You are viewing an obsolete version of the DU website which is no longer supported by the Administrators. Visit The New DU.
Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login

Reply #8: Not sure I really care anymore [View All]

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » General Discussion Donate to DU
The Straight Story Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-22-11 08:10 PM
Response to Original message
8. Not sure I really care anymore
If I stand against intrusions into the lives and choices of others by complaining about laws that limit choice I get called a libertarian here.

Here on a progressive board I find people willing to throw freedom out the window for the sake of health care costs (trying to control what you eat/smoke/drink/etc), folks who think the government should control and make choices because the average adult can't/won't make the choices those people feel is best for them, etc and so on.

Standing on principles of freedom and such has went out the window.

We won't lose our freedoms - we will give them away with a smile on our face thinking we have saved others from themselves.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
  -3 new expansions of Surveillance State cloak the powerful in secrecy and make our lives open books nashville_brook  May-22-11 07:17 PM   #0 
  - K&R  Exilednight   May-22-11 07:24 PM   #1 
  - K & R  lonestarnot   May-22-11 07:46 PM   #2 
  - 62% of DUers (in a recent poll) agree with that. I'm surprised it was that low a %  Electric Monk   May-22-11 07:49 PM   #3 
  - "panopticon" is right -- i think most people aren't aware of how bad it's become  nashville_brook   May-22-11 07:57 PM   #5 
  - The internet was invented by ARPA, so I fully expect everything I type to be read by one of em  Electric Monk   May-22-11 08:09 PM   #7 
  - Education is dangerous -  Kaleko   May-22-11 10:07 PM   #11 
  - Them eddicated 'people' strongly tend to be more Liberal too!  Cherchez la Femme   May-23-11 06:59 PM   #110 
  - and that is the true danger of 'left cover', that somehow the police state is more benign under the  stockholmer   May-23-11 05:17 AM   #19 
  - Exactly so. Right or left hand, each can hold a club. And what happens when the right it back?  DirkGently   May-23-11 09:26 AM   #37 
     - They have 'non-partisan' precendents: that's what happens.  Cherchez la Femme   May-23-11 07:07 PM   #111 
  - It seems to me that they are already using it against citizens....  blackspade   May-23-11 08:39 AM   #33 
     - well, the scary thing is that we'd have no way of knowing w/o a whistleblower  nashville_brook   May-23-11 08:59 AM   #34 
     - How are they using it against citizens?  CoffeeCat   May-23-11 11:06 AM   #60 
        - that's the ultimate question -- if it's all secret, we have no way to know. however, certain folks  nashville_brook   May-23-11 11:54 AM   #68 
           - Yep, that makes sense...  CoffeeCat   May-23-11 12:40 PM   #74 
              - think: Eliot Spitzer. or, think about a private prison system needing "clients"....  nashville_brook   May-23-11 04:20 PM   #92 
  - The Panopticon model  Cherchez la Femme   May-23-11 06:50 PM   #107 
  - Secret spying for secret reasons based on secret legal rationale. INDEFENSIBLE.  DirkGently   May-22-11 07:52 PM   #4 
  - well, maybe someone here will try to defend it...i wonder what grounds they'd use?  nashville_brook   May-22-11 11:44 PM   #14 
     - the vast bulk of people(in the world)will 'defend it' through silence & the willful act of ignoring  stockholmer   May-23-11 10:34 AM   #50 
     - "It isn't creeping fascisim when WE do it?"  DirkGently   May-23-11 11:15 AM   #62 
     - The establishment has defended it since 9/11  noise   May-23-11 11:27 AM   #65 
  - K&R  The Backlash Cometh   May-22-11 08:05 PM   #6 
  - Not sure I really care anymore  The Straight Story   May-22-11 08:10 PM   #8 
