Pithlet
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Thu Feb-01-07 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #38 |
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Edited on Thu Feb-01-07 05:32 PM by Pithlet
It's just not good enough. Birth control should be readily available to all women everywhere. Any means of causing an impediment to that is not acceptable. You're willing to concede that bare minimum that individual pharmacists shouldn't be able to take the prescriptions away, and that's good. That's more than many on your side are willing to do. But, it's not enough. Communities where access to birth control is severely limited and made difficult to obtain will suffer. Your one concession doesn't do anything to prevent that scenario. The women and those who care about them in the community have rights, too. Supporting the right for pharmacies to refuse to carry birth control is supporting their right to block the community from access to something they have a right to. It doesn't matter if that's not the reason you're supporting it, and some other principle is behind it. The results are the same.
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| -Should states be permitted to force doctors to help perform executions? |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 10:53 AM |
#0 |
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No. eom. |
PDJane |
Feb-01-07 10:55 AM |
#1 |
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Why of course. But, pharmacists should not have to administer birth control. |
mzmolly |
Feb-01-07 11:02 AM |
#2 |
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NO. The thought is absolutely appalling. |
sparosnare |
Feb-01-07 11:02 AM |
#3 |
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How would you feel about the required presence of Jury foreman |
jarab |
Feb-01-07 11:09 AM |
#6 |
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It's not the same thing. |
sparosnare |
Feb-01-07 11:20 AM |
#10 |
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Everyone who condemned the person to death should.... |
TechBear_Seattle |
Feb-01-07 11:50 AM |
#13 |
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"First do no harm" |
Horse with no Name |
Feb-01-07 11:03 AM |
#4 |
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No one should be forced to end another person's life - that's fucked up. |
Katherine Brengle |
Feb-01-07 11:07 AM |
#5 |
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Killing people goes against a doctor's oath. |
femmedem |
Feb-01-07 11:11 AM |
#7 |
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You're right of course, but... |
Orrex |
Feb-01-07 11:21 AM |
#11 |
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Yep, and it's a dumb argument. |
Pithlet |
Feb-01-07 12:32 PM |
#17 |
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Once again I agree! |
Orrex |
Feb-01-07 12:52 PM |
#18 |
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II know. I don't get why they think they have the right |
Pithlet |
Feb-01-07 04:58 PM |
#40 |
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The pharmacist is really only there to carry out the Dr.s orders |
alarimer |
Feb-01-07 12:32 PM |
#16 |
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pharmacists have a much more important role than merely following orders |
fishwax |
Feb-04-07 10:58 AM |
#108 |
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NO n/t |
datadiva |
Feb-01-07 11:16 AM |
#8 |
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Of course not. And capital punishment should be banned, too. |
Orrex |
Feb-01-07 11:20 AM |
#9 |
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IT is NOT the job of a physician to KILL... It IS the job of a |
hlthe2b |
Feb-01-07 11:27 AM |
#12 |
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Why do they need a doctor? |
Crandor |
Feb-01-07 12:00 PM |
# |
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federal judges have been requiring doctors to be sure the prisoner isn't suffering |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 03:40 PM |
#21 |
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what would the state do if they refused? Kill them?.... |
Bluerthanblue |
Feb-01-07 12:00 PM |
#14 |
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Indeed |
dancingAlone |
Feb-02-07 06:18 PM |
#102 |
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The two issues aren't remotely the same. |
Pithlet |
Feb-01-07 12:19 PM |
#15 |
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I'm struck by how many people clearly haven't read the OP. |
Donald Ian Rankin |
Feb-01-07 12:55 PM |
#19 |
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that is exactly my position |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 03:38 PM |
#20 |
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The analogy doesn't hold up. Pharmacists who refuses to dispense stocked |
mondo joe |
Feb-01-07 03:50 PM |
#23 |
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Oopsie, my bad. |
Katherine Brengle |
Feb-01-07 04:14 PM |
#25 |
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so you don't see a real, demonstrated need... |
VelmaD |
Feb-01-07 03:48 PM |
#22 |
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No other ethical exceptions are judged on moral grounds |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 04:11 PM |
#24 |
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But a pharmacists job is to carry out the physician's orders. |
mondo joe |
Feb-01-07 04:15 PM |
#26 |
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If a store carries the drug it must dispense it |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 04:23 PM |
#29 |
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I think that's arguable. Here's why: |
mondo joe |
Feb-01-07 04:26 PM |
#32 |
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Then why not require that doctors |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 05:47 PM |
#52 |
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Again, the analogy fails. |
mondo joe |
Feb-01-07 05:53 PM |
#55 |
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Because women have been granted the right to access to birth control -- |
Katherine Brengle |
Feb-01-07 04:40 PM |
#37 |
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The right of the whole state is being infringed |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 05:49 PM |
#53 |
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How are they shutting it down |
Pithlet |
Feb-01-07 06:01 PM |
#59 |
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I see where you are coming from a logical debate standpoint -- |
Katherine Brengle |
Feb-01-07 06:23 PM |
#65 |
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The situations remain unalike anyway. |
mondo joe |
Feb-01-07 06:31 PM |
#70 |
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Excellent points. nt |
Katherine Brengle |
Feb-01-07 06:32 PM |
#71 |
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They absolutely can and should be told what to sell |
Pithlet |
Feb-01-07 04:53 PM |
#39 |
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Here are a few examples: |
Katherine Brengle |
Feb-01-07 04:22 PM |
#28 |
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At most one of these examples fit |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 04:39 PM |
#36 |
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way to avoid every question I asked in my response |
VelmaD |
Feb-01-07 04:24 PM |
#30 |
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and here's another link |
VelmaD |
Feb-01-07 04:30 PM |
#35 |
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I honestly don't know how many times I can utter the words |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 04:42 PM |
#38 |
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It's kinda like talking to a brick wall |
VelmaD |
Feb-01-07 05:09 PM |
#41 |
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Actually it was AIDS drugs which were the first problem |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 05:24 PM |
#44 |
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Do your own damn homework |
VelmaD |
Feb-01-07 08:21 PM |
#90 |
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Give me a break |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 09:47 PM |
#95 |
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I think we get that. |
Pithlet |
Feb-01-07 05:32 PM |
#45 |
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actually that is all I concede and yes I have stated the rest before |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 05:40 PM |
#49 |
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How does one link to the fact |
Pithlet |
Feb-01-07 05:54 PM |
#56 |
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The very same red state governments that you wish to give this |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 06:17 PM |
#62 |
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The record isn't that great? I'm not sure what you mean by that. |
Pithlet |
Feb-01-07 06:28 PM |
#68 |
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In comparision to large corporations, governments have been awful |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 06:55 PM |
#80 |
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But when you talk about a drug that only one class of people use - and |
mondo joe |
Feb-01-07 07:00 PM |
#81 |
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to some extent it does |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 07:07 PM |
#83 |
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Doesn't government have plenty of power here to begin with? |
mondo joe |
Feb-01-07 07:17 PM |
#86 |
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Not state governments |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 07:26 PM |
#88 |
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How do you define "'huge problem"? |
femmedem |
Feb-02-07 07:22 AM |
#99 |
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You sound as if you believe that if a woman was denied birth control |
femmedem |
Feb-01-07 09:15 PM |
#92 |
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You at least would need evidence that one of those stores isn't selling bc |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 09:57 PM |
#98 |
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This is a hypothetical situation, |
Lautremont |
Feb-02-07 12:37 PM |
#100 |
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evidence |
SemperEadem |
Feb-04-07 10:41 AM |
#106 |
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Sorry, but it's not the same at all. |
Hell Hath No Fury |
Feb-01-07 04:19 PM |
#27 |
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IF a doctor is hired to perfom executions, dr should have to do them. |
uppityperson |
Feb-01-07 04:26 PM |
#31 |
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My first instinct is to say no |
LibFromWV |
Feb-01-07 04:26 PM |
#33 |
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Surely they can find a doctor with no morals...... |
Porcupine |
Feb-01-07 04:28 PM |
#34 |
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They should force the children of the people who support |
BuyingThyme |
Feb-01-07 05:22 PM |
#42 |
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I don't remember doctors being required to perform executions... |
Solon |
Feb-01-07 05:24 PM |
#43 |
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No. |
Left Is Write |
Feb-01-07 05:32 PM |
#46 |
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Yes, it's a principled difference. |
LeftishBrit |
Feb-01-07 05:35 PM |
#47 |
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There is only one instance in which a physician helping perform execution would |
mondo joe |
Feb-01-07 05:37 PM |
#48 |
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I thought that doctors did not perform the execution |
MATTMAN |
Feb-01-07 05:44 PM |
#50 |
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No. |
NoSheep |
Feb-01-07 05:45 PM |
#51 |
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A pharmacist signs up to fill prescriptions. Not to pick and choose. |
impeachdubya |
Feb-01-07 05:50 PM |
#54 |
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Dispensing birth control is an expected normal part of being a pharmacist. Executing people is NOT |
Mayberry Machiavelli |
Feb-01-07 05:58 PM |
#57 |
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Make the Birth Control Pill Available OTC, and this won't be a problem. |
impeachdubya |
Feb-01-07 05:59 PM |
#58 |
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I tend to agree |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 06:03 PM |
#60 |
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But it's not. Only pharmacies can carry it. |
Pithlet |
Feb-01-07 06:10 PM |
#61 |
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What other drugs should they be required to carry? |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 06:23 PM |
#64 |
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It wouldn't be hard to determine a mimimum formulary of the most highly prescribed |
mondo joe |
Feb-01-07 06:26 PM |
#67 |
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Any legal prescription drug that they refuse to carry. |
Pithlet |
Feb-01-07 06:43 PM |
#76 |
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I am by no means a libertarian |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 07:04 PM |
#82 |
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Your argument sounds extremely Libertarian in nature. |
Pithlet |
Feb-01-07 07:23 PM |
#87 |
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frankly I am a bit tired of waiting |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 08:27 PM |
#91 |
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I don't blame you. |
Pithlet |
Feb-01-07 09:49 PM |
#96 |
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The public sector is better than the private sector |
femmedem |
Feb-01-07 09:23 PM |
#93 |
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Two reasons (neither all that great, but there the two usually given) |
LeftyMom |
Feb-01-07 06:18 PM |
#63 |
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I think there are ways around those |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 06:24 PM |
#66 |
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Warning labels are all well and fine... |
Katherine Brengle |
Feb-01-07 06:38 PM |
#74 |
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yeah, but people manage to kill themselves or their kids every year by accidental tylenol OD |
LeftyMom |
Feb-01-07 07:36 PM |
#89 |
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Like those OTC behind the counter medications - no scrip needed, but you have to ask -- |
Katherine Brengle |
Feb-01-07 09:38 PM |
#94 |
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BC it's hormonal and can have very severe negative health effects if used |
Katherine Brengle |
Feb-01-07 06:35 PM |
#72 |
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Talking real-world solutions, however, I think making it avail. OTC makes the most sense. |
impeachdubya |
Feb-01-07 06:41 PM |
#75 |
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I can agree with this -- |
Katherine Brengle |
Feb-01-07 07:08 PM |
#84 |
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I can, too. |
Pithlet |
Feb-01-07 06:55 PM |
#79 |
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because we're talking about hormones |
SemperEadem |
Feb-04-07 10:45 AM |
#107 |
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dsc, do you think that pharmacists should be protected from being fired for not doing |
Mayberry Machiavelli |
Feb-01-07 06:30 PM |
#69 |
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No, and I have stated that repeatedly, no employee should be permitted |
dsc |
Feb-01-07 06:36 PM |
#73 |
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Force? |
Katzenkavalier |
Feb-01-07 06:45 PM |
#77 |
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No, but they should let others do the deed if needed. |
aikoaiko |
Feb-01-07 06:45 PM |
#78 |
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Laughable Comparison |
Madspirit |
Feb-01-07 07:14 PM |
#85 |
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no- |
madrchsod |
Feb-01-07 09:51 PM |
#97 |
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Nonsense! Being a druggist and operating a drug store ... |
damntexdem |
Feb-02-07 12:37 PM |
#101 |
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the demonstrated need is determined by a medical doctor, not a pharmacist |
SemperEadem |
Feb-04-07 10:08 AM |
#103 |
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No, Never. I don't want my doctor practicing death. |
spanone |
Feb-04-07 10:16 AM |
#104 |
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No. |
Vidar |
Feb-04-07 10:34 AM |
#105 |
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