| 43. "Prove" Him Wrong? How Do You Prove Someone's Idiotic Opinion Wrong? |
|
Blue is the best color. Prove me wrong.
|
| -Tariq Ali Book Equates Obama and Bush |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 09:31 AM |
#0 |
 -
Deleted sub-thread |
Name removed |
Sep-23-10 09:36 AM |
#1 |
| -
K&R... |
SidDithers |
Sep-23-10 09:38 AM |
#2 |
| -
Thanks for your thoughts on this MM nt |
flamingdem |
Sep-23-10 09:40 AM |
#3 |
  -
Yeah, they were unclear in the other thread about this same issue. |
Stinky The Clown |
Sep-23-10 09:42 AM |
#4 |
| -
My friend, it's not at all uncommon for more than one thread |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 09:49 AM |
#13 |
| -
How was the content of your thread unique? |
EFerrari |
Sep-23-10 02:18 PM |
#96 |
| -
Well, the OP in the other thread from yesterday didn't include the |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 02:54 PM |
#115 |
| -
the discussion of the cover of the Book was in the NPR video ..did you listen to it? |
flyarm |
Sep-23-10 02:59 PM |
#119 |
| -
I included that link to democracynow.org in my OP. |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 03:04 PM |
#124 |
| -
I didn't miss a thing until my posts were removed, that gave the links as well. |
flyarm |
Sep-23-10 03:12 PM |
#129 |
| -
I don't know anything about posts being removed. |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 03:14 PM |
#131 |
| -
But you did post this: |
flyarm |
Sep-23-10 03:24 PM |
#136 |
| -
Not the point. Not the point at all. |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 03:31 PM |
#138 |
| -
Not my point eitther ..this point was clearly addressed in the interview posted yesterday! eom |
flyarm |
Sep-23-10 03:40 PM |
#141 |
| -
No, the last thread was supportive of that tool bag equating Obama to Bush |
USArmyParatrooper |
Sep-23-10 10:42 AM |
#42 |
| -
Refutation to that meme could have been accomplished there |
Stinky The Clown |
Sep-23-10 11:00 AM |
#50 |
| -
Or, it could be done, as I did here, in a new thread |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 11:03 AM |
#59 |
| -
Yes, I read your threads. I'm very Ceasarean that way. |
Stinky The Clown |
Sep-23-10 11:06 AM |
#64 |
| -
Well, again...my thanks to you for visiting my threads and |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 11:10 AM |
#66 |
| -
So what are you getting at? |
USArmyParatrooper |
Sep-23-10 11:16 AM |
#72 |
| -
So this respected historian, novelist and director is like the KKK? |
EFerrari |
Sep-23-10 01:34 PM |
#89 |
| -
Everyone knows we should judge a book by its cover. |
EFerrari |
Sep-23-10 02:16 PM |
#95 |
| -
An aging liberal who's time has come and gone, hoping to cash in on a quick buck |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 09:42 AM |
#5 |
| -
Jumping The Bandwagon? |
Beetwasher |
Sep-23-10 09:46 AM |
#8 |
| -
Well, Ali has every right to write a book containing his opinion. |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 09:46 AM |
#9 |
| -
Liberal? Don't make me laugh |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 09:47 AM |
#11 |
| -
You can try and laugh, but it will not change the correctness of my statement |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 09:50 AM |
#14 |
| -
Not so much. |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 09:57 AM |
#19 |
| -
How is that Marxism working out these days? |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 09:59 AM |
#21 |
| -
Marx's criticism of capitalism was actually spot on |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 10:07 AM |
#27 |
| -
Results matter more than words. Marx was a fool who had no clue about human nature |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 10:10 AM |
#29 |
| -
If so, don't go with the ad hominem attacks. |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 10:17 AM |
#31 |
| -
Actually you did that for me as you pointed out the author has extremely poor judgment |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 10:19 AM |
#33 |
| -
SO I guess |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 10:36 AM |
#41 |
| -
"Prove" Him Wrong? How Do You Prove Someone's Idiotic Opinion Wrong? |
Beetwasher |
Sep-23-10 10:48 AM |
#43 |
| -
Now what's wrong with you? being all sensible and logical |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 10:52 AM |
