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Reply #14: Reclaiming government from the corporations may not be sufficient [View All]

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starroute Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-22-11 12:16 PM
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14. Reclaiming government from the corporations may not be sufficient
You look at countries like Greece and you see a situation where even left-wing governments are pushing through crippling austerity programs because they are at the mercy of international lenders.

The United States has been exempt from those kinds of outside pressure because we are effectively above it all. Our dollar is the world's reserve currency, our bonds have no lack of buyers, and so forth.

But what if that were to change? What if global corporations and global capital were to realize they could no longer control the US and depend on the US military to secure resources and markets for their use and decided to cut us loose?

I don't know enough about the underlying economics to say exactly how this would happen -- but I do know that it's a real possibility. And I suspect it may underlie some of the thinking of the Obama administration when they seem to be kowtowing to business interests.

So the question is not merely how to free ourselves of corporate control but how to do it in a way that does not leave us economically crippled and beset on all sides by far more savage global forces, many of them with an active desire to punish us for our temerity.

This may be the real reason the occupy movement needs to be global. The existing system needs to be deconstructed on a global basis -- and a more authentic alternative put in its place -- because without that there's no way to simply extract yourself from it safely.

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  -I went to Zuccotti Park last night. alberg  Oct-22-11 10:29 AM   #0 
  - I think you nailed it-- Campaign Finance; Corporate Personhood; Taxation/Regulation...  NYC_SKP   Oct-22-11 10:38 AM   #1 
  - Corporate Personhood  femrap   Oct-22-11 10:46 AM   #6 
  - Yeah, a lot of people don't realize that Santa Clara v. Southern Pacific was decided in 1886.  iris27   Oct-22-11 12:08 PM   #12 
     - Corporations are a  femrap   Oct-22-11 12:11 PM   #13 
     - Occupy Wall Steet does K.I.S.S. -- Three principles + four ideas  vets74   Oct-23-11 09:00 AM   #61 
        - That's a great visual. nt.  femrap   Oct-23-11 02:30 PM   #78 
           - Feel free to email it, copy and distribute it.  vets74   Oct-23-11 05:08 PM   #79 
     - But the court NEVER ruled on corporate person-hood in 1886 in Santa Clara v. Southern Pacific.  fasttense   Oct-23-11 02:31 AM   #51 
        - As announced by President McCain's new appointee for an AJ opening....  vets74   Oct-23-11 09:23 AM   #62 
        - Hmmm, that sounds like it may be grounds for a challenge. Laws  jwirr   Oct-23-11 10:21 AM   #66 
  - Agreed, we should re-institute Glass-Steagall.  alberg   Oct-22-11 10:56 AM   #7 
  - plus  flamingdem   Oct-22-11 09:50 PM   #44 
  - The Corporate Masters didn't calculate that "the Masses" would object  no_hypocrisy   Oct-22-11 10:41 AM   #2 
  - It's like some Wall Street stooge wrote last week on why he thinks OWS will fail  deutsey   Oct-23-11 06:18 AM   #55 
     - What an absolute asshole that guy is.  SammyWinstonJack   Oct-23-11 08:35 AM   #60 
     - He is telling us what the elite think and he is right - they think that all  jwirr   Oct-23-11 10:27 AM   #67 
  - K&R,,,Good idea....implimentation may be difficult  Tippy   Oct-22-11 10:42 AM   #3 
  - General Strike? National Sick Day!  yogini   Oct-22-11 11:30 AM   #9 
  - National Sick day works for me  Tippy   Oct-22-11 12:01 PM   #11 
     - Propose July 5, 2012.  Amonester   Oct-23-11 10:28 AM   #68 
  - We need a wealth tax  PETRUS   Oct-22-11 10:43 AM   #4 
  - When was the last effective general strike in the US?  ProgressiveProfessor   Oct-22-11 10:44 AM   #5 
  - You'll get an answer as soon as they figure out how to overturn Supreme Court decisions.  TreasonousBastard   Oct-22-11 11:07 AM   #8 
  - I'm not sure if there has evere been a General Strike in the US.  alberg   Oct-22-11 11:43 AM   #10 
  - Reclaiming government from the corporations may not be sufficient  starroute   Oct-22-11 12:16 PM   #14 
  - If we're all going to strike we have to do it for more than one day  lunatica   Oct-22-11 12:18 PM   #15 
  - I agree with your sentiment, but I think we have a better chance of getting it off the ground  alberg   Oct-22-11 12:30 PM   #17 
  - Sorry- call me a traitor to the cause- but I need my job, and I like the company I work for  NBachers   Oct-23-11 09:44 AM   #63 
  - Is there any chance that you boss in this small business would actually  jwirr   Oct-23-11 11:02 AM   #73 
     - You see the problem you've got already?  customerserviceguy   Oct-23-11 08:37 PM   #81 
     - No- our stock-in-trade is contractors, home owners, building owners, trades people  NBachers   Oct-23-11 10:07 PM   #87 
  - How much food and water do you have stored?  GreenStormCloud   Oct-24-11 08:25 PM   #90 
  - Gee I sure hope you don't need a doctor or ambulance driver that day  customerserviceguy   Oct-22-11 12:28 PM   #16 