  - i hear you, and you nailed with the last sentence..."we'll give them away"  nashville_brook   May-22-11 10:47 PM   #12 
  - or we'll even pay for them!  appal_jack   May-23-11 09:43 AM   #39 
     - thanks...and i totally get it about the cell phone!  nashville_brook   May-23-11 09:58 AM   #42 
     - ...which I why I use a throwaway Tracphone.  Occulus   May-23-11 10:47 AM   #52 
  - Thank you for  christx30   May-23-11 10:22 AM   #45 
  - So, so true...  CoffeeCat   May-23-11 11:10 AM   #61 
  - You're confusing things a bit here  liberation   May-23-11 12:25 PM   #70 
     - would i give up my smoking habit and caffeine binges for single-payer?  nashville_brook   May-23-11 12:29 PM   #71 
     - So the govt decides to pick up the tab on things and then they control your life  The Straight Story   May-23-11 04:04 PM   #90 
        - since the govt isn't in the habit of picking up anyone's tab except GoldmanSachs, we're getting  nashville_brook   May-23-11 05:54 PM   #100 
  - Thank you, n_b  HCE SuiGeneris   May-22-11 08:37 PM   #9 
  - HUGE K & R !!!  WillyT   May-22-11 09:35 PM   #10 
  - K&R'd  snot   May-22-11 11:42 PM   #13 
  - Cue the "Obama is a Saint who Can Do No Wrong" Brigade in  coalition_unwilling   May-23-11 12:30 AM   #15 
  - surprised they haven't shown up yet -- maybe this is beyond the pale for them too.  nashville_brook   May-23-11 07:05 AM   #28 
  - Nah -- they just know they'd lose the argument  Donnachaidh   May-23-11 07:55 AM   #30 
     - damn, i've been busy baking them a cake, too.  nashville_brook   May-23-11 08:31 AM   #31 
     - And isn't that the biggest dupe of all?  CoffeeCat   May-23-11 11:18 AM   #63 
     - amen!  nashville_brook   May-23-11 11:25 AM   #64 
     - Yup. Nailed it C Cat.  Donnachaidh   May-23-11 11:41 AM   #66 
     - ty..the adoring fan base is unnatural..its teeny bopper especially when considering info such  xiamiam   May-23-11 06:03 PM   #101 
     - They never debate the issues. They only attack the messengers. nt  Lorien   May-23-11 05:54 PM   #99 
  - Maybe they realize they can't spin this one  MissDeeds   May-23-11 10:52 AM   #54 
  - or...maybe they were RAPTURED!!  nashville_brook   May-23-11 10:58 AM   #57 
     - ...!  DirkGently   May-23-11 06:53 PM   #108 
  - Note how most of their posts are about his popularity or his image. The fawning  Lorien   May-23-11 05:53 PM   #98 
     - lol Lorien. I just made that same that's the over the top swooners impress me now..n  xiamiam   May-23-11 06:05 PM   #102 
  - kr  Hannah Bell   May-23-11 12:57 AM   #16 
  - k/r  emilyg   May-23-11 01:15 AM   #17 
  - K&R  me b zola   May-23-11 01:18 AM   #18 
  - ^^^  Gravel Democrat   May-23-11 05:32 AM   #20 
  - Judging from this thread, most of us on DU are running around  JDPriestly   May-23-11 12:48 PM   #75 
  - that is so totally the case. hmmm - wonder what PDK would say about this?  nashville_brook   May-23-11 02:56 PM   #82 
  - I know that petitions do nothing besides raising awareness.  dotymed   May-23-11 06:04 AM   #21 
  - you know, i actually saw something this weekend about a May 24 call-in push  nashville_brook   May-23-11 07:04 AM   #27 
  - This the exact kind of thing I didn't sign up for and hoped would be beyond the pale for  TheKentuckian   May-23-11 06:35 AM   #22 
  - This is very telling if you are not afraid to look directly at it.  Bonobo   May-23-11 06:35 AM   #23 
  - :) that's a good one.  nashville_brook   May-23-11 06:49 AM   #24 
  - K&R  Luciferous   May-23-11 06:57 AM   #25 
  - K&R...  Hubert Flottz   May-23-11 06:59 AM   #26 
  - Hubert Flottz  Diclotican   May-23-11 09:04 AM   #36 
  - Since a war was never declared, neither will peace. Such power is not given up voluntarily.  leveymg   May-23-11 07:08 AM   #29 
  - Exactly  hootinholler   May-23-11 09:49 AM   #40 
  - a constitutional scholar of national repute(albeit repute coming from being POTUS) is EXPANDING &  stockholmer   May-23-11 10:44 AM   #51 
