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Reply #62: That is simply incorrect. [View All]

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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-13-10 10:16 PM
Response to Reply #57
62. That is simply incorrect.
I am a lawyer. That's why I know you're misinformed.

That's why I asked you to cite statutes or case law.

There are 50 states. I asked you to cite controlling law from any one of them which is consistent with your claim that drunk adults cannot consent to sex and that sex with such a person is rape. You have not done so. There may be such a state, but I'd have to read their statute and/or court holdings to see it for myself. Find statutes or cases, and I'll read them. I'm not interested in what an advocacy site says. That's not law. That's advocacy.
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  -I think some liberals view women as children. ZombieHorde  Dec-13-10 01:58 PM   #0 
  - Mmm, I must be getting hungry...  1955doubledie   Dec-13-10 02:13 PM   #1 
  - Your 2nd example is interesting. Is it rape if a woman has sex with a drunk  kelly1mm   Dec-13-10 02:20 PM   #2 
  - There's a level of, for lack of a better word, participation...  Recursion   Dec-13-10 03:07 PM   #4 
     - I've seen it happen  guitar man   Dec-13-10 04:37 PM   #20 
     - sufficient cocaine can do that  Sen. Walter Sobchak   Dec-15-10 05:09 PM   #93 
     - Roofies dont make you pass out, nor does 4 loco.  WingDinger   Dec-13-10 04:46 PM   #21 
     - It is possible for a man's physiology to act without the participation  Crunchy Frog   Dec-13-10 09:44 PM   #52 
        - Yes. Many men are sometimes "functional" when they are asleep. nt  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 09:47 PM   #54 
  - So society has no duty to protect those under mental impairment?  blondeatlast   Dec-13-10 02:41 PM   #3 
  - They can legally waive Miranda, can't they? (n/t)  Shandris   Dec-13-10 04:12 PM   #11 
  - DU is difficult today. nt  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 04:17 PM   #13 
  - I am having a hard time posting today.  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 04:19 PM   #14 
  - 2nd example is wrong imo. Drunk people (men/women)are unable to legally consent to anything.  uppityperson   Dec-13-10 03:15 PM   #5 
  - let's see if this one shows in "my du" or if replying to bug reply doesn't  uppityperson   Dec-13-10 03:23 PM   #6 
  - No doubt, something is wrong today. nt  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 04:21 PM   #15 
  - So, according to you, when two drunk adults have sex they're both rapists?  TexasObserver   Dec-13-10 03:30 PM   #8 
  - Yes. It may seem odd, but yes. Being intoxicated means they cannot give legal consent.  uppityperson   Dec-13-10 04:15 PM   #12 
     - I would ask: To what law do you refer to?  Xicano   Dec-13-10 07:45 PM   #28 
     - Prollee to the one that voids any contracted signed while under the influence.  lonestarnot   Dec-13-10 08:13 PM   #36 
     - Then you should be able to cite the statute which makes it so.  TexasObserver   Dec-13-10 08:20 PM   #37 
        - I'm not an attorney. Maybe you could contact one to find the specific law?  uppityperson   Dec-13-10 09:19 PM   #47 
           - When an adult couple is arrested for raping each other, it will be a first.  TexasObserver   Dec-13-10 09:34 PM   #50 
           - I doubt it would happen, a lawsuit like that, but it could.  uppityperson   Dec-13-10 09:41 PM   #51 
           - We're talking about criminal cases, not civil lawsuits.  TexasObserver   Dec-13-10 09:54 PM   #56 
              - Drunk people (men/women)are unable to legally consent to anything.  uppityperson   Dec-13-10 09:56 PM   #57 
                 - That is simply incorrect.  TexasObserver   Dec-13-10 10:16 PM   #62 
                    - A point of clarity:  darkstar3   Dec-13-10 10:21 PM   #64 
                    - Can't sign a consent to surgery either.  uppityperson   Dec-13-10 10:25 PM   #66 
                    - Deleted sub-thread  Name removed   Dec-13-10 10:22 PM   #65 
           - Every week, every night, all over America, drunk adults have consensual sex.  guitar man   Dec-14-10 07:56 AM   #70 
              - Well bully for your parents. Of course we do. Just need to be careful  uppityperson   Dec-14-10 11:50 AM   #78 
           - I think you have a skewed interpretation that should be rebuked.  TheKentuckian   Dec-15-10 05:12 PM   #94 
