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Reply #88: So socialism is about providing services? [View All]

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FrodosPet Donating Member (35 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-05-11 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #11
88. So socialism is about providing services?
I always thought it was about either state or worker ownership of the means of production, like farms and factories. I think one of the biggest problem people have with socialism is that it has such wide ranging, and sometimes contradictory definitions. I've been trying to understand it for years - specifically how it would work day to day, and it leaves my head swimming.
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  -My problem with liberal capitalism. white_wolf  Nov-05-11 02:29 PM   #0 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Nov-05-11 02:41 PM   #1 
  - Fascism is a form of capitalism. It maintains private property and the capitalist mode of production  white_wolf   Nov-05-11 02:48 PM   #6 
  - Fascism is a form of capitalism. The biggest difference is that fascism is rooted in  Exilednight   Nov-05-11 05:13 PM   #62 
  - You think there's room for a modified form, tempered with  tblue   Nov-05-11 02:42 PM   #2 
  - I don't think you can successfully regulate capitalism.  white_wolf   Nov-05-11 02:51 PM   #7 
     - It's a rude awakening for Americans  tblue   Nov-05-11 04:09 PM   #18 
     - Agreed. The regulators will always be for sale.  Taverner   Nov-05-11 04:54 PM   #45 
        - Sadly even the Social-Democracies are facing calls for austerity.  white_wolf   Nov-05-11 05:06 PM   #54 
           - Yes - victims of capitalism  Taverner   Nov-05-11 05:10 PM   #59 
  - Unfortunately  DemocratSinceBirth   Nov-05-11 02:44 PM   #3 
  - +1. We are beyond reformation. And even if we manage to reform a little...  Modern_Matthew   Nov-05-11 02:46 PM   #4 
  - "We need a new political and economic system."  DemocratSinceBirth   Nov-05-11 02:48 PM   #5 
     - I'm surprised that I have to keep saying this but: Socialism  Taverner   Nov-05-11 02:54 PM   #8 
        - Define Socialism And Please Give Me A Nation To Which The Socialism You Envision Is Practiced  DemocratSinceBirth   Nov-05-11 03:00 PM   #9 
        - Define capitalism!  napoleon_in_rags   Nov-05-11 03:17 PM   #10 
        - Lenin Sounds A Lot Like Hubert Humphrey  DemocratSinceBirth   Nov-05-11 03:22 PM   #12 
           - I think you meant to write "Lennon"  napoleon_in_rags   Nov-05-11 03:41 PM   #15 
              - I Read It Fast  DemocratSinceBirth   Nov-05-11 03:45 PM   #16 
                 - I like that too. I'll never forget visiting the Anasazi ruins as a child.  napoleon_in_rags   Nov-05-11 03:54 PM   #17 
                    - There are many ancient civilzations which thrived  hyphenate   Nov-05-11 06:48 PM   #81 
                       - Also the Iroquois Confederacy is an example of a society not based on private property or profit  white_wolf   Nov-05-11 07:30 PM   #82 
                       - It makes me wonder what the future looks like.  napoleon_in_rags   Nov-05-11 08:34 PM   #83 
        - Choose any of the northern European Social democracies....  prairierose   Nov-05-11 03:22 PM   #11 
        - They Are Advanced Welfare States  DemocratSinceBirth   Nov-05-11 03:26 PM   #13 
        - The Term is Social Democracy  Taverner   Nov-05-11 04:39 PM   #26 
        - Every one has a capitalistic economy as its core  hack89   Nov-05-11 04:32 PM   #21 
        - Sweden's Government MAKES money  Taverner   Nov-05-11 04:39 PM   #27 
           - Care to provide some examples?  hack89   Nov-05-11 10:14 PM   #87 
        - +10000  Taverner   Nov-05-11 04:44 PM   #32 
        - So socialism is about providing services?  FrodosPet   Nov-05-11 11:29 PM   #88 
