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Reply #47: Preventing smokers from endangering sick people is not fascism. [View All]

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bluestate10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-24-11 08:26 AM
Response to Reply #10
47. Preventing smokers from endangering sick people is not fascism.
The term fascism is thrown around so freely, even to describe perfectly sane policy, that it has lost it's sharp early warning aspect.
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  -Only Non-Smokers Need Apply At Baylor The Northerner  Sep-24-11 01:35 AM   #0 
  - I believe they're within their rights to do this.  CaliforniaPeggy   Sep-24-11 01:39 AM   #1 
  - So do drinkers. I cannot wait for companies to bar people who drink from being hired.  Luminous Animal   Sep-24-11 01:46 AM   #2 
  - Companies have every right not to hire or to terminate people that  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 08:20 AM   #45 
  - sorry zero-tolerance doesnt work that way.. in our zero-tolerance nation.  meow mix   Sep-24-11 02:17 PM   #112 
  - Not all alcohol is bad. Red Wine has been shown to have health benefits  LynneSin   Sep-24-11 02:00 PM   #97 
  - Yup. No overweight folks either.  HappyMe   Sep-24-11 08:22 PM   #154 
     - "Former drug users need not apply at Baylor" -- imagine how the same people would react  Leopolds Ghost   Sep-25-11 08:42 AM   #168 
  - Not to repeat a tired line but,  Tunkamerica   Sep-24-11 01:55 AM   #4 
  - Me too  Politicalboi   Sep-24-11 03:23 AM   #9 
  - Gee, next thing ya know, they'll fire you for having "bad" DNA.  MADem   Sep-24-11 02:23 AM   #6 
  - +1  area51   Sep-24-11 04:16 AM   #14 
  - You're making an overstatement. nt.  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 07:56 AM   #37 
  - It saddens me to see you compare a personal choice with the way a person is born.  cleanhippie   Sep-24-11 10:22 AM   #57 
  - Why does it "sadden" you? You aren't pulling the string, I see. Tsk, tsk.  MADem   Sep-24-11 12:32 PM   #80 
  - That's most likely on its way...  BiggJawn   Sep-24-11 11:20 AM   #71 
  - Henry Ford, the fascist and a fan of Hitler, had a "social department' for his workers.  Luminous Animal   Sep-24-11 02:30 AM   #7 
  - It IS discrimination  ixion   Sep-24-11 05:37 AM   #19 
  - There's almost always discrimination in every hiring  Major Nikon   Sep-24-11 02:08 PM   #104 
     - Not hiring a blind person to drive a truck is not, by any stretch of the imagination, discrimination  dflprincess   Sep-24-11 10:55 PM   #157 
        - Certainly the moral issue is much larger than the legal issue  Major Nikon   Sep-25-11 09:39 AM   #169 
  - Yep, that the BS we were all served, but health care nor insurance rates have  Lionessa   Sep-24-11 05:43 AM   #21 
  - Fat people have health problems too.  proud2BlibKansan   Sep-24-11 07:07 AM   #24 
  - fat people are already on the list, even if it's unofficial.  Sirveri   Sep-24-11 07:39 AM   #30 
  - What about Native Americans who use tobacco as part of their religious beliefs? nt  ZombieHorde   Sep-24-11 11:09 AM   #69 
  - But where does this end?  LeftishBrit   Sep-24-11 11:26 AM   #74 
  - No business should base any hiring or retention of employees  Occulus   Sep-24-11 01:49 AM   #3 
  - Exactly. My comp prohibits employees smoking on campus and offers free  Tunkamerica   Sep-24-11 01:56 AM   #5 
  - so it's ok for your 4th-grade son's teacher to work as a stripper in her off hours?  DrDan   Sep-24-11 07:16 AM   #26 
  - It's fine with me  Occulus   Sep-24-11 10:07 AM   #54 
  - Why wouldn't it be?  cleanhippie   Sep-24-11 10:24 AM   #58 
  - just wondered if anyone thought it might be disruptive to learning  DrDan   Sep-24-11 02:38 PM   #124 