              - Have you ever driven and come across a stop sign and no cars around?  uppityperson   Dec-15-10 06:30 PM   #98 
  - Does that include a sobriety test?  The Straight Story   Dec-13-10 03:55 PM   #10 
  - Drunk is not safe to drive, inebriated is not safe to walk.  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 04:25 PM   #16 
  - I do. The ones under 18, at any rate. nt  Occam Bandage   Dec-13-10 03:23 PM   #7 
  - I call them girls, as opposed to women, but I do appreciate a smart ass. ;) nt  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 04:26 PM   #17 
  - Oh, boy.  Warren DeMontague   Dec-13-10 03:53 PM   #9 
  - My wife and sometimes share a bottle of wine and have fun.  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 04:29 PM   #19 
  - Between committed partners I can see some degree of implied consent (morally as well as legally).  blondeatlast   Dec-13-10 05:04 PM   #22 
  - Yep - 99% of the student body, male & female, at my alma mater, for starters. n/t.  apocalypsehow   Dec-13-10 06:04 PM   #24 
  - I imagine we often infer only those things that validate our opinions...  LanternWaste   Dec-13-10 04:29 PM   #18 
  - When you say "some liberals," do you mean some liberal men or are women included? It's not  Liquorice   Dec-13-10 06:00 PM   #23 
  - Are you saying some people feel mocking men is more OK because men are the cause of  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 07:44 PM   #27 
     - No I'm not saying that. I'm saying that men are the aggressors in most  Liquorice   Dec-13-10 08:01 PM   #31 
  - Some men use alcohol as a rape drug  Nikia   Dec-13-10 07:26 PM   #25 
  - I feel like I am still in control of my sexuality when I drink.  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 07:50 PM   #30 
     - Your experience isn't universally applicable. eom  Hello_Kitty   Dec-13-10 08:51 PM   #43 
        - You make a good point. Some humans may have a will which is easily conquered by alcohol, but  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 08:56 PM   #44 
           - I'm not really liking your rhetoric here. eom  Hello_Kitty   Dec-13-10 09:16 PM   #46 
              - I am trying to clearly state my interpretation of the replies I am reading.  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 09:27 PM   #49 
  - You put both feet in it with your second example.  darkstar3   Dec-13-10 07:43 PM   #26 
  - "If they won't fuck you sober, it's rape."  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 08:24 PM   #38 
  - Internal consistency would dictate "yes".  darkstar3   Dec-13-10 09:00 PM   #45 
     - Pretty much any rule about human behavior is going to have some weird exceptions, but I think your  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 09:22 PM   #48 
     - "if neither party regrets the sex, then the sex was not rape."  darkstar3   Dec-13-10 09:45 PM   #53 
        - Would the caveat have to be applied in reverse?  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 09:57 PM   #58 
        - You're not talking about a law,  darkstar3   Dec-13-10 10:01 PM   #60 
           - God dammit, I thought I had a wicked point.  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 10:52 PM   #67 
        - If one's spouce gets drunk and has sex with someone outside of the marriage,  ZombieHorde   Dec-14-10 11:51 PM   #83 
        - Tough to answer based on that small amount of information.  darkstar3   Dec-15-10 01:16 PM   #87 
           - I agree human behavior is complex and varied.  ZombieHorde   Dec-15-10 01:22 PM   #88 
              - It would be easier if people could separate  darkstar3   Dec-15-10 01:38 PM   #89 
        - A person has the right to say no at any point... except afterwards. n/t  lumberjack_jeff   Dec-16-10 09:53 AM   #109 
     - I am in agreement with you here.  uppityperson   Dec-13-10 10:04 PM   #61 
        - Well, in order, thank you, and you're welcome.  darkstar3   Dec-13-10 10:16 PM   #63 
  - How is she to know that I wouldn't have sex with her if I was sober? n/t  lumberjack_jeff   Dec-15-10 12:13 PM   #86 
  - I think guys just have a sicker sense of humor about castration but also rape etc... I don;t think  bettyellen   Dec-13-10 07:46 PM   #29 
  - I agree. nt  Liquorice   Dec-13-10 08:08 PM   #32 
  - I don't think more women should be prosicuted for rape, I just don't think drunk sex  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 08:11 PM   #33 