  - There would obviously be exceptions for critical occupations like medical care and  alberg   Oct-22-11 12:33 PM   #18 
  - And people get funny  customerserviceguy   Oct-22-11 12:41 PM   #20 
     - National Sick Day  yogini   Oct-22-11 12:52 PM   #21 
     - Good luck with that  customerserviceguy   Oct-22-11 12:54 PM   #22 
     - You certainly could get fired  pipi_k   Oct-23-11 10:41 AM   #70 
     - When enough Americans decide it's worth the inconvenience  alberg   Oct-22-11 12:55 PM   #23 
        - The reason I think it will not happen  customerserviceguy   Oct-22-11 02:07 PM   #30 
        - People here swore up and down that Americans would never take to the streets..  girl gone mad   Oct-22-11 02:19 PM   #32 
        - Any idea what percentage have, as you put it, taken to the streets?  customerserviceguy   Oct-22-11 08:58 PM   #37 
           - You seem to have a good grasp of the obstacles we face.  alberg   Oct-22-11 09:21 PM   #39 
              - In Western societies  customerserviceguy   Oct-22-11 10:31 PM   #45 
        - There was always someone around who said stuff like:  yogini   Oct-22-11 03:40 PM   #35 
        - OK, you're an idealist  customerserviceguy   Oct-22-11 09:07 PM   #38 
        - Yet those movements in the 60-70s did bring about change - civil  jwirr   Oct-23-11 11:18 AM   #74 
           - How old are you?  customerserviceguy   Oct-23-11 08:29 PM   #80 
              - LOL I am 70 years old and I not only have memories I have experiences.  jwirr   Oct-23-11 08:47 PM   #82 
              - Ok, I find a lot of people here  customerserviceguy   Oct-23-11 08:53 PM   #83 
              - So all these years when my family got to vote, got to run for office,  jwirr   Oct-23-11 08:54 PM   #84 
                 - It's not that I don't see any progress  customerserviceguy   Oct-23-11 09:14 PM   #85 
        - See, that's the problem...  pipi_k   Oct-23-11 10:46 AM   #71 
  - Traditionally health sector workers have been excempt from striking  lunatica   Oct-22-11 12:37 PM   #19 
  - Those who would give up Essential Liberty, to purchase a little Temporary Safety,  Zorra   Oct-22-11 01:35 PM   #26 
     - They were fighting an unelected king  customerserviceguy   Oct-22-11 02:12 PM   #31 
        - We don't have to convince "Joe Average American" - he's already convincing himself.  alberg   Oct-22-11 03:10 PM   #33 
        - It's early  customerserviceguy   Oct-22-11 08:56 PM   #36 
           - They were not successful, the war in Viet Nam ended.  Ikonoklast   Oct-23-11 01:01 PM   #77 
        - I'm working on it, and so far nobody at all has laughed. In fact, Joe  Zorra   Oct-22-11 09:47 PM   #43 
           - Get outside the bus routes  customerserviceguy   Oct-22-11 10:36 PM   #46 
              - I'm out in rural Arizona right now, 45 miles from the nearest bus station.  Zorra   Oct-23-11 01:23 AM   #49 
                 - Ok, I guess I made a wrong assumption there  customerserviceguy   Oct-23-11 11:42 AM   #75 
                    - Progressive? Moderate republicans are often suspected to be closet communists here  Zorra   Oct-23-11 12:36 PM   #76 
  - Great post. Mic check...  Zorra   Oct-22-11 01:23 PM   #24 
  - Great reply!  alberg   Oct-22-11 01:53 PM   #28 
  - HUGE K & R !!! - Thank You !!!  WillyT   Oct-22-11 01:33 PM   #25 
  - Kick and Recommend!  Fire Walk With Me   Oct-22-11 01:41 PM   #27 
  - thanks for your great article -- I am right now watching last night's activities via streaming  Douglas Carpenter   Oct-22-11 02:02 PM   #29 
  - k&r for a general strike. n/t  Laelth   Oct-22-11 03:25 PM   #34 
  - Are these your ideas, or were they being discussed at Zucotti?  Remember Me   Oct-22-11 09:21 PM   #40 
  - They are not "my" ideas - I've heard them discussed in many different forums.  alberg   Oct-22-11 09:32 PM   #41 
     - I'm not  Remember Me   Oct-22-11 09:40 PM   #42 
  - Again, the cart before the horse.  bluestate10   Oct-22-11 10:40 PM   #47 
  - An idea to share  airplaneman   Oct-23-11 01:03 AM   #48 
  - Excellent!  Democracydiva   Oct-23-11 02:03 AM   #50 
  - Also...  cyglet   Oct-23-11 10:00 PM   #86 
  - You've got my vote, or whatever OWS calls it these daze. Very practical and doable all 3.  99th_Monkey   Oct-23-11 04:26 AM   #52 
  - General strike seems to be gaining popularity. I'd say by spring, it's more than possible  glowing   Oct-23-11 04:59 AM   #53 
  - That is a great idea,but emergency personnel  dotymed   Oct-23-11 05:07 AM   #54 
  - When I experienced a general strike in Europe years ago, such people were neither asked to nor  Pacifist Patriot   Oct-23-11 06:22 AM   #56 
  - in the meantime...  handmade34   Oct-23-11 06:41 AM   #57 
  - How to achieve #3...  Javaman   Oct-23-11 07:57 AM   #58 
  - Step #4  izquierdista   Oct-23-11 08:26 AM   #59 
  - Agreed.  alberg   Oct-24-11 10:14 AM   #88 
  - While I agree with you alberg, I see this as a long term fight  Jim_Shorts   Oct-23-11 10:12 AM   #64 
  - Constitutional amendments are needed. Like these:  Maineman   Oct-23-11 10:19 AM   #65 
  - July 5, 2012.  Amonester   Oct-23-11 10:32 AM   #69 
  - I agree with this post and would like to see steps taken to implement  jwirr   Oct-23-11 10:50 AM   #72 
  - Those actions require the consent of the 1%  Courtesy Flush   Oct-24-11 11:09 AM   #89 

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