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Reply #2: Please explain how they were 'cheated' out of their 'votes' [View All]

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Debi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 08:40 AM
Response to Original message
2. Please explain how they were 'cheated' out of their 'votes'
since a caucus is not a primary but a measure of presidential preference of the electorate as a whole? The caucuses were never designed to be one-person-one-vote and yet people continue to try to measure them that way. It is interesting that neither Joe Biden nor Chris Dodd are claiming they were 'cheated' of votes, only people who have tried to bend the caucus rules around a primary perspective.

They were not cheated - their supporters went in with the ability to stand for their candidate. Since their candidate did not receive enough 'votes' (which would have ended their chances in a primary) to be a 'winner' their supporters had the opportunity to ask others to join the Joe Biden group or they themselves had the opportunity to seek out another candidate. They also had the opportunity to stay put. No primary gives the voter/candidates a second chance. The caucuses do.
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  -Iowa Democratic Party ShariJH  Jan-06-08 07:44 AM   #0 
  - The fact that one of his precinct captains immediately left for Edwards  monmouth   Jan-06-08 08:18 AM   #1 
  - In my precinct the captain immediately bailed for Richardson. Sad.  youthere   Jan-07-08 11:59 AM   #25 
     - Ouch, that's gotta hurt  tsegat01   Jan-07-08 12:44 PM   #43 
        - Yep. She didn't even make an attempt at an argument for him...  youthere   Jan-07-08 01:24 PM   #53 
  - Please explain how they were 'cheated' out of their 'votes'  Debi   Jan-06-08 08:40 AM   #2 
  - Debi:  demommom   Jan-06-08 09:05 AM   #3 
  - Oh, you are correct.  Debi   Jan-06-08 09:07 AM   #4 
  - One thing...  1corona4u   Jan-06-08 10:19 AM   #6 
     - Since we have agreed to disagree regarding primary vs. caucus  Debi   Jan-06-08 10:44 AM   #7 
        - You know what Debi?  demommom   Jan-06-08 01:03 PM   #10 
           - We are all still in a state of shock and grief  tsegat01   Jan-06-08 01:28 PM   #12 
           - As if in my entire lifetime I will give a flying fuck what you say about me on an anonymous message  Debi   Jan-06-08 05:58 PM   #13 
              - Your language is  elleng   Jan-07-08 01:51 AM   #14 
              - The language looks very strange juxtaposed with the  NCarolinawoman   Jan-07-08 09:12 AM   #16 
              - You are correct. However, even the most 'hospitable' person must draw the line somewhere  Debi   Jan-07-08 10:50 AM   #19 
              - I agree, it is not.  Debi   Jan-07-08 10:41 AM   #17 
              - Wow, Iowans really curse like that?  48percenter   Jan-07-08 10:44 AM   #18 
              - Well, after reading the comments posted since 9:00 PM on January 3rd  Debi   Jan-07-08 11:15 AM   #22 
              - I'm not PM'ing anyone to respond to your post  48percenter   Jan-07-08 11:36 AM   #23 
              - I will agree - any state that is first will do anything to retain that position  Debi   Jan-07-08 12:01 PM   #26 
              - I read an interesting blurb about the history of caucusing in Iowa -- and Iowa's  gateley   Jan-07-08 12:18 PM   #31 
                 - You're dead on - IA and NH were supposed to be easier to compete  Debi   Jan-07-08 12:36 PM   #41 
              - I had to look up internecine. :-) nt  gateley   Jan-07-08 12:05 PM   #27 
              - Thank you for your reasoned post.  DesertedRose   Jan-07-08 12:21 PM   #33 
              - Debi  1corona4u   Jan-07-08 11:44 AM   #24 
              - Are you asking me to leave?  Debi   Jan-07-08 12:15 PM   #29 
                 - I'm not asking you to leave...  1corona4u   Jan-07-08 01:29 PM   #54 
                    - Got it - I don't talk about Iowa and we all get along.  Debi   Jan-07-08 02:21 PM   #60 
                       - Well, your state caused it...  1corona4u   Jan-07-08 02:33 PM   #63 
                          - You post reminds me of the Blame Canada song from the South Park movie  Debi   Jan-07-08 02:40 PM   #65 
                          - And your refusal to admit your state fucked up  1corona4u   Jan-07-08 02:43 PM   #67 
                             - But you said I wasn't every Iowan  Debi   Jan-07-08 03:04 PM   #70 
                          - Corona...  Steely_Dan   Jan-07-08 03:01 PM   #69 
                             - Steely....  1corona4u   Jan-07-08 03:42 PM   #72 
              - A little short-sighted  DesertedRose   Jan-07-08 12:16 PM   #30 
              - Yep, these articles show up every four years  Debi   Jan-07-08 12:19 PM   #32 
              - I think Biden and Dodd are smart enough not to do that in public  DesertedRose   Jan-07-08 12:25 PM   #35 
                 - Are you saying they lie?  Debi   Jan-07-08 12:51 PM   #48 
                    - OK, now you are being unnecessarily hostile.  DesertedRose   Jan-07-08 02:18 PM   #58 
                       - No, I'm not looking for a fight  Debi   Jan-07-08 02:29 PM   #61 
                          - Maybe I haven't read up enough on their final statements, but  DesertedRose   Jan-07-08 02:41 PM   #66 
                             - No hostility n/t  Debi   Jan-07-08 03:13 PM   #71 
              - I was pissed about the primary process in 2004!!  48percenter   Jan-07-08 12:43 PM   #42 
                 - As a Clark supporter you should be pissed at the Clinton's and their supporters  Debi   Jan-07-08 12:58 PM   #51 
                    - I'm more annoyed that he endorsed Hillary n/t  48percenter   Jan-07-08 01:42 PM   #55 
                       - I have a strange feeling there is a quid pro quo at work there  Debi   Jan-07-08 02:11 PM   #57 
                          - I don't like to think Clark is that calculating  48percenter   Jan-07-08 02:18 PM   #59 
                             - The General is too good of a man to be like the Clintons  Debi   Jan-07-08 02:32 PM   #62 
              - I haven't received any PM's  tsegat01   Jan-07-08 12:26 PM   #36 
                 - Eloquently stated  DesertedRose   Jan-07-08 12:29 PM   #39 
                 - I think ABC effectively pulled the plug on Dodd's and Biden's campaigns by  gateley   Jan-07-08 12:31 PM   #40 
                 - I am sorry about the loss as well - and I came here for comfort too  Debi   Jan-07-08 12:49 PM   #45 
              - not all iowas curse like that  cbear70   Jan-07-08 07:56 PM   #74 
              - Debi  demommom   Jan-07-08 09:21 PM   #77 
  - Doesn't seem to me  BenV   Jan-06-08 10:08 AM   #5 
  - can someone point me to the BSI group?  cbear70   Jan-06-08 11:17 AM   #8 
  - cbear and all,  elleng   Jan-07-08 07:51 AM   #15 
     - I contacted him last night, and have not heard back yet...  1corona4u   Jan-07-08 11:00 AM   #21 
  - At this point I'm just thinking that Joe didn't have enough people, period.  gateley   Jan-06-08 12:23 PM   #9 
  - The media, lack of $$$ and high Dem turnout  48percenter   Jan-06-08 01:24 PM   #11 
  - Joe would have received 14 of 231 votes.  Frustratedlady   Jan-07-08 12:29 PM   #38 
  - Well, I found all of the counties online...  1corona4u   Jan-07-08 10:56 AM   #20 
     - That was interesting - and in a weird way, made me feel better.  pirhana   Jan-07-08 12:26 PM   #37 
  - I don't believe Joe would have benefitted from a straight up or down vote...  youthere   Jan-07-08 12:09 PM   #28 
     - You are right....except..  pirhana   Jan-07-08 12:22 PM   #34 
     - I figured his "staying in until the end of January" was based on the assumption  gateley   Jan-07-08 12:49 PM   #46 
        - We were set, if we hadn't been inundated by Dems appearing beyond normal.  Frustratedlady   Jan-07-08 12:58 PM   #50 
     - I blame most of this on the media  48percenter   Jan-07-08 12:48 PM   #44 
     - Agree.  gateley   Jan-07-08 12:50 PM   #47 
     - Good for your father.  Frustratedlady   Jan-07-08 12:55 PM   #49 
     - I love your dad!  pirhana   Jan-07-08 08:09 PM   #75 
     - Clinton would have 'won' in our precinct  Debi   Jan-07-08 01:10 PM   #52 
        - Actually I am glad that she who would be queen  48percenter   Jan-07-08 02:08 PM   #56 
           - Yeah - young women sunk her battleship!  Debi   Jan-07-08 02:37 PM   #64 
              - I think Clinton is sunk in NH. My Dad has been giving me  48percenter   Jan-07-08 02:44 PM   #68 
                 - And John McCain unfortunately  tsegat01   Jan-07-08 06:36 PM   #73 
                    - Sigh.  gateley   Jan-07-08 09:10 PM   #76 

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