  - So when a drunk man and woman have sex...  Lucian   Dec-13-10 08:13 PM   #34 
  - I think each situation is different. In some situations, neither of them are rapists. nt  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 08:28 PM   #40 
  - I think Bill Maher is a sexist pig.  undeterred   Dec-13-10 08:13 PM   #35 
  - Some of his jokes about women don't seem like jokes.  ZombieHorde   Dec-13-10 08:26 PM   #39 
  - He truly seems to believe that all women exist for the purpose  undeterred   Dec-13-10 08:50 PM   #42 
  - he is absolutely disgusting  Skittles   Dec-13-10 08:47 PM   #41 
  - You just HAD to dig up this topic, didn't you?  Odin2005   Dec-13-10 09:53 PM   #55 
  - I think this tread has been mostly constructive, and many of the replies have been  ZombieHorde   Dec-14-10 12:11 AM   #69 
  - I'm sorry, I'm trying to understand this...  HEyHEY   Dec-13-10 10:01 PM   #59 
  - I don't think women always stick together. I don't see a lot of  ZombieHorde   Dec-14-10 12:10 AM   #68 
  - How do you think conservatives view women?  Jim__   Dec-14-10 08:08 AM   #71 
  - I think many conservatives view women as designed by God to be inferior.  ZombieHorde   Dec-14-10 08:26 AM   #72 
     - I'm not clear on how your observation pertains to liberals, as liberals.  Jim__   Dec-14-10 09:09 AM   #73 
        - I grew up Roman Catholic, so that is the religous group I pick on the most.  ZombieHorde   Dec-14-10 09:47 AM   #75 
  - "thoughtful", now that's funny.... n/t.  okieinpain   Dec-14-10 09:20 AM   #74 
  - No. Regardless of gender, you cannot properly consent if you're impaired by drugs or alcohol.  lightningandsnow   Dec-14-10 09:56 AM   #76 
  - My wife and I sometimes have some drinks and then have some fun.  ZombieHorde   Dec-14-10 10:30 AM   #77 
  - you ain't got no pancake mix  snooper2   Dec-14-10 11:51 AM   #79 
  - Especially those under 18.  ChairmanAgnostic   Dec-14-10 12:04 PM   #80 
  - After many years  caty   Dec-14-10 04:39 PM   #81 
  - "Instead of using differences as weapons, we should use them to help each other."  ZombieHorde   Dec-14-10 11:42 PM   #82 
  - Nice. Can we not want to "take care" of each other without implying diminution?  DirkGently   Dec-15-10 04:53 PM   #91 
  - Here you go  ismnotwasm   Dec-15-10 12:26 AM   #84 
  - I am hoping to take a women's study course at my university.  ZombieHorde   Dec-15-10 12:13 PM   #85 
  - I disagree for the most part.  DirkGently   Dec-15-10 04:34 PM   #90 
  - Not all sex is male + female. Some is male + male, or female + female, etc.  ZombieHorde   Dec-15-10 05:29 PM   #95 
     - Don't disagree with that. But male + female + booze = more threat to the woman.  DirkGently   Dec-15-10 06:25 PM   #97 
        - Are you saying women are intellectually inferior to men? nt  ZombieHorde   Dec-15-10 07:03 PM   #100 
           - What does intellectual capacity have to do with rape?  DirkGently   Dec-15-10 10:13 PM   #101 
              - The ability to consent comes from the mind. nt  ZombieHorde   Dec-16-10 10:30 AM   #110 
  - These neat reversals never work for me.  Sparkly   Dec-15-10 04:59 PM   #92 
     - I am not reversing anything other than the opinion men are intellectually superior to women. nt  ZombieHorde   Dec-15-10 05:50 PM   #96 
        - No, you are using "reversal" as a test of gender bias.  Sparkly   Dec-15-10 06:49 PM   #99 
        - Yes. Moreover, equality is not sameness.  DirkGently   Dec-15-10 10:35 PM   #103 
        - There is nothing in our culture and there is nothing in a women's physiology which makes her  ZombieHorde   Dec-15-10 11:01 PM   #106 
        - "less competent than men" -- of course not.  Sparkly   Dec-16-10 09:27 AM   #107 
           - You have not seen the claim, if she's drunk, it's rape?  ZombieHorde   Dec-16-10 10:45 PM   #111 
        - If the genders are not interchangeable, they are not equal.  lumberjack_jeff   Dec-16-10 09:51 AM   #108 
        - The poster is correct. No neat reversal is possible here. Rape is not an intellectual contest.  DirkGently   Dec-15-10 10:30 PM   #102 
           - Your edit is what I am talking about. We both seem to agree on this subject.  ZombieHorde   Dec-15-10 10:49 PM   #104 
              - Sorry, maybe I missed the point at the jump. I wouldn't assume sex with a drunken woman must be rape  DirkGently   Dec-15-10 10:55 PM   #105 
 

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