     - Now why would the students know?  nadinbrzezinski   Sep-24-11 03:55 PM   #135 
     - no - obviously not - but do you think anonymity is guaranteeed?  DrDan   Sep-24-11 04:53 PM   #136 
        - Privacy in the modern us s a fantasy  nadinbrzezinski   Sep-24-11 11:20 PM   #160 
     - Since when do male students need facts to base their raging hormone fantasies on?  Gidney N Cloyd   Sep-25-11 10:43 AM   #174 
  - yes but I prefer that we paid teachers enough to not have to work a second job.  Warren Stupidity   Sep-24-11 10:24 AM   #59 
  - I'm fine with it.  bigwillq   Sep-24-11 10:25 AM   #61 
  - As long as she isn't stripping in class, I don't see why her legal, off hours activities  Arkansas Granny   Sep-24-11 11:00 AM   #67 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Sep-24-11 11:26 AM   #75 
  - Why the fuck wouldn't it be?  Joe the Revelator   Sep-24-11 11:47 AM   #77 
  - Wouldn't bother me  Major Nikon   Sep-24-11 02:10 PM   #108 
  - ok - so let's say you are a Project Manager for a state whose job is to  DrDan   Sep-24-11 04:57 PM   #137 
     - Come on  etherealtruth   Sep-24-11 06:09 PM   #139 
        - EXACTLY my point - thank you  DrDan   Sep-24-11 06:27 PM   #143 
           - I don't think so ...  etherealtruth   Sep-24-11 07:48 PM   #152 
              - but it does place a limit on you in terms of your off-hours empolyment  DrDan   Sep-25-11 04:46 AM   #161 
  - I saw this coming over 25 years ago. Baylor is hardly the first to institute such a policy. . .  Journeyman   Sep-24-11 02:37 AM   #8 
  - Or we have unions to protect us from fascism.  Luminous Animal   Sep-24-11 03:41 AM   #10 
  - Preventing smokers from endangering sick people is not fascism.  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 08:26 AM   #47 
     - Can a sick person make a smoker ill? Maybe we ought to just kill everyone off! nt  boston bean   Sep-24-11 10:10 AM   #55 
     - You're becoming desperate. Can't win on logic and commonsense? nt  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 01:40 PM   #90 
     - We're not even talking about people smoking at work.  KamaAina   Sep-24-11 06:13 PM   #140 
  - 3-5 packs? jeez.  Tunkamerica   Sep-24-11 04:09 AM   #12 
  - 3-5 Packs a day? I'd quit just because I'd be too broke to buy em.  LynneSin   Sep-24-11 02:01 PM   #98 
     - When I took up the addiction, in 1970, smokes cost about 30 a pack. . .  Journeyman   Sep-24-11 03:38 PM   #130 
  - If smoking didn't make you stink  Jane Austin   Sep-24-11 03:50 AM   #11 
  - I'm an ex smoker and that's ridiculous. I hang out with several smokers and ex-smokers and no one  Tunkamerica   Sep-24-11 04:11 AM   #13 
  - I'm an ex-smoker, and I disagree  bhikkhu   Sep-24-11 02:27 PM   #119 
  - their hair, their clothes and their breath smell.  PADemD   Sep-24-11 05:14 AM   #16 
  - obviously they don't deserve jobs.  Tunkamerica   Sep-24-11 05:23 AM   #18 
     - Smokers are an imminent threat to sick people.  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 08:23 AM   #46 
        - That is a good argument for banning people from smoking at work...  LeftishBrit   Sep-24-11 11:29 AM   #76 
  - you have asthma? You are costing too much $$. No JOB for you! nt  boston bean   Sep-24-11 07:11 AM   #25 
  - What gets me is the number of breaks smokers take each day...  Darth_Kitten   Sep-24-11 08:26 AM   #48 
  - I'm a non-smoker and I always took a break with 'em.  bengalherder   Sep-24-11 11:25 AM   #73 
     - The smokers don't have to account for every minute of their workdays...  Darth_Kitten   Sep-24-11 06:03 PM   #138 
  - And some people don't bathe regularly and splash stinking cologne  Joe Fields   Sep-25-11 10:21 AM   #170 
