MNDemNY
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Thu Nov-12-09 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #9 |
| 14. But that does not really matter, does it? |
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The "bishops" seem to have a 'Hot Line" to the "Hill". Are you OK if the Stupak language remains? Will you still support the bill?
|
| -Obama triumph ahead |
babylonsister |
Nov-12-09 02:21 PM |
#0 |
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k & r |
HopeOverFear |
Nov-12-09 02:22 PM |
#1 |
| -
Will you still support the HCR bill if the Stupak language remains in the final bill? |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 02:23 PM |
#2 |
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I'm optimistic it will be removed. nt |
babylonsister |
Nov-12-09 02:27 PM |
#3 |
| -
But that, as you know , was not the question. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 02:55 PM |
#5 |
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Yes I will; it will still help loads of people, and selfishly, |
babylonsister |
Nov-12-09 03:04 PM |
#7 |
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It is brave of you to admit that ... |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 03:31 PM |
#10 |
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Thanks for the lecture; coming from you it's positively laughable. nt |
babylonsister |
Nov-12-09 03:33 PM |
#11 |
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You are the one willing to delegate 50 years of fighting for womens rights to the scrap heap. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 03:36 PM |
#13 |
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I guess that makes you the one sentencing those without health insurance to death |
DrToast |
Nov-12-09 03:58 PM |
#16 |
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Trading one groups civil rights for another's? No not me, that would be you. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 04:01 PM |
#17 |
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We all hope the Stupak language is removed, but if it's not |
ecstatic |
Nov-12-09 05:44 PM |
#29 |
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Bullshit. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 06:38 PM |
#33 |
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I am a woman who has spent 98% of my life uninsured, |
ecstatic |
Nov-12-09 06:54 PM |
#34 |
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Apparently only your opinion matters. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 07:59 PM |
#39 |
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In other words, this isn't about choice. This is about your hatred for the insurance industry |
ecstatic |
Nov-12-09 08:04 PM |
#42 |
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I will lecture you, or any other Faux Democrat who shills this bill. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 08:10 PM |
#44 |
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If a "faux Democrat" = someone with a pre-existing condition then guilty as charged |
ecstatic |
Nov-12-09 08:28 PM |
#45 |
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Exactly what, and who's rights are you willing to trade for less than mediocre health coverage? |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 09:11 PM |
#49 |
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I am a Real Democrat with a preexisting condition and I will NOT support this Bill if Stupak is not |
saracat |
Nov-13-09 02:14 PM |
#128 |
| -
Deleted message |
Name removed |
Nov-12-09 09:05 PM |
#47 |
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God is in fact , fiction, therefore he could not be an asshole. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 09:09 PM |
#48 |
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This health care bill is a nice piece of "speculative fiction" is it not? |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 09:27 PM |
#51 |
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So lets talk about the amendment, - again |
demwing |
Nov-13-09 06:02 AM |
#56 |
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Really? Defend it please. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 07:01 AM |
#60 |
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Let's be specific |
demwing |
Nov-13-09 10:53 AM |
#83 |
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It in ,effect does just that. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 11:45 AM |
#92 |
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That's correct |
demwing |
Nov-13-09 04:26 PM |
#158 |
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The bill doesn't require insurance cos. to cover birth control. |
Hello_Kitty |
Nov-13-09 10:56 PM |
#165 |
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As a female who will probably be helped by this bill, I oppose it |
Tansy_Gold |
Nov-13-09 02:23 PM |
#130 |
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Right on. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 03:57 PM |