#45 |
| -
Is Guantanamo closed? ARe the predator drone strikes stopped? |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 10:53 AM |
#46 |
| -
Have "the predator drone attacks strikes stopped"? |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 10:55 AM |
#47 |
| -
Sorry multiple reply |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 11:01 AM |
#53 |
| -
Sorry multiple reply |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 11:01 AM |
#54 |
| -
Sorry multiple reply |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 11:01 AM |
#55 |
| -
Defending one's self from terrorists is a good thing |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 11:05 AM |
#61 |
| -
SO you approved of it when Bush did it? |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 11:06 AM |
#63 |
| -
I approve of the use of drones to defend our nation from Al Qaeda |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 11:34 AM |
#77 |
| -
No, you should be upset when Obama doesn't do what he promised |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 01:02 PM |
#85 |
| -
President Obama promised to concentrate on Al Qaeda and take the fight to them |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 03:07 PM |
#126 |
| -
I did. |
USArmyParatrooper |
Sep-23-10 11:36 AM |
#78 |
| -
In any case, I fail to see why Ali's argument is unfair or inaccurate. |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 01:07 PM |
#87 |
| -
I haven't read the book. Have you? |
USArmyParatrooper |
Sep-23-10 02:04 PM |
#94 |
| -
So, let's run this down. You haven't read the book. |
EFerrari |
Sep-23-10 02:24 PM |
#98 |
| -
And yet, you haven't read it either. |
USArmyParatrooper |
Sep-23-10 02:40 PM |
#103 |
| -
What? I have read it and I'm watching it now. |
EFerrari |
Sep-23-10 02:41 PM |
#105 |
| -
You accidentally forgot to address the rest of my post |
USArmyParatrooper |
Sep-23-10 02:46 PM |
#107 |
| -
Well, no, I didn't. I'm still trying to figure out |
EFerrari |
Sep-23-10 02:51 PM |
#112 |
| -
"Obama = Bush" Is ignorant and inflammetory garbage |
USArmyParatrooper |
Sep-23-10 02:56 PM |
#117 |
| -
It is ignorant inflammatory crap and brought to you not by Tariq Ali |
EFerrari |
Sep-23-10 03:02 PM |
#123 |
| -
Yeah, not people. Just when you peel back Obama's skin you get Bush underneath |
USArmyParatrooper |
Sep-23-10 03:11 PM |
#128 |
| -
No, what's ignorant and "inflammetory" garbage is comparing |
Puregonzo1188 |
Sep-23-10 04:20 PM |
#150 |
| -
Please. Spare me your indignant, phony outrage. |
USArmyParatrooper |
Sep-23-10 04:43 PM |
#154 |
| -
Well then I apologize. However, judging by some of the other |
Puregonzo1188 |
Sep-23-10 05:08 PM |
#162 |
| -
Ignorant crap? Yes. |
USArmyParatrooper |
Sep-23-10 08:45 PM |
#183 |
| -
Sorry multiple reply |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 11:01 AM |
#56 |
| -
So going after a few hundred people, killing several innocent people |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 11:02 AM |
#57 |
| -
that has nothing to do with marxism sucking ass. |
dionysus |
Sep-23-10 08:17 PM |
#180 |
| -
Cardboard cutout comrades?" |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 11:07 PM |
#189 |
| -
Simple. Provide specific examples of how Obama's policies differ from Bush's. |
Spheric |
Sep-23-10 04:50 PM |
#156 |
| -
You Mean, You Don't Know Of Any? |
Beetwasher |
Sep-23-10 05:03 PM |
#159 |
| -
You assert that there are stark differences between the policies... |
Spheric |
Sep-23-10 05:15 PM |
#163 |
| -
The Author Has An Idiotic Opinion "Asserting" That Obama=Bush, It's His Opinion |
Beetwasher |
Sep-23-10 05:26 PM |
#164 |
| -
Still no facts. See, facts can actually prove opinions wrong. |
Spheric |
Sep-23-10 05:31 PM |
#166 |
| -
No, Facts Don't Matter When You've Already Made Up Your Mind That Obama=Bush |
Beetwasher |
Sep-23-10 05:31 PM |
#167 |
| -
I don't believe that has anything to do with this. |
Spheric |
Sep-23-10 06:29 PM |
#170 |
| -
Of Course You Don't! Because It's A BELIEF/Opinion. That's Why Facts Will NEVER Matter To You! Duh. |
Beetwasher |
Sep-23-10 08:50 PM |
#184 |
| -
Claiming that facts wouldn't matter is a cheap way of avoiding having to provide any. |
Spheric |
Sep-24-10 02:56 AM |
#192 |
| -
Facts Don't Matter When It Comes To Faith Based Belief Or Opinion, I'm On To The Pathetic Game |