  - I think the "constitutional scholar" credential was oversold, and the corporate lawyer ignored  leveymg   May-23-11 12:31 PM   #72 
     - That *and* the community organizer  hootinholler   May-23-11 04:03 PM   #88 
        - Shows how easy it is to knock the wind out of reformist politics in America  leveymg   May-23-11 04:30 PM   #93 
           - Makes one wonder indeed.  hootinholler   May-23-11 07:50 PM   #113 
  - i'm realizing, this is our "I Told You So" moment -- and it needs to be said repeatedly...  nashville_brook   May-23-11 09:54 AM   #41 
     - "War is Peace" isn't just a slogan - it's a form of governance. The US hasn't had a moment of peace  leveymg   May-23-11 12:50 PM   #76 
  - Unreal.  blackspade   May-23-11 08:37 AM   #32 
  - pols never give up power willingly, and now it seems we can't even know what powers they're grabbing  nashville_brook   May-23-11 09:34 AM   #38 
  - No doubt!  blackspade   May-23-11 10:15 AM   #44 
  - Which is why  christx30   May-23-11 10:30 AM   #47 
     - well said!  nashville_brook   May-23-11 10:33 AM   #48 
  - Anti-Terrorism and Effective Death Penalty Act of 1996 and the 1996 Telecommunications Act laid some  stockholmer   May-23-11 11:43 AM   #67 
     - i was such a Clintonite dingle berry back then that I completely blocked-out how bad the Telecom Act  nashville_brook   May-23-11 12:15 PM   #69 
  - k&r n/t  Hotler   May-23-11 09:00 AM   #35 
  - Transparentcy...  Javaman   May-23-11 09:59 AM   #43 
  - K&R  CrispyQ   May-23-11 10:24 AM   #46 
  - K&R. nt  OnyxCollie   May-23-11 10:33 AM   #49 
  - k&r  JackRiddler   May-23-11 10:51 AM   #53 
  - The Corpzis are consolidating their control. They  Zorra   May-23-11 10:52 AM   #55 
  - K&R  MissDeeds   May-23-11 10:53 AM   #56 
  - Yep, tyranny is not a left vs. right issue. Nt  krabigirl   May-23-11 10:59 AM   #58 
  - Land of the Free?  progressoid   May-23-11 11:00 AM   #59 
  - Secret Government is UNDEMOCRATIC Government  Octafish   May-23-11 12:37 PM   #73 
  - that's a great example -- also the RNC convention protestors  nashville_brook   May-23-11 01:04 PM   #77 
  - Very well stated Octafish.  suffragette   May-23-11 02:24 PM   #80 
  - Were you able to catch last night's "Sixty Minutes"  truedelphi   May-23-11 02:34 PM   #81 
  - "Drake." The New Yorker article about him is what got Greenwald started on this.  DirkGently   May-23-11 03:58 PM   #87 
  - The Founders understood that. Any abuse that can be carried out in secret. WILL.  DirkGently   May-23-11 03:26 PM   #83 
  - not even super scary middle eastern things with hard-to-prounounce names?  nashville_brook   May-23-11 03:31 PM   #84 
     - Well, of course, wars & violence hadn't been invented then.  DirkGently   May-23-11 03:38 PM   #85 
  - yup  fascisthunter   May-23-11 04:42 PM   #95 
  - I love transparency  Angry Dragon   May-23-11 01:09 PM   #78 
  - and don't forget this..  BetsysGhost   May-23-11 01:19 PM   #79 
  - they've expanded the use of wire taps etc  formernaderite   May-23-11 03:40 PM   #86 
  - couple this with prison privatization and i see the next bubble market.  nashville_brook   May-23-11 04:14 PM   #91 
  - K & R  Better Believe It   May-23-11 04:03 PM   #89 
  - I'm Supposed to Feel Safer Now?  fascisthunter   May-23-11 04:41 PM   #94 
  - Kicked  a simple pattern   May-23-11 04:44 PM   #96 
  - welcome to DU!  nashville_brook   May-23-11 05:43 PM   #97 
  - WHY do you despise America? WHY??  Cherchez la Femme   May-23-11 06:26 PM   #103 
  - this has made my day!! hippie-weasels unite!!  nashville_brook   May-23-11 06:47 PM   #105 
  - Crypto-fasc-tastic!  DirkGently   May-23-11 06:54 PM   #109 
     - naughty!  nashville_brook   May-23-11 07:37 PM   #112 
  - K&R n/t  lordsummerisle   May-23-11 06:37 PM   #104 
  - K&R n/t  DeSwiss   May-23-11 06:49 PM   #106 

Home » Discuss » General Discussion Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators

Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC