26-11 02:06 PM   #32 
  - It didn't. If you talk to (& that doesn't mean POLL) enough REAL people, you find there ARE more  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:04 AM   #138 
  - A-FREAKIN'-MEN! K&R Moyers is spot on.  in_cog_ni_to   Nov-26-11 02:09 PM   #33 
  - Bill Moyers is now on automatic unrecommend. n/t  LoZoccolo   Nov-26-11 02:23 PM   #36 
  - Yes, Moyers an unrec and Andrew Sullivan a wise sage voice. Amazing turn of events,  Safetykitten   Nov-26-11 02:29 PM   #37 
  - why?  DisgustipatedinCA   Nov-26-11 02:34 PM   #39 
  - Nice to see you're giving this decision the careful and measured consideration  whatchamacallit   Nov-26-11 02:34 PM   #40 
  - Oh. "Ignored" must've said something zany again.  Vanje   Nov-26-11 02:49 PM   #46 
     - LOL! My thoughts exactly.  Pacifist Patriot   Nov-26-11 03:07 PM   #52 
     - heh. Now I wonder what "Ignored" said that was stupid again.  provis99   Nov-26-11 03:29 PM   #57 
     - I think he just threw Bill Moyers under the bus. It's getting crowded under here!  Better Believe It   Nov-26-11 04:22 PM   #64 
     - yup  shanti   Nov-26-11 07:42 PM   #79 
  - awwww  fascisthunter   Nov-26-11 07:51 PM   #82 
  - explain yourself  paulk   Nov-26-11 09:35 PM   #89 
  - I don't have to if I don't want to.  LoZoccolo   Nov-26-11 10:55 PM   #103 
  - then I'm going to put you on ignore  paulk   Nov-26-11 11:03 PM   #105 
  - I better follow suit. nm  rhett o rick   Nov-26-11 11:05 PM   #107 
     - Not very horizontal of either one of you. Same old divide & conquer BS. Anti-Revolutionary.  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:38 AM   #154 
        - I disagree  paulk   Nov-27-11 11:44 AM   #165 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Nov-27-11 08:27 AM   #125 
  - 1+ . . . that's the way I see it.  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:39 AM   #155 
  - Deleted sub-thread  Name removed   Nov-26-11 11:04 PM   #106 
  - Rule by mob? "Most people ______" = truth??? wow.  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:17 AM   #144 
  - Thanks for the laugh  tavalon   Nov-26-11 10:39 PM   #98 
  - And,  chervilant   Nov-27-11 02:26 AM   #117 
  - I automatically rec anything you unrec so that means you have no "unrec" power. nt  Bonobo   Nov-27-11 06:03 AM   #118 
  - I am rubber, and you are glue, so whatever you say bounces off me and sticks to you. n/t  LoZoccolo   Nov-27-11 08:45 AM   #129 
     - Are you in middle school? eom  City Lights   Nov-27-11 09:43 AM   #134 
     - Thanks, we always look forward to your intellectual additions. nm  rhett o rick   Nov-27-11 10:38 AM   #152 
  - LOL!  City Lights   Nov-27-11 09:31 AM   #133 
  - At least no longer an auto rec., not that responsible DU -ers du such things, that is!  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:07 AM   #139 
  - Deep Thought...  cui bono   Nov-27-11 01:10 PM   #178 
  - Bill Moyers is absolutely correct. This is the reason for OWS.  woo me with science   Nov-26-11 02:30 PM   #38 
  - OWS is needed because the left lets 1000 coordinated radio stations undermine the feedback mechanis  certainot   Nov-26-11 02:51 PM   #47 
     - The media is purchased along with Congress and the White House. nt  woo me with science   Nov-26-11 04:07 PM   #61 
  - This continual movement of "intellectuals" to try and upturn the two party  truedelphi   Nov-26-11 02:39 PM   #43 
  - Lovely thought that we would actually be working towards an end to wars ....  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 03:28 AM   #204 
  - another of left intelligentsia analyzing politics in a talk radio vacuum  certainot   Nov-26-11 02:48 PM   #45 
  - I decided a while ago I wouldn't live long enough to see this country back on track  nini   Nov-26-11 03:07 PM   #51 
  - 54 here too  unionworks   Nov-26-11 11:12 PM   #108 
  - From the OP:  ProSense   Nov-26-11 03:18 PM   #55 
  - just as self described change agents can do more to retard change.  hulka38   Nov-27-11 12:02 AM   #112 
     - 1++++++ & key trait = "self"  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:56 AM   #160 
     - BECAUSE they never have an answer for what to do with those who disagree, besides make them enemies.  patrice   Nov-27-11 11:05 AM   #162 
  - Kicked and recommended! nt  Enthusiast   Nov-26-11 03:48 PM   #60 
  - REC. Bill Moyers is right on target with his analysis.  bertman   Nov-26-11 04:08 PM   #62 
  - "raw, hungry capital can, like fire, turn from a good servant into a bad master"  Martin Eden   Nov-26-11 04:41 PM   #66 
  - K&R  DeSwiss   Nov-26-11 04:48 PM   #67 
  - Moyers is right. After seeing how the '92 democratic party nominating process was rigged in favor  Citizen Worker   Nov-26-11 05:04 PM   #68 
  - I've been saying this since 2002 or so-- the democratic party...  mike_c   Nov-26-11 05:08 PM   #69 
  - "They are frozen, paralyzed, purchased."  democrank   Nov-26-11 06:09 PM   #73 
  - Why should parties "reflect their interests" in any but the  treestar   Nov-26-11 06:12 PM   #74 
  - Bill Moyers Is A Good Man And He's Right  Sportsguy   Nov-26-11 06:21 PM   #75 
  - K&R  deutsey   Nov-26-11 07:33 PM   #76 
  - amen, brother!  shanti   Nov-26-11 07:36 PM   #78 
  - Moyers is totally on point. nt  Raine   Nov-26-11 07:46 PM   #80 
  - The People will be deciding the Parties actions soon  fascisthunter   Nov-26-11 07:50 PM   #81 
  - Shouldn't a majority of Democrats or Republicans in Congress unfreeze this?  Swede   Nov-26-11 07:56 PM   #83 
  - How well did that work out between '09 and '11?  a2liberal   Nov-27-11 07:31 AM   #122 
  - He put his finger on it, but then he mis-solved the puzzle.  gulliver   Nov-26-11 08:18 PM   #85 
  - This is it. Anything else we disparate polities say, this is IT.  Taverner   Nov-26-11 08:31 PM   #86 
  - Yep. How many of us were delighted with the accomplishments of a full Democratic majority gov?  Kablooie   Nov-26-11 09:13 PM   #88 
  - OCCUPY THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY.  yodermon   Nov-26-11 09:37 PM   #90 
  - Organize outside the system with the Interactive Voter Choice System  NancyBordier   Nov-26-11 09:48 PM   #91 
  - IVCS....... u need a name folks can remember  sam11111   Nov-26-11 10:51 PM   #102 
  - The Interactive Voter Choice System is a Consensus-Building Mechanism  NancyBordier   Nov-27-11 02:11 PM   #182 
  - Good info...  CanSocDem   Nov-27-11 09:28 AM   #132 
  - Thank You!  NancyBordier   Nov-27-11 02:12 PM   #183 
  - LOTS of engineering questions BEHIND somethig like that. Wouldn't it be nice to see a  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:20 AM   #145 
     - Please elaborate  NancyBordier   Nov-27-11 02:13 PM   #185 
  - Could Not Agree More With Bill Moyers  colsohlibgal   Nov-26-11 10:37 PM   #96 
  - many people on the left have been saying the same thing for 40 years  eridani   Nov-26-11 11:33 PM   #109 
  - I no longer feel aligned with the Democratic party...  CoffeeCat   Nov-26-11 11:49 PM   #110 
  - This Is Too Bleak Of An Assessment -- Barely  DallasNE   Nov-26-11 11:56 PM   #111 
  - K&R!  blackspade   Nov-27-11 12:20 AM   #113 
  - knr  Douglas Carpenter   Nov-27-11 01:47 AM   #115 
  - K&R (n/t)  a2liberal   Nov-27-11 07:25 AM   #121 
  - I first learned about America being the Corporate from CSI: Miami  Bryn   Nov-27-11 07:50 AM   #123 
  - Just found this on facebook  Bryn   Nov-27-11 07:57 AM   #124 
  - The biggest reason we cant go forward is the hard core RW and the media backing them up.  DCBob   Nov-27-11 08:32 AM   #126 
  - What liberal/progressive legislation on the economy/Wall Street are we talking about?  Better Believe It   Nov-28-11 01:47 PM   #210 
  - The problem with his article is that he uses a poll to support his theory.  Major Hogwash   Nov-27-11 09:15 AM   #130 
  - You need a poll to understand that corporations control both parties ... ???  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 03:35 AM   #205 
     - It's not about the stupid poll he refers to.  Major Hogwash   Nov-28-11 04:53 AM   #208 
        - Evidently, you thought the "poll" was important enough to mention .... ???  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 02:20 PM   #212 
           - Because Bill Moyers built his entire argument on that poll. He mentioned it in line 1.  Major Hogwash   Nov-28-11 08:50 PM   #218 
              - Moyers may have referred to a poll, but certainly he has also known for decades ....  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 08:59 PM   #221 
                 - Now you're claiming that you're able to read Bill Moyer's mind!!!  Major Hogwash   Nov-29-11 01:50 AM   #228 
                    - Those who understand corporate takeover of both parties are in "Twilight Zone" ... ???  defendandprotect   Nov-29-11 11:47 AM   #230 
  - "True" Bill, but how do you separate correction from the INTENT TO KILL the best chance we've had at  patrice   Nov-27-11 09:46 AM   #135 
  - P.S. Not to mention how to separate correction from the INTENT TO KILL Labor's Right to Organize. nt  patrice   Nov-27-11 09:58 AM   #136 
     - "Correction" needs definition before we can discuss whether killing is part of the package  TheKentuckian   Nov-27-11 11:51 AM   #166 
  - Two parties that serve corporate america, been saying that for years.  sarcasmo   Nov-27-11 10:14 AM   #142 
  - WE are the ones we've been waiting for ...  Fly by night   Nov-27-11 10:16 AM   #143 
  - Go out into the streets & talk to REAL people. You will find 2 parties is a lie propagated by the  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:23 AM   #146 
  - Can't understand here why we're trusting a 2 partyself-assessment from a CORRUPT system we hate.  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:25 AM   #147 
  - Why would a CORRUPT system tell the truth about ANYTHING, especially its own nature.  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:26 AM   #148 
  - Question ALL authority, ESPECIALLY!!! that you agree with.  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:31 AM   #149 
  - Just in case you missed it, that includes BILL MOYERS. Anything less is not freedom. nt  patrice   Nov-27-11 10:48 AM   #158 
  - when a majority (52%) believe that they are not represented  ThomThom   Nov-27-11 10:42 AM   #157 
  - "Im drawn to the Howard Zinns and the Ralph Naders..."  gulliver   Nov-27-11 11:05 AM   #161 
  - Dare I allude to The PROFESSIONAL "Left"?  patrice   Nov-27-11 11:09 AM   #163 
  - " It's absurd to complain about Democrats taking money from corporations" Ya .... really absurd.  Better Believe It   Nov-27-11 07:44 PM   #191 
  - ditto  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 03:43 AM   #207 
  - ...  Bobbie Jo   Nov-28-11 03:53 PM   #217 
  - Right ... we can fight corruption by voting for it --- !!! ROFL  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 03:41 AM   #206 
  - Does he think that if the Dems took no corporate money they would be pure and represent the people?  LiberalLovinLug   Nov-29-11 03:45 PM   #231 
  - I believe pressure should come from outside and put pressure on  theophilus   Nov-27-11 12:24 PM   #173 
  - !  lonestarnot   Nov-27-11 02:12 PM   #184 
  - Kick. nt  woo me with science   Nov-27-11 06:23 PM   #189 
  - Coming from a lifelong Dem  KamaAina   Nov-28-11 01:51 PM   #211 
  - Wait ....  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 02:26 PM   #213 
     - No, Bill Moyers worked in LBJ's White House. I was 4 when he left office.  KamaAina   Nov-28-11 02:59 PM   #214 
        - No -- my fault ....  defendandprotect   Nov-28-11 03:07 PM   #215 
  - agree  upi402   Nov-29-11 12:53 AM   #225 
  - Kick and Rec  Myrina   Nov-29-11 06:45 PM   #232 
 

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