Beetwasher |
Sep-24-10 10:54 AM |
#196 |
| -
Yes, I get it, You can't argue against the message, so you try to paint the messengers as wingnuts. |
Spheric |
Sep-24-10 05:42 PM |
#197 |
| -
Not my fault the mindset and game is the same faith based nonsense demanding "proof" of a negative |
Beetwasher |
Sep-25-10 09:05 AM |
#198 |
| -
if you can't tell the difference, i question your ability to read. |
dionysus |
Sep-23-10 08:18 PM |
#181 |
| -
K&R |
HughMoran |
Sep-23-10 09:43 AM |
#6 |
| -
How is it unfair to hold him to his promise |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 11:10 AM |
#67 |
| -
Smearing Obama unfairly and comparing him to Bush is the last thing we need right now. |
HughMoran |
Sep-23-10 11:11 AM |
#68 |
| -
I agree, but this is not an unfair smear |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 11:13 AM |
#70 |
| -
Yes, we know the Titanic had too small of a rudder to turn on a dime. |
HughMoran |
Sep-23-10 11:25 AM |
#73 |
| -
"It's election time." |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 01:06 PM |
#86 |
| -
No, it really is election time. |
HughMoran |
Sep-23-10 01:34 PM |
#90 |
| -
It's never NOT "election time" that's my point. |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 02:02 PM |
#93 |
| -
That's just not true |
HughMoran |
Sep-23-10 02:31 PM |
#100 |
| -
Was it election time six months ago? |
Spheric |
Sep-23-10 05:03 PM |
#158 |
| -
No it wasn't. |
HughMoran |
Sep-23-10 05:06 PM |
#160 |
| -
Analyzing policy is "viscous attacks?" |
Spheric |
Sep-23-10 06:42 PM |
#171 |
| -
Would you be OK savaging Democrats right up until election day? |
HughMoran |
Sep-23-10 06:57 PM |
#172 |
| -
Well, all I'm interested in is a discussion of policy. |
Spheric |
Sep-23-10 07:14 PM |
#175 |
| -
It's been debunked a thousand times here |
HughMoran |
Sep-23-10 07:56 PM |
#178 |
| -
Making a factual comparison is a vicious attack? |
wookie72 |
Sep-23-10 11:04 PM |
#188 |
| -
Making over the top exaggerated claims is just dumb |
HughMoran |
Sep-23-10 11:27 PM |
#191 |
| -
Who is we? Does it include any of the innocent civilians killed |
Puregonzo1188 |
Sep-23-10 04:26 PM |
#152 |
| -
"WE" are Democrats. |
HughMoran |
Sep-23-10 04:50 PM |
#155 |
| -
Time for a book burning |
quinnox |
Sep-23-10 09:45 AM |
#7 |
| -
It is a free country. I'll actually buy this book, and I don't burn |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 09:47 AM |
#12 |
| -
the only question is: |
G_j |
Sep-23-10 09:47 AM |
#10 |
| -
I don't' know yet. I haven't had a chance to buy and read the book. |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 09:52 AM |
#15 |
| -
no, I didn't hear you say |
G_j |
Sep-23-10 09:58 AM |
#20 |
| -
Thanks. I'd never comment on the contents of a book I hadn't |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 10:00 AM |
#22 |
| -
I listened to the DN interview |
G_j |
Sep-23-10 10:26 PM |
#187 |
| -
To answer you question- No he does not have a legitimate POV |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 09:54 AM |
#16 |
| -
and I should take your word on that? |
G_j |
Sep-23-10 09:55 AM |
#17 |
| -
If you have some facts to back up your contrary opinion I am all ears (or in the case of message |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 10:00 AM |
#23 |
| -
I didn't realize I had expressed an opinion -nt |
G_j |
Sep-23-10 10:51 AM |
#44 |
| -
Actually you did You expressed the opinion that you doubted my opinion |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 10:57 AM |
#49 |
| -
I asked why I should accept your statement |
G_j |
Sep-23-10 11:05 AM |
#62 |
| -
why did you ask that question? |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 11:31 AM |
#76 |
| -
I'm going to wait until I have a chance to read this book |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 09:55 AM |
#18 |
| -
I am going to go by the nonsense he spouted in his interview |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 10:04 AM |
#25 |
| -
Well, right now, that's all we have. That's why I posted this. |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 10:17 AM |
#32 |
| -
"Quixotic liberals"? Is that the "professional left"? Or, just "Reds" that you're baiting? |
Tierra_y_Libertad |
Sep-23-10 10:03 AM |
#24 |
| -