#147 |
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Hi Tansy Gold. Beautifully stated, as always! |
saracat |
Nov-15-09 02:04 PM |
#169 |
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Coming from a male-laughable. nt |
babylonsister |
Nov-12-09 07:37 PM |
#36 |
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You support the Bill with the stupak amendment. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 07:52 PM |
#38 |
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No, I care about millions of people who will be covered under the bill |
babylonsister |
Nov-12-09 08:00 PM |
#40 |
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But you are OK with the Stupak amendment. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 08:06 PM |
#43 |
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Just be sure and let folks know what YOU think. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 09:30 AM |
#68 |
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So if it came from a woman you would take it seriously? Gender biased much? n/t |
poverlay |
Nov-13-09 09:29 AM |
#67 |
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Than this bill? Yes. I CAN elaborate, but I'm presently busy drinking a beer. |
pattmarty |
Nov-13-09 11:52 AM |
#97 |
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Touche. |
timeforpeace |
Nov-12-09 05:16 PM |
#23 |
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50? More like 50,000 |
elehhhhna |
Nov-12-09 05:22 PM |
#24 |
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Deleted message |
Name removed |
Nov-13-09 06:51 AM |
#59 |
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i find it hillarious, that in order to rationalize that you guys are a tiny minority on this board, |
dionysus |
Nov-13-09 08:34 AM |
#65 |
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Minority? Do you seriously think the majority of Democrats on this board think |
saracat |
Nov-13-09 01:56 PM |
#123 |
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no, no one here thinks the stupak ammendment is good. however, most, at least many, |
dionysus |
Nov-13-09 02:48 PM |
#138 |
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Many of us understand that it is much worse than an extension of the Hyde Amendment |
saracat |
Nov-13-09 03:46 PM |
#143 |
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hyperbole fail. |
dionysus |
Nov-13-09 08:31 AM |
#64 |
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Let's be clear. Those 50 years of fighting are not in danger of being consigned to the scrap heap. |
stopbush |
Nov-13-09 03:05 PM |
#139 |
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Exactly |
spiritual_gunfighter |
Nov-13-09 06:12 AM |
#57 |
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Are you aware that people with pre-existing conditions can be charged higher premiums |
Garam_Masala |
Nov-13-09 01:04 PM |
#112 |
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Hi babylonsister ~ I like your style |
goclark |
Nov-13-09 01:47 PM |
#120 |
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No. And people I trust say they are going to get it out. Harkin, Clyburne, etc Additionally I |
emulatorloo |
Nov-12-09 05:05 PM |
#21 |
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But it seems that the 'bishops" have a direct line to the "hill". |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 05:13 PM |
#22 |
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Well then we disagree. Only 30ish Dems voted for it in the house. |
emulatorloo |
Nov-12-09 05:26 PM |
#25 |
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You underestimate the strength of this stalking-horse. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 09:19 AM |
#66 |
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The Stupak amendment did exactly what it was designed to do; shift our |
Lorien |
Nov-13-09 09:44 AM |
#69 |
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Until it passes, then it is coat hangers and blood. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 12:00 PM |
#102 |
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You're fucking ridiculous |
Egnever |
Nov-13-09 03:41 PM |
#141 |
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Deleted message |
Name removed |
Nov-13-09 10:34 PM |
#164 |
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K & R |
Tigermoose |
Nov-12-09 02:48 PM |
#4 |
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It's so cool to know who the OP is just by the title of a thread! |
timeforpeace |
Nov-12-09 10:46 PM |
#52 |
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People don't seem to realize that |
ProSense |
Nov-12-09 03:03 PM |
#6 |
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I realize that; this bill is far from perfect, but it's very important to |
babylonsister |
Nov-12-09 03:06 PM |
#8 |
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How about you, ProSense? Are you willing to answer "the question" |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 03:34 PM |