  - BRAVO for Baylor  DrDan   Sep-24-11 05:12 AM   #15 
  - BAylor has not allowed smoking on hospital grounds for years  Uben   Sep-24-11 05:21 AM   #17 
  - It's discrimination, pure and simple.  ixion   Sep-24-11 05:38 AM   #20 
  - No it isn't.  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 07:47 AM   #34 
  - Eating is legal and a choice, and sometimes people get fat engaging in that behavior.  boston bean   Sep-24-11 07:49 AM   #35 
  - Overweight people do not present a clear and present danger to seriously  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 08:01 AM   #38 
     - It common sense, really. I don't understand why more don't get that.  cleanhippie   Sep-24-11 10:28 AM   #62 
  - well, yes it is, actually.  ixion   Sep-24-11 08:12 AM   #41 
  - Smoking is a choice, not an unchangeable characteristic. nt  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 08:17 AM   #44 
     - It is a lifestyle choice, just like anything else  ixion   Sep-24-11 08:35 AM   #52 
        - Its a choice that affects everyone, not just the individual.  cleanhippie   Sep-24-11 10:31 AM   #63 
        - It's an addictive predisposition for many, nestled in your DNA--like alcoholism.  MADem   Sep-24-11 12:37 PM   #82 
           - Humans are all flawed in one form or another  ixion   Sep-24-11 12:52 PM   #84 
  - They are also banning chewing tobacco, so it's not just about the sick people. nt  ZombieHorde   Sep-24-11 11:12 AM   #70 
  - Smokers do not endanger their patients  eilen   Sep-24-11 06:29 PM   #144 
  - I agree with denying jobs to healthcare workers who smoke around patients.  LeftishBrit   Sep-25-11 02:29 PM   #179 
  - Oh yeah, exactly the same.  cleanhippie   Sep-24-11 10:25 AM   #60 
  - well, yeah, it is...  ixion   Sep-24-11 01:14 PM   #86 
  - Were you born a smoker?  LynneSin   Sep-24-11 02:03 PM   #100 
     - It has nothing whatsoever to do with choice.  ixion   Sep-24-11 02:07 PM   #103 
        - Not buying it  LynneSin   Sep-24-11 02:22 PM   #115 
           - whether you 'buy' it or not is irrelevant. It is still discrimination.  ixion   Sep-24-11 02:26 PM   #118 
           - Odd how it's mostly smokers that feel that way  LynneSin   Sep-24-11 02:32 PM   #122 
           - Choose better parents. The "addictive personality" is a genetic condition.  MADem   Sep-24-11 03:19 PM   #129 
  - Discrimination.  eilen   Sep-24-11 06:58 AM   #22 
  - Would you cut off a good finger because another finger is infected?  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 07:55 AM   #36 
  - Smokers are not a protected class.  YellowRubberDuckie   Sep-24-11 12:44 PM   #83 
     - Being overweight is not a "protected class " either.  eilen   Sep-24-11 06:37 PM   #145 
  - If I were in HR...  YellowRubberDuckie   Sep-24-11 07:02 AM   #23 
  - More power to Baylor. Smoking is a choice. nt  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 07:24 AM   #27 
  - living is a choice too. nt  boston bean   Sep-24-11 07:30 AM   #28 
  - Whatever. I choose to live and not smoke.  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 07:38 AM   #29 
     - yeah, they are lighting up in patients rooms and blowing smoke in babies faces.  boston bean   Sep-24-11 07:43 AM   #32 
        - You are right. If the behavior of the people you mentioned causes  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 08:09 AM   #40 
           - What? You want to blood test people daily for alcohol?  NutmegYankee   Sep-24-11 08:32 AM   #51 
              - Where did I say test daily?  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 01:52 PM   #94 
                 - It was implied.  NutmegYankee   Sep-24-11 07:22 PM   #151 
  - so is going to a bar that allows it - I am sure you are ok with that too (nt)  The Straight Story   Sep-24-11 01:46 PM   #91 