You need to be familiar with the Novel: The Ingenious Hidalgo Don Quixote of La Mancha |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 10:06 AM |
#26 |
| -
You should be familiar with Joe McCarthy and his list. |
Tierra_y_Libertad |
Sep-23-10 10:07 AM |
#28 |
| -
That would certainly be a good example to support my reference |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 10:14 AM |
#30 |
| -
It's the "sensible liberals" who see the Left as monsters and the right as their allies. |
Tierra_y_Libertad |
Sep-23-10 10:20 AM |
#35 |
| -
Yes there are always evil villains in the world of Quixote liberals |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 10:28 AM |
#37 |
| -
Yah know, you're still misquoting Rahm and Gibbs. I'm one |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 10:33 AM |
#39 |
| -
I don't think it's very sensible or practical to abandon the left in favor of "bipartisanship". |
Tierra_y_Libertad |
Sep-23-10 11:16 AM |
#71 |
| -
How far to the left can an EX-congressman move the country? |
USArmyParatrooper |
Sep-23-10 11:29 AM |
#75 |
| -
Nobody has "abandoned the left." The bottom line in this |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 11:52 AM |
#82 |
| -
good call |
G_j |
Sep-23-10 10:55 AM |
#48 |
| -
Do you ever get tired fo the meme that sensibility is the enemy? |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 11:01 AM |
#51 |
| -
IMHO, the |
G_j |
Sep-23-10 11:12 AM |
#69 |
| -
So you support the sadly misguided meme that being sensible, practical a |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 11:36 AM |
#79 |
| -
Judging by his interviews |
Radical Activist |
Sep-23-10 02:46 PM |
#108 |
| -
please do be more specific..where does he " cherry pick"or engage in "exaggeration and distortion" |
flyarm |
Sep-23-10 03:09 PM |
#127 |
| -
Here ya go |
Radical Activist |
Sep-23-10 10:15 PM |
#186 |
| -
Whoever thinks this is a true idiot. Short memories in this country. |
young but wise |
Sep-23-10 10:20 AM |
#34 |
| -
I cannot make heads nor tails out of this! |
POAS |
Sep-23-10 01:40 PM |
#91 |
| -
Whoever thinks Obama=Bush is true idiot. |
young but wise |
Sep-23-10 02:33 PM |
#101 |
| -
Thanks for clearing it up! n/t |
POAS |
Sep-23-10 03:05 PM |
#125 |
| -
No one can say that the "Professional Left" is out to make a buck |
Kahuna |
Sep-23-10 10:28 AM |
#36 |
| -
Well, they're "Professionals," innit? |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 10:35 AM |
#40 |
| -
O has repeated far too many -- |
Hell Hath No Fury |
Sep-23-10 10:33 AM |
#38 |
| -
Of course the alternative explanation is that he has a better understanding of the Constitution |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 11:03 AM |
#58 |
| -
Presumption of innocence is fundamental to the American way. |
Usrename |
Sep-23-10 03:19 PM |
#133 |
| -
For those who aren't familiar with Tariq Ali... |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 11:01 AM |
#52 |
| -
Thanks MineralMan. |
Scurrilous |
Sep-23-10 11:05 AM |
#60 |
| -
Well, I'm sure many don't even know who this writer is, so |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 11:07 AM |
#65 |
| -
Except they had sources available in Better Believe It's thread |
EFerrari |
Sep-23-10 02:21 PM |
#97 |
| -
Oh, not everyone clicks through to read the original |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 02:30 PM |
#99 |
| -
No. What you did was blow up a book cover image |
EFerrari |
Sep-23-10 02:34 PM |
#102 |
| -
Actually, I reduced an image that was too large, and hosted it |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 02:41 PM |
#104 |
| -
So, you went to the trouble of editing the image, hosting it |
EFerrari |
Sep-23-10 02:48 PM |
#110 |
| -
Thanks, I don't like hotlinking images from other sites. Bandwidth |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 02:52 PM |
#113 |
| -
Bandwidth is "expense". And I look forward to more of |
EFerrari |
Sep-23-10 02:55 PM |
#116 |
| -
In this case, a picture speaks a thousand words. |
HughMoran |
Sep-23-10 03:02 PM |
#121 |
| -
Oops. Thanks for the correction. I edited the post. I guess I was |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 03:02 PM |
#122 |
| -
I included a link to the transcript of the interview in my OP, as well. |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 03:12 PM |
#130 |
| -
WOW, K&R! Thank you for this Mineral Man. |
SunsetDreams |
Sep-23-10 11:26 AM |
#74 |
| -
Thanks for reading the thread! |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 11:40 AM |
#80 |
| -
Lending further credence to the admonition "consider the source." |
AtomicKitten |
Sep-23-10 11:47 AM |
#81 |
| -
The 18 unrecs to date seem to be promoting the Bush = Obama meme |
HughMoran |
Sep-23-10 12:24 PM |
#83 |
| -
Thank you for pulling back the curtain |
JNelson6563 |
Sep-23-10 12:25 PM |
#84 |
| -
What curtain, exactly? What new information did you get in this OP? |
EFerrari |
Sep-23-10 01:54 PM |
#92 |
| -
bullshit, but hey it's opinions |
spanone |
Sep-23-10 01:07 PM |
#88 |
| -
"from one of the worst Democrat areas in the country, Chicago" |
Radical Activist |
Sep-23-10 02:43 PM |
#106 |
| -
Well, in Tariq Ali's defense, he's British, you know. |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 02:48 PM |
#109 |
| -
And he probably has no idea that |
Radical Activist |
Sep-23-10 02:53 PM |
#114 |
| -
Ali probably knows Chicago better than both of you together |
EFerrari |
Sep-23-10 02:58 PM |
#118 |
| -
How would he? |
Radical Activist |
Sep-23-10 03:01 PM |
#120 |
| -
How would he? Because he is an edcuated man |
EFerrari |
Sep-23-10 07:10 PM |
#173 |
| -
lol Just like the people who think Rahm is the frontrunner for Chicago mayor |
Radical Activist |
Sep-23-10 10:12 PM |
#185 |
| -
No, Rad, not like that. |
EFerrari |
Sep-23-10 11:07 PM |
#190 |
| -
How on earth can you make that claim?!?! |
NJmaverick |
Sep-23-10 03:17 PM |
#132 |
| -
+1. |
VMI Dem |
Sep-23-10 03:23 PM |
#135 |
| -
Deleted sub-thread |
Name removed |
Sep-23-10 02:49 PM |
#111 |
| -
Obama is carrying out the Bush Doctrine in Afghanistan. |
VMI Dem |
Sep-23-10 03:19 PM |
#134 |
| -
He's also the President of The United States. |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 03:27 PM |
#137 |
| -
He has allowed or caused more drone attacks in 2 years than 8 years of Bush. |
Bonobo |
Sep-24-10 04:05 AM |
#194 |
| -
You know, the best way to refute this meme would seem to be to actually refute it. |
Spheric |
Sep-23-10 03:36 PM |
#139 |
| -
Hmm...I've seen that done many, many times on DU. Perhaps |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 03:38 PM |
#140 |
| -
Links would be nice. |
Spheric |
Sep-23-10 03:40 PM |
#142 |
| -
I don't have time at the moment to do the search required. Sorry. |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 03:43 PM |
#143 |
| -
I understand. |
Spheric |
Sep-23-10 03:46 PM |
#144 |
| -
Another day, perhaps. But it's been done before by others. |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 03:50 PM |
#145 |
| -
Oh well. And the beat goes on. /nt |
Spheric |
Sep-23-10 03:53 PM |
#146 |
| -
Please tell us what specifically you would like to know.... |
chowder66 |
Sep-23-10 05:36 PM |
#168 |
| -
Policy differences. /nt |
Spheric |
Sep-23-10 07:28 PM |
#176 |
| -
okay...but will they satisfy? doubt it.... |
chowder66 |
Sep-24-10 03:50 AM |
#193 |
| -
Actually, their policy (and their rhetoric) is virtually identical. |
Usrename |
Sep-24-10 08:52 AM |
#195 |
| -
The current war policy was enacted under Bush. |
Usrename |
Sep-23-10 07:29 PM |
#177 |
| -
Do you REALLY think the author will "convince some progressives" of anything? |
Stinky The Clown |
Sep-23-10 03:56 PM |
#147 |
| -
It IS simply my opinion vs. his. Thanks for recognizing that. |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 04:06 PM |
#148 |
| -
I don't actually disagree with the statement. |
Stinky The Clown |
Sep-23-10 05:06 PM |
#161 |
| -
But I have read the entirety of that interview. I have said so |
MineralMan |
Sep-23-10 07:11 PM |
#174 |
| -
Opinion |
HughMoran |
Sep-23-10 04:20 PM |
#151 |
| -
Indeed. And opinions don't specifically require validation. |
Spheric |
Sep-23-10 04:29 PM |
#153 |
| -
Hugh |
Stinky The Clown |
Sep-23-10 05:30 PM |
#165 |
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No more free pop tarts? |
HughMoran |
Sep-23-10 05:53 PM |
#169 |
| -
Not on every issue. |
Puregonzo1188 |
Sep-23-10 04:13 PM |
#149 |
| -
Who says Obama isn't creating jobs? |
celebritymagnet |
Sep-23-10 05:00 PM |
#157 |
| -
Weird. |
HughMoran |
Sep-23-10 08:05 PM |
#179 |
| -
I've got an idea |
Panaconda |
Sep-23-10 08:23 PM |
#182 |
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