        - Stop dumping on USSR already. It was destroyed 20 years ago,  Fool Count   Nov-06-11 06:06 PM   #96 
           - You're not serious, are you?  ParkieDem   Nov-07-11 05:17 PM   #101 
              - I am serious. And I lived in USSR 40 years in time removed  Fool Count   Nov-07-11 06:08 PM   #103 
        - Socialism is a very big tent. It can be anything from employee owned companies...  Taverner   Nov-05-11 04:37 PM   #24 
           - What You Are Refeering To Is A Really Advanced Welfare State Supported By Capitalist Profits  DemocratSinceBirth   Nov-05-11 04:40 PM   #28 
              - Not necesarrily. Socialism simply means, the workers control the means of production  Taverner   Nov-05-11 04:44 PM   #31 
        - Some of us are unilaterally antithetical to socialism...  Chan790   Nov-05-11 04:38 PM   #25 
           - Alas you have no clue what socialism is  nadinbrzezinski   Nov-05-11 04:41 PM   #29 
           - I Don't Like Labels  DemocratSinceBirth   Nov-05-11 04:45 PM   #33 
           - Yup, he did.  nadinbrzezinski   Nov-05-11 04:46 PM   #35 
              - He also said they fix prices and monopolize.  Taverner   Nov-05-11 04:47 PM   #37 
                 - Alas he was talking of the ill of his day  nadinbrzezinski   Nov-05-11 04:49 PM   #39 
           - Actually you're wrong on both counts but I'll let you persist in such beliefs. n/t  Chan790   Nov-05-11 05:00 PM   #48 
              - So I did not read such in the wealth of nations?  nadinbrzezinski   Nov-05-11 05:03 PM   #50 
                 - I care piss-all about Adam Smith.  Chan790   Nov-05-11 05:30 PM   #68 
                    - Four hundred years?  nadinbrzezinski   Nov-05-11 09:41 PM   #85 
                       - He misspoke Adam Smith has only been dead for 300 years.  Synicus Maximus   Nov-06-11 06:07 PM   #98 
                          - Three hundred years? When did the us celebrate our 300 anniversary.  nadinbrzezinski   Nov-07-11 04:33 PM   #100 
           - Am I your enemy? I am a Socialist.  Taverner   Nov-05-11 04:42 PM   #30 
           - I'd debate your socialist cred if you're advocating any Socialism that looks like Social Democracy.  Chan790   Nov-05-11 04:58 PM   #47 
              - Confessions of an Economic Hitman  nadinbrzezinski   Nov-05-11 05:05 PM   #52 
              - Great book  Taverner   Nov-05-11 05:13 PM   #61 
              - Chavez has done a lot of good for Venezuela  Taverner   Nov-05-11 05:12 PM   #60 
           - Care to explain what is so evil about the collective ownership of modes of production?  themadstork   Nov-06-11 03:54 AM   #91 
  - I see capital (money) as a unit of motivation, energy and organization.  CJCRANE   Nov-05-11 03:30 PM   #14 
  - Excellent post...  AntiFascist   Nov-05-11 11:57 PM   #89 
  - Just come out and say it. You hate capitalism in any form.  bluestate10   Nov-05-11 04:17 PM   #19 
  - In The Early Days Of Israel  DemocratSinceBirth   Nov-05-11 04:27 PM   #20 
  - Problem is you don't start it that way  Taverner   Nov-05-11 04:51 PM   #41 
  - Capitalism does not make people's lives better. Not for the majoirty.  white_wolf   Nov-05-11 04:33 PM   #22 
  - I Am Sympathetic To Small C Communism But I See No Evidence It Has Worked  DemocratSinceBirth   Nov-05-11 04:35 PM   #23 
     - Communism =/= Socialism  Taverner   Nov-05-11 04:51 PM   #42 
  - Socialism does not equal Marxism  Taverner   Nov-05-11 04:47 PM   #36 
  - REGULATED capitalism can succeed, imo,  elleng   Nov-05-11 04:46 PM   #34 
  - Problem is regulation has failed, and will fail  Taverner   Nov-05-11 04:48 PM   #38 
     - Capitalism is for sale in this country because 'law' has enabled it to become so.  elleng   Nov-05-11 06:01 PM   #72 
        - Well, a few years of wealth redistribution would do wonders  Taverner   Nov-05-11 06:13 PM   #76 