#12 |
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I am willing to choose to support the bill with the Stupak amendment |
27inCali |
Nov-12-09 05:39 PM |
#27 |
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Don't care what you think, even though that line is crap.(You really should re-think that) |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 09:21 PM |
#50 |
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man, you're rude to everybody, aren't you? you sure must be fun to hang out with. |
dionysus |
Nov-13-09 09:53 AM |
#73 |
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Keep "rolling" it's easier to "take it" when your already on the floor. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 10:01 AM |
#77 |
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Cough, Ahem. You really aren't in any position to make that charge |
saracat |
Nov-13-09 01:58 PM |
#124 |
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"Apparently only your opinion matters." |
Qutzupalotl |
Nov-13-09 11:23 AM |
#86 |
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too bad the question was directed to another. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 11:50 AM |
#95 |
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Thanks for proving my point. |
Qutzupalotl |
Nov-13-09 12:39 PM |
#109 |
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ask a question, I'll answer, spout "points" I'll do as I wish. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 01:46 PM |
#118 |
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Well, that's a day-brightener. Thank you, babs. It gives me hope we can even get rid of Stupak... |
Hekate |
Nov-12-09 03:08 PM |
#9 |
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But that does not really matter, does it? |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 03:39 PM |
#14 |
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Nice Post |
Roosesvelte |
Nov-12-09 03:52 PM |
#15 |
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I hope so, and welcome to DU Roosesvelte! |
babylonsister |
Nov-12-09 04:02 PM |
#18 |
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Thanks! |
Roosesvelte |
Nov-12-09 04:23 PM |
#19 |
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This is a CLASSIC example of what's wrong with America- and why you're headed for 3rd world status |
depakid |
Nov-12-09 04:30 PM |
#20 |
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"This debate (and others) ought to be about effective public policy- but it's not." |
ProSense |
Nov-12-09 05:28 PM |
#26 |
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Nope- for most ordinary people and the corporate media that sways them it's- he won she lost |
depakid |
Nov-12-09 05:43 PM |
#28 |
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Telling, your point really isn't about how seriously people took the discussion, but |
ProSense |
Nov-12-09 06:14 PM |
#30 |
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You're getting lousy policy and all the VAST majority cares about is who "won" and "lost" |
depakid |
Nov-12-09 06:22 PM |
#31 |
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Lousy is your opinion. n/t |
ProSense |
Nov-12-09 06:58 PM |
#35 |
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No thems the facts. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-12-09 08:01 PM |
#41 |
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No, ProSense is correct. The legislation is good enough for a start. |
stevietheman |
Nov-13-09 12:08 AM |
#53 |
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bull. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 07:02 AM |
#62 |
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I realize it |
spiritual_gunfighter |
Nov-13-09 06:17 AM |
#58 |
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Lap dogs. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 07:02 AM |
#61 |
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Yep. In the end we see no positive changes. The corporations just |
Lorien |
Nov-13-09 09:47 AM |
#70 |
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The President said in no uncertain terms that the health bill "would not fund abortion." |
mistertrickster |
Nov-12-09 06:27 PM |
#32 |
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Does it cover Viagra? |
1corona4u |
Nov-13-09 05:52 AM |
#55 |
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Deleted message |
Name removed |
Nov-13-09 07:03 AM |
#63 |
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I live in Wichita. I used to protest in front of now dead George Tiller's clinic against the antis. |
mistertrickster |
Nov-13-09 09:48 AM |
#71 |
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i'm starting to think these guys don't even give a rat's ass about the ammendment. i think it's |
dionysus |
Nov-13-09 09:52 AM |
#72 |
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Your are foolish. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 10:00 AM |
#75 |
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no, i'd rather save lives while you wait for a perfect bill that will never exist. |
dionysus |
Nov-13-09 10:24 AM |
#80 |
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How much worse can it get and still win your support?? (Real question) |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 11:24 AM |
#87 |
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if the senate can't get a public option, i'd say it's not worth the effort. |
dionysus |
Nov-13-09 11:34 AM |
#89 |
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Triggered?? Opt out?? Co-ops?? |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 11:39 AM |
#90 |
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triggers never get triggered, co-opts don't have a big enough pool to be good. |
dionysus |
Nov-13-09 11:44 AM |
#91 |
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But you would be OK with a veto? how is that materially different from my position? |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 11:47 AM |
#94 |
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i believe it's different in that you think the house bill with it's imperfect public option is worse |
dionysus |
Nov-13-09 11:52 AM |
#98 |
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We have a difference in the threshold of when a bill is "not worth the bother" |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 11:57 AM |
#100 |
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well, in my opinion, the letting people die thing happens if a bill WITH a public option, albeit |
dionysus |
Nov-13-09 12:03 PM |
#103 |
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and i say there a still needless deaths with the House bill. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 12:08 PM |
#106 |
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i am pragmatic or cynical enough not to be satisfied with, but at least thankful for, anything good |
dionysus |
Nov-13-09 12:31 PM |
#108 |
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"the political climate we have" ????? |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 01:50 PM |
#121 |
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we have blue dogs and house members that were too bought off or |
dionysus |
Nov-13-09 02:24 PM |
#132 |
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My point is that a push to change that fact is a winning strategy. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 02:27 PM |
#133 |
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i agree that single payer is the way to go. if we could get congress to vote the way they should |
dionysus |
Nov-13-09 02:32 PM |
#134 |
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Push for it and change congress. If not now, when? |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 02:35 PM |
#135 |
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i wholehearted agree we need better dems in office. we also need to educate the voters in |
dionysus |
Nov-13-09 02:44 PM |
#137 |
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Why are we arguing? |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 03:47 PM |
#144 |
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um... cause it's GD:P!!111 |
dionysus |
Nov-13-09 07:09 PM |
#162 |
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The stupak bill goes too far. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 09:56 AM |
#74 |
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He said federal funds would not be used to fund abortion |
laughingliberal |
Nov-13-09 01:40 PM |
#117 |
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No, it doesn't do that at all |
demwing |
Nov-13-09 04:29 PM |
#160 |
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It's not a great bill - but I do hope it's seen as a triumph for Obama. nt |
polichick |
Nov-12-09 07:49 PM |
#37 |
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Thanks babylonsister for |
Cha |
Nov-12-09 08:58 PM |
#46 |
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Cosgrove at Cleveland Clinic says it will do little to control escalating costs. |
Kolesar |
Nov-13-09 05:05 AM |
#54 |
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That is irrelevant, we need a "win" |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 10:00 AM |
#76 |
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For the most part, I'll stay out of the line of fire in this thread. |
Altoid_Cyclist |
Nov-13-09 12:11 PM |
#107 |
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I love this article, babylonsister. Very cool. |
BlancheSplanchnik |
Nov-13-09 10:07 AM |
#78 |
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And he's proud of this? |
Beacool |
Nov-13-09 10:07 AM |
#79 |
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Unlike some, he isn't a bitter sore loser when it comes to supporting HCR & the President. |
ClarkUSA |
Nov-13-09 04:10 PM |
#153 |
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The easily fooled are the enemy of the good and right thing to do. n/t |