     - I personally would not patronize a bar or restaurant that allows smoking.  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 01:55 PM   #95 
  - Smoking is legal  Aerows   Sep-24-11 07:42 AM   #31 
  - Baylor Health Systems has a right not to hire smokers.  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 08:16 AM   #43 
  - So what you're saying is you are for discrimination  ixion   Sep-24-11 08:45 AM   #53 
  - That one has a LOT in common with the 'baggers....  PassingFair   Sep-24-11 10:18 AM   #56 
  - I prefer to be called a Moderate with commonsense.  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 02:02 PM   #99 
     - You're right, of course.  PassingFair   Sep-24-11 02:17 PM   #113 
  - Discrimination is when one denies a person due to an unchangeable  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 01:57 PM   #96 
     - That is YOUR definition, conveniently crafted to fit your own prejudices  ixion   Sep-24-11 02:04 PM   #102 
        - That is not the legal definition of discrimination. To be legally  COLGATE4   Sep-24-11 02:13 PM   #109 
           - Thank you. nt  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 02:18 PM   #114 
           - Yes, all smoking doctors should be shit-canned.  PassingFair   Sep-24-11 02:23 PM   #116 
           - There's that word 'choice' again...  ixion   Sep-24-11 02:28 PM   #120 
           - I've heard all of my life from people who thought  Aerows   Sep-25-11 11:13 AM   #177 
           - So according to your legal definition  Eric_323   Sep-24-11 03:47 PM   #132 
           - In some cases?  Aerows   Sep-25-11 11:09 AM   #176 
  - So let me get back to another example I used  Aerows   Sep-25-11 11:33 AM   #178 
  - It's legal. Stupid, but legal. nt  LWolf   Sep-24-11 02:25 PM   #117 
  - Companies should control ALL personal behavior of employees - and rid themselves of all undesirable  Douglas Carpenter   Sep-24-11 07:44 AM   #33 
  - sorry... but i have the right to privacy  LadyInAZ   Sep-24-11 01:12 PM   #85 
     - I was being facetious - in an attempt at making a point  Douglas Carpenter   Sep-24-11 01:38 PM   #89 
  - "The FDA estimates smoking costs American employers some $200 billion a year in lost productivity.."  Cool Logic   Sep-24-11 08:08 AM   #39 
  - This is common in healthcare.  XanaDUer   Sep-24-11 08:15 AM   #42 
  - I favor adding alcohol and illegal drugs to that Scan. nt  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 08:27 AM   #49 
     - They've already got that covered  XanaDUer   Sep-24-11 08:28 AM   #50 
     - No. Because there are many routes for getting HIV, many which the affected  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 02:09 PM   #105 
        - But they still may be injurious to employees  XanaDUer   Sep-24-11 06:48 PM   #148 
     - a pro discrimination DUer. swell  dionysus   Sep-24-11 12:12 PM   #78 
        - Read up on the definition of discrimination. You seriously need to. nt  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 02:04 PM   #101 
        - I believe there is a name for that....  eilen   Sep-24-11 06:44 PM   #146 
           - i was trying to be nice eilen.  dionysus   Sep-24-11 08:16 PM   #153 
  - When employers CAN pick and choose, they will  SoCalDem   Sep-24-11 10:49 AM   #64 
  - Smoking is bad for children. nt  Zorra   Sep-24-11 10:52 AM   #65 
  - I would have an easier time understanding this if tobacco was an illegal substance.  Arkansas Granny   Sep-24-11 10:57 AM   #66 
  - agreed. tobacco is legal. end of story.  Joe Fields   Sep-25-11 10:28 AM   #171 
  - Seems logical. Seeing doctors smoking outside a healthcare facility is a big turnoff.  Shagbark Hickory   Sep-24-11 11:03 AM   #68 
