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Reply #13: Most of those are sensible; 4 and 7 are blinders; 2 and 10c are daft. [View All]

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Donald Ian Rankin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-22-11 07:03 PM
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13. Most of those are sensible; 4 and 7 are blinders; 2 and 10c are daft.

1: Yes, of course.

2: No. Speaking as a non-American, I can assure you that there is nothing immoral about employing non-Americans, any more than there's anything immoral about employing Americans (do you think that companies that employ Americans but make profits in other countries should be penalised?). In a clash of interests between poor Americans and rich Americans, one should usually side with the former; in a clash of interests between poor Americans and poor people in other countries there's no such "presumption of rightness" on one side.

3: I don't know enough about this to comment, but it sounds like a good idea on the face of it.

4: Yes, this is one of the two I agree with most strongly - I've heard an awful lot of people who appear to be right about other things blame the recent economic meltdown on the repeal of Glass-Steagal.

5: Yes, of course. But I don't expect there to be many - the crash was caused by regulations being removed, not by regulations being broken; it was the fault of government and the electorate, not individual bankers.

6: Yes, of course.

7: Yes, of course. America spends far more on healthcare than Europe, for worse results. Take a look at the NHS, and learn.

8: Yes, of course, in theory, although I suspect easier said than done.

9: No, this looks to me like a bad idea. Employees interests are represented by unions; boards are there to represent the interests of shareholders. I think this would be a lot like requiring every union to have 50% of its members appointed by the shareholders.

10a1&2: Certainly something like this would be a good idea; this may go too far.

10a3: Seems sensible.

10a4: I think this is shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted, and goes too far, albeit in a sensible direction. Every election needs to leave a paper trail so it can be checked, but there's no reason not to count votes by computer. Press a button on the screen, get a receipt, check it says what it should, drop it in a box, and only bother counting what's in the box if there's a controversy.

10b: No, I like being able to sue corporations, than you very much. And the idea that "the interests of corporations" are not a vital part of "the interests of society" is just silly.