change_notfinetuning |
Nov-13-09 10:34 AM |
#81 |
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The traveler in casual shoes offers nothing to the drifting ambergris. n/t |
NYC_SKP |
Nov-13-09 11:00 AM |
#84 |
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Thank You Babylonsiter for this article and viewpoint. |
stubtoe |
Nov-13-09 10:51 AM |
#82 |
| -
Obama triumph ahead |
Andronex |
Nov-13-09 11:16 AM |
#85 |
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Very good point. That is the heart of the problem.We need real health care |
saracat |
Nov-13-09 02:23 PM |
#131 |
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And the insurance industry hates the bill |
ProSense |
Nov-13-09 11:29 AM |
#88 |
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ProSense loves it, even with the Stupak language. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 12:05 PM |
#104 |
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INSURANCE INDUSTRY: don't throw me in the briar patch |
frylock |
Nov-13-09 01:35 PM |
#116 |
| -
Yeah, sure. The "triumph" will be; pass a shit bill and declare victory. |
pattmarty |
Nov-13-09 11:46 AM |
#93 |
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But the Rose Garden ceremony will be wonderful!!! |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 11:51 AM |
#96 |
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I hope they hang around to help with the 2010 and 2012 elections.......... |
pattmarty |
Nov-13-09 11:57 AM |
#99 |
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I do not understand why "we" do not see that STRONG HCR, yes, even Single Payer. Is a WINNING issue! |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 11:58 AM |
#101 |
| -
I'll disagree on the single payer issue. Where we are at NOW.......... |
pattmarty |
Nov-13-09 12:06 PM |
#105 |
| -
List for me the 218 reps and 60 Senators that would ever conceivably vote for Medicare for All. |
Nicholas D Wolfwood |
Nov-13-09 12:45 PM |
#110 |
| -
I think pushing it in the 2012 midterms is a winning play. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 02:04 PM |
#126 |
| -
I agree with this . . . |
h9socialist |
Nov-13-09 12:54 PM |
#111 |
| -
I take issue with this statement |
peace frog |
Nov-13-09 01:04 PM |
#113 |
| -
"Obama triumph ahead" |
unaffiliated liberal |
Nov-13-09 01:06 PM |
#114 |
| -
+1 |
jgraz |
Nov-13-09 02:07 PM |
#127 |
| -
But is getting a bad bill passed really that great? |
winyanstaz |
Nov-13-09 01:32 PM |
#115 |
| -
It is if all you care about is politics |
jgraz |
Nov-13-09 02:02 PM |
#125 |
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thats what I think too.. |
winyanstaz |
Nov-13-09 03:08 PM |
#140 |
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The victory is very important as it springboards the ability for Pres. Obama to get more things done |
ProgressOnTheMove |
Nov-13-09 01:47 PM |
#119 |
| -
And unicorns will once again inhabit the earth. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 01:54 PM |
#122 |
| -
More "reform" done badly? |
unaffiliated liberal |
Nov-13-09 02:16 PM |
#129 |
| -
What does an abortion procedure cost these days? I'd imagine it's around $500. |
stopbush |
Nov-13-09 02:39 PM |
#136 |
| -
You have a point? |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 03:45 PM |
#142 |
| -
Maybe. You have an answer to my question? |
stopbush |
Nov-13-09 03:47 PM |
#145 |
| -
For the sake of discussion. $500.00 |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 03:48 PM |
#146 |
| -
For the sake of discussion, you're willing to scuttle providing insurance |
stopbush |
Nov-13-09 03:59 PM |
#148 |
| -
Yes, but the point is the rollback of hard fought rights. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 04:04 PM |
#150 |
| -
Why do you consider government subsidy of abortion a "right?" |
stopbush |
Nov-13-09 04:15 PM |
#154 |
| -
Only women who can afford an abortion should have that right? |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 04:19 PM |
#155 |
| -
Logic and reality escape you. |
stopbush |
Nov-13-09 06:59 PM |
#161 |
| -
For the sake of women |
unaffiliated liberal |
Nov-13-09 04:00 PM |
#149 |
| -
I'm with you! Don't holler at me! |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 04:06 PM |
#151 |
| -
What happens today with life-saving treatments that the uninsured receive? |
stopbush |
Nov-13-09 04:09 PM |
#152 |
| -
Back under your rock. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 04:21 PM |
#156 |
| -
I am so weary of the argument that hospitals have to provide life saving treatment |
laughingliberal |
Nov-13-09 07:34 PM |
#163 |
| -
The Pukes, abetted by Stupak, WANTED to cause this argument... |
freddie mertz |
Nov-13-09 04:22 PM |
#157 |
| -
Why is irrelevant at this point. |
MNDemNY |
Nov-13-09 04:26 PM |
#159 |
| -
Of course, I agree completely. Dem leadership got trumped... |
freddie mertz |
Nov-14-09 02:28 PM |
#168 |
| -
Kick |
Hekate |
Nov-13-09 10:56 PM |
#166 |
| -
K&R |
akbacchus_BC |
Nov-14-09 12:27 AM |
#167 |
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