  - Good premise but faulty conclusion. Liberals love MARKETS (as I do).  banned from Kos   Nov-05-11 04:51 PM   #40 
  - Hmm not quite  nadinbrzezinski   Nov-05-11 04:52 PM   #43 
  - Markets, yes. The Stock Market, no.  Taverner   Nov-05-11 04:52 PM   #44 
  - Why don't you just ignore the stock market then?  banned from Kos   Nov-05-11 05:02 PM   #49 
     - The difference is the Southern Baptists have not ruined the economy or bought the government.  white_wolf   Nov-05-11 05:03 PM   #51 
     - So you think its good that all of our destiny is tied to a roulette wheel?  Taverner   Nov-05-11 05:09 PM   #57 
     - Ignoring problems doesn't solve them. n/t  Exilednight   Nov-05-11 05:20 PM   #65 
  - So tell me how much of their work do hedge fund managers sell?  white_wolf   Nov-05-11 04:54 PM   #46 
     - Good question. Hedge fund managers get paid to be right.  banned from Kos   Nov-05-11 05:06 PM   #53 
     - What good to they do for society?  white_wolf   Nov-05-11 05:09 PM   #56 
        - They do NO GOOD for society. But that is not a condition to live in the USA.  banned from Kos   Nov-05-11 05:15 PM   #63 
           - You can't really be comparing being gay to being a hedge fund manager.  white_wolf   Nov-05-11 05:18 PM   #64 
           - +1000  Taverner   Nov-05-11 05:23 PM   #67 
           - Gays don't add to society? Tell that to Oscar Wilde, Walt Whitman, Harvey Milk, Tom Amiano...  Taverner   Nov-05-11 05:23 PM   #66 
              - "some" gays and hedge fund managers add to society! Of course!  banned from Kos   Nov-05-11 05:47 PM   #69 
                 - You cite Carl Ichan??? The man who destroyed TWA????  Taverner   Nov-05-11 05:52 PM   #70 
                 - Yes. Ichan has contributed much to society. He might have been a complete dick  banned from Kos   Nov-05-11 06:01 PM   #73 
                    - I don't care if he fed starving babies, he helped destroy labor in the US  Taverner   Nov-05-11 06:06 PM   #75 
                 - Here is the problem. By it's nature the profession hedgefund manager is going to cause trouble.  white_wolf   Nov-05-11 05:56 PM   #71 
                    - The great Soros is a hedgie! And he donates millions to democratic causes!  banned from Kos   Nov-05-11 06:03 PM   #74 
                       - Yes. You. Can.  Taverner   Nov-05-11 06:39 PM   #78 
     - +100000  Taverner   Nov-05-11 05:09 PM   #58 
  - liberal capitalism  just us   Nov-05-11 05:08 PM   #55 
  - I think that some capitalism is a good thing  hyphenate   Nov-05-11 06:32 PM   #77 
  - But as the dominant economic theology  Taverner   Nov-05-11 06:40 PM   #79 
  - Enterprise is not exclusive to capitailsm  themadstork   Nov-06-11 04:08 AM   #92 
  - this is fascism, not liberal capitalism  fascisthunter   Nov-05-11 06:41 PM   #80 
  - the unbridled economic and political power....  unkachuck   Nov-05-11 09:22 PM   #84 
  - Liberalism won the cold war. That is why all countries in the world are mixed market economies.  applegrove   Nov-05-11 09:54 PM   #86 
  - I don't understand the natural-rights justification for the existence of capitalists,  themadstork   Nov-06-11 03:20 AM   #90 
  - The natural rights argument is something I just can't take seriously.  white_wolf   Nov-06-11 01:17 PM   #94 
     - It's a form of reasoning.  themadstork   Nov-06-11 05:31 PM   #95 
        - The point is it is a faulty form of reasoning.  white_wolf   Nov-06-11 06:06 PM   #97 
  - I'm with you. Liberalism is dead.  Scruffy1   Nov-06-11 05:20 AM   #93 
  - "Liberalism" in the classical sense has very little to do with American "liberalism"  Spider Jerusalem   Nov-06-11 06:10 PM   #99 
     - The "Third Way" movement here in the US ("New Democrats") is specifically an attempt  Romulox   Nov-07-11 05:25 PM   #102 
 

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