10c: God no. An amendment saying you have a right to employment is like an amendment saying you have a right not to get cancer. Keep constitutional amendments for nitty-gritty literal stuff, and save high-minded waffle for speeches.
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  -Where Does Occupy Wall Street Go From Here? ...a proposal from Michael Moore Mira  Nov-22-11 03:35 PM   #0 
  - Thank you Michael Moore...  ellisonz   Nov-22-11 03:37 PM   #1 
  - Great ideals, Michael. I actually came up with the SAME LIST YEARS AGO  BanTheGOP   Nov-23-11 04:22 PM   #77 
  - What a fabulous list! nt  valerief   Nov-22-11 03:49 PM   #2 
  - Michael Moore for President!  markmyword   Nov-23-11 01:00 AM   #23 
  - Too late to Rec, but recommend and will share the list! Thanks for posting it.  freshwest   Nov-23-11 03:50 PM   #65 
  - Everything he said is just what needs to be  Autumn   Nov-22-11 03:51 PM   #3 
  - Goal #9 sounds fascinating...  AntiFascist   Nov-22-11 04:14 PM   #4 
  - It is already the 99.9%. nt  Lucky Luciano   Nov-23-11 03:14 PM   #62 
  - There have been bases for such systems in the past.  Fantastic Anarchist   Nov-23-11 04:07 PM   #72 
  - Looks like a great list of demands  Proud Liberal Dem   Nov-22-11 04:21 PM   #5 
  - This sounds real good.  SalviaBlue   Nov-22-11 04:41 PM   #6 
  - Oh wait...more non demands?  nadinbrzezinski   Nov-22-11 04:43 PM   #7 
  - tax data: Moore's point 1.  sam11111   Nov-22-11 05:31 PM   #8 
  - Michael totally gets it. Fingers rolling skyward. nt  Zorra   Nov-22-11 05:38 PM   #9 
  - He really does. nt  EFerrari   Nov-23-11 01:05 AM   #24 
  - co ops(point 9)...should apply to ANY size business and employees shd be 60%  sam11111   Nov-22-11 05:50 PM   #10 
  - Actually,  chervilant   Nov-23-11 10:56 AM   #45 
  - SS: his last point ... SS income should equal average US family income- 50K.. financed by the tax  sam11111   Nov-22-11 06:16 PM   #11 
  - #2 is slippery  Courtesy Flush   Nov-22-11 06:32 PM   #12 
  - It might need to be tweaked.  Enthusiast   Nov-23-11 09:42 AM   #39 
  - What about something that would  Beavker   Nov-23-11 03:47 PM   #64 
  - Most of those are sensible; 4 and 7 are blinders; 2 and 10c are daft.  Donald Ian Rankin   Nov-22-11 07:03 PM   #13 
  - Speaking as an American  onpatrol98   Nov-23-11 07:11 AM   #27 
  - Why do you think those countries have such poor working conditions?  Donald Ian Rankin   Nov-23-11 09:22 AM   #37 
  - Strangle another countries economy?  onpatrol98   Nov-23-11 10:57 PM   #83 
  - K&R!  Enthusiast   Nov-23-11 09:45 AM   #40 
  - +1,000  freshwest   Nov-23-11 03:54 PM   #66 
  - you HONESTLY think that OWS is about people's support for neoliberal economics  Romulox   Nov-23-11 12:42 PM   #55 
     - No, I don't but I think that the impulse to screw the rest of the world to protect America  Donald Ian Rankin   Nov-25-11 07:27 AM   #95 
  - The devil's in the details...  hootinholler   Nov-22-11 07:15 PM   #14 
  - Michael asked us to let HIM know what we think. I hope posters with comments go there too. But  cyberpj   Nov-22-11 07:54 PM   #15 
  - kick  Zorra   Nov-22-11 09:24 PM   #16 
  - Okay, I teared up.  woo me with science   Nov-22-11 09:27 PM   #17 
  - Thank you for saying it better than I could.  russspeakeasy   Nov-23-11 08:19 AM   #32 
     - Me too.  Enthusiast   Nov-23-11 09:47 AM   #41 
  - HUGE REC. nt  bertman   Nov-22-11 10:54 PM   #18 
  - Capitalism: A love Story.  mick063   Nov-22-11 11:31 PM   #20 
     - Agree, mick063. Also, "Inside Job". If seeing that doesn't piss people off to the point  bertman   Nov-23-11 11:27 AM   #46 
     - Well, now,  chervilant   Nov-23-11 11:29 AM   #47 
  - Rec'ed with hopes of more environmental/species stuffs added.  glinda   Nov-22-11 11:26 PM   #19 
  - Works for me!  blackspade   Nov-23-11 12:09 AM   #21 
  - that is a pretty good list!!  Douglas Carpenter   Nov-23-11 12:15 AM   #22 
  - Wish I could rec this a million times  BigBearJohn   Nov-23-11 04:46 AM   #25 
  - Moore's list is great ; he asked for suggestions so  stuffmatters   Nov-23-11 05:51 AM   #26 
  - I like your additions!  Pacifist Patriot   Nov-23-11 12:31 PM   #50 
  - I like your adds, I'll add one.  mick063   Nov-24-11 01:35 AM   # 
  - I like you adds, I'll add one.  mick063   Nov-24-11 01:35 AM   #86 
  - I'd be thrilled to see any three of those become reality. K&R  Auggie   Nov-23-11 07:21 AM   #28 
  - Impressive.  Kaleko   Nov-23-11 07:45 AM   #29 