  - Much as I oppose tobacco use...  LeftishBrit   Sep-24-11 11:20 AM   #72 
  - Any university with Ken Starr as it's President is a joke.  Patriot 76   Sep-24-11 12:29 PM   #79 
  - I wouldn't even complete the application if that stipulation appeared  Gormy Cuss   Sep-24-11 12:37 PM   #81 
  - How about the obese????  RagAss   Sep-24-11 01:25 PM   #87 
  - Few things about my obsesity vs. smokers  LynneSin   Sep-24-11 02:09 PM   #106 
     - Is your obesity a genetic predisposition? Do you have fat forebears?  MADem   Sep-24-11 03:39 PM   #131 
     - I've never heard it put so well..Thanks....n/t  RagAss   Sep-24-11 08:43 PM   #155 
        - Anytime.  MADem   Sep-25-11 07:04 AM   #164 
     - if you tripped and fell on me it would ...  Joe Fields   Sep-25-11 10:29 AM   #172 
  - I have no problem with this. n-t  Logical   Sep-24-11 01:29 PM   #88 
  - I never expected to see this much anti-worker sentiment on DU.  name not needed   Sep-24-11 01:48 PM   #92 
  - some of these posts remind me that there can be a fascism on the left just as easy as there can be  Douglas Carpenter   Sep-24-11 01:51 PM   #93 
     - You use the term "Fascism" too lightly. Beware because YOU will be part  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 02:14 PM   #110 
        - those who support bullying people and pushing them around and telling them what they can do in their  Douglas Carpenter   Sep-24-11 02:29 PM   #121 
        - Yet in the immortal words of Iigo Montoya  nadinbrzezinski   Sep-24-11 03:52 PM   #133 
        - I think you have characterized the concept of "Nanny-State'  eilen   Sep-24-11 06:48 PM   #147 
  - Non-smokers  SOS   Sep-24-11 02:10 PM   #107 
  - You have an important concern. Do any of those people exhale what  bluestate10   Sep-24-11 02:16 PM   #111 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Sep-24-11 02:33 PM   #123 
  - I believe people have the right to end their life if they choose.  gulliver   Sep-24-11 02:47 PM   #125 
  - I would normally think what you posted is pretty harsh however...  LynneSin   Sep-24-11 02:53 PM   #126 
     - There's a "pretty" death?  PassingFair   Sep-24-11 03:17 PM   #128 
        - Oh I know Death is not pretty  LynneSin   Sep-25-11 05:57 AM   #162 
  - Fuck Baylor then.  Rex   Sep-24-11 02:54 PM   #127 
  - While the policy is discriminatory  nadinbrzezinski   Sep-24-11 03:54 PM   #134 
  - I've been a nurse for 14 years.  eilen   Sep-24-11 07:05 PM   #150 
     - As a former medic I am aware  nadinbrzezinski   Sep-24-11 11:19 PM   #159 
     - thank you, from a conscientous smoker who tries to keep it to himself.  Joe Fields   Sep-25-11 10:34 AM   #173 
  - Anyone have a picture of Ken Starr lighting up a Cuban?  KamaAina   Sep-24-11 06:14 PM   #141 
  - To Ken Starr, "lighting up a Cuban"  MADem   Sep-25-11 07:15 AM   #166 
  - Definitely a slippery slope  Blasphemer   Sep-24-11 06:23 PM   #142 
  - Good for Baylor. Until we have UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE, this is what  madinmaryland   Sep-24-11 06:51 PM   #149 
  - more like "good for bigotry and discrimination"  dionysus   Sep-24-11 10:42 PM   #156 
     - Bigotry --> ABSOLUTELY NOT; discrimination --> maybe, but only  madinmaryland   Sep-24-11 11:12 PM   #158 
        - no this is about people smoking off-duty - outside of work  Douglas Carpenter   Sep-25-11 07:14 AM   #165 
  - The Law of Unintended Consequences: Lack of cigarette taxes hurts state coffers (note the spelling).  WinkyDink   Sep-25-11 06:01 AM   #163 
  - Health Care?  JustAnotherGen   Sep-25-11 07:54 AM   #167 
  - I think it is okay. People can quit smoking.  roody   Sep-25-11 10:49 AM   #175 

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