  - decision by consensus can be tough  Shanti Mama   Nov-23-11 07:56 AM   #30 
  - I hope he doesn't horn in on the empty leadership position.  JNelson6563   Nov-23-11 08:04 AM   #31 
  - "this movement's leadership role just might be big enough to accomodate his ego." That's not nice.  in_cog_ni_to   Nov-23-11 08:21 AM   #33 
  - Take a deep breath!  JNelson6563   Nov-23-11 08:30 AM   #34 
     - "My day is now complete."  Enthusiast   Nov-23-11 09:52 AM   #43 
     - Occupy doesn't need more firebaggers  mimi85   Nov-23-11 04:17 PM   #73 
     - What proposals have you hashed out with your fellow citizens to bring to your local GA?  Luminous Animal   Nov-23-11 04:22 PM   #75 
     - Really? You wince? Horrors. And it is established fact that MM will stop you from going to pee  Luminous Animal   Nov-23-11 04:17 PM   #74 
        - Actually it's about being polite, even to those who are not.  JNelson6563   Nov-24-11 07:20 AM   #89 
  - Agreed.  Myrina   Nov-23-11 09:07 AM   #36 
  - Gosh, Julie...  chervilant   Nov-23-11 11:36 AM   #48 
  - Agree. Tends to correspond neatly with his "Book Tour 2011", too.  Romulox   Nov-23-11 01:03 PM   #58 
     - Yes. He and his publisher predicted in advance the OWS movement thus rolling out  Luminous Animal   Nov-23-11 04:03 PM   #69 
     - Um, perhaps the concept of "opportunism" is new to you. It's not new to Mikey. nt  Romulox   Nov-23-11 04:49 PM   #80 
     - "But you try and tell the young people today that... and they won't believe ya'."  Zorra   Nov-24-11 01:15 AM   #85 
     - hmm...  chervilant   Nov-24-11 06:53 PM   #92 
  - Terrific. Now let's work to make it happen!  Scuba   Nov-23-11 08:57 AM   #35 
  - Kick for greater vis. n/t  Scuba   Nov-24-11 06:39 AM   #87 
  - Kicked and recommended!  Enthusiast   Nov-23-11 09:39 AM   #38 
  - This one's a winner. nt  LWolf   Nov-23-11 09:48 AM   #42 
  - K & R!  lonestarnot   Nov-23-11 09:53 AM   #44 
  - K...  CJCRANE   Nov-23-11 11:54 AM   #49 
  - Kr...I'm with you MM. nt  ooglymoogly   Nov-23-11 12:32 PM   #51 
  - It's a compelling list, especially with the three additional suggestions mentioned above.  Pacifist Patriot   Nov-23-11 12:34 PM   #52 
  - Education is missing on that list  Hutzpa   Nov-23-11 12:36 PM   #53 
  - Great list.  DirkGently   Nov-23-11 12:36 PM   #54 
  - "we secure the civil and human rights of all from violation by tyrannical forces and unjust govt's"  Martin Eden   Nov-23-11 12:49 PM   #56 
  - I agree.  Luminous Animal   Nov-23-11 04:04 PM   #70 
  - Yep  kctim   Nov-23-11 01:00 PM   #57 
  - If leadership is ceded right back to the "well meaning" 1%, what is OWS even about?  Romulox   Nov-23-11 01:07 PM   #59 
  - Leadership hasn't and it won't be. Do people not read? Mike is attending and participating  Luminous Animal   Nov-23-11 04:07 PM   #71 
     - It's silly to claim that Moore doesn't generate more publicity than "any other GA attendee".  Romulox   Nov-23-11 04:48 PM   #79 
        - Publicity means squat in the GA. Your ignorance is embarrassing.  Luminous Animal   Nov-23-11 11:40 PM   #84 
  - Kick and highly recommend!  davekriss   Nov-23-11 01:10 PM   #60 
  - Something must be done to bring access and balance to the courts.  nineteen50   Nov-23-11 02:48 PM   #61 
  - +1 -- Supreme Court, Drug War, Prison system -- !! Completely corrupt systems -- !!!  defendandprotect   Nov-23-11 03:44 PM   #63 
  - 10 (a) 1. That's the key.  Prometheus Bound   Nov-23-11 04:00 PM   #67 
  - Especially Number 9  Fantastic Anarchist   Nov-23-11 04:02 PM   #68 
  - Sounds good dto me. . kick. . .n/t  annabanana   Nov-23-11 04:22 PM   #76 
  - Good starting points.  moondust   Nov-23-11 04:33 PM   #78 
  - Here is a list I have been circulating  LuckyTheDog   Nov-23-11 08:05 PM   #81 
  - Goals great. The vision thing - not so much. I'm almost 60 - "truly free," what does that  Kashka-Kat   Nov-23-11 10:43 PM   #82 
  - Kicking in agreement & a return to the democracy we once  mother earth   Nov-24-11 07:19 AM   #88 
  - No I won't have a happy genocide day  Mosaic   Nov-24-11 11:28 AM   #90 
  - 15 of 16 2010 NCAA basketball universities endorse limbaugh/1% by broadcasting on its stations-  certainot   Nov-24-11 11:35 AM   #91 
  - A Systems-Changing Solution for the OWS Movement?  NancyBordier   Nov-24-11 07:57 PM   #93 
  - Welcome to DU!  Zorra   Nov-24-11 08:09 PM   #94 
     - Thanks!  NancyBordier   Nov-25-11 09:53 PM   #97 
  - kick  Zorra   Nov-25-11 02:10 PM   #96 

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